Marmotte 2015

richymcp

I think it quite probable that the route will follow the usual route to Saint Jean de Maurienne (so over the Glandon) then come back over the Mollard and Croix De Fer before returning along the same route back to Bourg then up the Alp.

So a little less distance and a bit less climbing (although still a very hard day in the saddle).

BenderRodriguez

richymcp wrote:

I think it quite probable that the route will follow the usual route to Saint Jean de Maurienne (so over the Glandon) then come back over the Mollard and Croix De Fer before returning along the same route back to Bourg then up the Alp.

So a little less distance and a bit less climbing (although still a very hard day in the saddle).

Wouldn't this see the front riders having to pass the tail-enders in the opposite direction, who would likely still be riding up the Glandon? (As far as I can make out, last year the front group was at the top of the Glandon by 8:30, and the tail-enders still hadn't got to the top two and a half hours later.)

stanthomas

richymcp wrote:

I think it quite probable that the route will follow the usual route to Saint Jean de Maurienne (so over the Glandon) then come back over the Mollard and Croix De Fer before returning along the same route back to Bourg then up the Alp.

So a little less distance and a bit less climbing (although still a very hard day in the saddle).

They have promised that we "will not be disappointed" and I for one would feel seriously short-changed by a Glandon / Croix de Fer loop.

Glandon followed by a flat run to Albertville and back over the Madeleine then the Croix de Fer might just do it. Would certainly avoid the problem of the fast guys overlapping with tail enders on the Glandon. Still about 500m short on climbing though; maybe chuck the Mollard in for good measure.

richymcp

Well yes that's what they are going to have to work out; personally I think it'll be fine, remember you still have got over the Mollard and Croix De Fer.
Although agreed there might be some stragglers coming up the Glandon when the elite group are on the return leg, guess we shall see at some point this week.

richymcp

stanthomas wrote:

.
Glandon followed by a flat run to Albertville and back over the Madeleine then the Croix de Fer might just do it. Would certainly avoid the problem of the fast guys overlapping with tail enders on the Glandon. Still about 500m short on climbing though; maybe chuck the Mollard in for good measure.

I’ll have to work that route out but it sounds like a very long day in the saddle (maybe 2 days for some ) I think it unlikely at this late stage that they’ll make the event any longer/harder, we’ve all been training for 175km and 5,180 metres of climbing and given the geography and the fact that the Galibier is off the menu I think the Mollard route is quite likely. I’d also imagine trying to run as much of it on the roads they usually use is going to be attractive to the organisers.

chaffordred

Any thought on this?

Bourg-Glandon, then Le Chambre - St. Jean de Maurienne - Croix de Fer - descend Glandon-La Paute - Col d' Ornon-Bourg d'Oisans-ADH

104 Miles
Approx 20k of Climbing
Shorter but more climbing

chaffordred

stanthomas wrote:

richymcp wrote:

I think it quite probable that the route will follow the usual route to Saint Jean de Maurienne (so over the Glandon) then come back over the Mollard and Croix De Fer before returning along the same route back to Bourg then up the Alp.

So a little less distance and a bit less climbing (although still a very hard day in the saddle).

They have promised that we "will not be disappointed" and I for one would feel seriously short-changed by a Glandon / Croix de Fer loop.

Glandon followed by a flat run to Albertville and back over the Madeleine then the Croix de Fer might just do it. Would certainly avoid the problem of the fast guys overlapping with tail enders on the Glandon. Still about 500m short on climbing though; maybe chuck the Mollard in for good measure.

I make that 158 Miles and 23k of climbing. Can't see that happening.

DeVlaeminck

I suspect we will see a shorter simpler route because that will be easier for them to agree with the local police (who are bound to want something shorter and simpler) and cheaper and easier to run. It's a one off route which is sold out anyway in an event which will sell out for the foreseeable future irrespective so I can't see why they would push the boat out and make it a real epic - however I hope I'm wrong. My money is on a Glandon - CdF loop with something thrown in on the Maurienne valley side to prevent the fast boys descending back to Bourg while the back markers are still climbing the same road.

tomb2100

What about:

Up Glandon descend to La Chambre as usual then up the spectacular Lacets de Monvernier, hang a right descend via le Chatel to St Jeane to Maurienne then up the Croix to Fer, down the Glandon and up the Alpe.
May be 15-20km shorter than the usual but about 5,300m of vertical gain

BenderRodriguez

Or... Glandon, La Chambre, Montgellafrey, Longchamp (200m below the summit of the Madeleine), down the main road from the Madeleine, Croix de Fer, Alpe D'Huez. Over 5500m of vertical?

fuzzdog

I've been looking at the news from the area because there was a meeting in Le Grave this evening. Not much to report yet but the locals obviously need a solution quickly and there was apparently suggestions of getting some bigger boats to ferry people round the tunnel but maybe more interestingly a floating pontoon bridge. They are all just suggestions at the moment.

chaffordred

BenderRodriguez wrote:

Or... Glandon, La Chambre, Montgellafrey, Longchamp (200m below the summit of the Madeleine), down the main road from the Madeleine, Croix de Fer, Alpe D'Huez. Over 5500m of vertical?

It would be great to climb the Madeleine but, the road up to Longchamp via Montgellafrey looks dangerous and would never be able to handle an event like this. Singletrack road with patchy tarmac, sheer drops, avalanche warnings, rocks in the road etc. The other issue would be faster riders running into the ones who started later/slower riders at la Chambre.

Personally I think the Glandon-Croix de Fer loop, then a loop up to Ornon from Bourg d'Oisans then descend to La Paute with a finish on ADH looks more doable and safer as the same roads have been used in the TDF so can handle big traffic. The organisers also use the road to Ornon on the La Vaujany event so they are familiar with the territory.

cc78

There is a report in the Dauphine this morning saying that ASO (the organisers of the Tour) are looking at a Plan B for the Galibier stage, scheduled for Saturday 25th July. The prediction is that they will simply use the Croix de Fer instead of the Galibier; obviously there are different circumstances for a stage race rather than a one-off event.

Surely it won't be long before Sport Communication announce what they are going to do.

DeVlaeminck

chaffordred wrote:

Personally I think the Glandon-Croix de Fer loop, then a loop up to Ornon from Bourg d'Oisans then descend to La Paute with a finish on ADH looks more doable and safer as the same roads have been used in the TDF so can handle big traffic. The organisers also use the road to Ornon on the La Vaujany event so they are familiar with the territory.

Is there a suitable loop up round the Ornon without either going on tiny roads or adding huge miles ?

chaffordred

tomb2100 wrote:

What about:

Up Glandon descend to La Chambre as usual then up the spectacular Lacets de Monvernier, hang a right descend via le Chatel to St Jeane to Maurienne then up the Croix to Fer, down the Glandon and up the Alpe.
May be 15-20km shorter than the usual but about 5,300m of vertical gain

This may also be a possible route as the tour goes from to St. Jean de Maurienne to Col du Chaussy on stage 19.

chaffordred

DeVlaeminck wrote:

chaffordred wrote:

Personally I think the Glandon-Croix de Fer loop, then a loop up to Ornon from Bourg d'Oisans then descend to La Paute with a finish on ADH looks more doable and safer as the same roads have been used in the TDF so can handle big traffic. The organisers also use the road to Ornon on the La Vaujany event so they are familiar with the territory.

Is there a suitable loop up round the Ornon without either going on tiny roads or adding huge miles ?

To get up to Ornon from Bourg d'Oisans D219-D210, then descend on the D256 to La Paute, do a right to the foot of the alpe. I make that exactly 107 miles (with the Glandon-Croix de Fer loop and finish on ADH)

tlr

I only found out about this route change on here a couple of days ago, I think its pretty poor that the organisers haven't bothered to let people know themselves. Its going to be a £1200 trip for me with 24 hours of driving, and frankly its not worth it for a single random ride in the Alps. The Marmotte is about testing yourself against that route surely, it'd be like taking Hardknott out of the Whitton.

I have to decide this week whether to cancel the trip and lose £200, or hope against all evidence that they manage to get the tunnel sorted.

Does anyone know if there is a process for deferment of your place until next year?

grimpeur

"and frankly its not worth it for a single random ride in the Alps"

Whilst I understand your disappointment in not being able to ride the full Marmotte route. There is a lot more to the Alps than riding only the Glandon, Telegraph, Galibier and Alpe.

tlr

I agree, and I've spent many weeks there riding them, including the Glandon, Telegraph, Galibier and Alpe d'Huez.

Had I of known earlier I could have booked a week off instead of a long weekend and that cash would have got me a pleasant 7 days of riding instead of 1 day, but annual leave and ferries are now booked.

3 days in Provence up and around Ventoux might be an alternative.

tomb2100

Look I get the disappointment but I think the organisers are coming in for a lot of unfair criticism here. The crack in the tunnel was discovered in April I believe and it was due to be fixed during June, it's only in the last week or so that the date has been put back to mid July, hardly the fault of Sport Communication. I'm pretty sure a lot of people booked last year before anyone knew of the problems.

I suggest people wait for the new route to be revealed and then if it's a poor imitation moan away!

tonyscp

To get up to Ornon from Bourg d'Oisans D219-D210, then descend on the D256 to La Paute, do a right to the foot of the alpe. I make that exactly 107 miles (with the Glandon-Croix de Fer loop and finish on ADH)

This might look like a possible route, but there is a stretch between Villard Reymond and Villard Notre Dame that is essentially a dirt track running alongside the edge of the mountain. I've done it very gingerly on my road bike because it's a nice round route, but it's not feasible for a sportive with thousands of riders.

DeVlaeminck

Yes that's the only way round the Ornon I know (without going a long way) and I agree it isn't really a road they are likely to use on the Marmotte.

shimmipete

How about this route I saw suggested in the commentsection on the organizers fb-page:
http://www.openrunner.com/index.php?id=4814946

Glandon - Ventour - Mollard - Croix Fer - AdH. 170 km and 5000m elevation

ilav84

tomb2100 wrote:

Look I get the disappointment but I think the organisers are coming in for a lot of unfair criticism here. The crack in the tunnel was discovered in April I believe and it was due to be fixed during June, it's only in the last week or so that the date has been put back to mid July, hardly the fault of Sport Communication. I'm pretty sure a lot of people booked last year before anyone knew of the problems.

I suggest people wait for the new route to be revealed and then if it's a poor imitation moan away!

I agree! I am disappointed as well. It will be my first time riding anything like this type of event. But what could they do? It's certainly not the organisers fault. I think it is a good thing that they are not rushing into announcing a new route too quickly. They seem to be taking in all the options available to them. Hopefylly it will be a good route! Gives me a reason to go back next year!

fuzzdog

One of the main problems with most of these alternative routes is the prospect of the faster riders coming up against the tail enders still coming up the Glandon when they are on their way back to the Alp.
How about they alter the start this year and have the slower riders going off first. It's probably safer for the speedier riders to overtake the slower riders on their way up the Glandon. Maybe?
Also. I know most people here are probably are not that bothered but I just wondered what the organisers will do about the Mi Marmotte. That only runs over the part of the course that can't be done. From Valloire to the finish.

tomb2100

fuzzdog wrote:

One of the main problems with most of these alternative routes is the prospect of the faster riders coming up against the tail enders still coming up the Glandon when they are on their way back to the Alp.
How about they alter the start this year and have the slower riders going off first. It's probably safer for the speedier riders to overtake the slower riders on their way up the Glandon. Maybe?
Also. I know most people here are probably are not that bothered but I just wondered what the organisers will do about the Mi Marmotte. That only runs over the part of the course that can't be done. From Valloire to the finish.

We don't know but it's kind of fun guessing, especially if we get it right

Maybe it could be the Croix de Fer 1st, descend via the Mollard, up the Col de Chaussy from Montvernier descend into La Chambre then up the Glandon the truly evil way :twisted: and then to the Alp. Mi Marmotte and Randonée crew to stay in St Jean de Maurienne. Part Marmotte part Etape - epic !

richymcp

They won't descend the Croix De Fer (it's deemed too dangerous) it will be the Glandon descent as per usual, apparently they had a local meeting about the new route on Monday so hopefully we should know soon (although agreed this guessing game is kinda fun).

chaffordred

Another alternative would be to do it on cross bikes, bypass the tunnel by taking the gravel track around the other side of the Chambon lake

BTW anyone know any cheap French tarmacers?

chaffordred

fuzzdog wrote:

Also. I know most people here are probably are not that bothered but I just wondered what the organisers will do about the Mi Marmotte. That only runs over the part of the course that can't be done. From Valloire to the finish.

Forgot about that. I would imagine people doing that will have accommodation booked in Valloire. Maybe they will start it down in the maurienne valley now which means descending the Telegraphe to start.

BenderRodriguez

fuzzdog wrote:

How about they alter the start this year and have the slower riders going off first. It's probably safer for the speedier riders to overtake the slower riders on their way up the Glandon.

Can't see that working. There is hardly enough room to let everyone pass as it is. (For example, there were roadworks on the Glandon last year which took the road down to one lane and I wasted the best part of 5 minutes waiting to get through the bottleneck, with most people having to walk.) The congestion that would happen as the faster riders came up behind the slower ones would be huge, and it would be pretty dangerous too, given that the faster riders would have to try to thread their way through all the donkeys going at half their speed.