Has the bottom fallen out of Elite racing in the UK?
Comments
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Parkrun clearly attracts a wide range of abilities and fitness levels, including regular 'Elite' atheletes in some places, it's a great idea and has been a huge success .
But an Elite level in any sport is where young athletes might aspire to and if BCF are not willing to back racing then clearly their priorities now lay elsewhere and its participation where the money is at now and inclusion is more important (if that drives revenue).0 -
gsk82 wrote:I think there'll also be a number on long time organisers who have just had enough and, unfortunately the new generation of cyclists have no interest is giving anything back.
A very valid point. A concern I voiced a few years ago was the rise of clubs such as Road.cc and Rapha. They offer lots of incentives and cycling lifestyle stuff and also B.C. membership which entitles members to race. What they don't do is organise races so an element of bringing through race organisers is lost.
Also when the IOM bid for the 2016 Nat Champs they had a hard fought contest with Stockton and lost. The following year I don't think anyone else had pitched at all and so the IOM had it almost by default.
The hopeful legacy though is that there might be an IOM premier 2 day event commencing next year but it is very much in the planning stages atm.0 -
First up, it's not called the BCF. The name changed years ago when they merged with the BCCA.
My understanding of National Champs (all disciplines) is that you tender for the honour to host the event and without pretty significant sponsorship you are likely to lose money by promoting the event. For off-road / closed road events the cost is high but for road racing at that level with a rolling road closure it's becoming unsustainable. Even lower level road racing is becoming too beuracratic and expensive to run safely. It would be interesting to know if all levy funds raised by BC in road racing are invested back into supporting road racing.
One thing I'm pretty sure of though is that any issues aren't related to so called scandals, away from road racing I would say cycle sport in he UK is still thriving. I haven't organised anything for a few years now mainly for reasons stated above but when I did there was plenty of appetite still from a participation perspective.0 -
gsk82 wrote:I think there'll also be a number on long time organisers who have just had enough and, unfortunately the new generation of cyclists have no interest is giving anything back.
Theres definitely some truth in that. All entitlement and no responsibility.0 -
awavey wrote:andyp wrote:gsk82 wrote:RayParker wrote:Granted and that is sadly a generational thing. In local football leagues are folding as players are not willing to give anything back and help run things once they have stopped playing.
But we are talking about Elite level cycling here, teams that at present have sponsors and riders.
At this level are we relying on older volunteers to support BCF, why on earth don't they they pay a staff to help do this?
What do BCF use their income for otherwise?
No one knows. BC won't pay to put on a race. Races are only there to make money for them. They're a leach on the sport.
BC publish their accounts, in summary form, in their annual report each year.
They are the governing body of the sport, not a promoter. You can't do both, as you create a conflict of interest.
but their aim surely has to be to promote cycling as the sport that they govern, because if they dont, there wont be a sport for them to govern anymore, I mean Im not saying these are great examples of sports bodies, but the FA, the ECB, rugby, hockey, rowing,basketball, motorsport etc etc have no problem stepping in to try to promote their sport from grass roots levels and up through their structure to the elite level because they know thats how you create your elite level talent pool that go on to international success.
BC shouldnt be able to sit there and go well its not our problem that no-one can arrange an elite road series anymore because it costs too much to put on, while name checking one of the worlds largest banks everytime they open their mouths, I mean they even put the damn logo on my membership card now, so why cant HSBC fund the shortfall, thats the deal they have isnt it ?? its crazy to think last year it was called the HSBC road series, their logos were everywhere on the coverage and yet it seems like they or BC didnt provide any useful contribution or assistance for it at all.
Thats a very good point. HSBC get a lot for not a lot of investment. But they're a bank they're not likely to be altruistic.0 -
Disclaimer - I work for BC, although not in the cyclesport dept. Lots of reasons, including many already mentioned upthread. We are one of the richer NGBs, but like all sports, funding from Sport England, UK Sport and HSBC is ringfenced for certain things; the organisation can't just spend it on anything and auditors are sent in to check what it is being spent on. Some sponsorship deals are value in kind rather than bankable cash. Funding can be cut at a moment's notice - UKS and SE threatened this if we didn't agree to their new code of governance. Races are becoming more expensive to put on - cost are increasing, councils are skint, some police forces just don't have the manpower and a couple are becoming more hostile to racing on the highways. The number of people wanting to race has increased massively, and so sometimes there is a shortage of volunteers - loads of people want to race, but you'd be surprised how few want to put back into the sport and become a commissare, or marshall. This means that officials are sometimes being shared between regions,and the region or race organiser is is having to pay mileage for 100 miles rather than 20 miles.
Insurance is a real challenge - it only takes a couple of accidents resulting in catastrophic, life-changing injuries or fatalities (which we've had)to make the organisation uninsurable - a large proportion of your membership subscription, licence fee and race levy goes towards what is now (I think) a large six-figure annual premium. Even if we're not at fault, the legal fees can be enormous. It goes without saying that these also really upset the staff at HQ who love riding as much as anyone and want to make sure that everyone has a good time and goes home safe. This is why every circuit and course is being risk assessed again, much to the wrath of some of the older race organisers who can't understand why they can't have as many riders on a closed road circuit as they used to in the old days. Some of your money goes to the regions, to pay for transponders, barriers, mileage for volunteers etc, and we can only put the levies and membership up so much before there's a backlash from the members.
Anyway, just a view from the inside.Commute: Chadderton - Sportcity0 -
^thanks for that, useful insight msmancunia
at least one poster will be bound to reply with a tittish response, but I appreciate another perspective0 -
msmancunia wrote:Disclaimer - I work for BC, although not in the cyclesport dept. Lots of reasons, including many already mentioned upthread. We are one of the richer NGBs, but like all sports, funding from Sport England, UK Sport and HSBC is ringfenced for certain things; the organisation can't just spend it on anything and auditors are sent in to check what it is being spent on. Some sponsorship deals are value in kind rather than bankable cash. Funding can be cut at a moment's notice - UKS and SE threatened this if we didn't agree to their new code of governance. Races are becoming more expensive to put on - cost are increasing, councils are skint, some police forces just don't have the manpower and a couple are becoming more hostile to racing on the highways. The number of people wanting to race has increased massively, and so sometimes there is a shortage of volunteers - loads of people want to race, but you'd be surprised how few want to put back into the sport and become a commissare, or marshall. This means that officials are sometimes being shared between regions,and the region or race organiser is is having to pay mileage for 100 miles rather than 20 miles.
Insurance is a real challenge - it only takes a couple of accidents resulting in catastrophic, life-changing injuries or fatalities (which we've had)to make the organisation uninsurable - a large proportion of your membership subscription, licence fee and race levy goes towards what is now (I think) a large six-figure annual premium. Even if we're not at fault, the legal fees can be enormous. It goes without saying that these also really upset the staff at HQ who love riding as much as anyone and want to make sure that everyone has a good time and goes home safe. This is why every circuit and course is being risk assessed again, much to the wrath of some of the older race organisers who can't understand why they can't have as many riders on a closed road circuit as they used to in the old days. Some of your money goes to the regions, to pay for transponders, barriers, mileage for volunteers etc, and we can only put the levies and membership up so much before there's a backlash from the members.
Anyway, just a view from the inside.
LVRC put on an awesome years racing at lower cost and with the same considerations. There are too many excuses from BC.0 -
're. Parkrun. I have three local Parkruns. All are treated as recruiting grounds for local running clubs. At every Parkrun there are weeks when the local club will volunteer en-masse to cover the event, so the regular organisers get a break and a chance to run.
I'm not sure how cycling clubs ( or BC) can generate that sort of grassroots involvement, but long-term survival and development requires that sort of encouragement.0 -
And they'll probably continue to do so. Well, until some 45 year old bloke who's only been riding a couple of years, has never raced in a bunch, never come up through the club system as a kid, (but is convinced he knows what he's doing) fails to hold his line, takes another rider out, who snaps his spinal cord and ends up in a wheelchair for the rest of his life. Then the lawyers and insurers get involved, and before you know it, it's a two-year legal case while everyone blames each other -riders, promoters, commissaires, etc, and the insurer bangs a £3,000,000 reserve on the LVRC's policy. Then it all gets a bit more serious.
Hopefully it'll never happen, but it could just be a matter of time.Commute: Chadderton - Sportcity0 -
mrfpb wrote:
I'm not sure how cycling clubs ( or BC) can generate that sort of grassroots involvement, but long-term survival and development requires that sort of encouragement.
If clubs didn't accept entries to their races from these grubby little race teams, maybe it'd stop every third cat in the country jumping ship to one as soon as they get the golden 15 points. Clubs around the country are scraping around for race marshals who don't race themselves, because all the racers have vanished in search of an ego boost."Unfortunately these days a lot of people don’t understand the real quality of a bike" Ernesto Colnago0 -
msmancunia wrote:And they'll probably continue to do so. Well, until some 45 year old bloke who's only been riding a couple of years, has never raced in a bunch, never come up through the club system as a kid, (but is convinced he knows what he's doing) fails to hold his line, takes another rider out, who snaps his spinal cord and ends up in a wheelchair for the rest of his life. Then the lawyers and insurers get involved, and before you know it, it's a two-year legal case while everyone blames each other -riders, promoters, commissaires, etc, and the insurer bangs a £3,000,000 reserve on the LVRC's policy. Then it all gets a bit more serious.
Hopefully it'll never happen, but it could just be a matter of time.
There are plenty of muppets like that in the bc system too. Quite strong but no experience, with a f everyone else attitude, i even heard one guy saying its not his problem he has only been doing it a little while, he cant be expected to look before he moves. It nearly ended in a punch up. As for club system and kids, its not helpful allowing juniors into 3/4 events when theyre idea of leaning on people to get in a different position leads to them being lent back on and bounced out only to have their parents jumping up and down.
The issue is not the club system it’s people and from what ive seen of lvrc it has high levels of ability experience and awareness. Certainley more than is obvious at crashfests like castlecoome.0 -
gsk82 wrote:mrfpb wrote:
I'm not sure how cycling clubs ( or BC) can generate that sort of grassroots involvement, but long-term survival and development requires that sort of encouragement.
If clubs didn't accept entries to their races from these grubby little race teams, maybe it'd stop every third cat in the country jumping ship to one as soon as they get the golden 15 points. Clubs around the country are scraping around for race marshals who don't race themselves, because all the racers have vanished in search of an ego boost.
This is the way. If you dont put in, you cant take out. Perhaps a register of volunteering from grass ropts to pro. In fact since froome isnt racing at the mo perhaps a couple of sunday marshalling stints will show the ay from the front. The top riders benefit disproportionately from bc funds and facilities, they should do their bit too. (Acknowledging that some of them do of course)0 -
Yes, there are people like that in the BC system, which is why we're in the position that we are. It could be argued that racing has increased in popularity to the extent that we're struggling to keep up with the resources that we have. Someone who has come up through the club system will usually have been coached by the seniors - even if it's just a couple of tips on how a kid is riding during a B ride on a Sunday club run, or sometimes it's more formal - but it's better than a grown man on a nice bike who's done a couple of decent sportive times, can flick an elbow, and thinks he's now a pro.
We need more people involved to help administrate the sport at all levels because we can't do it on our own. The regional set-up is very road and track heavy, and like it or not, the dirt disciplines are growing in popularity, especially cyclocross. One look at our AGM room tells you all you need to know - mostly men, mostly road/track, mostly old - some are in their mid-eighties. There's an argument to be made for the voice of experience but also for younger, forward thinking people! And this needs to come from the bottom up, from the membership.
We've had our hand forced to have independents on the board, and to be fair, they have done a great job using the non-cycling skills they have (having twelve people who don't know the first thing about finance approving a multi-million pound budget is ridiculous, for example). But we also need people with good, domestic cycling knowledge and experience - of marshalling, regulations, the ins and outs of running racing. So if you want to help change things, then help. Train to be a commisaire - there's a really clear pathway all the way up to officiating at international races. Challenge your regional board, go to their meetings, get on the regional board, be a national councillor, get on our board. Don't just ride your bike - get involved. Before you know it you could be helping run our sport.Commute: Chadderton - Sportcity0 -
msmancunia wrote:Yes, there are people like that in the BC system, which is why we're in the position that we are. It could be argued that racing has increased in popularity to the extent that we're struggling to keep up with the resources that we have. Someone who has come up through the club system will usually have been coached by the seniors - even if it's just a couple of tips on how a kid is riding during a B ride on a Sunday club run, or sometimes it's more formal - but it's better than a grown man on a nice bike who's done a couple of decent sportive times, can flick an elbow, and thinks he's now a pro.
We need more people involved to help administrate the sport at all levels because we can't do it on our own. The regional set-up is very road and track heavy, and like it or not, the dirt disciplines are growing in popularity, especially cyclocross. One look at our AGM room tells you all you need to know - mostly men, mostly road/track, mostly old - some are in their mid-eighties. There's an argument to be made for the voice of experience but also for younger, forward thinking people! And this needs to come from the bottom up, from the membership.
We've had our hand forced to have independents on the board, and to be fair, they have done a great job using the non-cycling skills they have (having twelve people who don't know the first thing about finance approving a multi-million pound budget is ridiculous, for example). But we also need people with good, domestic cycling knowledge and experience - of marshalling, regulations, the ins and outs of running racing. So if you want to help change things, then help. Train to be a commisaire - there's a really clear pathway all the way up to officiating at international races. Challenge your regional board, go to their meetings, get on the regional board, be a national councillor, get on our board. Don't just ride your bike - get involved. Before you know it you could be helping run our sport.
I think we're singing the same song with the exception that I'm certain BC could be improving access by reducing red tape for organisers and cost for competitors.
I cant talk for current conditions in France and Belgium but it always used to be the case that there were loads of crits and properly marshalled closed road races and the costs were a fraction of the smaller less competitive alternatives in the UK.0 -
There i always the Daverayner method of growing the next generation of Elites if other opportunity ceases.
http://www.daveraynerfund.co.uk/2018-supported-riders/0 -
B.C. could help by not charging a fee to organisers of events like the Nat Champs. Everything else has to be paid for by the organisers so it is expensive enough0
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msmancunia wrote:Yes, there are people like that in the BC system, which is why we're in the position that we are. It could be argued that racing has increased in popularity to the extent that we're struggling to keep up with the resources that we have. Someone who has come up through the club system will usually have been coached by the seniors - even if it's just a couple of tips on how a kid is riding during a B ride on a Sunday club run, or sometimes it's more formal - but it's better than a grown man on a nice bike who's done a couple of decent sportive times, can flick an elbow, and thinks he's now a pro.
We've had our hand forced to have independents on the board, and to be fair, they have done a great job using the non-cycling skills they have (having twelve people who don't know the first thing about finance approving a multi-million pound budget is ridiculous, for example). But we also need people with good, domestic cycling knowledge and experience - of marshalling, regulations, the ins and outs of running racing. So if you want to help change things, then help. Train to be a commisaire - there's a really clear pathway all the way up to officiating at international races. Challenge your regional board, go to their meetings, get on the regional board, be a national councillor, get on our board. Don't just ride your bike - get involved. Before you know it you could be helping run our sport.
The situation with dangerous riding hasnt been addressed by BC, a simple accreditation scheme, like the track one could be introduced but from my perspective, BC want membership and licence fees to fund the never ending chase for medals, the support given to youths is outstanding BUT once said youth and especially girls, become juniors, the support falls of a cliff UNLESS the youth goes onto ODP.
So, back to the OP, why would BC offer financial support for elite level racing? in the main, these elites are not going to be winning medals at international level.
I went down the route of joining a regional board, total waste of time, its an old boys, misogynistic, network of mates.0 -
gsk82 wrote:mrfpb wrote:
I'm not sure how cycling clubs ( or BC) can generate that sort of grassroots involvement, but long-term survival and development requires that sort of encouragement.
If clubs didn't accept entries to their races from these grubby little race teams, maybe it'd stop every third cat in the country jumping ship to one as soon as they get the golden 15 points. Clubs around the country are scraping around for race marshals who don't race themselves, because all the racers have vanished in search of an ego boost.
I had a policy with my races of prioritising clubs from the region that organised races and then those from clubs outside the region who organised events mainly as I was fed up of a couple of race clubs that were hoovering up all the prizes and points while doing nothing in return. That said, membership of my club is thriving but it was still hard to get enough volunteers for road races as most of the hundreds of new members were families and the adults were only interested in the stuff their kids do.0 -
Pross wrote:gsk82 wrote:mrfpb wrote:
I'm not sure how cycling clubs ( or BC) can generate that sort of grassroots involvement, but long-term survival and development requires that sort of encouragement.
If clubs didn't accept entries to their races from these grubby little race teams, maybe it'd stop every third cat in the country jumping ship to one as soon as they get the golden 15 points. Clubs around the country are scraping around for race marshals who don't race themselves, because all the racers have vanished in search of an ego boost.
I had a policy with my races of prioritising clubs from the region that organised races and then those from clubs outside the region who organised events mainly as I was fed up of a couple of race clubs that were hoovering up all the prizes and points while doing nothing in return. That said, membership of my club is thriving but it was still hard to get enough volunteers for road races as most of the hundreds of new members were families and the adults were only interested in the stuff their kids do.
+1 for that approach Pross. Non- organising clubs really get my goat.0 -
Joining a club has certain obligations.. one of them is pass on the AGM with its 1 free drink , but not pass on the corner standing duty with a flag once in a while. If you choose to join a road racing club , well does it not say on the tin?0
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Pross wrote:gsk82 wrote:mrfpb wrote:
I'm not sure how cycling clubs ( or BC) can generate that sort of grassroots involvement, but long-term survival and development requires that sort of encouragement.
If clubs didn't accept entries to their races from these grubby little race teams, maybe it'd stop every third cat in the country jumping ship to one as soon as they get the golden 15 points. Clubs around the country are scraping around for race marshals who don't race themselves, because all the racers have vanished in search of an ego boost.
I had a policy with my races of prioritising clubs from the region that organised races and then those from clubs outside the region who organised events mainly as I was fed up of a couple of race clubs that were hoovering up all the prizes and points while doing nothing in return. That said, membership of my club is thriving but it was still hard to get enough volunteers for road races as most of the hundreds of new members were families and the adults were only interested in the stuff their kids do.
BC are moving toward Accredited Marshall's and have been for a few years now, so ringing around for a helper isnt possible (where AMS are specified) as you cant mix ad hoc volunteers with A/Marshal's, the guys and gals standing holding a flag can be anyone, in your club or in none, as long as they ve BC membership.
Cycle racing is expensive enough, joining a team might be seen in a bad light by some but who forgoes free kit or entries, let alone in some cases, a bike?0 -
Lookyhere wrote:
The situation with dangerous riding hasnt been addressed by BC.
This. The last local race to me was 3 years ago. The organiser hasn't run another as there was a crash on the final sprint caused by inexperienced riders moving all over the place, and it took down half the field. The organiser then got hit with several compo claims!
The knock on effect was crippling for elite cycle races in this area as this organiser was also a local sponsor for larger races, including the national championships (in wales), the tour series and even the tob, but following this incident they stopped funding and supporting/organising races.0 -
Lookyhere wrote:Pross wrote:gsk82 wrote:mrfpb wrote:
I'm not sure how cycling clubs ( or BC) can generate that sort of grassroots involvement, but long-term survival and development requires that sort of encouragement.
If clubs didn't accept entries to their races from these grubby little race teams, maybe it'd stop every third cat in the country jumping ship to one as soon as they get the golden 15 points. Clubs around the country are scraping around for race marshals who don't race themselves, because all the racers have vanished in search of an ego boost.
I had a policy with my races of prioritising clubs from the region that organised races and then those from clubs outside the region who organised events mainly as I was fed up of a couple of race clubs that were hoovering up all the prizes and points while doing nothing in return. That said, membership of my club is thriving but it was still hard to get enough volunteers for road races as most of the hundreds of new members were families and the adults were only interested in the stuff their kids do.
BC are moving toward Accredited Marshall's and have been for a few years now, so ringing around for a helper isnt possible (where AMS are specified) as you cant mix ad hoc volunteers with A/Marshal's, the guys and gals standing holding a flag can be anyone, in your club or in none, as long as they ve BC membership.
Cycle racing is expensive enough, joining a team might be seen in a bad light by some but who forgoes free kit or entries, let alone in some cases, a bike?
We've been using CSAS marshals in Wales for years now as well as NEG bikes that have delegated powers but it adds yet another cost (and still relies on there being enough available as it's still voluntary). I can't recall the exact cost but I think the last race I did was about £100 per bike and £60 per static so you were looking at around £800 for marshals alone. Add on a first aid bike and you're getting close to a grand. However, you still need volunteers - two or three lead cars who have to be BC members and ideally have experience racing so they don't get in the way; drivers for up to three commisaires; prime judges; finish judges; people putting out and taking down signage and others to do the refreshments.
Once you get to National A races you also have to guarantee minimum prize funding of several thousand which in itself is an issue for most promoters.0 -
Pross wrote:Lookyhere wrote:Pross wrote:gsk82 wrote:mrfpb wrote:
I'm not sure how cycling clubs ( or BC) can generate that sort of grassroots involvement, but long-term survival and development requires that sort of encouragement.
If clubs didn't accept entries to their races from these grubby little race teams, maybe it'd stop every third cat in the country jumping ship to one as soon as they get the golden 15 points. Clubs around the country are scraping around for race marshals who don't race themselves, because all the racers have vanished in search of an ego boost.
I had a policy with my races of prioritising clubs from the region that organised races and then those from clubs outside the region who organised events mainly as I was fed up of a couple of race clubs that were hoovering up all the prizes and points while doing nothing in return. That said, membership of my club is thriving but it was still hard to get enough volunteers for road races as most of the hundreds of new members were families and the adults were only interested in the stuff their kids do.
BC are moving toward Accredited Marshall's and have been for a few years now, so ringing around for a helper isnt possible (where AMS are specified) as you cant mix ad hoc volunteers with A/Marshal's, the guys and gals standing holding a flag can be anyone, in your club or in none, as long as they ve BC membership.
Cycle racing is expensive enough, joining a team might be seen in a bad light by some but who forgoes free kit or entries, let alone in some cases, a bike?
We've been using CSAS marshals in Wales for years now as well as NEG bikes that have delegated powers but it adds yet another cost (and still relies on there being enough available as it's still voluntary). I can't recall the exact cost but I think the last race I did was about £100 per bike and £60 per static so you were looking at around £800 for marshals alone. Add on a first aid bike and you're getting close to a grand. However, you still need volunteers - two or three lead cars who have to be BC members and ideally have experience racing so they don't get in the way; drivers for up to three commisaires; prime judges; finish judges; people putting out and taking down signage and others to do the refreshments.
Once you get to National A races you also have to guarantee minimum prize funding of several thousand which in itself is an issue for most promoters.
Completely agree, there is a lot of expense and of course volunteers are always needs, we found it was the Marshalling that was always the ball ache,, you can always find some one to make the tea or line judge & driving a round in a nice warm car strangely wasn't an issue either lol! Comms were always booked way ahead.
I was really replying to the comment on standing around with a flag and searching around for Marshals, which BC are moving away from.
I remember once offering to withdraw from a race because they were a Marshal short and another when myself and the GF happened upon a race and ended up marshalling in it!
In England NEG dont have any powers bestowed on them to legally stop traffic (unless that has changed recently?) and AMS individuals have to agree to marshal a minimum number of races.0 -
Lookyhere wrote:In England NEG dont have any powers bestowed on them to legally stop traffic (unless that has changed recently?) and AMS individuals have to agree to marshal a minimum number of races.
I think Essex is the exception (or was a few years ago). I'm not sure if any other forces have allowed it since.0 -
+2 our club does a good job whenever we do something but there is a core of around 80/560+ that do the legwork.... to make that change would be good.Yellow Peril wrote:Pross wrote:gsk82 wrote:mrfpb wrote:
I'm not sure how cycling clubs ( or BC) can generate that sort of grassroots involvement, but long-term survival and development requires that sort of encouragement.
If clubs didn't accept entries to their races from these grubby little race teams, maybe it'd stop every third cat in the country jumping ship to one as soon as they get the golden 15 points. Clubs around the country are scraping around for race marshals who don't race themselves, because all the racers have vanished in search of an ego boost.
I had a policy with my races of prioritising clubs from the region that organised races and then those from clubs outside the region who organised events mainly as I was fed up of a couple of race clubs that were hoovering up all the prizes and points while doing nothing in return. That said, membership of my club is thriving but it was still hard to get enough volunteers for road races as most of the hundreds of new members were families and the adults were only interested in the stuff their kids do.
+1 for that approach Pross. Non- organising clubs really get my goat.
some race teams (sic) in our level of sport are pretty good at getting their tactics, but they also need to get races organised... (talking 2/3/4 cat stuff in the surrey league). there are some excellent examples of folk that do run races really well with limited resources, but it is in the minority...0 -
Yellow Peril wrote:B.C. could help by not charging a fee to organisers of events like the Nat Champs. Everything else has to be paid for by the organisers so it is expensive enough
THIS0 -
It's not just lack of interest that makes getting volunteers difficult, there's also a huge pull on time from different directions. That said, if you made volunteering or being part of a club that put on events a condition of entry (and then enforced it) that would make a difference.
Mostly when Ive marshalled on my own its a long day but on occasion with others its been good fun taking the pi ss0 -
Vino'sGhost wrote:It's not just lack of interest that makes getting volunteers difficult, there's also a huge pull on time from different directions. That said, if you made volunteering or being part of a club that put on events a condition of entry (and then enforced it) that would make a difference.
Mostly when Ive marshalled on my own its a long day but on occasion with others its been good fun taking the pi ss
This gets discussed every AGM at our club... the question then arises how do we go about enforcing it? (Given your comment about pull on time) We've lost one race this year due to lack of support and changed another to meet club demographic and get members racing.
There's always the argument about "race" teams not putting anything back in terms of organising and it's a valid point in most cases.0
