Domestic cats and wildlife...

Mikey23

So we've been doing our springwatch thing and have had a delightful family of young blackbirds nesting in our garden. So there's daddy blackbird down on the lawn by the hedge with baby blackbird doing the parenting and feeding thing when a cat from next door takes the baby out. The poor mite makes its escape but it so badly injured that all it can do is slowly bleed to death on my patio chair ... So I had to put it down as humanely as possible.

So why do people keep domestic cats and do they know or care what savage killing machines they are when the little darlings are out of sight?

tlw1

they keep cats because they are mad women living on their own

desweller

Get some of the mains-powered audible scarers. Haven't had a cat in my garden since I put one up.

I bloody hate the little sods. Nothing more than domesticated vermin IMO.

jawooga

I love cats and i have two. But I can sympathise why people hate them on account of what they do to urban wildlife. When my cats die, the only reason i wouldn't get more would be for this reason.

Edit: maybe cats should be trained to catch whatever an ecosystem has an excess of. So in my locale, that would be sea gulls, or in the summer, holidaying brummies

lemon63

DesWeller wrote:

Get some of the mains-powered audible scarers. Haven't had a cat in my garden since I put one up.

Sounds like what I need to keep the feckers away from my fish pond - where do you get them from?

desweller

lemon63 wrote:

DesWeller wrote:

Get some of the mains-powered audible scarers. Haven't had a cat in my garden since I put one up.

Sounds like what I need to keep the feckers away from my fish pond - where do you get them from?

The specific product I'm using is called a Gardman Cat Gard (check out that whacky spelling!). But it does not appear to be available any more.

There are lots of similar products though. I'd recommend a mains-powered unit with a really long lead so you have a few options about where you can place it.

ballysmate

jawooga wrote:

I love cats and i have two. But I can sympathise why people hate them on account of what they do to urban wildlife. When my cats die, the only reason i wouldn't get more would be for this reason.

Edit: maybe cats should be trained to catch whatever an ecosystem has an excess of. So in my locale, that would be sea gulls, or in the summer, holidaying brummies

I'd be happy if they had the f*cking pigeons that had my peas. Bastards!

pinno

I like cats but I keep the bloody things in at night. They get used to it.

.and I am not a mad woman living on my own, well not yet anyway.

tlw1

pinarello001 wrote:

I like cats but I keep the bloody things in at night. They get used to it.

.and I am not a mad woman living on my own, well not yet anyway.

There's time

Daz555

A cat with a bell collar will rarely catch a bird ever again - will still bring home the odd vermin though which is not so bad.

sungod

plenty of birds kill insects, other birds, mammals, reptiles, fish etc.

that is nature, it doesn't discrminate in favour of the cute and/or fluffy

cats are doing what they evolved to do

projecting human emotions/values on them, or birds, is delusional

desweller

sungod wrote:

plenty of birds kill insects, other birds, mammals, reptiles, fish etc.

that is nature, it doesn't discrminate in favour of the cute and/or fluffy

cats are doing what they evolved to do

projecting human emotions/values on them, or birds, is delusional

Except wild animals kill for food and form part of the ecosystem they occupy.

Domestic cats are not subject to predators or environmental conditions, so they have a disproportionate effect on their environment.

NB They did not evolve, they were bred.

team47b

I was sat with my cat watching a sparrow hopping around the lawn one day when a magpie dropped down, grabbed the sparrow and tore it's head off in one go, the cat and I just looked at each other, shared a moment, I said "nature!" the cat washed it's testicles.

@DesWeller- cars are the newly 'evolved' predator for cats.

simonhead

If we didnt keep cats as domestic pets and control their breeding to some extent they would be a real menace. They would breed and breed and then become out of control, hunting in packs, steeling babies and worrying sheep. They dont have a natural predator except the Chinese.

Mikey23

i think it was the sheer pointlessness of it that got to me. if it had been taken by summat further up the food chain as food then i would have coped with that. but as a random act for sport is hard to watch. we have known daddy blackbird for a couple of years and watched him teaching and feeding his youngster was quite impressive. i just felt his distress...

anyways, a high pressure water pistol thingy is going to b purchased as a humane alternative to a shotgun (note to GCHQ only kidding).. fed up with other peoples cats using our garden as their flipping toilet as well

seanoconn

One day when i was out, my wife sat and watched (she was too scared to move) our cute squeaky cat Mini, crunch and gulp down a whole mouse, head first. I didn't think cats did that!

(We do feed the cat)

goonz

I have a cat, but its an indoor one but I know it would definitely hunt birds etc if it was an outdoor cat. Its in their DNA and no amount of breeding will remove that from them. Its nature, why do we think its wrong in anyway?

Us breeding and killing baby cows for venison is much more cruel than what the cat does. Hunting is programmed into the cats brain, killing for food is not exactly programmed into the human mind, yet we still do it.

simonhead

goonz wrote:

Us breeding and killing baby cows for venison

Hate to point it out but Venison is deer meat. Do you meen Veal?

laurentian

sungod wrote:

plenty of birds kill insects, other birds, mammals, reptiles, fish etc.

that is nature, it doesn't discrminate in favour of the cute and/or fluffy

cats are doing what they evolved to do

projecting human emotions/values on them, or birds, is delusional

The difference is that the cat is a non-native, uncontrolled predator on our indigenous birds and small mammals whereas what you describe is, indeed, nature. It has nothing to do with projecting human emotions or the anthropomorphising of animals.

Imagine if there were no cats in this country and some bright spark approached the government or whoever and said that they would like to introduce a non-native species to the UK that is allowed to roam (and defecate!) wherever it wanted with impunity, would kill our native small mammals and birds with no redress, would be allowed to breed with no checks or balances and that does not require any kind of licence, checks or balances to own?

I would like to think that even the most bovine of our legislature would see the problem with it and not let it happen.

In all seriousness, I would like to see immediate licensing of cats and the requirement for them to wear a collar or microchip. Any found not to have one would be destroyed in the same way that stray dogs are. Their free movement should be controlled to within the secure boundary of the owner, otherwise they should be walked on leads and the owners obliged to pick up and dispose of their faeces in the same way that dog owners do. Any found to be trespassing on another's property could be legally trapped or shot (as per dogs on farmland now).

I would also prohibit breeding of them in the hope that in 20 or so years we are rid of the murderous vermin.

goonz

simonhead wrote:

goonz wrote:

Us breeding and killing baby cows for venison

Hate to point it out but Venison is deer meat. Do you meen Veal?

Sorry yes Veal.

bdu98252

Laurentian appears to be calling for a change to the law and the right to kill others pets and does not appear to understand the difference between cats and dogs currently held within the law. I would not mind a law that allows me to shoot Laurentian for being within 10 yards of me. Intolerance breeds intolerance.

goonz

laurentian wrote:

sungod wrote:

plenty of birds kill insects, other birds, mammals, reptiles, fish etc.

that is nature, it doesn't discrminate in favour of the cute and/or fluffy

cats are doing what they evolved to do

projecting human emotions/values on them, or birds, is delusional

The difference is that the cat is a non-native, uncontrolled predator on our indigenous birds and small mammals whereas what you describe is, indeed, nature. It has nothing to do with projecting human emotions or the anthropomorphising of animals.

Imagine if there were no cats in this country and some bright spark approached the government or whoever and said that they would like to introduce a non-native species to the UK that is allowed to roam (and defecate!) wherever it wanted with impunity, would kill our native small mammals and birds with no redress, would be allowed to breed with no checks or balances and that does not require any kind of licence, checks or balances to own?

I would like to think that even the most bovine of our legislature would see the problem with it and not let it happen.

In all seriousness, I would like to see immediate licensing of cats and the requirement for them to wear a collar or microchip. Any found not to have one would be destroyed in the same way that stray dogs are. Their free movement should be controlled to within the secure boundary of the owner, otherwise they should be walked on leads and the owners obliged to pick up and dispose of their faeces in the same way that dog owners do. Any found to be trespassing on another's property could be legally trapped or shot (as per dogs on farmland now).

I would also prohibit breeding of them in the hope that in 20 or so years we are rid of the murderous vermin.

Reading this, it seems you could quite easily have replaced the words animals, cats , dogs etc with immigrants, or humans and this post will be just as insulting and repulsive.

seanoconn

laurentian wrote:

The difference is that the cat is a non-native, uncontrolled predator on our indigenous birds and small mammals whereas what you describe is, indeed, nature. It has nothing to do with projecting human emotions or the anthropomorphising of animals.

Imagine if there were no cats in this country and some bright spark approached the government or whoever and said that they would like to introduce a non-native species to the UK that is allowed to roam (and defecate!) wherever it wanted with impunity, would kill our native small mammals and birds with no redress, would be allowed to breed with no checks or balances and that does not require any kind of licence, checks or balances to own?

I would like to think that even the most bovine of our legislature would see the problem with it and not let it happen.

In all seriousness, I would like to see immediate licensing of cats and the requirement for them to wear a collar or microchip. Any found not to have one would be destroyed in the same way that stray dogs are. Their free movement should be controlled to within the secure boundary of the owner, otherwise they should be walked on leads and the owners obliged to pick up and dispose of their faeces in the same way that dog owners do. Any found to be trespassing on another's property could be legally trapped or shot (as per dogs on farmland now).

I would also prohibit breeding of them in the hope that in 20 or so years we are rid of the murderous vermin.

Not a pussy lover then?

thegreatdivide

I need something to keep the feckin’ fat baxstard Wood Pigeons off my windowsill. I put out soaked sultanas for the local Blackbrids, Starlings, and their offspring in the morning and evening but have a couple of fat fuxkers who can swipe the lot in a minute flat. I was thinking about a casserole dish and a bottle of red wine?

Blackbirds are crafty sods btw. I have some quite tame chaps that will sit in front of the bedroom window and make a racket until I get up and feed them. There’s also one that makes the alarm call while stuffing his beak so the rest of his mates stay hidden.

goonz

thegreatdivide wrote:

I need something to keep the feckin’ fat baxstard Wood Pigeons off my windowsill. I put out soaked sultanas for the local Blackbrids, Starlings, and their offspring in the morning and evening but have a couple of fat fuxkers who can swipe the lot in a minute flat. I was thinking about a casserole dish and a bottle of red wine?

Blackbirds are crafty sods btw. I have some quite tame chaps that will sit in front of the bedroom window and make a racket until I get up and feed them. There’s also one that makes the alarm call while stuffing his beak so the rest of his mates stay hidden.

A potato gun?

crescent

lemon63 wrote:

DesWeller wrote:

Get some of the mains-powered audible scarers. Haven't had a cat in my garden since I put one up.

Sounds like what I need to keep the feckers away from my fish pond - where do you get them from?

I have a Patterdale Terrier and consequently have no cats within a 100yd radius of my house.

I wouldn't knowingly harm one, but I don't like them.

laurentian

bdu98252 wrote:

Laurentian appears to be calling for a change to the law and the right to kill others pets and does not appear to understand the difference between cats and dogs currently held within the law. I would not mind a law that allows me to shoot Laurentian for being within 10 yards of me. Intolerance breeds intolerance.

I don't think you can argue that domestic cats are not an introduced species that predates on our indigenous wildlife.

All I would like to see is that the same restrictions apply to cats as currently apply to dogs.

Dogs are not allowed to roam if not under control. Dogs can be shot if they are worrying farm animals and otherwise destroyed if they are proved to be a nuisance or if stray. Dogs must be walked on a lead. Dog sh!t must be picked up . . . all of these controls and yet and dogs do not independently predate on our native species.

laurentian

goonz wrote:

laurentian wrote:

sungod wrote:

plenty of birds kill insects, other birds, mammals, reptiles, fish etc.

that is nature, it doesn't discrminate in favour of the cute and/or fluffy

cats are doing what they evolved to do

projecting human emotions/values on them, or birds, is delusional

The difference is that the cat is a non-native, uncontrolled predator on our indigenous birds and small mammals whereas what you describe is, indeed, nature. It has nothing to do with projecting human emotions or the anthropomorphising of animals.

Imagine if there were no cats in this country and some bright spark approached the government or whoever and said that they would like to introduce a non-native species to the UK that is allowed to roam (and defecate!) wherever it wanted with impunity, would kill our native small mammals and birds with no redress, would be allowed to breed with no checks or balances and that does not require any kind of licence, checks or balances to own?

I would like to think that even the most bovine of our legislature would see the problem with it and not let it happen.

In all seriousness, I would like to see immediate licensing of cats and the requirement for them to wear a collar or microchip. Any found not to have one would be destroyed in the same way that stray dogs are. Their free movement should be controlled to within the secure boundary of the owner, otherwise they should be walked on leads and the owners obliged to pick up and dispose of their faeces in the same way that dog owners do. Any found to be trespassing on another's property could be legally trapped or shot (as per dogs on farmland now).

I would also prohibit breeding of them in the hope that in 20 or so years we are rid of the murderous vermin.

Reading this, it seems you could quite easily have replaced the words animals, cats , dogs etc with immigrants, or humans and this post will be just as insulting and repulsive.

Trust me, you couldn't and I wouldn't . . . whats repulsive about it? Why do you not support the control of cats in the same way that dogs are controlled? Do you think it's OK for cats to kill native species and for their owners to be unaccountable for this?

I accept that a cat lover will not like the above but, frankly I would rather see our wildlife flourish without the threat of decimation through somebodies irresponsible choice of pet.

bompington

goonz wrote:

laurentian wrote:

sungod wrote:

plenty of birds kill insects, other birds, mammals, reptiles, fish etc.

that is nature, it doesn't discrminate in favour of the cute and/or fluffy

cats are doing what they evolved to do

projecting human emotions/values on them, or birds, is delusional

The difference is that the cat is a non-native, uncontrolled predator on our indigenous birds and small mammals whereas what you describe is, indeed, nature. It has nothing to do with projecting human emotions or the anthropomorphising of animals.

Imagine if there were no cats in this country and some bright spark approached the government or whoever and said that they would like to introduce a non-native species to the UK that is allowed to roam (and defecate!) wherever it wanted with impunity, would kill our native small mammals and birds with no redress, would be allowed to breed with no checks or balances and that does not require any kind of licence, checks or balances to own?

I would like to think that even the most bovine of our legislature would see the problem with it and not let it happen.

In all seriousness, I would like to see immediate licensing of cats and the requirement for them to wear a collar or microchip. Any found not to have one would be destroyed in the same way that stray dogs are. Their free movement should be controlled to within the secure boundary of the owner, otherwise they should be walked on leads and the owners obliged to pick up and dispose of their faeces in the same way that dog owners do. Any found to be trespassing on another's property could be legally trapped or shot (as per dogs on farmland now).

I would also prohibit breeding of them in the hope that in 20 or so years we are rid of the murderous vermin.

Reading this, it seems you could quite easily have replaced the words animals, cats , dogs etc with immigrants, or humans and this post will be just as insulting and repulsive.

Let me get this right, you are saying that it is equally repulsive to argue for the extermination of animals and people? I've always struggled to work out what equal rights for animals people are actually advocating - where do you draw the line? Vertebrates? Bacteria? Plants?
Actually I am disgusted at your speciesism, as you seem to care deeply for cats but show no concern for all the other small animals they slaughter.

edhornby

Daz555 wrote:

A cat with a bell collar will rarely catch a bird ever again - will still bring home the odd vermin though which is not so bad.

Mrs Ed reckons that putting a bell on our cat when he was starting to hunt taught him to be stealthier - thankfully all he ever catches are vermin pigeons and occasional mice, and when we lived in Prestwich there were squirrels he used to eat, I'd come home to find just a tail...

I do think that it's a tough job to keep on top of the population of domestic cats, we have ours chipped, speyed and he has a collar but it's too easy for an irresponsible owner to cause a mini population explosion - too many people try to profit from bred animals too.

goonz

Not equally repulsive, i admit not best worded at all.

I dont have speciesism, I care for all animals just dont think you can take away a cats instincts from it. Its part of nature, but I have no issue with neutering cats to keep the population under control. Dogs also have the instinct to hunt etc but I draw the line when its humans they turn on.