LEAVE the Conservative Party and save your country!

rjsterry

PBlakeney wrote:

As I pointed out to someone on FB, changing the captain after hitting the iceberg wouldn’t have saved the Titanic.
Quite proud of that one. What does anyone realistically expect to achieve with a leadership change?

A major factor in the Titanic disaster was the reaction after the initial impact, based on a misguided belief that the iceberg couldn't possibly sink the ship. It was the dithering as much as anything that caused the loss of life. So the right leader might be able to salvage something.

robert88

rjsterry wrote:

PBlakeney wrote:

As I pointed out to someone on FB, changing the captain after hitting the iceberg wouldn’t have saved the Titanic.
Quite proud of that one. What does anyone realistically expect to achieve with a leadership change?

A major factor in the Titanic disaster was the reaction after the initial impact, based on a misguided belief that the iceberg couldn't possibly sink the ship. It was the dithering as much as anything that caused the loss of life. So the right leader might be able to salvage something.

I think the belief that the Titanic was unsinkable would have been a Leave POV.

Unlike on board the Titanic, Remainers have to sail with the ship unless they have dual nationality. (Loss of life was mainly due to lack of lifeboats, not 'dithering'. Hitting the berg was partly due to the lookouts not being given binoculars - they forgot to bring any and I guess it would have been embarrassing to ask passengers for the loan of some!)

If the Captain of the Titanic had got all the passengers together and said "look here chaps*, we can either slow down through the ice field and take a bit longer in safety or press on regardless - it's your choice here are your ballot papers" then at least the choice would have been a more informed one.

*women didn't get the vote till later.

pblakeney

Rick Chasey wrote:

PBlakeney wrote:

As I pointed out to someone on FB, changing the captain after hitting the iceberg wouldn’t have saved the Titanic.
Quite proud of that one. What does anyone realistically expect to achieve with a leadership change?

Have said before BoJo as PM makes a calamitous Brexit materially more likely.

Achieving usually means a positive outcome.

john80

Robert88 wrote:

rjsterry wrote:

PBlakeney wrote:

As I pointed out to someone on FB, changing the captain after hitting the iceberg wouldn’t have saved the Titanic.
Quite proud of that one. What does anyone realistically expect to achieve with a leadership change?

A major factor in the Titanic disaster was the reaction after the initial impact, based on a misguided belief that the iceberg couldn't possibly sink the ship. It was the dithering as much as anything that caused the loss of life. So the right leader might be able to salvage something.

I think the belief that the Titanic was unsinkable would have been a Leave POV.

Unlike on board the Titanic, Remainers have to sail with the ship unless they have dual nationality. (Loss of life was mainly due to lack of lifeboats, not 'dithering'. Hitting the berg was partly due to the lookouts not being given binoculars - they forgot to bring any and I guess it would have been embarrassing to ask passengers for the loan of some!)

If the Captain of the Titanic had got all the passengers together and said "look here chaps*, we can either slow down through the ice field and take a bit longer in safety or press on regardless - it's your choice here are your ballot papers" then at least the choice would have been a more informed one.

*women didn't get the vote till later.

Yeah but if you were female and able to get on deck then you got in a lifeboat. Those chivalrous gets. Obviously if you were poor and locked down below then being female was not an advantage.

bompington

john80 wrote:

Obviously if you were poor and locked down below then being female was not an advantage.

Hoary old myth alert! There is no evidence that this happened: none.

BTW it's also a myth that anyone ever claimed the Titanic was unsinkable.

surrey_commuter

TailWindHome wrote:

I haven't costed it.

But I think if I were in charge of tax rates, on point of principle, the personal allowance would equal the living wage *37.5*52
Ie. Anyone earning the minimum wage wouldn't pay any of it back in tax.

I would also align these with the maximum level of benefits that are allowed

rjsterry

bompington wrote:

john80 wrote:

Obviously if you were poor and locked down below then being female was not an advantage.

Hoary old myth alert! There is no evidence that this happened: none.

BTW it's also a myth that anyone ever claimed the Titanic was unsinkable.

I think that analogy is now well and truly dismembered. PB will wish he'd never mentioned it.

tailwindhome

rjsterry wrote:

bompington wrote:

john80 wrote:

Obviously if you were poor and locked down below then being female was not an advantage.

Hoary old myth alert! There is no evidence that this happened: none.

BTW it's also a myth that anyone ever claimed the Titanic was unsinkable.

I think that analogy is now well and truly dismembered. PB will wish he'd never mentioned it.

She was grand when she left Belfast.

bompington

TailWindHome wrote:

She was grand when she left Belfast.

Funny, that's exactly how Mrs Bomp says she felt when she left Belfast ;-)

Stevo_666

Robert88 wrote:

Stevo 666 wrote:

Sgt.Pepper wrote:

Rick Chasey wrote:

Stevo 666 wrote:

Rick Chasey wrote:

Is anyone challenging the Tories on how they’re gonna pay for all the tax cuts all the various leadership runners are announcing?

Most likely it would be additional debt. However as you have said on several occasions, you think that the amount a country borrows doesn't matter - so what's your problem here?

So, as it seems to be becoming clear, I value consistency in political leaders and I think it's fair to hold political leaders to their previously stated convictions. Would you not agree? I am all for politicians changing their mind, if they offer a good reason for why they have done so.

That sort of balanced reasoning isn't going to get you anywhere.

Thanks for your useful contribution as ever

Balance vs bigotry?

No, I was being a bit sarcastic as you probably realised

pinno

Surrey Commuter wrote:

TailWindHome wrote:

I haven't costed it.

But I think if I were in charge of tax rates, on point of principle, the personal allowance would equal the living wage *37.5*52
Ie. Anyone earning the minimum wage wouldn't pay any of it back in tax.

I would also align these with the maximum level of benefits that are allowed

Rather than say, cap rent?

surrey_commuter

Pinno wrote:

Surrey Commuter wrote:

TailWindHome wrote:

I haven't costed it.

But I think if I were in charge of tax rates, on point of principle, the personal allowance would equal the living wage *37.5*52
Ie. Anyone earning the minimum wage wouldn't pay any of it back in tax.

I would also align these with the maximum level of benefits that are allowed

Rather than say, cap rent?

Not sure what you mean

pinno

Surrey Commuter wrote:

Pinno wrote:

Surrey Commuter wrote:

TailWindHome wrote:

I haven't costed it.

But I think if I were in charge of tax rates, on point of principle, the personal allowance would equal the living wage *37.5*52
Ie. Anyone earning the minimum wage wouldn't pay any of it back in tax.

I would also align these with the maximum level of benefits that are allowed

Rather than say, cap rent?

Not sure what you mean

One of the Tory benefit amendments was to cap Housing Benefit. Which to me, is the wrong way round. Cap the rent. They should re-instate Rental Authorities but they'll never do that because M Thatcher was the Tory who removed them.

However, councils are no longer legislators, they are simply enablers. There's no way Government is going to actually hand councils power and give them free reign to set local policy, is there?

pblakeney

rjsterry wrote:

bompington wrote:

john80 wrote:

Obviously if you were poor and locked down below then being female was not an advantage.

Hoary old myth alert! There is no evidence that this happened: none.

BTW it's also a myth that anyone ever claimed the Titanic was unsinkable.

I think that analogy is now well and truly dismembered. PB will wish he'd never mentioned it.

Nope, I still maintain that changing captain after the event would be of little consequence.
Much like the tories today, or 3 years ago.

pinno

If the campaign to make Brexit impossible without a deal is successful, where will Boris be, if he's PM?
[Apart from purgatory]

rjsterry

Anyone else hear the Liz Truss interview this morning on R4?

Apparently everyone listing the multiple failings of Johnson is a sign of how brilliant he is. He was brilliant at being Mayor of London; brilliant at being Foreign Secretary; just brilliant! [/fastshow]

On the plus side Truss's idiotic interview can't have improved Johnson's profile... can it?

bianchimoon

rjsterry wrote:

Anyone else hear the Liz Truss interview this morning on R4?

Apparently everyone listing the multiple failings of Johnson is a sign of how brilliant he is. He was brilliant at being Mayor of London; brilliant at being Foreign Secretary; just brilliant! [/fastshow]

On the plus side Truss's idiotic interview can't have improved Johnson's profile... can it?

I saw her on Sky this morning, she's totally inspired by chuckabee Sanders, Johnson's campaign will be a mirror of what's going on over there!

bianchimoon

yup, it's that obvious
https://www.indy100.com/article/liz-tru ... ys-8954836

coopster_the_1st

Telegraph ComRes Poll wrote:

Boris Johnson is the only Tory leadership candidate capable of beating both Jeremy Corbyn and the Brexit Party, according to new polling which suggests he would win a crushing 140-seat majority for the Conservatives at the next general election if he was elected Prime Minister.

Quite a simple decision for those Tory MP's that want to keep their seat

This should please all the snowflakes

rick_chasey

Fairly sure they said the same of May when she joined

bianchimoon

Coopster the 1st wrote:

Telegraph ComRes Poll wrote:

Boris Johnson is the only Tory leadership candidate capable of beating both Jeremy Corbyn and the Brexit Party, according to new polling which suggests he would win a crushing 140-seat majority for the Conservatives at the next general election if he was elected Prime Minister.

Quite a simple decision for those Tory MP's that want to keep their seat

This should please all the snowflakes

Crackin' not only do we not get no Brexit delivery, we can have flowery bridges, water cannons and brits abroad imprisoned.

rjsterry

bianchimoon wrote:

yup, it's that obvious
https://www.indy100.com/article/liz-tru ... ys-8954836

I get his minders' reluctance to let Johnson loose himself but could they not find someone better than Truss to big him up. You could sense Humphrys thinking "why am I even bothering to ask you questions?". Given that by now all politicians know the drill, why do they so often end up sounding like morons when asked very straightforward questions?

Ben6899

Coopster the 1st wrote:

Telegraph ComRes Poll wrote:

Boris Johnson is the only Tory leadership candidate capable of beating both Jeremy Corbyn and the Brexit Party, according to new polling which suggests he would win a crushing 140-seat majority for the Conservatives at the next general election if he was elected Prime Minister.

Quite a simple decision for those Tory MP's that want to keep their seat

This should please all the snowflakes

2016 called. It wants its insult back.

rjsterry

Coopster the 1st wrote:

Telegraph ComRes Poll wrote:

Boris Johnson is the only Tory leadership candidate capable of beating both Jeremy Corbyn and the Brexit Party, according to new polling which suggests he would win a crushing 140-seat majority for the Conservatives at the next general election if he was elected Prime Minister.

Quite a simple decision for those Tory MP's that want to keep their seat

This should please all the snowflakes

Telegraph puffs its star columnist with dubious claims from polling? Never!

There's some explanation of why the claims of a 140 seat majority are not supported by the poll here.

https://mobile.twitter.com/robfordmancs ... 0791140353

bianchimoon

Truss, like all the Johnson backers I've heard so far give the Impression they see him as a figurehead only and that he'll delegate all the real work/responsibility to those MP's who have backed him

rjsterry

bianchimoon wrote:

Truss, like all the Johnson backers I've heard so far give the Impression they see him as a figurehead only and that he'll delegate all the real work/responsibility to those MP's who have backed him

That was very much his approach to being Mayor.

bianchimoon

rjsterry wrote:

bianchimoon wrote:

Truss, like all the Johnson backers I've heard so far give the Impression they see him as a figurehead only and that he'll delegate all the real work/responsibility to those MP's who have backed him

That was very much his approach to being Mayor.

Gotta say, it's marginally less frightening than him taking control :?

kingstongraham

Coopster the 1st wrote:

Telegraph ComRes Poll wrote:

Boris Johnson is the only Tory leadership candidate capable of beating both Jeremy Corbyn and the Brexit Party, according to new polling which suggests he would win a crushing 140-seat majority for the Conservatives at the next general election if he was elected Prime Minister.

Quite a simple decision for those Tory MP's that want to keep their seat

This should please all the snowflakes

What happened to your disdain for opinion polls?

pinno

coopster_the_1st

KingstonGraham wrote:

Coopster the 1st wrote:

Telegraph ComRes Poll wrote:

Boris Johnson is the only Tory leadership candidate capable of beating both Jeremy Corbyn and the Brexit Party, according to new polling which suggests he would win a crushing 140-seat majority for the Conservatives at the next general election if he was elected Prime Minister.

Quite a simple decision for those Tory MP's that want to keep their seat

This should please all the snowflakes

What happened to your disdain for opinion polls?

It's the snowflakes reaction to it. Remoaners are now searching for all the ways possible to discredit it

Remoaners have lost their chance of BRINO by voting it down. That Boris as PM also means a huge majority for the Conservatives is only a good thing for the UK. My vote and millions of others would move back to the Conservatives if a proper Leaver e.g. Boris, was PM.