Marmotte 2017

DeVlaeminck

Is the first start 7am? So you'd probably have to be in Bourg by 6.30 which is an early start. I might be tempted to come over Thursday, register, set my bike up with chip etc and pay the camp site (Col Porteur?) in Bourg for a Saturday night pitch. Then turn up the night before with a pop up tent and a sleeping bag. There is plenty of space to park a car up in Bourg though if you decide to kip in the car.

DeVlaeminck

Or just park up by the supermarket and bung a pop up tent on the grass there - you'll be up early and gone.

frasermcampbell

It is pretty easy to sign in on the morning of the race at the feed station at the roundabout between Bourg and the start of ADH climb. I normally sign in around 6.00am as i like to get to the front of the first pen and it generally only takes 5 mins. It could take a little longer after this time as it gets busier?
I drive through from Basel the night before and camp at the campsite at the bottom of the ADH climb. They always have space. I also see people parking up along the road between Bourg and ADH climb the night before. There is a few small laybys or grass verges and I am guessing they sleep in the car or throw up a tent. If you come through on the Sunday morning it will need an early start and you may have to park up between Bourg and Allemont and then ride into town along the route, as the road to the start of the ADH climb gets pretty full even at 6.00am.

Personally, if I was you I would come through the night before and park up somewhere between Bourg and the start of the ADH climb and sign in around 6.00am. Much more relaxing and stress free than a longish morning drive and all the things that could go wrong

william39

Thanks both for the advice.

gavinbay

Yes forecast is now looking good for Sunday - and not at all bad (not too hot and not too cold).

This week however is awful, and really bad with a series of troughs and cold fronts Tues-Fri and I doubt if I'll be on the bike too much. In fact two mates coming out this week have postponed to August.

Today major school boy error in not packing a jacket as we both thought we'd miss the rain / storms forecast (we were doing a big chunk 135km of the 180km Etape route) and as we started the Col de Vars climb it started lashing it down with squally winds.

Climbing is not too bad as you're working hard, but temps dropped to 9 degrees and lower with the the windchill, was 30 in the valley - so at the Cafe at the top I asked the owner for a bin-bag which saved me on the long descent back down.

harry-s

No Marmotte for me this year.
Ai_1, the best food stop is about 2 miles after Valloire, lots of bread, cheese and fruit. It's worth fuelling up here ready for the Galibier and ADH. It depends how much food/weight you want to carry with you, although personally I've usually taken only a handful of gels on the bike. Glandon is a bun fight though, if you want to eat your own grub, this is the place to do it, and you've also got the benefit of a stopped clock. Your IM experience should see you ok with nutrition, I'm sure you're familiar with the warning signs.
One of our bunch last year was no climber, but was determined to get round. He arrived at ADH well after cut off, ignored any calls to stop, and just kept riding, he didn't have any problems. It must have been about 9:00 pm when he crossed the line.
Good luck all.

william39

Is it better taking two 750ml bidons and stopping less often to fill up but having extra weight to carry or taking two 500ml bidons and having to stop more often? I will probaly err on the side of caution and take two 750ml but interesting to see what others have done in the past.

vimfuego

I usually take two 750ml bidons with me on longer rides (I'm usually more worried about hydration than weight) & was planning on doing exactly that for the Marmotte. If you genuinely find you don't need the extra fluid / weight, just jettison some of the liquid, problem solved.

Anyway - looking forward to it. I'll be the one in the Harlequins jersey. Good luck & stay safe all.

narbs

We arrive tomorrow lunchtime and were planning to ride up to La Berarde in the afternoon. Not sure a soaking wet few hours on the first day will be of any benefit!

davidof

If you are planning water points this website will give you some clues

https://www.eau-cyclisme.com/

You could probably get away with a single bottle.

gavinbay

davidof wrote:

If you are planning water points this website will give you some clues

https://www.eau-cyclisme.com/

You could probably get away with a single bottle.

Interesting in that yesterday we were doing recce of the Etape stage looking out for water fountains and places to stash food in the villages that we could use rather than the official feeding points - and as I'm noticing more and more in the villages, many of the fountains are no longer working / water has been stopped, such as in Jausiers which is a major village when cycling Bonnette / Larche / Vars etc or those that are often have taps on.

So you'd have to be careful if relying just on that guide!!!!!

davidof

GavinBay wrote:

davidof wrote:

If you are planning water points this website will give you some clues

So you'd have to be careful if relying just on that guide!!!!!

Did you spot any in particular with that guide that don't work now? It is a community site so you can always update. It doesn't list Jausiers as having a working fountain.

Certainly in the Savoie a lot of the village fountains don't work at all. The Isere is much better generally.

The fountains in St Columban les Villards, Valloire and la Grave should be okay. You'd maybe want a top up before the Telegraph and Alpe d'Huez climbs though.

fenix

I do love this experiment - http://www.training4cyclists.com/how-mu ... lpe-dhuez/

According to this - 1800ml of water will cost you 1min 54 seconds extra on the Alpe. Not a huge amount at the end of the day and I'd think stopping several times more to refill, or even worse suffering for lack of water would probably slow you even more.

I guess France is like the UK - how many of our water fountains work ? When I was a kid there were loads more.

gavinbay

davidof wrote:

GavinBay wrote:

davidof wrote:

If you are planning water points this website will give you some clues

So you'd have to be careful if relying just on that guide!!!!!

Did you spot any in particular with that guide that don't work now? It is a community site so you can always update. It doesn't list Jausiers as having a working fountain.........

Sort of the reverse we spotted a few that were not on that guide (in the villages on the stretch to Barcelonnette from the lac) - you can see our diversions on my Strava track 8)

Plus we were also looking for ones that were more hidden away off the main road so would not be mobbed and where we could stash food.

We're probably going to be stashing food and water in a couple of spots on the day before which will save time as know what the bun fight is like at the food stops on both the Marmot and Etape.

DeVlaeminck

william39 wrote:

Is it better taking two 750ml bidons and stopping less often to fill up but having extra weight to carry or taking two 500ml bidons and having to stop more often? I will probaly err on the side of caution and take two 750ml but interesting to see what others have done in the past.

I would take 750s, I normally take two 1 litre bottles but wihout the usual 35 degree heat that may be overkill this year. My normal plan is stop on Glandon, stop in Valloire, refill bottles at top of Galibier and go to the end on that. I've never found the stops too difficult to get straight in and fill up but it may depend where you are in the field. I start with one bottle empty as you can get up the Glandon on one.

Certainly err on the side of caution, I know someone who rode through the Valloire stop as he had a bottle left and by half way up the Galibier he was out of juice and struggling.

ugo.santalucia

frasermcampbell wrote:

Ali 1, I like the denial that you are over thinking it then write a paragraph on inner tubes . The last guys advice is good. This will be my 6 La Marmotte running with times between 7 and 8 hours. From my experience.

- You can ride the route and take pictures and long stops anytime, but this is La Marmotte day so go for it. For sure you will feel crap but 3 hours after finishing you forget all of that.
- If you are concerned about the cut off at the bottom of the alp, then planning to have 1 hour stops is not the way to go. Really think about minimising time at stops, use them to fill up with water and grab food and eat on the bike. You should only consider longer stops if you have blown up (which is not in the plan, right!!)
- switching to a 32 cassette is a good choice. Trust me, you will use it. I would recommend using it early on in the ride. By the time you get to Galibier and for sure ADH you will be pushing squares and wishing for something bigger.
- Start to Glandon...This will be fast, and very busy. Everybody goes into the red here. Be disciplined there is no benefit to burning a match here. Grab a fast group and sit in.
-Glandon climb- ...It is much harder than the average gradiant indicates ( the av is lowre due to some down hills). Again be disciplined as it is easy to get carried away and try to match pace with others . Ignore what everybody else is doing as they are on their own journey. Sit high in your endurance or tempo zone and plan for 2 to 3 hrs of climbing. Avoid crossing your red line. Note, about a quarter of the way up there is a descent after a small hamlet, it finishes with a short and tight dog leg. Get your gearing sorted coming down this last section as it immediately kicks up to 10% after the turn. Lots of people get that wrong and come to a grinding halt. The Glandon food stop will be chaotic. If you are feeling good skip through it and stop for water at the bottom of the valley from the village fountains.
- Glandon descent - it is technical but neutralised so you can take your time. If you want to take a longer break somewhere in this section is the place to do it as your time will stop, but watch the cut off time). I always see lots of crashes at corners (dutch guys racing down it) and tube blow outs on this section. STAY OFF your breaks and enjoy it.
-Valley to Telegraph - You will have lots of group options here. DO NOT try this solo or lead a group as it is a long drag and would be mentally and physically demoralising. I normally go into the red a few times here trying to catch or stay in a group. If the group is too fast then drop off and wait for another one. As long as you are not constantly sitting in the red for long periods then accept that you will need to work hard occasionally to get the group benefit. It is worth it.
-Telegraph climb - Expect to climb for 1 to 2 hours. Again try to sit in your tempo zone. you will feel the fatigue now so even that may become difficult. There is a water stop at the bottom before the village and half way up.
- Galibier climb - it is a killer and everyone is now feeling the fatigue. You can probably forget about training zones now as your focus will be just to make forward progress and you may start to struggle to hit or sustain your higher end zones. It is a long drag for me from Valoire to Plan Lachat (the road is straight as an arrow) and I am almost relieved to hit the switchbacks. Just grind this out. If you have energy then push a little harder once past the car tunnel near the top.
- Galibier descent - Technical for the first 1km and then wide, curving and fast roads. Stay off the breaks (easier to do than on Glandon descent). Again try to get into a group here. It is a long way even if downhill. Once, I had the misfortune to do this solo as I could not catch or stay in a group and it was hard. I wasted a lot of energy and was much slower than other times. Groups normally form about a quarter of the way down. The new temporary road is fun but nasty. Twisty with short climbs. Enjoy this descent as if you have got this far then you will have earned it.
- ADH climb- it is torture and you will suffer like no other time on a bike. First, 4km is steep. It is about SURVIVAL at this point. Just keep the head down and grind.

If we get an extreme weather day (heat) then the pain, discomfort and nausea starts a good bit earlier....

P.S. in all your posts you do not talk about your nutrition. That is the most important part. I have yet to get it right and it kills me on ADH .. Good luck, push it, and enjoy

Where have you been all these years? It's rare to read such good advice on this forum, very good post!

BenderRodriguez

For those who might be led astray by the weather forecast posted earlier, which was for La Salle-les-Alpes. This is the forecast for Alpe D'Huez itself...

http://www.meteociel.fr/tendances/39995 ... d_huez.htm

This is pretty much in line with the meteofrance prediction...

http://www.meteofrance.com/previsions-m ... huez/38750

All in all amazingly cold for the time of year, and snow on the Galibier from the previous couple of days precipitation looks more than likely.

ugo.santalucia

BenderRodriguez wrote:

For those who might be led astray by the weather forecast posted earlier, which was for La Salle-les-Alpes. This is the forecast for Alpe D'Huez itself...

http://www.meteociel.fr/tendances/39995 ... d_huez.htm

This is pretty much in line with the meteofrance prediction...

http://www.meteofrance.com/previsions-m ... huez/38750

All in all amazingly cold for the time of year, and snow on the Galibier from the previous couple of days precipitation looks more than likely.

Going to be hypothermia galore then, with all those folks who have never been high up on a mountain, thinking they can get away with arm warmers...

harry-s

Going to be hypothermia galore then, with all those folks who have never been high up on a mountain, thinking they can get away with arm warmers...

Indeed. In previous years I got my brains boiled on ADH, and last year went along with the lightest, airiest summer kit I had. Sleet started as I got near the top of the Galibier, and continued for all the descent, turning to heavy rain as I got further down. To say I suffered is putting it mildy, a gilet and arm warmers just didn't do it, and I had to get off the bike when I got so cold that I was unable to control it. Ironically, it was the first year I didn't pack a full long sleeve waterproof. It's a bit of a gamble though, you can't pack everything.

fenix

It's hardly everything - a full sleeve waterproof and gloves ? Toestrap it under your saddle. It's not going to cost you any time and it could make the difference between finishing or failure. It's the highest climb of the Tour. It's been closed by snow in July in the past. Be prepared.

ALawson

Hello all, also watching the weather as it could be interesting, was planning on normal bibs, toe thingies, base layer and top with arm warmers and gillet.

That plan may need to be amended now, I assume a LS Gabba will be too hot?

I have ridden Tiede in most conditions but never snow so will read the rest of the recent posts.

For those who have done it before, I am a little confused by the last email from the organisers.

How to pick up my starting number? Provide your ID, letter of information and a valid licence or medical certificate. To pick up the starting number of a friend, you must provide us his/her passport.

Obviously I will have my letter with number and my ID (and Driving License for mate), as we have uploaded medicals and have letter surely they don't want medicals certs on the day?

Thanks in Advance.

ugo.santalucia

Harry-S wrote:

Going to be hypothermia galore then, with all those folks who have never been high up on a mountain, thinking they can get away with arm warmers...

Indeed. In previous years I got my brains boiled on ADH, and last year went along with the lightest, airiest summer kit I had. Sleet started as I got near the top of the Galibier, and continued for all the descent, turning to heavy rain as I got further down. To say I suffered is putting it mildy, a gilet and arm warmers just didn't do it, and I had to get off the bike when I got so cold that I was unable to control it. Ironically, it was the first year I didn't pack a full long sleeve waterproof. It's a bit of a gamble though, you can't pack everything.

Yes, you can... problem is you don't want to carry the stuff with you, because in essence you want to nail a fast time. A 3 lt saddle bag will take everything you need will weigh (when full) less than 2 kg. People do longer and harder Audax events carrying a lot more than that.

ugo.santalucia

ALawson wrote:

That plan may need to be amended now, I assume a LS Gabba will be too hot?

.

On the descents it might be just about enough if it rains... waterproof gloves and toe covers would be nice too.

rc856

Wow!!

I am from Scotland but didn't expect to be getting a Scottish summer in France!!

Daft question but are those temps based at the foot of the Alpe?
What was it...1degree drop for every 100m you climb?

Will it be similar round at the Galibier?

A while ago I was worried about it being too hot!

ugo.santalucia

RC856 wrote:

Wow!!

I am from Scotland but didn't expect to be getting a Scottish summer in France!!

Daft question but are those temps based at the foot of the Alpe?
What was it...1degree drop for every 100m you climb?

Will it be similar round at the Galibier?

A while ago I was worried about it being too hot!

Look, it's very simple... over 2000 mt you can easily find 2-3 degrees if it's raining... it can be wet snow or sleet... it's unlikely to be dry snow that sticks to the tarmac in July. Descending at 3 degrees is not fun... windchill and all you are well below freezing and wet, which makes it even colder.
Descending the Tourmalet in the wet at the end of June was a miserable experience.

The Alpe d'Huez is not going to be a problem, as it's uphill, so if it rains it's doing you a favour... it's the two descents before that you might want to be prepared for

ALawson

ugo.santalucia wrote:

ALawson wrote:

That plan may need to be amended now, I assume a LS Gabba will be too hot?

.

On the descents it might be just about enough if it rains... waterproof gloves and toe covers would be nice too.

So is the consensus it being wet and very cold? I have used gabba with full sleeve base and neoprene gloves in minus 7 for a couple of hours on a CG at 20mph in uk winter.

Surely climbing to 2700m without arm warmers will be ok.

I would have those Castelli toe things which are ok. Don't want to get a summer over shoe, if it rains heavily on the first climb you will be wet all day.

fenix

In 1996 the snow on top of the Galibier made the Queen stage start over the other side of the mountain rather than climbing the Telegraphe and then the Galibier.

We were there and rode up the Telegraphe. I think I was wearing all my bike kit PLUS a fleece on the way down the telegraphe and the only reason I was so fast is that I was too cold to brake properly.

Hopefully it'll be a lovely day for you - but at least travel over with extra kit and assess what it looks like the day before. I'd rather take an extra layer that doesn't get used rather than shiver.

ALawson

Fenix wrote:

In 1996 the snow on top of the Galibier made the Queen stage start over the other side of the mountain rather than climbing the Telegraphe and then the Galibier.

We were there and rode up the Telegraphe. I think I was wearing all my bike kit PLUS a fleece on the way down the telegraphe and the only reason I was so fast is that I was too cold to brake properly.

Hopefully it'll be a lovely day for you - but at least travel over with extra kit and assess what it looks like the day before. I'd rather take an extra layer that doesn't get used rather than shiver.

Leaving Friday morning so should get there Friday night, will be doing a recce ride Saturday so will see how bad it is then. Will be taking everything. My 68kg mate is taking all his winter stuff! Surely leggings aren't required! I have skied in shorts in Jan so feel the cold less then others, as long as the fingers are warm and braking is ok.

gavinbay

BenderRodriguez wrote:

For those who might be led astray by the weather forecast posted earlier, which was for La Salle-les-Alpes........

All in all amazingly cold for the time of year, and snow on the Galibier from the previous couple of days precipitation looks more than likely.

As I live just down from the Galibier and can see from where I live whether it's encased in cloud or not - that forecast is what we use in the winter (ski randonnee) as well as in the summer (hiking / cycling) for the Galibier sector and we get used to interpreting it as best as we can.

This is the April/May blog http://stylealtitude.com/april-2017-ski-blog.html and will give you an idea as to what we do in the mountains here away from the pistes and maybe you'll then appreciate why we have to know our "weather".

That said I'd be quite happy with the way the forecast has changed for better for the Sunday afternoon for the climb and descent from the Galibier.

The Isotherm (freezing level) even on the cold days of Thurs & Fri is still higher than that of the Col du Galibier so should now not be an issue on the Sunday though I would not be surprised to see a smattering of snow above 2,800 on Friday morning but it will melt within a couple of hours.

BenderRodriguez

GavinBay wrote:

that forecast is what we use in the winter (ski randonnee) as well as in the summer (hiking / cycling) for the Galibier sector and we get used to interpreting it as best as we can.

So, the Meteociel forecast for La Salle-les-Alpes gives a more accurate picture of the weather at Alpe D'Huez than the Meteociel (and Meteofrance) forecasts for Alpe D'Huez itself? I hope you are right as I am supposed to be riding on Sunday!