Fred Whitton Challenge 2016, the big thread

ugo.santalucia

Solis wrote:

Not done the EtapeDD so can't comment but worth noting that Wrynose is tackled from the "easier" direction on the Fred so don't end up climbing off the bike on Hardknott thinking you need to save yourself for the last climb, its not pretty but neither is it another Hardknott.

You should do it... great organisation, tough day on the bike, but totally worth it (and 4 well stocked feeding zones!)... also you support a cycling related charity, what's not to like?

mamil314

homers double wrote:

I hate this thread...

Amen, brother, let's go sulk in the corner.
Or, let's do Etape du Dales, instead?

MBCaad8

Got my place on the reserve list today

I don't mind admitting that I am off to buy an 11-32 cassette having had to walk with an 11-28 on last year.

ugo.santalucia

mamil314 wrote:

homers double wrote:

I hate this thread...

Amen, brother, let's go sulk in the corner.
Or, let's do Etape du Dales, instead?

do it, it's ace

london-red

MBCaad8 wrote:

Got my place on the reserve list today

I don't mind admitting that I am off to buy an 11-32 cassette having had to walk with an 11-28 on last year.

Don't be saying that - that's how I'm setting myself up for it... :?

MBCaad8

London-Red wrote:

MBCaad8 wrote:

Got my place on the reserve list today

I don't mind admitting that I am off to buy an 11-32 cassette having had to walk with an 11-28 on last year.

Don't be saying that - that's how I'm setting myself up for it... :?

Ah but I am heavy. And I went off too hard last year....

DeVlaeminck

My take on riding the Fred for a time rather than just to finish would be as soon as you are at the summit of Kirkstone look for a group and stick in it all the way to Honister even if that means expending a bit more energy than you'd like before the main road because once there it's pretty much flat for a long stretch. From Honister to the summit of Whinlatter a group isn't too important but you could do with sharing the work after that until the cold fell bit at least and again after the second feed to Hardknott someone to share the work with is important.

Agree with climbing Hardknott as slow as you can without falling off, unless you are a really strong rider well inside 7 hours anyway, however slow you ride up it's a lot faster than walking! First two times I did it I attacked it and walked a long way, thought I'd never be ale to ride up it, last two time took it slowly and was never in any danger of stopping. Same approach probably applies to first 100m of Honister though you are fresh enough and it's short enough that if you are getting off there you are in for a hard day. . Also agree about Honister descent, the most dangerous descent I've ever ridden in any event especially as by then you are getting into the ride and confidence can become over confidence. One year I passed 3 casualties all getting medical attention withn 200m there, for the sake of knocking 30 seconds off it isn't worth it.

alexjones5

Did the Fred and the EDD back to back a few years ago.
I'd say the Fred just shades it due to the severity of the last 2 climbs.
We had shocking weather on the EDD which made it a tough ride.
Definitely comparable though and (I think) the 2 toughest rides in the UK

ugo.santalucia

alexjones5 wrote:

Did the Fred and the EDD back to back a few years ago.
I'd say the Fred just shades it due to the severity of the last 2 climbs.
We had shocking weather on the EDD which made it a tough ride.
Definitely comparable though and (I think) the 2 toughest rides in the UK

Thanks

alexjones5

Just read your blog- good read!

I did Fred with 36x28 as biggest gear 2 years ago if that's any help? I sometimes think people overplay the gearing thing. If you want to sit and spin at 90rpm go smaller but, for me it's an out of the saddle climb. Sit down and you'll pull the front wheel off the tarmac anyway!!

ugo.santalucia

alexjones5 wrote:

Just read your blog- good read!

I did Fred with 36x28 as biggest gear 2 years ago if that's any help? I sometimes think people overplay the gearing thing. If you want to sit and spin at 90rpm go smaller but, for me it's an out of the saddle climb. Sit down and you'll pull the front wheel off the tarmac anyway!!

It's mostly to avoid knee cap inflammation. I had that issue in the past when I used 39 x 27 as the climbing gear, most painfully up the Tourmalet and up World's end in Wales, now I tend to spin on tiny gears when the road goes above 7-8%

warreng

I did it in 2014 and the weather was ok - wet but not too windy. Lots of good advice but one thing I did do correctly was getting to the start early. We set off in one of the earlier groups and the inbound traffic was awful. The other thing that sticks in my mind was the descents. Make sure your brakes are good. I nearly lost it on the descent of Honister and I saw half a dozen casualties throughout the day

lakesluddite

WarrenG wrote:

I did it in 2014 and the weather was ok - wet but not too windy. Lots of good advice but one thing I did do correctly was getting to the start early. We set off in one of the earlier groups and the inbound traffic was awful. The other thing that sticks in my mind was the descents. Make sure your brakes are good. I nearly lost it on the descent of Honister and I saw half a dozen casualties throughout the day

Yes, good point. When I set off out of Grasmere in '14, I passed a big queue of traffic waiting to get into the showground, so get there early. And it's basically a field so if the weather has been wet in the preceding few hours/days, it'll be muddy as hell.
As for Hardknott, IF you can keep going then it's a grind but not too bad if you're used to climbing. The problems that you might have, that you can't train for, is that people often walk in silly places (ie the middle of the road) AND don't forget the road isn't closed, so you may have to steer round traffic coming down (brakes squealing) or even worse going up. There are plenty of signs around warning of mass participation bike ride, but that doesn't stop some fools going over in their cars/vans/motorbikes.
Wrynose, as has been said, is not too bad, as you don't descend the full length off Hardknott - you get down to a plateau at Cockley Beck, so the climb up Wrynose isn't as long. The descent off Wrynose is a swine though, real squeaky-bum time! It's amazing the amount of people who exit Little Langdale and put the gas on - it's like the relief of seeing off the high stuff gives them a burst of adrenaline.

EarlofBarnet

Hope everyone's training is going well? I did a loop a couple of weeks ago with: Whinlatter; Honister; Newlands and then Whinlatter from the opposite side. Still need to tick off Hardknott and Wrynose though. Hoping now the clocks have changed I can get some evening rides in.

ugo.santalucia

EarlofBarnet wrote:

Hope everyone's training is going well? I did a loop a couple of weeks ago with: Whinlatter; Honister; Newlands and then Whinlatter from the opposite side. Still need to tick off Hardknott and Wrynose though. Hoping now the clocks have changed I can get some evening rides in.

Took advantage of 10 days in Italy to do a bit of cycling... mainly shortish rides (40 milers) but vertical: 300 miles and 11,000 mt of climbing in total... I have tried to go up and down the steepest roads in the area... there's a nice steady 6 Km at 10%, another terrible 3 Km at 12% and another bendy 4 Km at 10%, among others.
Just need to do the mileage now, the kind of 6-7 hours on the saddle, as the longest rides I have done in 2016 are 4 hours... April's work

shazzz

Not going great for me - illness in Jan/Feb means I have very few miles in the legs this year, although I was going well up to the end of 2015. Starting to ramp up my training but I think I'm now in the 'just getting round' category rather than going for a time (which would have been pretty average anyway...).

On the plus side, I've got my accommodation sorted. I'm staying in Eskdale so have the option of doing a 'fresh' ride up Hardknott on Saturday. Any thoughts on this? Good idea, or better to keep as fresh as poss before the big day?

brucebar1980

Training is going ok at the minute. Managing to get out a couple of times in the week and then a long hilly training ride at the weekends. Need to get a good few weeks of solid training now before judgment day on the 8th of May.
I've got a weeks holiday in the Lakes in a couple of weeks so i'm planning on doing the whole whitton ride and see if i can actually get up the climbs! I'm having nightmares about Hardnotts to be honest.

MBCaad8

Midweek training going well, just need to get some long weekend rides in now. Will be happy to get round in same time as last year but without the walking bit....as long as the weather isn't too bad

honeybadger99

Upto now not to bad at all. The mid week turbo sessions have been going very well (although with the improving weather/lighter nights I may start doing these outside more), beating last years targets so it's looking like I'm ahead on that score. Weekends for the last couple of months I've been doing rides outside that have been 80 miles plus, slowly increasing both the distances and average speeds so it's looking ok for me so far. Just need to get up there sometime before the big day to reccee some of the climbs to see what state winter has left the roads in.

ugo.santalucia

shazzz wrote:

On the plus side, I've got my accommodation sorted. I'm staying in Eskdale so have the option of doing a 'fresh' ride up Hardknott on Saturday. Any thoughts on this? Good idea, or better to keep as fresh as poss before the big day?

Not a good idea, keep your legs fresh

Spartacus1981

I'm cacking it fair play ! Got a lotta work to do. In fact I'm worried more about the descents than the climbs, thinking discs are the way forward for this plus I've never been described as a downhill expert :shock:. Anyway Mallorca for some hill training Friday coming but in our case that often means equal pizza and beer training. Oh well, compact and dinner plate cassette it is !! :roll:

honeybadger99

ugo.santalucia wrote:

shazzz wrote:

On the plus side, I've got my accommodation sorted. I'm staying in Eskdale so have the option of doing a 'fresh' ride up Hardknott on Saturday. Any thoughts on this? Good idea, or better to keep as fresh as poss before the big day?

Not a good idea, keep your legs fresh

Don't think it'd be that bad, as long as you kept the ride short (2hrs max) and kept the climb as your one and only "effort" The rest should be a zone 2. Then get back and eat your own weight in pasta

DeVlaeminck

shazzz wrote:

Not going great for me - illness in Jan/Feb means I have very few miles in the legs this year, although I was going well up to the end of 2015. Starting to ramp up my training but I think I'm now in the 'just getting round' category rather than going for a time (which would have been pretty average anyway...).

On the plus side, I've got my accommodation sorted. I'm staying in Eskdale so have the option of doing a 'fresh' ride up Hardknott on Saturday. Any thoughts on this? Good idea, or better to keep as fresh as poss before the big day?

Swings and roundabouts, there is some value in knowing the climb but you don't want to be doing too much. It's worth knowing where the top is as you can always find a bit extra if you know it's nearly over.

ugo.santalucia

Bilkobaggins wrote:

I'm cacking it fair play ! Got a lotta work to do. In fact I'm worried more about the descents than the climbs, thinking discs are the way forward for this plus I've never been described as a downhill expert :shock:. Anyway Mallorca for some hill training Friday coming but in our case that often means equal pizza and beer training. Oh well, compact and dinner plate cassette it is !! :roll:

Discs are not necessarily better... I prefer them as the "death zone" is more predictable, while it is harder to anticipate an exploding tyre, or maybe I have not developed that kind of sensitivity...

A few tips here, not necessarily disc related

https://wordpress.com/stats/day/whosatt ... 2016-04-03

shazzz

DeVlaeminck wrote:

shazzz wrote:

Not going great for me - illness in Jan/Feb means I have very few miles in the legs this year, although I was going well up to the end of 2015. Starting to ramp up my training but I think I'm now in the 'just getting round' category rather than going for a time (which would have been pretty average anyway...).

On the plus side, I've got my accommodation sorted. I'm staying in Eskdale so have the option of doing a 'fresh' ride up Hardknott on Saturday. Any thoughts on this? Good idea, or better to keep as fresh as poss before the big day?

Swings and roundabouts, there is some value in knowing the climb but you don't want to be doing too much. It's worth knowing where the top is as you can always find a bit extra if you know it's nearly over.

Thanks for the various views. I know the climb - having walked up it on previous FWCs! I have also ridden up it fresh once before. I was thinking that it may be a mental boost to ride up it the day before - will probably wait and see how I'm feeling, maybe ride up to the fort on the Saturday and leave the finale to Sunday....

homers_double

I'm over 90kg's and rode the Fred last year on standard brakes, as long as you don't go hell for leather right off the top you'll be fine.

london-red

Not quite sure how the training's going, but I can now ride up and down Dark Hill 10 times without too many problems

A little over a month to go, so it's too late to make much difference in fitness now IMO - just need to carry on with the regime and hope for the best. Still targeting 8 hours, but have a feeling that might be put to one side following Kirkstone.

We'll see. Judgement Day approaches :twisted:

shazzz

London-Red wrote:

A little over a month to go, so it's too late to make much difference in fitness now IMO - just need to carry on with the regime and hope for the best. Still targeting 8 hours, but have a feeling that might be put to one side following Kirkstone.

We'll see. Judgement Day approaches :twisted:

I really hope that isn't true!

ugo.santalucia

London-Red wrote:

Not quite sure how the training's going, but I can now ride up and down Dark Hill 10 times without too many problems

If you can go up and down Dark Hill in Richmond park 10 times, then the world is your oyster.
More seriously, if you want some hills to test your climbing, there isn't much noteworthy in the South East, maybe try doing a loop including Barhatch Lane and White Downs a few times... that's closer (but still quite far) to the gradients you'll find in Cumbria

ugo.santalucia

On the 16-17 April weekend a couple of us are doing two loops of this as "rehersal" of the Fred. It's the toughest/steepest stuff I could find within an hour drive from here.

110 Km with 3 Km of climbing should do... if anyone local wants to join in, let me know

https://www.strava.com/routes/4563906