Chris Froome salbutamol/Tour merged threads
Comments
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Topper harley wrote:aye but you are making it out that he doesn't think people with Asthma should be cycling and that's not what he said
What he said is directly supportive of my view. That’s because he’s a bright bloke and not some drone0 -
aye sure it is...
I doubt you gave a flying f*ck about Asthma until December 20170 -
Topper harley wrote:aye sure it is...
I doubt you gave a flying f*ck about Asthma until December 2017
I don’t give one now, what’s your point?0 -
Typically awful piece by Dan Roan on the BBC news website. I wish he would just fack off.0
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Agreed. Roan is becoming more of a pr1ck month by month. Keep pedalling Dan, that Icarus 2 film role you so crave is just slipping away from you... Wonder what happens when Wiggins bites back, as he so will?0
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Vino'sGhost wrote:Topper harley wrote:aye sure it is...
I doubt you gave a flying f*ck about Asthma until December 2017
I don’t give one now, what’s your point?
you know your point, your agenda is clear0 -
Topper harley wrote:Vino'sGhost wrote:Topper harley wrote:aye sure it is...
I doubt you gave a flying f*ck about Asthma until December 2017
I don’t give one now, what’s your point?
you know your point, your agenda is clear
Perhaps you could try and explain?0 -
you are saying people with asthma shouldn't race, G said they could ban all the athama treatment and the asthmatics could work in a office instead of cycling ...totally different
did you give a dam about cyclist with asthma before froome got asked to explain an abnormal result? no you didnt0 -
Topper harley wrote:you are saying people with asthma shouldn't race, G said they could ban all the athama treatment and the asthmatics could work in a office instead of cycling ...totally different
did you give a dam about cyclist with asthma before froome got asked to explain an abnormal result? no you didnt
No I didn’t give a dam then and I don’t give a dam now. Why should I?
I’ve never said cyclists with asthma shouldn’t race. Your missing the point spectacularly.0 -
mfin wrote:DeVlaeminck wrote:We've been through this, basically where do you draw the line, is ibruprofen ok? Caffeine ? Nicotine? Hi5 sports drink?
We want as many people playing sport as possible, if literally millions of people with asthma and other conditions that are controlled through medication are banned from competitive sport then how does that benefit society?
Just picking up on a point, you are implying that more people doing "competitive sport" "benefits society". Why?
I could agree that more people exercising benefits society, but "competitive sport"? Really?
Yes because a lot of people exercise through competitive sport. For a lot of people fitness is a byproduct of taking part in sport not the reason they compete.[Castle Donington Ladies FC - going up in '22]0 -
Vino'sGhost wrote:just to recap
my comments on asthma drugs etc apply to elite sport, its my view, some people dont agree with it. By the way heres a good G quote for you "people with asthma should go and work in an office"
So at some level they are banned? I don't think it's that simple distinguishing where elite starts and non- elite ends. A youth football academy? A national A road race ? I'm not saying it would be impossible but why should say 3rd cats have to compete against people on meds if pros don't?
Doesn't G need treatment for his spleen or lack of a spleen ?[Castle Donington Ladies FC - going up in '22]0 -
DeVlaeminck wrote:Vino'sGhost wrote:just to recap
my comments on asthma drugs etc apply to elite sport, its my view, some people dont agree with it. By the way heres a good G quote for you "people with asthma should go and work in an office"
So at some level they are banned? I don't think it's that simple distinguishing where elite starts and non- elite ends. A youth football academy? A national A road race ? I'm not saying it would be impossible but why should say 3rd cats have to compete against people on meds if pros don't?
Doesn't G need treatment for his spleen or lack of a spleen ?
I take your point about thirdcats but it’s amateur sport, a pastime. My comment is about elite sports the best if the best. Each federation could decide its own qualifying criteria0 -
Maybe they have.Vino'sGhost wrote:DeVlaeminck wrote:Vino'sGhost wrote:just to recap
my comments on asthma drugs etc apply to elite sport, its my view, some people dont agree with it. By the way heres a good G quote for you "people with asthma should go and work in an office"
So at some level they are banned? I don't think it's that simple distinguishing where elite starts and non- elite ends. A youth football academy? A national A road race ? I'm not saying it would be impossible but why should say 3rd cats have to compete against people on meds if pros don't?
Doesn't G need treatment for his spleen or lack of a spleen ?
I take your point about thirdcats but it’s amateur sport, a pastime. My comment is about elite sports the best if the best. Each federation could decide its own qualifying criteria
It simply varies from where you think it should be.The above may be fact, or fiction, I may be serious, I may be jesting.
I am not sure. You have no chance.Veronese68 wrote:PB is the most sensible person on here.0 -
orraloon wrote:Agreed. Roan is becoming more of a pr1ck month by month. Keep pedalling Dan, that Icarus 2 film role you so crave is just slipping away from you... Wonder what happens when Wiggins bites back, as he so will?
What a breast he is:
“For many, it will restore trust when it is most needed, and the narrative has certainly shifted. In the interviews that Thomas conducts on various television studio sofas in the coming days, the questions will no doubt focus on his upbringing, personal story and emotions, rather than on the specific details of how he managed to lose weight, while retaining power, and transform himself from Olympic pursuit rider, to Grand Tour champion
Thomas cannot avoid the fact that he has has been part of Team Sky since their formation in 2010. And he cannot avoid the fact they have now won six of the past seven Tours, a reign that will inevitably evoke suspicion, alongside admiration, jealousy and increasing apathy.
He cannot help the fact that his was the first victory following the various crises, mistakes and mysteries of recent years - something which perhaps explains the dramatic decline in television audiences for the race.
He cannot escape the association.
Now Thomas has won, some will find it easier to believe. But for others, it will understandably change nothing.
Too much has happened in both the distant - and much more recent past - for them to share in the joy and excitement that this victory once would have brought.”Giant Trance X 2010
Specialized Tricross Sport
My Dad's old racer
Trek Marlin 29er 20120 -
the article don wrote:orraloon wrote:Agreed. Roan is becoming more of a pr1ck month by month. Keep pedalling Dan, that Icarus 2 film role you so crave is just slipping away from you... Wonder what happens when Wiggins bites back, as he so will?
What a breast he is
He's not that useful.
What is the point of that article if not to just keep stirring the shiit? That's the sort of bo11ocks you'd expect from the worst of the gutter press. He's just trying to keep himself relevant. Total dog-dirt.It's only a bit of sport, Mun. Relax and enjoy the racing.0 -
Well that was a load of stirring if something brown. Does he have any appreciation for the sport of GT cycling? I mean does he hate the sport or something?I don't know if he understands or knows much about about it.
I think BBC needs some better sports reporters. If he's he best one for reporting on cycling then they certainly need new talent or even any talent.0 -
He's a bleepin' sports editor. Balance? Impartiality? Nah, boxxox to that when I've got an agenda, an increasingly false and pointless agenda. Effing disgrace to a national broadcaster.0
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Thanks Topper for providing the full quote. Selective quoting like this is a pretty pernicious thing Vino.Vino'sGhost wrote:
So we’re agreed he said it then? I agree with him.Topper harley wrote:
you snake, put the full quote upVino'sGhost wrote:just to recap
my comments on asthma drugs etc apply to elite sport, its my view, some people dont agree with it. By the way heres a good G quote for you "people with asthma should go and work in an office"
Thomas, who told us he’s never had a TUE himself, said the authorities “should do more to take out grey area.
“Brad ticked all the boxes,” he continued, “but the issue is how they dish them out, what’s involved.
“If someone has asthma and it reduces their performance by 8 per cent but they take a drug and it increases it by 12, how do you even measure that?
“It’s a hard one but at the end of the day you could just ban all that stuff anyway. If you’ve got asthma, go and work in an office or something,” he added.0 -
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Mab2444 wrote:
Thanks Topper for providing the full quote. Selective quoting like this is a pretty pernicious thing Vino.Vino'sGhost wrote:
So we’re agreed he said it then? I agree with him.Topper harley wrote:
you snake, put the full quote upVino'sGhost wrote:just to recap
my comments on asthma drugs etc apply to elite sport, its my view, some people dont agree with it. By the way heres a good G quote for you "people with asthma should go and work in an office"
Thomas, who told us he’s never had a TUE himself, said the authorities “should do more to take out grey area.
“Brad ticked all the boxes,” he continued, “but the issue is how they dish them out, what’s involved.
“If someone has asthma and it reduces their performance by 8 per cent but they take a drug and it increases it by 12, how do you even measure that?
“It’s a hard one but at the end of the day you could just ban all that stuff anyway. If you’ve got asthma, go and work in an office or something,” he added.
He makes an interesting comment about the effect of non performance improving asthma medication too, perhaps the full quote would have been even better0 -
the article don wrote:orraloon wrote:Agreed. Roan is becoming more of a pr1ck month by month. Keep pedalling Dan, that Icarus 2 film role you so crave is just slipping away from you... Wonder what happens when Wiggins bites back, as he so will?
What a breast he is: u
“For many, it will restore trust when it is most needed, and the narrative has certainly shifted. In the interviews that Thomas conducts on various television studio sofas in the coming days, the questions will no doubt focus on his upbringing, personal story and emotions, rather than on the specific details of how he managed to lose weight, while retaining power, and transform himself from Olympic pursuit rider, to Grand Tour champion
Thomas cannot avoid the fact that he has has been part of Team Sky since their formation in 2010. And he cannot avoid the fact they have now won six of the past seven Tours, a reign that will inevitably evoke suspicion, alongside admiration, jealousy and increasing apathy.
He cannot help the fact that his was the first victory following the various crises, mistakes and mysteries of recent years - something which perhaps explains the dramatic decline in television audiences for the race.
He cannot escape the association.
Now Thomas has won, some will find it easier to believe. But for others, it will understandably change nothing.
Too much has happened in both the distant - and much more recent past - for them to share in the joy and excitement that this victory once would have brought.”
His article might not be in the spirit of a pat on the back well earned for Thomas but it addresses the facts.
I know as afar as sky is concerned around here there are no facts just bad luck and coincidences but non the less it’s a fair if uncomfortable piece.0 -
Vino'sGhost wrote:the article don wrote:orraloon wrote:Agreed. Roan is becoming more of a pr1ck month by month. Keep pedalling Dan, that Icarus 2 film role you so crave is just slipping away from you... Wonder what happens when Wiggins bites back, as he so will?
What a breast he is: u
“For many, it will restore trust when it is most needed, and the narrative has certainly shifted. In the interviews that Thomas conducts on various television studio sofas in the coming days, the questions will no doubt focus on his upbringing, personal story and emotions, rather than on the specific details of how he managed to lose weight, while retaining power, and transform himself from Olympic pursuit rider, to Grand Tour champion
Thomas cannot avoid the fact that he has has been part of Team Sky since their formation in 2010. And he cannot avoid the fact they have now won six of the past seven Tours, a reign that will inevitably evoke suspicion, alongside admiration, jealousy and increasing apathy.
He cannot help the fact that his was the first victory following the various crises, mistakes and mysteries of recent years - something which perhaps explains the dramatic decline in television audiences for the race.
He cannot escape the association.
Now Thomas has won, some will find it easier to believe. But for others, it will understandably change nothing.
Too much has happened in both the distant - and much more recent past - for them to share in the joy and excitement that this victory once would have brought.”
His article might not be in the spirit of a pat on the back well earned for Thomas but it addresses the facts.
I know as afar as sky is concerned around here there are no facts just bad luck and coincidences but non the less it’s a fair if uncomfortable piece.
B*llocks, the facts.
Here's what a fact looks like: There a isn't shred evidence of any kind of breaking, bending or entering any grey area of WADA rules, on Thomas's resume.
The only thing that vile hypocrite, Roan is interested in addressing, is his own agenda.
He does this through a mix of innuendo, Clinic theory and the old guilt by association, cliche.
Facts need not apply."Science is a tool for cheaters". An anonymous French PE teacher.0 -
Vino'sGhost wrote:the article don wrote:
His article might not be in the spirit of a pat on the back well earned for Thomas but it addresses the facts.
I know as afar as sky is concerned around here there are no facts just bad luck and coincidences but non the less it’s a fair if uncomfortable piece.
I know you don't like to answer my questions, but i'm genuinely interested what the facts are. Is this just part of a larger article because i don't see any facts in this extract.0 -
Facts are sky are a dodgy team. Anyone in that team is guilty of being part of that regime of cheating. Plus they have too much money and are ruining the sport.
Facts are non-existent. You can't be certain evidence presented to the relevant authorities are true or not.
Facts are pieces of evidence presented to the relevant authorities and are weighed up by the relevant authorities experts on the matters as most probably true, before a decision is made.
Three alternative views. The view of the irrational who will never accept sky, Froome and anyone associated with that setup (first option). The third option is, IMHO, the most sensible approach. We are never going to see conclusive proof of guilt or innocent so for the good of the sport and our enjoyment of it we have to go by the decisions of the relevant authorities on any suspected case of cheating.
The second option is the difficult one to address. People who follow this option wants the impossible to provide absolutes or they will assume sky are cheating. It is the same story in the fight to address tobacco as a substance that is not healthy but harms life. The tobacco industry, AFAIK, used similar kinds of arguments as people following the second option. That is "I want complete certainty in the proof or it's not true'. Those who take the view mmr vaccine causes autism despite the majority of studies made since the original dodgy study by the ne England doctor are further examples.
As far as I am concerned this thread is the realm of those with the same view as the second option above and their enablers who try to debate the topic with them. Co-dependency is I think the right word for it. And as with cases of drug addiction and alcoholism where this occurs it's not healthy to continue.
My treatment is to no longer feed the addiction. Let this thread die out with only the addicts who don't want to accept the decisions of the relevant authorities posting.0 -
inseine wrote:Vino'sGhost wrote:the article don wrote:
His article might not be in the spirit of a pat on the back well earned for Thomas but it addresses the facts.
I know as afar as sky is concerned around here there are no facts just bad luck and coincidences but non the less it’s a fair if uncomfortable piece.
I know you don't like to answer my questions, but i'm genuinely interested what the facts are. Is this just part of a larger article because i don't see any facts in this extract.
You're right, there are no facts, sky kept a complete secure copy of riders medical records, sky didn't send a jiffy bag anywhere, ever. Wiggins TUEs were only taking advantage of the rules at the time. Other sky doctors didn't think there was anything dodgy going on. Chris Froome didn't return an AAF that needed investigating because A) we shouldn't have known about it so it didn't really happen and
following some unsupportable bs they decided all was fine. Also why would he do it since it has no benefit at all.
similar to "He'd never do it because he beat cancer and he's the most tested athlete in the world. WHERE IS THE EVIDENCE, correct there is non"
Nobody anywhere ever has been tainted through guilt by association. Ever.
The article is fine if unpalatable.0 -
Tangled Metal wrote:My treatment is to no longer feed the addiction. Let this thread die out with only the addicts who don't want to accept the decisions of the relevant authorities posting.
My issue isn't with Vino, he's just an incorrigible stirrer, it's with Roan p*ssing in the champagne, just for the troll value.
Even flipping Matt Lawton, while churning out the usual bile towards Sky, in his after Tour piece managed to say this:-Team Sky deserve the criticism they get, but Geraint Thomas has dared us to believe he's the perfect poster boy
In Paris on Sunday the chorus of disapproval for Team Sky wasn't present
The events of the last two years have taken a sledgehammer to Team Sky
Even now the team's former doctor remains subject of an inquiry by the GMC
But Geraint Thomas, all in yellow on Sunday, deserves the benefit of the doubt
But the sceptics also need to consider the counter-argument, which in the case of Thomas is actually fairly compelling.
While Sky deserve much of the criticism they have received, in Thomas they now at least have a powerful response.
His performance here in France has dared us to believe, dared us to admire this engaging 32-year-old from Cardiff even if we maintain a dimmer view of his employers.
When one considers the accusations that have been levelled at Sky, they are largely focused on an abuse of the medical exemption system and an unethical use of asthma medication.
Well, Thomas, as he confirmed in a side room at the media centre at the end of Saturday’s time trial, is not asthmatic, does not therefore use asthma medication and has never — even when contesting a Tour with a fracture of the pelvis — applied for a therapeutic use exemption. He struggled on that year using only painkillers.
He also insisted, in the wake of a parliamentary report that highlighted the large quantities of corticosteroids in the medical room at the National Cycling Centre in Manchester, that it had never even occurred to him to use cortisone for weight loss.
Thomas is not some flash in the pan, not a rider who has suddenly come good. He followed junior success in Paris-Roubaix with Olympic team pursuit gold at the tender age of 22. His talent as a road racer has long been evident too, even if he has so often been forced to sacrifice himself in the service of team-mates. In particular Froome.
And while history demands that we continue to regard any Tour winner with a healthy degree of cynicism, the man who rolled into Paris in yellow on Sunday night at least deserves the benefit of the doubt."Science is a tool for cheaters". An anonymous French PE teacher.0 -
Vino'sGhost wrote:inseine wrote:Vino'sGhost wrote:the article don wrote:
His article might not be in the spirit of a pat on the back well earned for Thomas but it addresses the facts.
I know as afar as sky is concerned around here there are no facts just bad luck and coincidences but non the less it’s a fair if uncomfortable piece.
I know you don't like to answer my questions, but i'm genuinely interested what the facts are. Is this just part of a larger article because i don't see any facts in this extract.
You're right, there are no facts, sky kept a complete secure copy of riders medical records, sky didn't send a jiffy bag anywhere, ever. Wiggins TUEs were only taking advantage of the rules at the time. Other sky doctors didn't think there was anything dodgy going on. Chris Froome didn't return an AAF that needed investigating because A) we shouldn't have known about it so it didn't really happen and following some unsupportable bs they decided all was fine. Also why would he do it since it has no benefit at all.
similar to "He'd never do it because he beat cancer and he's the most tested athlete in the world. WHERE IS THE EVIDENCE, correct there is non"
Nobody anywhere ever has been tainted through guilt by association. Ever.
The article is fine if unpalatable.
You could probably taint every rider with this sort of insightful investigative research. I know that ignorance is bliss, but inversely, how do you get any pleasure out of cycling, unless you actually like the fact that they're all cheating?0 -
i love cycling, i love the tour, ive loved the way Thomas won.
i dont believe in Father Christmas0 -
Vino'sGhost wrote:i love cycling, i love the tour, ive loved the way Thomas won.
i dont believe in Father Christmas
Ok, fair enough. Weird but fair enough. I don’t see you posting much about the actual racing but maybe you’re just too excited to type.0
