Six Nations 2018

Dorset_Boy

Pross - I do think that naturally you look for the oppo's offences and not those of the side you support, so wouldn't be surprised if England did the same, but remember England kicked the ball a lot more!
It did annoy me when AWJ moaned about a couple of things that clearly weren't offences - eg Anscombe running into Sinckler, but that is something creeping more and more into the game in general and there are certainly English player who are guilty.

I think Sinckler is great but you have to spot the point that his head is overheating and haul him off.

Pross

ddraver wrote:

As an ex hooker I wish I'd played with refs that couldn't see that straight.

I don't usually like criticizing refs but he was a bit rubbish today. Luckily he was equally a bit rubbish to both teams so didn't affect much....

Kyle needs to work on his innocent face.

Yeah, thought much the same. He made some odd decisions but was generally consistent with them. Not quite sure what he was thinking on that scrum penalty when England got their first points or two 'no arm' tackles (one apiece).

orraloon

At least this Sith Ifrican ref wasn't that xxxx Craig Joubert who robbed Scotland in the 2015 world cup match vs Australia.

ddraver

Much as I agree with you for most of his career, he did improve significantly in his final years and was the only referee, alongside Nigel Owens, who could actually referee a scrum...

bompington

Pross wrote:

England had no Plan B

You surprise me.

shirley_basso

Don't know all the facts and ins and outs of refereeing but the consensus among my viewing party is that England were outplayed and it was disappointing, based on what we had seen previously.

Wayne Plunger

As stated previously my rugger knowledge is not that great but I find it hard to understand how a nation of 50 million, augmented by quite a few players who are about as English as Alec Salmond are defeated by a meagre bunch of half wits from the valleys.

Matthewfalle

because the boys from the valleys are superior beings.

better disciplined
better drilled
less arrogant on and off the pitch
less spoilt
more talented
more dedicated
more confident
better singers
better work ethic
better trained
better strategy
just better.

Wayne Plunger

Matthewfalle wrote:

because the boys from the valleys are superior beings.

better disciplined
better drilled
less arrogant on and off the pitch
less spoilt
more talented
more dedicated
more confident
better singers
better work ethic
better trained
better strategy
just better.

Dwi'n cytuno.

Pross

Wayne Plunger wrote:

As stated previously my rugger knowledge is not that great but I find it hard to understand how a nation of 50 million, augmented by quite a few players who are about as English as Alec Salmond are defeated by a meagre bunch of half wits from the valleys.

To be fair Wales did have Anscombe and Parkes who have very dodgy Welsh accents plus a few 2nd generation Welsh born across the bridge. That said, Billy V was raised in Pontypool and might have played for Wales had he not been behind his cousin, Faletau, in the pecking order.

The bigger question is how the international side is doing well when club and regional rugby in Wales is in such sh!t state.

Matthewfalle

it's also God's own country so the team possess immortal powers of omnipotence and omnipresence on the pitch.

crispybug2

Italy 16-26 Ireland

Stuttering performance by Ireland, but still enough for a bonus point

I’m beginning to wonder whether Ireland peaked with their win over New Zealand and this current team in decline at almost the wrong time , this has happened before, an example being England in 2003 thrashing Ireland to win the six nations and beating Australia and New Zealand away but they scraped by at World Cup before completely declining, I truly hope not but they’ve been below par throughout this tournament so far

Dyrnog

Matthewfalle wrote:

because the boys from the valleys are superior beings.

better disciplined
better drilled
less arrogant on and off the pitch
less spoilt
more talented
more dedicated
more confident
better singers
better work ethic
better trained
better strategy
just better.

Excellent summary

ddraver

crispybug2 wrote:

Italy 16-26 Ireland

Stuttering performance by Ireland, but still enough for a bonus point

I’m beginning to wonder whether Ireland peaked with their win over New Zealand and this current team in decline at almost the wrong time , this has happened before, an example being England in 2003 thrashing Ireland to win the six nations and beating Australia and New Zealand away but they scraped by at World Cup before completely declining, I truly hope not but they’ve been below par throughout this tournament so far

I think the reality is that England, Ireland and Wales are all at a very similar level, so similar on fact that games turn on the bounce of a ball or how individual players are playing that day. Ireland may have the edge but it's a very small edge, as we saw...

Unfortunately I suspect that come World Cup time the All Blacks will carefully and concisely take all of us apart as usual...

tangled_metal

Isn't it funny how England start playing well and people get to thinking they're favourites only to get beaten by Wales or Ireland. Whichever one of them they're playing away third round onwards.

I didn't think we'd beat Wales after showing so well in Ireland and against a poorly playing France. Not away. Glad I was away and couldn't watch. Don't think I'll bother.

The other point I have is that IMHO gatland is the better coach. What do you more knowledgeable people think?

So how will this 6 nations end now?

navrig2

Tangled Metal wrote:

So how will this 6 nations end now?

Wales will take the Championship because in the very last match Scotland will raise their game and although still losing to England, we (the Scots) will frustrate them and stop them getting a necessary bonus point for the Championship.

Ideally though I'd like it to be because Scotland raise their game and beat England but I have to be realistic.

Matthewfalle

Wales will win everything and the english will be bad losers (again).

Wayne Plunger

Wales labour to a win over "plucky Scotland" , the combined might of Samoa and Fiji do for Italy.

crispybug2

Ireland beat an utterly abject France 26 - 14, with France only scoring their points in the last five minutes when Ireland had taken their foot off the gas

Ireland can now only retain their title if they can beat Wales in Cardiff and Scotland beat England at Twickenham, to be honest neither result seems likely

Pross

I reckon Ireland will win next week. That said Wales are turning into those teams that scrape wins whilst playing badly which is a useful skill. I can't seem Scotland winning, Italy v France could go either way.

Dorset_Boy

Wales have to be favourites with home advantage and their winning streak, although there will be a lot of Irish in Cardiff as it's the end of the Cheltenham festival isn't it, and St Paddy's weekend. Ireland are gradually recovering from the shock of the opening weekend so expect it to be very tight.

Scotland just have too many injuries to overturn their dire record at Twickenham whatever combinations mad Eddie chooses to put out.

I think Italy could well turn over France and for the sake of the competition really hope they do, as although England humped them, they have been much better this year, and played really well in patches.

tangled_metal

Relegation? Anyone for it?

timothyw

Tangled Metal wrote:

Relegation? Anyone for it?

I'm certainly happy for Italy to be eliminated, and perhaps a new 'guest nation' slot to be introduced, but given the five nations format dates from 1910 it seems like you can't risk relegating any of the others without changing what the competition is to an undesirable degree.

Italy and Scotland are the only nations not to have won under the six nations format, although this is a little unfair on Scotland who did win the last five nations, and have only had four six nations wooden spoons against Italy's thirteen (with a 14th I think mathematically unavoidable).

So yeah, not a fan of relegation unless you're talking about Italy....

kingstongraham

crispybug2 wrote:

Italy 16-26 Ireland

Stuttering performance by Ireland, but still enough for a bonus point

Bit harsh to describe it as stuttering. They were pretty much 100% dominant until they got the bonus point, then took off any key players they could afford to, and started getting ready for next week.

Pross

Tangled Metal wrote:

Relegation? Anyone for it?

No, there's just not enough strength elsewhere to get promoted. Italy have a squad playing top flight rugby around Europe and are still the whipping boys but if you relegated them who would come in? Romania? Georgia? Spain? They would just end up going straight back down again. Failing that you'd have to ship in Samoa, Fiji, Tonga etc. for the duration of the tournament and have them play all their games away or in a neutral country. If you wanted promotion and relegation you would first need to develop a strong competition below.

shirley_basso

Could open spaces for some other monster nations like Georgia etc.

Have a feeder League and one goes up and one goes down each year?

ballysmate

Anyone else aware of the Nations Champ proposals?

Pross

Ballysmate wrote:

Anyone else aware of the Nations Champ proposals?

It's all a bit up in the air until tomorrow's meeting and being opposed by the French and English top league clubs. Even World Rugby don't seem entirely convinced they know what they are proposing saying one week there won't be promotion and relegation for 12 years and the next that there will be. The basics seem to be a full tournament two years in every four, a slimmed down version in Lions years and nothing in world cup years. It would involve the current 6 Nations and Rugby Championship sides plus Fiji and Japan with both the 6 Nations and Rugby Championship having promotion and relegation.

I can't see it working, who is going to help fund the second tier teams to ensure it doesn't just end up being the same two teams trading places every year? OK, in the Southern Hemisphere there may be a bit more competition but I really don't see where there is a team that would join the 6 Nations that could stay up for more than a year. They'd be better off pumping money and resources into developing the Rugby Europe Championship and look at some way to strengthen the teams in the Pacific Nations Cup, Asia Rugby Cup and Americas Rugby Championship (possibly an extension of the previous Pacific 5 Nations) with each of those being in a league structure with promotion and relegation. It won't help the sport to develop if they pit second tier nations with a mainly semi-pro squad against the top teams with players who are playing top flight professional rugby week in, week out. Bar a few surprises even teams that are filled with experienced full time pros such as Italy, Fiji, Tonga and Samoa struggle to compete against the top 8 or 9 teams and many of the other teams rely on slightly dubious residency or ancestral links to put out a team. Development needs to happen from the bottom up with the necessary support of the governing body.

bompington

Pross wrote:

teams rely on slightly dubious residency or ancestral links to put out a team.

I, for one, am a bit surprised how many pacific islanders seem to have uncovered English ancestry ;-)

Alejandrosdog

bompington wrote:

Pross wrote:

teams rely on slightly dubious residency or ancestral links to put out a team.

I, for one, am a bit surprised how many pacific islanders seem to have uncovered English ancestry ;-)

I blame captain cook

I think Italy has improved considerably over the years just not enough, certainly theyre not the pushover they were.Scotland on the other hand seems to have got worse and its not a year or two dip.

I think the competition as it stands at the moment is one of the best sporting fixtures on the calendar.