I want this now...
Angus Young
Posts: 3,063
All the gear, no idea and loving the smell of jealousy in the morning.
Kona Process 134 viewtopic.php?f=10017&t=12994607
Kona Process 134 viewtopic.php?f=10017&t=12994607
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I don't think I do.
If the review is accurate then there's no downside, so why not other than a dogmatic aversion to anything with a battery.All the gear, no idea and loving the smell of jealousy in the morning.
Kona Process 134 viewtopic.php?f=10017&t=129946070 -
Looks interesting, it's weird though, I suppose it's an enevitable thing about technology advances.
In some ways it seems similar to the car enthusiast world, you have cars like the Nissan GTR, which have every mechanical and electrical advantage possible, and at the other end of the scale things like Caterham 7's which are basically engines strapped to wheels with a seat stuck on.
Both have thier appeals, but the argument against the high tech stuff is that you're not really driving the car, and the experience isn't as involving.. Obviously the argument for, is that it's faster and probably safer when driving beyond your ability.
It's an interesting conundrum, but on balance I'm more a Caterham man rather ttha a GTR man.0 -
Looks interesting, it's weird though, I suppose it's an enevitable thing about technology advances.
In some ways it seems similar to the car enthusiast world, you have cars like the Nissan GTR, which have every mechanical and electrical advantage possible, and at the other end of the scale things like Caterham 7's which are basically engines strapped to wheels with a seat stuck on.
Both have thier appeals, but the argument against the high tech stuff is that you're not really driving the car, and the experience isn't as involving.. Obviously the argument for, is that it's faster and probably safer when driving beyond your ability.
It's an interesting conundrum, but on balance I'm more a Caterham man rather ttha a GTR man.
Don't think this counts as a GTR, though. Just means your suspension is giving what you paid for, all of the time.All the gear, no idea and loving the smell of jealousy in the morning.
Kona Process 134 viewtopic.php?f=10017&t=129946070 -
Looks interesting, it's weird though, I suppose it's an enevitable thing about technology advances.
In some ways it seems similar to the car enthusiast world, you have cars like the Nissan GTR, which have every mechanical and electrical advantage possible, and at the other end of the scale things like Caterham 7's which are basically engines strapped to wheels with a seat stuck on.
Both have thier appeals, but the argument against the high tech stuff is that you're not really driving the car, and the experience isn't as involving.. Obviously the argument for, is that it's faster and probably safer when driving beyond your ability.
It's an interesting conundrum, but on balance I'm more a Caterham man rather ttha a GTR man.
That's exactly how I see it. i would forget to charge them and keep coming to a halt in the middle of nowhere.0 -
Why would you come to a halt? Plus, the article states it has a very long charge.All the gear, no idea and loving the smell of jealousy in the morning.
Kona Process 134 viewtopic.php?f=10017&t=129946070 -
Presumably it would stick in what ever setting was in use in the event of a flat battery.
I'd hope so anyway haha!
Or if like a car, the power steering craps out, the power assisted brakes crap out, you can't even tow it, and hope you have AA cover, or BA cover in this case hehe!0 -
I don't think I do.
If the review is accurate then there's no downside, so why not other than a dogmatic aversion to anything with a battery.
other than its fox
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Why would you come to a halt? Plus, the article states it has a very long charge.
Not so much for that, i was thinking of electronic gearing.0 -
I don't think I do.
If the review is accurate then there's no downside, so why not other than a dogmatic aversion to anything with a battery.
It's a Pink Bike review. So it's basically a paid advert. So accuracy is of little importance. And I haven't read the article because it involves a) Fox and b) electric stuff attached to a bikeCloset jockey wheel pimp whore.0 -
I don't think I do.
If the review is accurate then there's no downside, so why not other than a dogmatic aversion to anything with a battery.
I think it still has a long way to go before its fully developed. The on/off nature of the control is very crude. I'm sure the next version will include some modulation.
It's like the very first active suspension on cars started like this but now has much more sophisticated control.Transition Patrol - viewtopic.php?f=10017&t=130702350 -
I don't think I do.
If the review is accurate then there's no downside, so why not other than a dogmatic aversion to anything with a battery.
It's a Pink Bike review. So it's basically a paid advert. So accuracy is of little importance. And I haven't read the article because it involves a) Fox and b) electric stuff attached to a bike
So, mind made up, then.All the gear, no idea and loving the smell of jealousy in the morning.
Kona Process 134 viewtopic.php?f=10017&t=129946070 -
for me yeah, got no interest in that type of electrical switch on suspension. I never change the settings on the fork other than a change in LSC depending on the trail and then I just leave it. same goes for the shock, I don't even bother with the CS as the shock is so sorted0
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I know a serious (fast) XC racer whop has electronic lockout on his forks, it can be switched on or off OR has a button for short term presses, he uses it to accelerate out of slower corners, how much time he gains is a matter of conjecture!Currently riding a Whyte T130C, X0 drivetrain, Magura Trail brakes converted to mixed wheel size (homebuilt wheels) with 140mm Fox 34 Rhythm and RP23 suspension. 12.2Kg.0
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Nail > head.I don't think I do.
If the review is accurate then there's no downside, so why not other than a dogmatic aversion to anything with a battery.
The exact reason I don't want DI2, fancy lapierre suspension etc.0 -
Nail > head.I don't think I do.
If the review is accurate then there's no downside, so why not other than a dogmatic aversion to anything with a battery.
The exact reason I don't want DI2, fancy lapierre suspension etc.
So, fear, it is, then.All the gear, no idea and loving the smell of jealousy in the morning.
Kona Process 134 viewtopic.php?f=10017&t=129946070 -
i think it is an interesting idea.
Ive got nothing against modern ideas and progression in mtb. And as such, i like the sound of this. shame it looks so bloomin ugly though! couldnt the box of trixks be mounted under the saddle or somthing?
There are a lot of people who dont want change and i dont have any issue with that but i do wonder why those people dont go the whole hog and get rid of the suspension on both ends of their bikes too. i mean, surely that s technology making the bikes easier to ride over tougher terrain than before, surely there is more satisfaction to be found in using good old fashioned leg and arm suspension.0 -
i think it is an interesting idea.
Ive got nothing against modern ideas and progression in mtb. And as such, i like the sound of this. shame it looks so bloomin ugly though! couldnt the box of trixks be mounted under the saddle or somthing?
There are a lot of people who dont want change and i dont have any issue with that but i do wonder why those people dont go the whole hog and get rid of the suspension on both ends of their bikes too. i mean, surely that s technology making the bikes easier to ride over tougher terrain than before, surely there is more satisfaction to be found in using good old fashioned leg and arm suspension.
People can be oddly schizophrenic when it comes to what technology they will and won't accept. And that seems especially so of mountain bikers.All the gear, no idea and loving the smell of jealousy in the morning.
Kona Process 134 viewtopic.php?f=10017&t=129946070 -
i think it is an interesting idea.
Ive got nothing against modern ideas and progression in mtb. And as such, i like the sound of this. shame it looks so bloomin ugly though! couldnt the box of trixks be mounted under the saddle or somthing?
There are a lot of people who dont want change and i dont have any issue with that but i do wonder why those people dont go the whole hog and get rid of the suspension on both ends of their bikes too. i mean, surely that s technology making the bikes easier to ride over tougher terrain than before, surely there is more satisfaction to be found in using good old fashioned leg and arm suspension.
People can be oddly schizophrenic when it comes to what technology they will and won't accept. And that seems especially so of mountain bikers.
(Edited because I submitted without writing anything)
For me electronics has no place on a bike designed to be ridden out into the wilds. A shock is just a piece of mechanical engineering the same as the rear mech but somehow adding electronics to it (including Di2 type stuff) is like saying - I accept there is a limited distance I am going to ride this before returning to a house to recharge. Just feels wrong even if I know in reality my legs will fall off long before any battery loses charge.Closet jockey wheel pimp whore.0 -
I don't want anything with a battery controlling anything on my bike. The beauty of a bike is that you can just grab it and go, you don't need to make sure it's charged up etc.
Nail > head.I don't think I do.
If the review is accurate then there's no downside, so why not other than a dogmatic aversion to anything with a battery.
The exact reason I don't want DI2, fancy lapierre suspension etc.
So, fear, it is, then.0 -
Can you leave the house without your mobile phone if it isn't charged? How about air in your shocks? These are things we wouldn't have considered 15 years ago when taking a bike out but now they are normality.
I don't want anything with a battery controlling anything on my bike. The beauty of a bike is that you can just grab it and go, you don't need to make sure it's charged up etc.
Nail > head.I don't think I do.
If the review is accurate then there's no downside, so why not other than a dogmatic aversion to anything with a battery.
The exact reason I don't want DI2, fancy lapierre suspension etc.
So, fear, it is, then.
Give it another 15 years and it'll be the conundrum of syncing up your electronically controlled suspension to your GPS App so it can automatically make constant minute adjustments to it on the trail as it has the terrain already stored for the route you are riding.Bird Aeris : Trek Remedy 9.9 29er : Trek Procaliber 9.8 SL0 -
I think electronics is a step to far for me, i just like the simplicity of getting out on the trails. Too much help takes away the challenge and enjoyment of mountain biking. Disc brakes mean i can stop and suspension means i don't get too badly beaten up by the trails.0
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Can you leave the house without your mobile phone if it isn't charged? How about air in your shocks? These are things we wouldn't have considered 15 years ago when taking a bike out but now they are normality.
Exactly what I'm thinking. We're not talking e-bike here where it takes away the essence of a push bike (clue's in the name). We're just talking about a little wizgizmo that lets all that expensive suspension you bought give its all, all of the time. Can't understand why anyone wouldn't want that other than fear of change.All the gear, no idea and loving the smell of jealousy in the morning.
Kona Process 134 viewtopic.php?f=10017&t=129946070 -
Yeah, I'm pretty happy riding without my phone, and it doesn't exactly take long to stick some air in your suspension (I carry a shock pump). Charging batteries is something you actually have to keep on top of.
Can you leave the house without your mobile phone if it isn't charged? How about air in your shocks? These are things we wouldn't have considered 15 years ago when taking a bike out but now they are normality.
I don't want anything with a battery controlling anything on my bike. The beauty of a bike is that you can just grab it and go, you don't need to make sure it's charged up etc.
Nail > head.I don't think I do.
If the review is accurate then there's no downside, so why not other than a dogmatic aversion to anything with a battery.
The exact reason I don't want DI2, fancy lapierre suspension etc.
So, fear, it is, then.
Give it another 15 years and it'll be the conundrum of syncing up your electronically controlled suspension to your GPS App so it can automatically make constant minute adjustments to it on the trail as it has the terrain already stored for the route you are riding.0 -
Charging batteries is something you actually have to keep on top of.
According the the article is got a very long charge time so it's not something you're going to have to think about every ride. Once every two or three weeks, perhaps? So less effort than it takes oiling your chain. I'm guessing, but my mate's e-bike seems to last forever on a charge and, obviously, that sucks way more charge than this system will. Is it really too much trouble to plug your bike in once a fortnight over night when it's in its resting place? How do you keep up with maintaining all that other stuff on your bike if fl!cking a switch every two weeks is so onerous?All the gear, no idea and loving the smell of jealousy in the morning.
Kona Process 134 viewtopic.php?f=10017&t=129946070 -
Charging batteries is something you actually have to keep on top of.
According the the article is got a very long charge time so it's not something you're going to have to think about every ride. Once every two or three weeks, perhaps? So less effort than it takes oiling your chain. I'm guessing, but my mate's e-bike seems to last forever on a charge and, obviously, that sucks way more charge than this system will. Is it really too much trouble to plug your bike in once a fortnight over night when it's in its resting place? How do you keep up with maintaining all that other stuff on your bike if fl!cking a switch every two weeks is so onerous?
I maintain my bike as and when I think I need too. Generally as a result of hearing a noise on the trail. If I translate that to electronic suspension, I will only think of charging the battery as it dies as I thunder into a rock garden and lose the use of my rear shock....
As I said before, it just seems unnecessary to me and counter the concept of a push-bike.
A version of this stuff is on some Lapierre bikes isn't it - possibly with RS rather than Fox - seem to remember that not being well received.Closet jockey wheel pimp whore.0 -
A version of this stuff is on some Lapierre bikes isn't it - possibly with RS rather than Fox - seem to remember that not being well received.
The reviews of the Lapierre system said it worked well. And the Pinkbike review says this is a step up from that in the way it works.All the gear, no idea and loving the smell of jealousy in the morning.
Kona Process 134 viewtopic.php?f=10017&t=129946070 -
My bike stays pretty well maintained yes, but there's presumably a very fine line between having a good ride, and an electrical gremlin or flat battery ruining your ride. With mechanical problems, that line is nowhere near as fine, and is often something that's tweakable trailside, especially as I carry chain lube, shock pump, tools etc. with me on every ride. I don't have much faith in electronic technology to be honest, it never bloody works, and as soon as something has been around long enough for it to actually become useable on a day-to-day basis, the next 'innovative' thing comes out which inevitably sucks much more battery, breaks all the time, and support for the now reliable product ends. This is why I don't want electronic gadgets on my bike.Charging batteries is something you actually have to keep on top of.
According the the article is got a very long charge time so it's not something you're going to have to think about every ride. Once every two or three weeks, perhaps? So less effort than it takes oiling your chain. I'm guessing, but my mate's e-bike seems to last forever on a charge and, obviously, that sucks way more charge than this system will. Is it really too much trouble to plug your bike in once a fortnight over night when it's in its resting place? How do you keep up with maintaining all that other stuff on your bike if fl!cking a switch every two weeks is so onerous?
Call it fear, call me a miserable, skeptical sod, whatever. My mind won't be easily changed. Perhaps one day once the tech is old enough to be reliable and useable, but it's certainly not something that I think I 'need', particularly given the perceived downsides.0 -
While I think electronics can be a bad thing for some applications, having spent a bit of time riding and learning the inner workings of Di2 I think it has its place in the mtb world. The synchro shift mode in new xtr Di2 is a game changer IMO, it works so well and cleanly and it is not possible to achieve with a regular mechanical group set, and the front mech shifts like a rear, it's that smooth. Sure it's fecking expensive, but as it trickles down over the next 5-10 years I think we'll be seeing it a lot more. Battery life is a non issue with such systems as they use such minute amounts of power. Forgot 2-3 weeks, it's more like 2 months between charges and there are fail safes built in to warn you when you're running low. Batteries are only going to get better too as things progress.
Granted this new Fox stuff or Di2 won't be for everyone, and I won't begrudge anyone who says it not for them, but I will say this stuff is cool as sh!t and if means things are progressing for better bike performance then I'd like to give it a go and see how it gets on.0 -
Call it fear, call me a miserable, skeptical sod, whatever. My mind won't be easily changed. Perhaps one day once the tech is old enough to be reliable and useable.
I think this is the crux of the subject and is refreshingly honest. Skepticism in new tech is perfectly natural, especially when it is of someting so averse to our current style and comprehension.
I think it is sensible to wait and see if the tech works and is reliable, no doubt in my mind it is going to be expensive so i certainly wouldnt want to feel i have wasted my money. This kit will only be successful if reviewed favourably and honestly.
For it to be really successful, it needs to have a fail safe so that if worst comes to the worst, a battery failure wont foul the shock performance too badly and will allow the bike to be rideable in more than a "limp home mode." Develop that part of the idea and it will quash a large portion of the complaints by people who havent tried it.
So, "wait and see" is the sensible option but the problem is that if no one adopts early enough, the tech can fail immediately and will never achieve it's potential greatness. Someone needs to take a leap of faith. We need to trust that the tech is good enough now and will only get better.
i remember being an early adopter of dropper posts, i struggled with a wobbly speedball for months fully believeing that it was a great idea all the while anyone i knew who rode bikes would say " i dont see the point, its just one more thing to fail and i can always get off and adjust my saddle whenever i like for free."
All of those people are now sporting a dropper post and in my opinion, you would have to be mental to ride any bike without one.
Oh and i wonder how many of the FS riders started their lives in the "FS is skill flattering/ expensive/ heavy/ pointless/not-as-good-as-my-legs-even-though-i-use-front-suspension-which-is-better-than-my-arms-for-some-reason/ etc etc etc camp.
Even if you dont believe it will ever be for you; Look at the idea and the problem it is trying to overcome, understand and appreciate that not all problems exist for everyone, then be thankfull that bikes and their associated tech havent reached a stall point.
I suppose what i am really saying is, never say Never!!0
