Planet X Pricing - SMOKE AND MIRRORS

MikeBrew

Has anyone else noticed how each time they announce a bigger percentage discount on their "liquidation" sale they also hike the starting price up, so that the net price payable, barely really changes over the previous, lower percentage discount, "sale" ?

I was looking at something in their 30% sale a few weeks ago and, low and behold,net price of said item is no cheaper(or barely so) now in their 40%" sale."...

Treating customers like idiots isn't really the way forward in building customer loyalty, not in my book anyway. So much for their oft trumpeted "no nonsense" pricing !

Example Pro carbon frame £449 minus 40% £269.99. Sounds good till you remember it being available for £269.99 before the 40% sale..... :roll:
That sort of blatant BS puts me off using them at all, and I have used them a fair bit over the years..Don't get me wrong, they do, do some good deals but having to sort sieve the bargains out from from the BS does very little to enhance the buying experience.

pastryboy

yes have noticed it too, paid 25 for something which is now 30. if you bought it at 30 it is 75p cheaper than when it was 25 due to different discount codes.

sports direct of the bike world as someone here commented recently

londoncommuter

Yes, Khamsin wheelsets were £120 with 30% discount, they're now magically £140 with the 40% off.....

Completely agree that it's a bit insulting. It makes them seem a bunch of con artists which is a shame as when I've been there they all seem like a nice bunch (and I do love my RT-58 Alloy).

MikeBrew

Londoncommuter wrote:

It makes them seem a bunch of con artists which is a shame as when I've been there they all seem like a nice bunch (and I do love my RT-58 Alloy).

To be fair, they probably are a nice bunch. After all, the guys who serve you probably don't deal with the marketing.

Pretty sure they've previously had Khamsins at £99.99.... so the £140 minus 40%, net price of £84 is really only, to use their terminology, "an extra discount" of 16%... So why all the round the houses games on price ? Wiggle and Merlin et al have these wheels at £99.95 anyway... Come on Dave, stop treating loyal customers like retards. Or perhaps PX is more interested in duping the uninitiated newbies to the sport (you do remember that it's a sport and not JUST your personal money tree ?) with big number faux discounts....
I'm all for "no nonsense prices"....

ugo.santalucia

They do tweak their prices a lot... remember over Christmas the carbon gravel frames were 399 for a couple of days... then a few weeks later they were on sale at 599 or so. Basically the idea is buy when the price is good for you and don't worry about how much you are saving

rickeverett

Don't know. I was in store yesterday and got some bits. Gt85 for £2.99 ha!. And Marino socks for £1.99!

Remember margins are tight anyway so to get people in your clear out or pre tax year liquidation, you have to market a sale as a big deal. Companies do it all the time so I don't know why there's such a big deal accusing planet x of smoke and mirrors. Still there's some good stuff in there if you know what to look for.

You can currently get over £700 off this Viner Campag bike which is in the liquidation...http://www.planetx.co.uk/i/q/CBVIMITELT ... -road-bike

londoncommuter

rickeverett wrote:

Remember margins are tight anyway so to get people in your clear out or pre tax year liquidation, you have to market a sale as a big deal. Companies do it all the time so I don't know why there's such a big deal accusing planet x of smoke and mirrors. Still there's some good stuff in there if you know what to look for.

That's kind of our point. They do some good value stuff, great bikes and seem to be a decent shop. This fake sale thing just winds people up and cheapens their brand. I suppose they make a call that offering 90% off RRP of something only they sell and wacking prices up before a "sale" brings in more extra business than it loses through alienating more savvy shoppers.

rickeverett

londoncommuter wrote:

rickeverett wrote:

Remember margins are tight anyway so to get people in your clear out or pre tax year liquidation, you have to market a sale as a big deal. Companies do it all the time so I don't know why there's such a big deal accusing planet x of smoke and mirrors. Still there's some good stuff in there if you know what to look for.

That's kind of our point. They do some good value stuff, great bikes and seem to be a decent shop. This fake sale thing just winds people up and cheapens their brand. I suppose they make a call that offering 90% off RRP of something only they sell and wacking prices up before a "sale" brings in more extra business than it loses through alienating more savvy shoppers.

Yes but note it's only the selected stock.. The prices show the original discount threy have run online but the code adds 40% at checkout. So really it is a big discount on the stuff the want to get rid of. The viner bike however is a great buy. With £720 off its £1799 price, I don't care if that was its original rrp or not.

gabriel959

That Viner is advertised with Vento wheels at the top of the page but once you scroll down it says that it comes with Khamsin wheels, which are £30-£40 cheaper or so. Sneaky.

arlowood

Another recent example of "non-existent" deals or so it would appear. Got an email yesterday trumpeting the Viner Mitus carbon frameset from £475

If you click through to their website page

http://www.planetx.co.uk/i/q/FRVIMIT/vi ... 2ca1f51acf

I'm damned if I can find any of the size/colour options at that price - they're all £999. Maybe they had 1 XXS or something like that which was sold before I even opened the email but it does leave a slightly sour taste if the sales are of a mythical nature.

Must confess however that I did bag one of the PX Pro Carbon framesets at £269 back at the end of January. Was only the older matt black incarnation that was offered at that price but I'm not too bothered.

fenix

Don't wiggle do similar ? Their prices are up and down too.

As someone said - buy when the price suits you - ignore the % savings - pay what you think it's worth rather than imaginary savings,

part time waster

I have shopped with Planet x over the years and realised anything branded by themselves is basically junk. If you pay absolutely peanuts for it then you may feel ok with it. I end up sending it all back especially the clothes as they are toss.
Have also sent back a dura ace equipped bike as it was so badly built with wonky carbon wheels , chipped rear mech , the list goes on.
Only buy branded stuff if the price is right.
Shame as they are British based and I would like to support them.

rolf_f

Ribble do it as well - 5% price increase followed by 10% discounts. It's irritating but what do we expect? A shop sells stuff ludicrously cheaply and yet we want even more discounts. If people are daft enough' with the power of the internet at their hands' not to bother to do any research then its hard to feel much sympathy that their purchase is marginally less excessively good value than they think it is.

Personally I'd far prefer a world where there were not constant sales on all the time - where shops could sell stuff at the fair price they want and we could go and buy things when we wanted without having to consider waiting for whenever the next sale of that item was likely to be. But of course, in that world how would we be persuaded to keep buying more and more crap that we don't actually need?! So, in truth this is the world we want and have created so we really shouldn't complain about it.........

rolf_f

part time waster wrote:

I have shopped with Planet x over the years and realised anything branded by themselves is basically junk. If you pay absolutely peanuts for it then you may feel ok with it. I end up sending it all back especially the clothes as they are toss.

What actually have you tried? I find the PX overshoes to be excellent value for money.

MikeBrew

Fenix wrote:

Don't wiggle do similar ? Their prices are up and down too.

As someone said - buy when the price suits you - ignore the % savings - pay what you think it's worth rather than imaginary savings,

That's all very well to say blithely say "buy at the price that suits you", but that ignores the fact that folk are influenced (read mislead) by fantastical(read BS) offers. Take the post a few above yours by Arlowood, "bagging" a pro Carbon frameset for £269.99. The fact is they were £239 before xmas when it wasn't even a sale. So a bargain price is partly a matter of perception, rather than of simply what actually suits an individual buyer..... And to say that no one is ever influenced (read duped) by red sale banners screaming 20-30-40% discounts is naive to say the least..
Yes other retailers vary product prices on different items at different times. Wiggle (for instance) do genuine reductions to keep people interested and looking at their site, whereas PX often send out emails telling you something is in a sale when it's actually only the price it's been for months.
One way they do this is simultaneous listings on their website for the same product at different prices. Eg a frameset simultaneous advertised at £299.99 AND £179.99. Now unless you're very unlucky/inattentive, you probably wouldn't click to buy the £299.99 listing. However, what this actually means is that because it was advertised at £299.99 they can legally, advertise it again at £179.99, claiming a large % price reduction. It the strictest sense, it is a real reduction over the previous higher price, but taken along side the fact that the frame set was already available at the lower price anyway, where's the saving ? Well, there isn't one in reality, only the illusion of one that they are keen to create in the potential buyers mind.
I see this sort of BS manipulative marketing as cynical and insulting. Hardly true to their "No Nonsense Pricing" clarion call to purchasers. It wouldn't be so bad if they didn't like to play the value for money and quality/ "made in Britain" cards all the time. The Sports Direct analogy had been used a few times, but I don't entirely agree as Sports Direct is what it is, it doesn't claim to be something better than it is.

MikeBrew

rickeverett wrote:

. The viner bike however is a great buy. With £720 off its £1799 price, I don't care if that was its original rrp or not.

Sorry but that statement, as well as being self contradictory, makes it sound as though you've fallen for the tactic hook line and sinker.

It's bit like saying "I bought my house for £400K and it was a massive bargain BECAUSE it was on the market for £800K. Not really a bargain at all if it was only ever worth £400K (or even £300K!)

bompington

My goodness! Are retailers doing this kind of thing? How terrible! Who would have thought it in this day and age? Still, we can rely on that nice Mrs Thatcher not to take the kids' milk away.

MikeBrew

Rolf F wrote:

If people are daft enough' with the power of the internet at their hands' not to bother to do any research then its hard to feel much sympathy that their purchase is marginally less excessively good value than they think it is.

Thats pretty much a redundant argument when applied to PX's proprietary high value goods. Eg. bikes ...

And for this :

Rolf F wrote:

marginally less excessively good value than they think it is

I'd argue that

Not the great value they've been led to believe it was

was a more appropriate sentence in many (not all) cases ...

pastryboy

part time waster wrote:

I have shopped with Planet x over the years and realised anything branded by themselves is basically junk.

It's hit and miss.

I had some PX branded tyes fitted on a bike I got from them and they were the worst tyres ever. About 150 miles and they (front and rear) had a split round their entire circumference. I was pretty horrified when I saw that and was understandably a bit concerned about completing my ride on them. Wonder why my revoo review didn't appear on the site??

PX fingerless gloves - I had two pairs, both dug into the skin between my fingers. No other glove has ever done that to me.

Other bits I've had are jersey, base layers, unpadded shorts, gloves, overshoes. socks All absolutely fine and and very good considering the price.

fenix

part time waster wrote:

I have shopped with Planet x over the years and realised anything branded by themselves is basically junk. If you pay absolutely peanuts for it then you may feel ok with it. I end up sending it all back especially the clothes as they are toss.
Have also sent back a dura ace equipped bike as it was so badly built with wonky carbon wheels , chipped rear mech , the list goes on.
Only buy branded stuff if the price is right.
Shame as they are British based and I would like to support them.

Are you sure you don't work for a competitor ? I've a jacket, gilet, shorts, tights overshoes (possibly more) from them. Never had a problem and I do have Rapha, Castelli, Assos etc as well. I've also bought a few bikes from them with no issues.

N0bodyOfTheGoat

There are some genuine bargains, but you need to be doing frequent window shop sessions to spot them. For example, they were selling the Fatty Trail for under £900, undercutting the carbon forked Fatty and giving the buyer a free Bluto fork worth ~£400.

But for the unsavy, these discount basket codes are further reducing a lot of products that are already reporting a discount on the "liquidation sale" pages.

As I wrote when the 40% sale started, the constant sales is reminding me of a certain sofa company.

daniel_b

I do agree - their pricing policy does put me off, more so than previously.

step83

Does confuse me, was tempted by some 3/4 bibs, with the 40% off it comes to £24 down from £40, but then for £6 more I can get a bundle with a base layer, oversock an arm warmers. Prices do seem to creep up just before these sales though, same with many places mind.

part time waster

Like I said the own branded stuff is toss , badly cut jerseys , gloves , socks ,gilets. you get what you pay for.
Only my opinion. I now spend a bit more and get castelli , rapha , giordana , etc, all in the sales.

step83

part time waster wrote:

Like I said the own branded stuff is toss , badly cut jerseys , gloves , socks ,gilets. you get what you pay for.
Only my opinion. I now spend a bit more and get castelli , rapha , giordana , etc, all in the sales.

Fenix wrote:

Are you sure you don't work for a competitor ? I've a jacket, gilet, shorts, tights overshoes (possibly more) from them. Never had a problem and I do have Rapha, Castelli, Assos etc as well. I've also bought a few bikes from them with no issues.

Inclined to agree ive had a fair bit of kit, bibs jerseys etc no problems at all. Also the "clubman" fitting is great for a slightly more forgiving fit. Only gripe i have is the delivery charges, why did they change that!

ryanshattered

Step83 wrote:

part time waster wrote:

Like I said the own branded stuff is toss , badly cut jerseys , gloves , socks ,gilets. you get what you pay for.
Only my opinion. I now spend a bit more and get castelli , rapha , giordana , etc, all in the sales.

Fenix wrote:

Are you sure you don't work for a competitor ? I've a jacket, gilet, shorts, tights overshoes (possibly more) from them. Never had a problem and I do have Rapha, Castelli, Assos etc as well. I've also bought a few bikes from them with no issues.

Inclined to agree ive had a fair bit of kit, bibs jerseys etc no problems at all. Also the "clubman" fitting is great for a slightly more forgiving fit. Only gripe i have is the delivery charges, why did they change that!

The bibshorts are great cut and quality - I've got 3 different pairs (Planet X Proline, Clubman & On-One Proline) and the total cost was £60 - less than one pair of premium branded ones. Got numerous other bits - thicky merino socks, clubman compress bib tights, skull cap, neoprene overshoes, helmet. Very appy with all of them and imo the quality far exceeds the price in all instances. The only poor item I've had from them was the commuter jacket that came in the winter package.

super_davo

The good thing about Planet X is they do come on here and post occasionally, I think they have some sort of alert process so they will probably read this thread.
So on that basis, as a regular PX customer who has bought two bikes and lots of stuff from them - I think I speak for a lot of customers when I say the pricing strategy is annoying, and that it cheapens the brand. I don't want to see own brand stuff come out and immediately reduced by 70%, and that includes Selcof or Jobsworth of any other PX owned brand. It reminds me of Karrimor/Sports Direct. As does buying up old brands in difficulty and churning out versions of the Pro Carbon in their branding (Viner Mitus?).
I do want to see well made stuff at sensible prices under their brand without the fake discounts, and discontinued stuff from other brands at heavy discounts (which nobody else seems to do, and is one thing that makes them stand out). I do want them to use the brands they've bought to clearly differentiate ranges e.g. PX for value road, Viner for quality road, On One for value off road, Tomac for quality, Holdsworth for retro.
The quality control & testing on on brand stuff needs to be better, I've had excellent stuff like base layers and socks and dross like Echostorm bibtights with zips that broke after a handful of uses. DHB stuff for example is way less hit and miss.
They also need to reduce the free p&p spend back to a sensible level e.g. £20. I've ended up buying stuff from Wiggle or Merlin due to that.
I know they are clearly a very successful business but you wonder what would happen to them long term as more and more peoples perception of them seems to be they produce bargain basement junk that you use when you start out before you graduate onto better brands. Cycling is an aspirational hobby, people don't always make entirely rational price / quality purchase decisions so a cheap brand image can do an awful lot of damage in the long run.

imposter2.0

Step83 wrote:

part time waster wrote:

Like I said the own branded stuff is toss , badly cut jerseys , gloves , socks ,gilets. you get what you pay for.
Only my opinion. I now spend a bit more and get castelli , rapha , giordana , etc, all in the sales.

Fenix wrote:

Are you sure you don't work for a competitor ? I've a jacket, gilet, shorts, tights overshoes (possibly more) from them. Never had a problem and I do have Rapha, Castelli, Assos etc as well. I've also bought a few bikes from them with no issues.

Inclined to agree ive had a fair bit of kit, bibs jerseys etc no problems at all. Also the "clubman" fitting is great for a slightly more forgiving fit. Only gripe i have is the delivery charges, why did they change that!

+1, I find the PX kit very good. For the cost (ie not much), the VFM is excellent. I think maybe Mr Waster works for a rival company.

s@intsteve

I bought some vision 40 metron wheels a couple of weeks back in the last liquidation sale. I was in the market for some wheels and the discount was the best I could find on the internet. I hadn't shopped with PX before and there was a delay in fulfilling my order but the wheels have been great.

I must admit when I saw the last stock liquidation sale it did make me wonder why two similar type sales so close to together and yes I noticed some prices had changed as well. Its annoying but I suppose that buyers need to do their homework before buying stuff from the internet these days.

MikeBrew

s@intsteve wrote:

I bought some vision 40 metron wheels a couple of weeks back in the last liquidation sale. I was in the market for some wheels and the discount was the best I could find on the internet. I hadn't shopped with PX before and there was a delay in fulfilling my order but the wheels have been great.

I must admit when I saw the last stock liquidation sale it did make me wonder why two similar type sales so close to together and yes I noticed some prices had changed as well. Its annoying but I suppose that buyers need to do their homework before buying stuff from the internet these days.

Interesting case in point, as I think I'm right in saying that the price before discount on said wheels is now a couple of hundred quid higher than the previous 30 % sale and the price after discount 40% is applied about £30 higher than net price in the 30% sale....Obviously, you'd to in a better position than me to say this for sure.... I could have in mind the wrong set of Metrons as they are available, in both clincher and tub versions...

daniel_b

I have, and do buy stuff from them, and yes the free delivery fluctuations are an additional annoyance - just find a price and stick to it, which perhaps they have now done.
At one point it was £20, now it is £50, and at one point it went all the way to £100!

Things I have bought from them that I like a lot:

Winter socks - 3 pack are so nice and warm, get hammered through the winter and show no sign of wearing out or losing any of their thickness.
Clubman bibs - £17 IIRC, again with one discount code or another, easily £40 worth of bibshort, good for short training rides, or turbo work, but not for anything over 2 hours for me personally.
Ordered the same thing but in 3\4 lengths, decided to ignore the numerous reviews that said it was too wide at the calf, but the reviews were not wrong, incredibly wide and flappy, so that had to be sent back.

My bro ordered some of their stupendously cheap mitts, something like £3 a pair or something, both began to fall apart on their first rides - though give them their due they sent out replacements - no idea how they faired though.

Some of the other things that put me off, apart from the pricing policy, are the fact that attention to detail with promotional codes seems pretty laxed - ie they will have a big banner up (I'm paraphrasing here) saying that a sale code will be valid until March 10th. So if it were my company, I would task someone with logging on at midnight, or setting up an automated task to remove the banner at or as close to after midnight as possible.
In the above example the banner was there on March 12th (These are made up dates as I can't remember) AND the code at least purported to work, and some people placed orders with an effective double discount.
It was seemingly only after a forum member enquired about the code, that it was pulled, and then the banners were taken off.

That probably puts me off more than the weird up and down prices, as to me if they are missing simple things like that, what else gets missed.

Not saying that is the case, just stating why it makes me think twice about shopping with them.

My store of choice tends to be CRC still, Wiggle have come back a bit recently (Hope the merger doesn't bugger things up for CRC), Merlin not as much as a while ago, and also not shopped at the likes of ribble for ages either, though I am trying to be good.
Sigmasport have been good recently, and IIRC with free returns, and cyclestore are pretty good too.