TDF 2018, Stage 9: Arras Citadelle > Roubaix 15/07/2018 - 156,5 km *Spoilers*

Jez mon

I think after today maybe the calls that cobbles don't belong in a GT might die down?

ShutupJens

The last 30km of today as a time trial. That would be fun

DeadCalm

underlayunderlay wrote:

DeadCalm wrote:

So, was Thomas the only Sky rider not to fall off?

Don't think we saw Rowe go down either?

The next Sky marginal gain?

tailwindhome

GC times relative to Froome


2 Geraint Thomas (GBr) Team Sky - 59 secs
4 Bob Jungels (Lux) Quick-Step Floors -52 secs
5 Alejandro Valverde (Spa) Movistar Team -11 secs
6 Rafal Majka (Pol) Bora-Hansgrohe -10 secs
7 Jakob Fuglsang (Den) Astana Pro Team -9 secs
8 Chris Froome (GBr) Team Sky
9 Adam Yates (GBr) Mitchelton-Scott
10 Mikel Landa (Spa) Movistar Team
12 Vincenzo Nibali (Ita) Bahrain-Merida +6
13 Primoz Roglic (Slo) LottoNL-Jumbo +15
14 Bauke Mollema (Ned) Trek-Segafredo +16
15 Tom Dumoulin (Ned) Team Sunweb +21
16 Steven Kruijswijk (Ned) LottoNL-Jumbo +23
17 Romain Bardet (Fra) AG2R La Mondiale +50
18 Warren Barguil (Fra) Fortuneo-Samsic +55
19 Ilnur Zakarin (Rus) Katusha-Alpecin +60
20 Domenico Pozzovivo (Ita) Bahrain-Merida +66
21 Nairo Quintana (Col) Movistar Team +68
22 Rigoberto Uran (Col) EF Education First-Drapac p/b Cannondale +71
24 Daniel Martin (Irl) UAE Team Emirates +100

ShutupJens

DeadCalm wrote:

bobmcstuff wrote:

So Uran has one issue and loses a minute.

Bardet had 5 punctures and finishes with the main bunch.

Yeah OK.

Naesen.

And Dilier, and Frank earlier on. Whereas at one point Uran was being paced back by Craddock

What was Sep Vanmarcke on with today? He was in the Uran group but parked on the back at one stage while others were pulling

milemuncher1

Jez mon wrote:

I think after today maybe the calls that cobbles don't belong in a GT might die down?

I’m used to cobbles, and knackered roads, and cattle grids, some of these guys obviously aren’t . Bunny hop any interfaces, watch any sharp corners after the pave, stick to the middle, hammer it, you’ll be fine.

knedlicky

Slim Boy Fat wrote:

From INRNG.

"Non-displaced right clavicle fracture" for Richie Porte says team press release

So a case of Pascal Simon from years ago, except just not in yellow when it happened nor with a few 'easy' stages ahead - Simon's reason to continue.
I think Porte did right in 'retiring', but I doubt his 'best chance' in a GT will ever come again.

I heard that his collar bone injury from last year hadn't yet fully recovered when examined about 3-4 months ago. I can't imagine why, 9 months is normally more than enough (I know from my own experience). But maybe the judgement he heard then played a role in his hesitancy about today's stage.

hypster

Jez mon wrote:

I think after today maybe the calls that cobbles don't belong in a GT might die down?

I still don't like it as it makes the race too much of a lottery. I don't think it's just down to rider skill or experience either because even the best riders have crashed on these roads at some time or other.

How many times even on normal stages have we heard riders say they wouldn't want a race decided by a crash/mechanical/puncture? I know that can happen at any time but it's much more likely on a pave stage. Just think what the carnage might have been like if it was wet today. Did anybody find Richie Porte's crash entertaining today? - and that wasn't even on the pave.

ShutupJens

hypster wrote:

Jez mon wrote:

I think after today maybe the calls that cobbles don't belong in a GT might die down?

I still don't like it as it makes the race too much of a lottery. I don't think it's just down to rider skill or experience either because even the best riders have crashed on these roads at some time or other.

How many times even on normal stages have we heard riders say they wouldn't want a race decided by a crash/mechanical/puncture? I know that can happen at any time but it's much more likely on a pave stage. Just think what the carnage might have been like if it was wet today. Did anybody find Richie Porte's crash entertaining today? - and that wasn't even on the pave.

Richie's crash wasn't on the pave - so this is the argument against pave? It was 30km before any cobbles so hardly relevant. The best riders crash on them yes, most of Sky, Gilbert, Terpstra etc, but actually these weren't the best riders on the day, the best ones avoided trouble all together and ended up riding away towards the end

blazing_saddles

DeadCalm wrote:

underlayunderlay wrote:

DeadCalm wrote:

So, was Thomas the only Sky rider not to fall off?

Don't think we saw Rowe go down either?

The next Sky marginal gain?

Except Rowe didn't fall, he had a puncture.

Talking of marginal gains, this was Bardet's. Better than Naesen.

ddraver

It makes a for a fun stage but I don't like them...

If Bardet had punctured in a slightly different ways he'd have lost minutes and we wouldn't be seeing cobbles in the tour for another 10 years.

Porte, Uran, TJ* have all had their GC hopes ruined by chance and bad luck. Now I know that all pink/yellow/red jerseys need some good luck but activity encouraging bad luck is just...meh

It just turns cycling into a bloodsport

*Ok, yeah, couldn't type that without smirking

indyp

What a brilliant stage! I can't recall watching one so packed full of incidents and action. Chuffed Degenkolb finally got a win. His interview after was genuinely moving.

DeadCalm

Blazing Saddles wrote:

DeadCalm wrote:

underlayunderlay wrote:

DeadCalm wrote:

So, was Thomas the only Sky rider not to fall off?

Don't think we saw Rowe go down either?

The next Sky marginal gain?

Except Rowe didn't fall, he had a puncture.

Talking of marginal gains, this was Bardet's. Better than Naesen.

Haha. Don't be so sensitive. It was a light hearted post.

ShutupJens

ddraver wrote:

It makes a for a fun stage but I don't like them...

If Harder had punctured in a slightly different ways he'd have lost minutes and we wouldn't be seeing cobbles in the tour for another 10 years.

Porte, Uran, TJ* have all had their GC hopes ruined by chance and bad luck. Now I know that all pink/yellow/red jerseys need some good luck but activity encouraging bad luck is just...meh

It just turns cycling into a bloodsport

*Ok, yeah, couldn't type that without smirking

TJ was a GC contender for about 10km before his lie down

rick_chasey

No coincidence Sagan, GvA etc didn’t puncture

slim_boy_fat

ddraver wrote:

It makes a for a fun stage but I don't like them...

If Harder had punctured in a slightly different ways he'd have lost minutes and we wouldn't be seeing cobbles in the tour for another 10 years.

Porte, Uran, TJ* have all had their GC hopes ruined by chance and bad luck. Now I know that all pink/yellow/red jerseys need some good luck but activity encouraging bad luck is just...meh

It just turns cycling into a bloodsport

*Ok, yeah, couldn't type that without smirking

I'm not sure that should be the argument though. Descents, really hot weather, rain, spectators, motorbikes, etc., all these can ruin a GC riders race through no fault of their own. The argument should possibly be are GC riders equipped with the necessary skills to ride such terrain. And after today you would have to say yes.

Jez mon

ddraver wrote:

It makes a for a fun stage but I don't like them...

If Harder had punctured in a slightly different ways he'd have lost minutes and we wouldn't be seeing cobbles in the tour for another 10 years.

Porte, Uran, TJ* have all had their GC hopes ruined by chance and bad luck. Now I know that all pink/yellow/red jerseys need some good luck but activity encouraging bad luck is just...meh

It just turns cycling into a bloodsport

*Ok, yeah, couldn't type that without smirking

I think Uran had the chance to close the gap.

Portes accident happened in a nervous peloton, which can happen on any flat stage.

FocusZing

Yes exactly. Decents on wet days can be just a lethal.

ddraver

Slim Boy Fat wrote:

I'm not sure that should be the argument though. Descents, really hot weather, rain, spectators, motorbikes, etc., all these can ruin a GC riders race through no fault of their own. The argument should possibly be are GC riders equipped with the necessary skills to ride such terrain. And after today you would have to say yes.

It should go without saying that spectators and motorbikes should have zero impact on the race. That they are is a major failing.

Weather and descents however are calculated risks

That is different from a random joker, which is what cobbles provides.

There is a place for cobbles and it's in April ( to paraphrase Stuart O'grady, who it must be said did a Stirling job today. He has a potential future there.)

webboo

Milemuncher1 wrote:

Jez mon wrote:

I think after today maybe the calls that cobbles don't belong in a GT might die down?

I’m used to cobbles, and knackered roads, and cattle grids, some of these guys obviously aren’t . Bunny hop any interfaces, watch any sharp corners after the pave, stick to the middle, hammer it, you’ll be fine.

The man who never goes above 60 revs a minute and avoids hills, who also never gets his heart rate above 60% of max. Now is giving the professional’s advice.
What a c*ck.

iainf72

TailWindHome wrote:

GC times relative to Froome


2 Geraint Thomas (GBr) Team Sky - 59 secs
4 Bob Jungels (Lux) Quick-Step Floors -52 secs
5 Alejandro Valverde (Spa) Movistar Team -11 secs
6 Rafal Majka (Pol) Bora-Hansgrohe -10 secs
7 Jakob Fuglsang (Den) Astana Pro Team -9 secs
8 Chris Froome (GBr) Team Sky
9 Adam Yates (GBr) Mitchelton-Scott
10 Mikel Landa (Spa) Movistar Team
12 Vincenzo Nibali (Ita) Bahrain-Merida +6
13 Primoz Roglic (Slo) LottoNL-Jumbo +15
14 Bauke Mollema (Ned) Trek-Segafredo +16
15 Tom Dumoulin (Ned) Team Sunweb +21
16 Steven Kruijswijk (Ned) LottoNL-Jumbo +23
17 Romain Bardet (Fra) AG2R La Mondiale +50
18 Warren Barguil (Fra) Fortuneo-Samsic +55
19 Ilnur Zakarin (Rus) Katusha-Alpecin +60
20 Domenico Pozzovivo (Ita) Bahrain-Merida +66
21 Nairo Quintana (Col) Movistar Team +68
22 Rigoberto Uran (Col) EF Education First-Drapac p/b Cannondale +71
24 Daniel Martin (Irl) UAE Team Emirates +100

So in summary, all the actual GC contenders are already behind Froome.

bobmcstuff

ShutupJens wrote:

DeadCalm wrote:

bobmcstuff wrote:

So Uran has one issue and loses a minute.

Bardet had 5 punctures and finishes with the main bunch.

Yeah OK.

Naesen.

And Dilier, and Frank earlier on. Whereas at one point Uran was being paced back by Craddock

What was Sep Vanmarcke on with today? He was in the Uran group but parked on the back at one stage while others were pulling

Towards the end Bardet was completely on his own. His last puncture there were no support riders.

Uran did have some good riders. At one point he had 4 riders with him.

Not saying Uran should have got back on necessarily, probably it worked out fairly for him - but Bardet is only still in this because of French parochialism.

above_the_cows

iainf72 wrote:

TailWindHome wrote:

GC times relative to Froome


2 Geraint Thomas (GBr) Team Sky - 59 secs
4 Bob Jungels (Lux) Quick-Step Floors -52 secs
5 Alejandro Valverde (Spa) Movistar Team -11 secs
6 Rafal Majka (Pol) Bora-Hansgrohe -10 secs
7 Jakob Fuglsang (Den) Astana Pro Team -9 secs
8 Chris Froome (GBr) Team Sky
9 Adam Yates (GBr) Mitchelton-Scott
10 Mikel Landa (Spa) Movistar Team
12 Vincenzo Nibali (Ita) Bahrain-Merida +6
13 Primoz Roglic (Slo) LottoNL-Jumbo +15
14 Bauke Mollema (Ned) Trek-Segafredo +16
15 Tom Dumoulin (Ned) Team Sunweb +21
16 Steven Kruijswijk (Ned) LottoNL-Jumbo +23
17 Romain Bardet (Fra) AG2R La Mondiale +50
18 Warren Barguil (Fra) Fortuneo-Samsic +55
19 Ilnur Zakarin (Rus) Katusha-Alpecin +60
20 Domenico Pozzovivo (Ita) Bahrain-Merida +66
21 Nairo Quintana (Col) Movistar Team +68
22 Rigoberto Uran (Col) EF Education First-Drapac p/b Cannondale +71
24 Daniel Martin (Irl) UAE Team Emirates +100

So in summary, all the actual GC contenders are already behind Froome.

Hey at least the crash on stage one has injected a bit of intrigue with Thomas.

iainf72

Has everyone noticed how they Sky riders who weren't at the front sat up and took it easy?

Poels
Moscon
Kwaito
JC

etc all rolled in near the back. So clearly once they're out of it they're told to conserve energy.

above_the_cows

iainf72 wrote:

Has everyone noticed how they Sky riders who weren't at the front sat up and took it easy?

Poels
Moscon
Kwaito
JC

etc all rolled in near the back. So clearly once they're out of it they're told to conserve energy.

Makes sense.

RichN95.

iainf72 wrote:

Has everyone noticed how they Sky riders who weren't at the front sat up and took it easy?

Poels
Moscon
Kwaito
JC

etc all rolled in near the back. So clearly once they're out of it they're told to conserve energy.

It’s also less frantic back there. No-one at the back is crashing.

RichN95.

Double post

Lanterne_Rogue

Blazing Saddles wrote:

Talking of marginal gains, this was Bardet's. Better than Naesen.

Femke Van den Driessche?

surrey_commuter

Webboo wrote:

Milemuncher1 wrote:

Jez mon wrote:

I think after today maybe the calls that cobbles don't belong in a GT might die down?

I’m used to cobbles, and knackered roads, and cattle grids, some of these guys obviously aren’t . Bunny hop any interfaces, watch any sharp corners after the pave, stick to the middle, hammer it, you’ll be fine.

The man who never goes above 60 revs a minute and avoids hills, who also never gets his heart rate above 60% of max. Now is giving the professional’s advice.
What a c*ck.

In fairness to Walt he was not giving them advice he was just pointing out why he is so much better than them

jam1e

iainf72 wrote:

TailWindHome wrote:

GC times relative to Froome


2 Geraint Thomas (GBr) Team Sky - 59 secs
4 Bob Jungels (Lux) Quick-Step Floors -52 secs
5 Alejandro Valverde (Spa) Movistar Team -11 secs
6 Rafal Majka (Pol) Bora-Hansgrohe -10 secs
7 Jakob Fuglsang (Den) Astana Pro Team -9 secs
8 Chris Froome (GBr) Team Sky
9 Adam Yates (GBr) Mitchelton-Scott
10 Mikel Landa (Spa) Movistar Team
12 Vincenzo Nibali (Ita) Bahrain-Merida +6
13 Primoz Roglic (Slo) LottoNL-Jumbo +15
14 Bauke Mollema (Ned) Trek-Segafredo +16
15 Tom Dumoulin (Ned) Team Sunweb +21
16 Steven Kruijswijk (Ned) LottoNL-Jumbo +23
17 Romain Bardet (Fra) AG2R La Mondiale +50
18 Warren Barguil (Fra) Fortuneo-Samsic +55
19 Ilnur Zakarin (Rus) Katusha-Alpecin +60
20 Domenico Pozzovivo (Ita) Bahrain-Merida +66
21 Nairo Quintana (Col) Movistar Team +68
22 Rigoberto Uran (Col) EF Education First-Drapac p/b Cannondale +71
24 Daniel Martin (Irl) UAE Team Emirates +100

So in summary, all the actual GC contenders are already behind Froome.

To be honest I would have expected Froome to be a couple of minutes ahead of most of the others by now and trying to manage his fatigue related decline over the next couple of weeks to minimise losses in the mountains. I reckon Sky would probably have been hoping for the same - TTT, echelon possibilities and cobbles could have created some sizeable gaps.