Warning about the Mekk Poggio‏

MrSingh

Oh man this is beginning to annoy me. My Poggio is arriving today and I'm getting ignored by Mekk: https://twitter.com/atma_singh/status/4 ... 1980299265

At the very least they could respond to me? Any response is better than no response right...I've just sank over £600 into this young company, based on reviews, knowing I could've gone for other options like a Planet X bike I am already feeling nervous.

Anyone tell me where I stand should I want to return the bike to Wiggle un-used and used?

deimosjohnny

I would guess that the part is wearing quicker than expected. Keep an eye on it as you want to intervene before any frame damage, then replace with better quality.

I would have thought though at he cost of the component that if MEKK were aware and thought it was a major issue they would have sent out better to retailers for when they build up the bike.

I would guess that on a new build if it could be addressed it would.

I got my replacement yesterday and I am off to have a look and see if they look any different to the ones in the pictures above…….

Nope looks like the same red piece used. I would suggest these are unusual instances, not great if your the one it happened to and not great if MEKK are putting the onus on the bike shop setup.

I am not going to lose any sleep over it. But hope the guys who have had the bad luck receive a resolution which they are happy with.

MrSingh

They responded saying they're looking into it: https://twitter.com/atma_singh/status/4 ... 1980299265

Jon_1976

Investigating...err. I'd like to believe that but the cynic in me suggests thats a brush off.

Re; Mekk, I appreciate that I got replies to my emails pretty quickly but it was the content of the email that I found not so good.

Hi

I am sorry to hear of the problems with your bike. I have read the Bike Radar post.

This issue will occur on any carbon frame bike, the cable routing is very important, and sometimes may not be perfectly set from the factory, there are several factors that can cause this issue, the size of frame the length of the cables and the routing.

I suggest you return your bike to your original place of purchase, any parts required we can support the dealer

I still don't how the cable and outer lengths can matter unless they are massively long or short (which they aren't). Once the cables the tensioned up, the ferrule is held in the stop at a set angle and the cable has to exit the ferrule at the angle the BB cable guide dictates. Its this angle that is the problem.

I followed up with an email to Mekk explaining the shop was 70 miles and I don't have a car at the moment. They suggested the shop might do a courier or use a LBS and they'd supply any parts, no mention of labour costs.

Going to contact the shop again.

Shame as its a really nice bike otherwise.

ManOfKent

MrSingh wrote:

Oh man this is beginning to annoy me. My Poggio is arriving today and I'm getting ignored by Mekk: https://twitter.com/atma_singh/status/4 ... 1980299265

At the very least they could respond to me? Any response is better than no response right...I've just sank over £600 into this young company, based on reviews, knowing I could've gone for other options like a Planet X bike I am already feeling nervous.

Anyone tell me where I stand should I want to return the bike to Wiggle un-used and used?

Under distance selling regulations you can return the bike to Wiggle within 30 days, for any or no reason. You may have to pay the cost of sending it back - check the Returns T&Cs on their website.

apreading

I am guessing that unfortunately you got more than 15% discount, so dont qualify for the 30 day test ride: http://www.wiggle.co.uk/h/option/30testride

Assuming that it was a bigger discount, you should still qualify for:

Bikes not eligible for our 30 Day Test Ride

If your bike is not eligible for our 30 Day Test Ride, you can return your bike within 365 calendar days from the delivery date. Please Contact Us to arrange a collection. Please note we will charge £20 for this service.

You must use the original box and the bike should be part disassembled in the same way that it arrived. A replacement box can be provided at a cost £25. For a guide on how to repack your bike for shipping, see the Return Bike Packaging guide.

Terms and conditions:

Unwanted bikes must be returned new and un-ridden
The bike must be returned within 365 calendar days.
Intention to return the bike must be notified via email within this timeframe.
Returning your bike will incur a £20 charge for collection.
Bikes must be packaged securely in the same packaging used to deliver the bike to you.
A replacement box can be provided at a cost £25. A surcharge of £25 will be applied for bikes returned without the original box
Any accessories supplied with or fitted to your bike need to be removed. Our normal Returns Policy applies to the accessories.

Jon_1976

To people who have just bought one, I don t think theres any need to get stressed out. Looking at all the reviews on wiggle, it looks like a lot of people are happy with theirs. This cable problem doesnt appear to be widespread or people just havent noticed it.

Obviously, there is a problem as Roadie74 and myself have suffered the exact same problem so its there. The shifting has got so bad on mine (even with adjusting the barrel adjusters) that its resigned to the spare room at the moment. It was really getting on my nerves and sapping the enjoyment out of riding.

rickeverett

Jon_1976 wrote:

To people who have just bought one, I don t think theres any need to get stressed out. Looking at all the reviews on wiggle, it looks like a lot of people are happy with theirs. This cable problem doesn't appear to be widespread or people just havent noticed it.

Obviously, there is a problem as Roadie74 and myself have suffered the exact same problem so its there. The shifting has got so bad on mine (even with adjusting the barrel adjusters) that its resigned to the spare room at the moment. It was really getting on my nerves and sapping the enjoyment out of riding.

My gut feeling is this is some sort of build issue on some bikes. Its certainly doesn't seem to be commonplace.

The problem may be solved (even averted) if you fit Nosed Ferrules to the gear Cables entry and exit points. Another thing I would look at is the length of the cable housing. When you have long housing it bends around more and puts more strain on furrules and clamps.

You can get the nosed ferrules on ebay. (Double Check Size. - Think the MEKK might be 4mm cable housing. - You will need brake ones for brake cables if you want to do those too as they are thicker wire)

They will help guide the cable away through the frame better. I would remove the cables, wipe down, lube the cable, housing and ferrules and rebuild. The front cables can just have then fitted to the entry points on the frame.

You could ask a LBS to do this. But you don't learn is you do !

Jon_1976

The housings arent too long. The ferrule is entering the stop at the straightest angle possible. It a bad frame design when you have to think about buying nosed ferrules to stop the cables sawing into the frame.

rickeverett

Jon_1976 wrote:

The housings arent too long. The ferrule is entering the stop at the straightest angle possible. It a bad frame design when you have to think about buying nosed ferrules to stop the cables sawing into the frame.

deimosjohnny

MrSingh How's the bike, had your first ride?

Jon_1976

Yes, it would be good to hear you get on with Mr Singh, you too deimosjohhny.

deimosjohnny

I love the poggio, the first one was solid, responsive and comfortable ride.

The new one seems to be set up better or maybe everything is just nice and tight. I think i have now have a better fit with seat and height position, as first ride this evening just felt better.

The frame is also better in that the carbon fibre pattern under the lacquer on the top bar is in a better pattern. I love my Poggio and I am a MEKK fanboy.

Jon_1976

deimosjohnny wrote:

I love the poggio, the first one was solid, responsive and comfortable ride.

The new one seems to be set up better or maybe everything is just nice and tight. I think i have now have a better fit with seat and height position, as first ride this evening just felt better.

The frame is also better in that the carbon fibre pattern under the lacquer on the top bar is in a better pattern. I love my Poggio and I am a MEKK fanboy.

Nice one 8) Good to hear.

Roadie74

Jon_1976 wrote:

The housings arent too long. The ferrule is entering the stop at the straightest angle possible. It a bad frame design when you have to think about buying nosed ferrules to stop the cables sawing into the frame.

Sorry to see you have the same problem, especially after only 370 odd miles, I hope you get it sorted. Yeah having to think about new ferrules to try and combat a problem that should have not been there in the first place, Mekk should be attempting different solutions for you, or maybe they already are. When I buy a new bike I'm thinking about the groupset, geometry, weight, wheels etc. not "what type of ferrules are they using". You assume that they have got that bit right.

Good that deimosjohnny got his replacement.

Jon_1976

Roadie74 wrote:

Jon_1976 wrote:

The housings arent too long. The ferrule is entering the stop at the straightest angle possible. It a bad frame design when you have to think about buying nosed ferrules to stop the cables sawing into the frame.

Sorry to see you have the same problem, especially after only 370 odd miles, I hope you get it sorted. Yeah having to think about new ferrules to try and combat a problem that should have not been there in the first place, Mekk should be attempting different solutions for you, or maybe they already are. When I buy a new bike I'm thinking about the groupset, geometry, weight, wheels etc. not "what type of ferrules are they using". You assume that they have got that bit right.

Good that deimosjohnny got his replacement.

Thanks mate.

Agree with all your comments.

Still haven't got a reply from the store yet. I thought it'd be easier emailing them (with photos) than trying to explain it over the phone. I'll phone them up next week just to check they got the emails. Haven't emailed Mekk again, as they just keep fobbing me off.

Bike is currently residing in the spare room and hasn't been used for a bit as I don't want to make it worse.

Jon_1976

Bit of an update. The bike is going back to the shop on Monday for them to have a look.

Haven't used it since early June, longest break from cycling I've had. Cabin fever :twisted:

MrSingh

deimosjohnny wrote:

MrSingh How's the bike, had your first ride?

I've been riding the bike 1-2hours around 3-4 times a week since getting it. It's my first road bike and a joy to ride. Learning a lot. Swapped out the cheapo brake pads for KoolStop ones which have made things much better (DuraAce/ 105/Ultegra ones fits shoes perfectly). Re-indexed the Sora gears the other day (hoping this isn't early stages of the cabling fault!) but can't seem to eliminate front derailleur chain rub :-( although that's another issue...anyway I digress lol.

Re: cabling issue: I haven't tried to take a look. Keep in mind that internal cabling is new to me and I don't want to take things off or misadjust them which would affect my ride. However I'm also keen to spot this problem asap. In fact I want to proactively prevent it by getting Mekk/Wiggle/LBS at no cost to me to replace those parts that might eventually cause it. I feel this is totally reasonable given the fact that either it is a design fault and/or crap bike-building.

Ps - Twitter Convo with Mekk hasn't really progressed yet. See here (includes my reference to another person having similar problems):

https://twitter.com/atma_singh/status/4 ... 5572993024

Jon_1976

Mr Singh, good to hear your enjoying the bike and I applaud you on your persistence on twittering Mekk. I don't applaud their lack of replies (and lack of interest). I hope you get the answers you deserve.

Re: the front mech rubbing. Is it rubbing whilst on the big ring or little? First check alignment with chainrings.
If it's the big, you need either more cable tension or the high limit screw needs loosening.
If it's little, it's either too much tension or low level limit screws needs loosening.
you should set these using big ring - smallest cassette sprocket & small ring- biggest sprocket.

Good video here http://m.youtube.com/watch?v=lxV_vKlgolc

A tell tale sign of the cable cutting into the stops and ferrules is there is noticeable cable drag and shifting to smaller sprockets becomes very erratic unless you back the cable tension off loads (at which point shifting to larger sprockets becomes problematic/ impossible).

Matthewfalle

madasahattersley wrote:

Worried about being sued.

madasahattersley wrote:

Still worried about being sued...

Why? What have you done? I know there are some legal guys on here - they may be able to assist you with pro bono advice (standard caveats obviously) or maybe CAB or legal aid?

Remember - a problem shared is a problem halved.

Hope that all turns out ok and that someone can help.

M

Old_Timer

Mr. Singh,
Glad to read that you are back on the bicycle, that is some good news that is welcome.

Madasahattersly,
Even as litigious as our societies have become nothing my studies ever gave credence to offering advise to someone would bring about a successful legal action. Unless you were encouraging unsafe or deadly actions to someone a forum reply doesn't ride to the level of actionable. Sure there are lawyers and solicitors that will bring a suit against their mum for the way she baked her biscuits but they get drummed out of courts. This isn't a "reality show" or an episode of Inspector Morse, you are safe replying to a post. Even the pro racing forum has its disclaimer and warning about defamation and libelous posts, read that if you are worried.

Cheers.

Matthewfalle

Agree completely with O/T

Although society has become more and more litigious and there is now a greater risk than ever of free speech and opinion being interpreted in the wrong manner by those privy to the Courts and Law, I don't feel how your comments would leave you open to potential aggressive litigation from another party.

Looking at it, you're merely offering a personal opinion that in no way can be accepted or viewed as professional or learned in a Court of Law.

You have never stated as such and therefore I would assume that you do not fall foul of litigatory legislation concerning reputational matters or affecting goodwill and product sales (well, as far as I am aware under the Law of England and Wales - perhaps someone more versed in inter jurisdictional jurisprudence may be able to assist with other legislative areas?)

As above, I am sure that people on here would be only too happy to help if needed - I like to think that we are all one big cycling club!

Yours in cycling

M

MrSingh

Jon_1976 wrote:

Mr Singh, good to hear your enjoying the bike and I applaud you on your persistence on twittering Mekk. I don't applaud their lack of replies (and lack of interest). I hope you get the answers you deserve.

Re: the front mech rubbing. Is it rubbing whilst on the big ring or little? First check alignment with chainrings.
If it's the big, you need either more cable tension or the high limit screw needs loosening.
If it's little, it's either too much tension or low level limit screws needs loosening.
you should set these using big ring - smallest cassette sprocket & small ring- biggest sprocket.

Good video here http://m.youtube.com/watch?v=lxV_vKlgolc

A tell tale sign of the cable cutting into the stops and ferrules is there is noticeable cable drag and shifting to smaller sprockets becomes very erratic unless you back the cable tension off loads (at which point shifting to larger sprockets becomes problematic/ impossible).

Thanks Jon.

Re: front mech - have followed similar vids when adjusting but this one seems more in-depth so will give it a go. As a newbie can do with all extra info :-)

Re: cable frame-carving signs - I'm new to road bikes so can't compare to how this bike's gears should normally behave and then there's the new bike cable stretch to factor-in. I think I'm going to need to pull off the plastic housings and take a look and see if my frame is getting eaten away. I'm interested in putting better quality ferrules in but tbh I want Mekk to be more upfront - why should I be doing this?

Current cenario: Cables cutting frame isn't an isolated issue - Bikes are going for cheap online - this year's bike has different internal cabling entry points - Mekk are pretty much ignoring concerns...current scenario doesn't bode well.

Ps Bottom bracket seems to have let some people down too: see recent comments on Mekk's Facebook:

https://www.facebook.com/MEKKBicycles

Jon_1976

No problems Mr.Singh If you want to check your cable stops and ferrules, all you need to do is disconnect the cable from the mechs and pull some slack though the stops so you can move the outers away from the stops a bit. No need to pull the inner cable through the frame as feeding it back through the frame can be a pain at the BB area (you can tape some string on the the cable if you want to remove it fully).

I got an email from the shop saying they've fixed my bike and will be returning it on Monday. They have been good about handling this issue with arranging couriers, etc. According to the email, they have fitted nose ferrules and new inners. No mention of the frame stops or outers so I'll find out about them on Monday. I should be able to give some feedback on your comment of better ferrules anyway.

Agree with your comments about Mekk's lack of interest, it isn't good. I wasn't at all impressed with their email replies when I brought this issue up. I might as well have asked my 1 year old nephew for advice

Still think its a decent bike (apart from the cable issue) but I'd never buy another Mekk after this. I know it makes no difference to them, just the way I feel.

Re: BB creaking, that wouldn't bother me as all BBs are prone to creaking (press fit types more so) and they are an easy fix. The cable issue is more worrying.

Old_Timer

Glad the bicycle seems to be sorted, now. The BB creaks are the seeming current ill du jour for road cyclist judging from the number of workshop threads about them. I have BB30 on my CAAD10 and it has been a solid performer, I've done the regular maintenance greasing of the bearings and cleaned everything when it was done. The various press fit bearing schemes all seem to need some type of locking or bearing retaining adhesive applied.

I think a lot of the sounds are from poor manufacturing tolerances allowing some slop to set up as time goes by. The Cannondale site has a tech bulletin, in the accessories area, on how to correctly install the BB30 (and the PF30) bottom brackets, they also include the correct Loctite Green level bearing retaining adhesive part number.

Hopefully yours is just is up for a cleaning and greasing, not having a problem. You've had your share for the year. :roll:

MrSingh

Jon_1976 wrote:

No problems Mr.Singh If you want to check your cable stops and ferrules, all you need to do is disconnect the cable from the mechs and pull some slack though the stops so you can move the outers away from the stops a bit. No need to pull the inner cable through the frame as feeding it back through the frame can be a pain at the BB area (you can tape some string on the the cable if you want to remove it fully).

I got an email from the shop saying they've fixed my bike and will be returning it on Monday. They have been good about handling this issue with arranging couriers, etc. According to the email, they have fitted nose ferrules and new inners. No mention of the frame stops or outers so I'll find out about them on Monday. I should be able to give some feedback on your comment of better ferrules anyway.

Agree with your comments about Mekk's lack of interest, it isn't good. I wasn't at all impressed with their email replies when I brought this issue up. I might as well have asked my 1 year old nephew for advice

Still think its a decent bike (apart from the cable issue) but I'd never buy another Mekk after this. I know it makes no difference to them, just the way I feel.

Re: BB creaking, that wouldn't bother me as all BBs are prone to creaking (press fit types more so) and they are an easy fix. The cable issue is more worrying.

Re: buying Mekk in future - Your decision not to buy Mekk in future is a big deal. For a new smallish producer customers like us are crucial. Threads like this getting bumped on major cycling forums are an issue. If it turns out that my bike has the cable carving issues then how they respond is critical. So far I reckon they're letting the side down as far as customers are concerned.

MrSingh

Checked the ferrules. I have the problem too...having had the bike for well under a month! I'm going to now bring this up with Mekk/Wiggle and report back.

Mekk - a young & exciting British bike manufacturer, fronted by two big names, have an excellent opportunity to ensure that they retain a customer for the future...because aside from this issue I REALLY love this bike. Sadly this is where companies often prove short-sighted, not realising the long-term damage they do to their own reputation by dismissing such concerns or playing totally dumb...instead of doing the right thing which is to put a smile back on the customer's face.

Let's see what they do...

Jon_1976

Sorry to hear that mate

I can tell you, from experience, Mekk will just fob you off to Wiggle. Maybe they are too busy 'investigating'

Jon_1976

Maybe crossing the cables might alleviate the problem

. Having the cable outers enter the frame on opposite sides so the cables cross over in the down tube so the inner cable exit the ferrule at a straighter angle. Obviously, you shouldn't have to do this or buy nosed ferrules. The problem should have been picked up on in the design/manufacture stage.

I've had 2 specialized Allez bikes, one came with the cables installed parallel and the outers rubbed the head tube a lot. The other bike has crossed cables and the outers looped around the head tube much better. No difference in shifting.

That was an external cable bike though, not sure if it could cause further issues on an internal cable bike like the poggio though.

rickeverett

Could I just point out that have you lot contacted MEKK directly or the distributor responsible for "normal" customer service (Paligap)

Its just that I have had excellent service from them and quick response in regards to replacing my BB Guide that was worn through normal wear and tear.



See if you can Tweet / Facebook to Mark Edwards or Ken Knight ??