paris
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Very interesting Rick.
In the fall out from the Paris massacre some EU member states are beating themselves up over their apparent failings in integrating the influx of muslim migrants and subsequent generations. See/hear interviews on Radio 5 live from Belgium on Monday or Tuesday.
As far as I am concerned I have no problem with those genuinely seeking asylum. One has an obligation to care for ones fellow human being in times of strife. The village I used to live in accepted a large number of Vietnamese 'boat people' a long time back. They were cared for and have since gone on to integrate brilliantly into the larger UK community by adopting their host nation's culture. Likewise I have met Cambodian refugees who fled the killing fields and they too have integrated within western culture, even though I am sure they had a very different culture/belief system in their home country.
Host nations should only supply shelter/food/clothing, this in itself is a huge undertaking given the numbers involved. I do not see that there should be any obligation or policies to force the population of the host nation to adjust their culture and way of life to accommodate the minority who sought shelter or came here to improve their lot.
I totally agree with you on the UK nationals in their enclaves in sunny Spain. Same too in some parts of France I understand. If you want beans on toast, marmite and PG Tips stay in Blighty.Always be yourself, unless you can be Aaron Rodgers....Then always be Aaron Rodgers.0 -
It's an odd position to take though Bally.
It's like most people in the UK want to make sure all their responsibility absolved.
I don't remember clamours for people of the various Christian churches to sort out their own kind during the troubles in Ireland - which did spill over into terrorism.
I don't remember calls about the KKK in America, suggesting those churches should take more responsibility.
Smacks of discrimination Bally, and it isn't becoming.
Hmm absolved of responsibility? Most people?
Safety of ALL of our citizens is EVERYONE's responsibility. If I became aware of anyone who was doing anything to jeopardise that safety i would take the appropriate steps. People espousing radical or offensive ideals would be outed. Most people I'm sure would do the same. I can obviously only do that in respect of people and ideas that I encounter.
As Sadiq Khan has written, there are people within the Muslim community who do espouse such ideas and obviously because of the lack of integration, the people best placed to counter such ideas are the fellow Muslims in that community.
The 'Troubles' in Ireland are perhaps not a straight comparison. The terrorists were fighting for a political ideal, not a religious one. Yes, the support for the IRA was predominately from the Catholic community but not necessarily religiously driven.
If we had been having a discussion about terrorism 20 or 30 years ago, I would have been complaining about communities sheltering known terrorists, it certainly happened. People committed atrocities and then blended back into the communities, either in the sectarian divided north, the south or even the US.
Do you remember when the Women for Peace movement started and people started to say Enough!!. Communities started to turn on the evil people hiding in their mist. The Muslim communities are no different and no, I haven't made any distinction.
It should not have escaped your notice that things have improved in N Ireland since the power sharing initiative. Barriers come down, people integrate and people manage to live together.
KKK? Have you ever seen me post anything to defend them? In fact I can't remember them being discussed.
Come to think of it, have you ever seen me defend any religion? In fact I have been quite condemning of the Catholic Church.
You may disagree with my point of view, but Sadiq Khan is one of the highest profile Muslim politician in the country and his views should not be ignored.
The label 'Discrimination' or 'Racist' was just as much expected as it was lazy. The standard response to anyone who challenges the idea that Multi culturism is a roaring success. People need to live together and segregation is counter productive.0 -
On QT last night it was mentioned that 7 potential terrorist attacks on the UK have been thwarted so far this year.0
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And according to some people on here we don't have the resources to do that...On QT last night it was mentioned that 7 potential terrorist attacks on the UK have been thwarted so far this year."I spent most of my money on birds, booze and fast cars: the rest of it I just squandered." [George Best]0 -
And according to some people on here we don't have the resources to do that...On QT last night it was mentioned that 7 potential terrorist attacks on the UK have been thwarted so far this year.
We were just lucky that our one Bobby happened to be on his computer at the right moment. If he'd been on tea break...0 -
Also on QT, I'm sure the Col whose name escapes me at the moment who reported to COBRA, said that the poverty and inequality in France was much worse than in the UK. How can this be? After all we have a nasty Conservative government haven't we.
Edit That should be This Week not QT0 -
Also on QT, I'm sure the Col whose name escapes me at the moment who reported to COBRA, said that the poverty and inequality in France was much worse than in the UK. How can this be? After all we have a nasty Conservative government haven't we.
Oh get off your soap box you old fart and post a bloody picture. This is the wrong thread.seanoconn - gruagach craic!0 -
Also on QT, I'm sure the Col whose name escapes me at the moment who reported to COBRA, said that the poverty and inequality in France was much worse than in the UK. How can this be? After all we have a nasty Conservative government haven't we.
Income inequality is lower in France, but racial inequality is a major problem. The French built a lot of sink estates on the edges of towns following WW2 and they're just really depressing, crime-ridden, neglected places - just places for people to live, with opportunities for employment and leisure based far away, so you end up with (often black and Arab) teenagers hanging around getting into all sorts of bother before they reach adulthood.
Watch the film La Haine if you want to get a feel for how things can be in those crapholes.0 -
My kind of town.
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Not an AN fan but this was brilliant, i love france, and this is a fantastic response to these scum.
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-348776830 -
Very very good ^.seanoconn - gruagach craic!0
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You have to give them the respect that they deserve - absolufely FA
https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=XMpvvnOHC1U"I spent most of my money on birds, booze and fast cars: the rest of it I just squandered." [George Best]0 -
Wouldn't surprise me in the slightest.
My kind of town.
Larkhall might welcome equal opportunities in the 23rd century.The above may be fact, or fiction, I may be serious, I may be jesting.
I am not sure. You have no chance.Veronese68 wrote:PB is the most sensible person on here.0 -
Wouldn't surprise me in the slightest.
My kind of town.
Larkhall might welcome equal opportunities in the 23rd century.
The people of Larkhall will no doubt be devastated to learn that you do not share their view.0 -
They are probably still in the Lodge so I am safe for a while.
Wouldn't surprise me in the slightest.
My kind of town.
Larkhall might welcome equal opportunities in the 23rd century.
The people of Larkhall will no doubt be devastated to learn that you do not share their view.The above may be fact, or fiction, I may be serious, I may be jesting.
I am not sure. You have no chance.Veronese68 wrote:PB is the most sensible person on here.0 -
We're now looking for a vote to sanction the bombing of Syria to destroy IS. Waste of time.
If you were to kill every last member of IS in Syria and Iraq how are you going to sort them living in Bradford,Leicester,Nottingham,Birmingham and around the world?
Another point, these politicians are happy to send "cannon fodder" into the jaws of death but, who is selling and profiting from the sale of arms to IS. Who is profiting from the purchase/sale of oil to IS. The men sending soldiers to fight know who both of these groups are. Sort them out first. Or are they the friends of the duplicious politicians, I think so. Money talks and life is cheap, especially ours.Tail end Charlie
The above post may contain traces of sarcasm or/and bullsh*t.0 -
The French and Americans have been targeting fuel transportation vehicles.
By the same token, I do not know why they aren't strangling the banks and paymasters who are funding IS.seanoconn - gruagach craic!0 -
I suspect it's because they're duplicious,unscrupulous,greedy,uncaring b@stards.The likes of us don't know the pies these pillars of society have their fingers in. Call me a cynic but I don't trust any of them, we are expendable and are looked upon purely as commodities to use. And this country is one of the best FFS.The French and Americans have been targeting fuel transportation vehicles.
By the same token, I do not know why they aren't strangling the banks and paymasters who are funding IS.Tail end Charlie
The above post may contain traces of sarcasm or/and bullsh*t.0 -
finchy wrote:Watch the film La Haine if you want to get a feel for how things can be in those crapholes.
What a brilliant film,I did hear although I do not Know how true it is,that a French PM made the whole of the French Parliament sit and watch this film to show them real problems the were facing on the projects0 -
Oi!By the same token, I do not know why they aren't strangling the banks and paymasters who are funding IS.
I suspect it's because they're duplicious,unscrupulous,greedy,uncaring b@stards.The likes of us don't know the pies these pillars of society have their fingers in. Call me a cynic but I don't trust any of them, we are expendable and are looked upon purely as commodities to use. And this country is one of the best FFS.
I'm the cynical one on here.
As I said elsewhere......What Countries produce weapons?
What Countries are pushing for them to be used?
Hmmmm.The above may be fact, or fiction, I may be serious, I may be jesting.
I am not sure. You have no chance.Veronese68 wrote:PB is the most sensible person on here.0 -
The west no doubt does know where new supplies of weapons come from but the region is so awash with guns and new exporters such as Sudan, makes stopping them having guns almost impossible, the borders of Syria/Iraq are huge and with no real means of policing them, IS have also shown they can do terrible things without a gun.
I see the French have suggested that Assad forces become the "troops on the ground" to re take Rukka, at least some one is talking sense.0 -
the French have suggested that Assad forces become the "troops on the ground"
Wasn't Assad the devil incarnate last time our politicians were banging drums in favour of chucking more airborne explosives into the fire in Syria?
Another year, another target. Jeez, is depressing how keen are the armchair warriors to waste more blood and gold in yet another sxxthole.
Anybody know which years if any since the end of WW2 UK forces have not been expended in some usually pointless military conflict?
Remember "nation building" in Afghanistan? How did that all turn out?0 -
the French have suggested that Assad forces become the "troops on the ground"
Remember "nation building" in Afghanistan? How did that all turn out?
Glowing success according to our illustrious leaders :? Iraq too i believe :oops:
Syria will no doubt turn out to be another outstanding example of foreign policy.0 -
Corbyn has a point on the bombing. (ducks and runs for cover
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Can someone please tell all involved to stop using the word "Syria" instead of "ISIS"?
If it turns out that we are indeed bombing Syria instead of ISIS then I am even more confused as to what is going on.The above may be fact, or fiction, I may be serious, I may be jesting.
I am not sure. You have no chance.Veronese68 wrote:PB is the most sensible person on here.0 -
But aren't we intending to bomb Syria, just can't seem to decide which faction in Syria to bomb? 0
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But ISIS is not confined to Syria.But aren't we intending to bomb Syria, just can't seem to decide which faction in Syria to bomb?
Or, as I originally asked, is ISIS not the target?
And if not, why not?
And who are our enemies in this war?
And what is the end game?
Too many questions, not enough answers.The above may be fact, or fiction, I may be serious, I may be jesting.
I am not sure. You have no chance.Veronese68 wrote:PB is the most sensible person on here.0 -
Can someone please tell all involved to stop using the word "Syria" instead of "ISIS"
If it turns out that we are indeed bombing Syria instead of ISIS then I am even more confused as to what is going on.
Do we have much in the way of intel on the ground in Syria?
given that the answer is no (as we ve never been able to successfully rescue any hostages in either Syria or Iraq) then any bombing of IS will enevitably involve killing syrian civilians and destroying buildings that have nothing to do with ISil, so to me, we are bombing syria and iraq.0 -
It's weird. When the attack us, we are resolute. When we plan to bomb them, are we expecting them to just give up?My blog: http://www.roubaixcycling.cc (kit reviews and other musings)
https://twitter.com/roubaixcc
Facebook? No. Just say no.0 -
It's weird. When the attack us, we are resolute. When we plan to bomb them, are we expecting them to just give up?
I see your point but I think their is an air of the expectation that we will cripple them by bombing them.seanoconn - gruagach craic!0
