Is my life less valuable than a police officer?
Comments
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She's offering them a sweetener for the coming troubles planned for teh summer.
And i'm not sure you can fail at education - i find that concept quite odd.
The dissenter is every human being at those moments of his life when he resigns
momentarily from the herd and thinks for himself.0 -
BelgianBeerGeek wrote:The police are civilians not some kind of paramilitary force. If you're not in HM Forces, you are a civilian. This isn't just a point of pedantry. The Police are just like the rest of Her Majesty's subjects but do a vital job on top.
Actually, the pedantry is wrong, or at least debateable (and it is debated on the internet!).
Certainly all police in the UK refer to non-sworn in staff, with no powers of authority as 'civilians' or civilian posts.
humanitarian law refers to civilians as not a member of the armed forces, or military - but that because humanitarian law was originally written with wars/prisoners of war etc as its main (only?) focus. Certainly official american policy is that police are not civilian and common usage also defines it as such, as does all of the official studies/correspondance/terminology in the UK.
http://www.psi.org.uk/publications/arch ... EMPOL4.pdf
http://www.eveningtimes.co.uk/news/scot ... n.20948535
for example - as you say, not that it makes any difference to the points being discussed here...
Actually - this suggests that killing a police officer is now officially worse than killing someone in the armed forces or other blue light service?!0 -
What I am waiting for, now that we have political Crime Commisioners for police forces, is there to be an industrial dispute somewhere like Warwickshire that needs mutual aid from other forces, only for labour Crime Commisioners to refuse to send their cops to 'help subvert a strike'... That will be an interesting situation that WILL happen before long!0
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apreading wrote:the playing mantis wrote:teaching trades would be good, as would moving away from the ridiculous idea that everyone should go to university. in most cases its not needed, and simply a means for people to have a jolly up, and get into a load of debt that could potentially mess their lives up for years to come.
everyone going to university also erodes one of the key reasons to go to university - to differentiate yourself from less able people when going for a job. If everyone has degrees then suddenly you start needing a PHD or masters to get a job. Apart from a fairly low percentage, most people who get a degree dont use the knowledge/skills afterwards but all expect it to look good on their CV and help them get a better job. Its pointless if everyone gets to uni and then the A levels or degrees get dumbed down to help everyone achieve. We have dumbed our academic qualifications down so much that we are now looking overseas at things like the Baccalaureate. Just because we dont want anyone to fail, but then passing becomes meaningless...
indeed, university should be for the few academically gifted to actually benefit from it, and increase their advanced knowledge as they have such a good learning capacity, relevant to what they are going to do in life.
the culture now is that its not fair for it to be for thye academically elite, which in a way is true, but only if we divert from the actusl fundamental purpose and reason for existence of a university. we need to get back to seeing what universities exist for originally and thus move away from feeling its unfair if some people, should be the vast majority, dont get to go. they should also get rid og a lot of the unis themselves as they are self serving.
i was lucky enough to go to a top uni, despite not getting top A level results. has it actually helped me in my xchosen career, not one bit, the degree was not relevant to the work i do now, and it wasnt a very good dgreee anyway as i didnt knuckle down. did i enjoy uni life, yes, but the experince of uni life isnt the purpose (or at least wasnt and shouldnt be) the point of going to university.
gone off police topic but ive written it now so here it is,0 -
Murder of a police officer is already distinguished from the majority of other murders as it normally carries a 30 year minimum term before the offender is eligible for parole.0
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+1, although i wouldnt mind being a teacher in a girls private school...
bit noncey that isnt it?
maybe you should be breaking rocks on a chain gang- it may curb your urges for under age girls?
'dont forget lads, one evertonian is worth twenty kopites'0 -
fast as fupp wrote:+1, although i wouldnt mind being a teacher in a girls private school...
bit noncey that isnt it?
maybe you should be breaking rocks on a chain gang- it may curb your urges for under age girls?
turn it up... i clearly meant 6th form, maybe year 10 at a push.0 -
the playing mantis wrote:fast as fupp wrote:+1, although i wouldnt mind being a teacher in a girls private school...
bit noncey that isnt it?
maybe you should be breaking rocks on a chain gang- it may curb your urges for under age girls?
turn it up... i clearly meant 6th form, maybe year 10 at a push.
ha ha! its still an offence for a teacher to get sexy with a pupil even if they are over 16 ! :shock:'dont forget lads, one evertonian is worth twenty kopites'0 -
Well Frank, because I don't know you personally, the original question has proved to have been a poser. So I have spent all day looking through all of your posts so that I could make an informed decision. And the answer is ....yes!
Surprised no-one said it earlier to be honest. 0 -
Ballysmate wrote:Well Frank, because I don't know you personally, the original question has proved to have been a poser. So I have spent all day looking through all of your posts so that I could make an informed decision. And the answer is ....yes!
Surprised no-one said it earlier to be honest. I love you too. :P Tail end Charlie
The above post may contain traces of sarcasm or/and bullsh*t.0 -
I couldn't care less if the penalty for murdering me is harsher than for others. The level of protection that affords me is negligible, probably even non-existent. It'll be of no comfort to me because I'll be dead, nor will it be any comfort to my family.
After a concerted attack on police pay and conditions over the past few years this is nothing more than Teresa May throwing us a bone.0 -
I think the penalty for murdering a police officer should be higher not because the individual is more worthy but because of the ultimate contempt it shows for the law and order of the land. Someone who kills a police officer will stop at nothing and should be incarcerated for life.
As for police pay and conditions, for many years these were exceedingly generous and I guess unsustainable especially as far as pensions are concerned but that is another story.0 -
Surely somebody who plans in advance say a rape and murder shows at least as much contempt for law and order as somebody who fatally attacks a police officer when backed into a corner.
Far from exhaustive examples but just two contrasting situations. Both actions are despicable btw so I'm not making any excuses. Just don't agree with the proposed hierarchy of victims.0 -
Statistically, I'm reasonably sure a police officer is still more likely to be murdered by a friend or family member than because of their job per se. Would that still carry the increased sentence?0
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come on what was written??0
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fast as fupp wrote:the playing mantis wrote:fast as fupp wrote:+1, although i wouldnt mind being a teacher in a girls private school...
bit noncey that isnt it?
maybe you should be breaking rocks on a chain gang- it may curb your urges for under age girls?
turn it up... i clearly meant 6th form, maybe year 10 at a push.
ha ha! its still an offence for a teacher to get sexy with a pupil even if they are over 16 ! :shock:
really? damn my dream will never come true now! what a shame0 -
MountainMonster wrote:pinarello001 wrote:What gets me too is when you get a story of someone who is killed or dies and they go into how full of life they were or how much potential they had etc etc. Its adding a crazy subjectivism to the whole thing.
We are going down the American route unfortunately.
How is that an American thing to say? I've heard it from Thailand, India, Austria, the UK, the US and many other places. Why do you hate Americans so much?
You get me wrong.
As a race of people, the British are great except for a few individuals who are complete tw4ts.
As a race of people, the Amerians are a race of tw4ts, however you do get some great individuals.
seanoconn - gruagach craic!0 -
pinarello001 wrote:MountainMonster wrote:pinarello001 wrote:What gets me too is when you get a story of someone who is killed or dies and they go into how full of life they were or how much potential they had etc etc. Its adding a crazy subjectivism to the whole thing.
We are going down the American route unfortunately.
How is that an American thing to say? I've heard it from Thailand, India, Austria, the UK, the US and many other places. Why do you hate Americans so much?
You get me wrong.
As a race of people, the British are great except for a few individuals who are complete tw4ts.
As a race of people, the Amerians are a race of tw4ts, however you do get some great individuals.
How many real Americans have you met face to face? Were all lovely, i've had more disrespect in this country for being American than you will ever be disrespected as a foreigner in America. That sounds like a ignorant statement which complete twits get brought up hearing. Fail at school?0 -
MountainMonster wrote:That sounds like a ignorant statement which complete twits get brought up hearing. Fail at school?
I do hope you're not expecting a response. Even though he likes to play the big man he isn't so keen on actually being the big man. Putting his hands up and acknowledging that he may be wrong seems to be beyond him.0 -
MountainMonster wrote:pinarello001 wrote:MountainMonster wrote:pinarello001 wrote:What gets me too is when you get a story of someone who is killed or dies and they go into how full of life they were or how much potential they had etc etc. Its adding a crazy subjectivism to the whole thing.
We are going down the American route unfortunately.
How is that an American thing to say? I've heard it from Thailand, India, Austria, the UK, the US and many other places. Why do you hate Americans so much?
You get me wrong.
As a race of people, the British are great except for a few individuals who are complete tw4ts.
As a race of people, the Amerians are a race of tw4ts, however you do get some great individuals.
How many real Americans have you met face to face? Were all lovely, i've had more disrespect in this country for being American than you will ever be disrespected as a foreigner in America. That sounds like a ignorant statement which complete twits get brought up hearing. Fail at school?
I don't for one minute think that is his opinion of Americans. It has somehow become popular/acceptable to bash America or Americans. I must stick up for our friends across the Atlantic, the numerous ones I have met have been warm and generous.
To show how acceptable it is to denigrate Americans, try substituting white and black for British and American in the above post.
I must point out that I would find neither post offensive, but my point is that some would be offended if it referred to black and white people instead. I am just trying to point out double standards within society.0 -
I have spent a lot of time researching this, and the output of my research is that my life is indeed more valuable than anyone else's !0
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Ballysmate wrote:MountainMonster wrote:pinarello001 wrote:MountainMonster wrote:pinarello001 wrote:What gets me too is when you get a story of someone who is killed or dies and they go into how full of life they were or how much potential they had etc etc. Its adding a crazy subjectivism to the whole thing.
We are going down the American route unfortunately.
How is that an American thing to say? I've heard it from Thailand, India, Austria, the UK, the US and many other places. Why do you hate Americans so much?
You get me wrong.
As a race of people, the British are great except for a few individuals who are complete tw4ts.
As a race of people, the Amerians are a race of tw4ts, however you do get some great individuals.
How many real Americans have you met face to face? Were all lovely, i've had more disrespect in this country for being American than you will ever be disrespected as a foreigner in America. That sounds like a ignorant statement which complete twits get brought up hearing. Fail at school?
I don't for one minute think that is his opinion of Americans. It has somehow become popular/acceptable to bash America or Americans. I must stick up for our friends across the Atlantic, the numerous ones I have met have been warm and generous.
To show how acceptable it is to denigrate Americans, try substituting white and black for British and American in the above post.
I must point out that I would find neither post offensive, but my point is that some would be offended if it referred to black and white people instead. I am just trying to point out double standards within society.
It may be acceptable in the cliques of people who have nothing better to talk about, such as Pinarello, but definitely doesn't reflect the vast majority of the population. I'm guessing he came from a council estate watching East Enders in his youth, as those are the types to say those things.
I don't get offended at it even being an American, I just find it shocking that he probably has absolutely no reason to say that yet he does.0 -
Cornerblock wrote:MountainMonster wrote:That sounds like a ignorant statement which complete twits get brought up hearing. Fail at school?
I do hope you're not expecting a response. Even though he likes to play the big man he isn't so keen on actually being the big man. Putting his hands up and acknowledging that he may be wrong seems to be beyond him.
Nope, I've come to realise he says something then runs and cowards. Most people who say things like he does do that. After all, racism and segregation is just a form of weakness.0 -
What a giggle. What a load of nonsense people spout.
Firstly, my first stepfather was a man called Stirling Doughty. He sold his farm in Napa valley California. Sold out because of an acrimonious divorce and the mafia. Walked away from it all. Died in Januray 1979. He was a good man. Much missed.
During this time, there was a large hippy colony in Kenya mostly made up of vietnam vets. These vets were smuggling drugs to finance the PLO such was their resentment towards the US and US foreign policy as well as the fact that a lot of vets were treated badly by the wider American public in America. I always remember Stirling being at complete odds with these people. I always found them friendly and approachable but so laissez-faire and their kids ran wild.
On the other end of the spectrum we had to deal with the 'yankee' tourists in the wildlife parks. I call them yanks because they were the worst of Americans. They paid 'big bucks to come see wildlife'. So much so, that they bribed the drivers of the Combi wagons to get too close to big game especially the cats. One of Leakeys gamekeepers was once threatened and held up against the wall of a Safari lodge when he was telling the yank to keep away from a Cheetah who had a cub but was actually starving to death because she couldn't move and hunt without the constant clattering of camera shutters, plethora of combi vans and totally uncaring tourists.
Most people climb up Mount Kenya, the Americans pay $400 to fly by helicopter.
My sister went the International School of Kenya which was predominantly American. I know and correspond with many of them, now scattered far and wide. Dr Shapiro, an American Jew was our neighbour for a while. He was in Kenya working on sleeping sickness (Trypanosomiasis). Great Guy - cannot fault him. The American Jewish community were a tightly knit bunch and of the most accomodating people I have ever met. The super rich Ambassadors to the US were crass, vulgar, overpaid and nauseatingly arrogant.
One of our long time friends is Alan Mussell - published a Historical novel, married my mothers work colleague from Durham:
http://www.amazon.co.uk/Last-Crusade-Novel-Alan-Mussell/dp/0595379443/ref=sr_1_1?s=books&ie=UTF8&qid=1368882640&sr=1-1&keywords=alan+mussell
Alan is an American through and through.
I have met Americans from all walks: From the over rich and over paid to the disenfranchised.
So those silly naval gazing dissenters and sit-on-the-fence "omg, don't dare say nasty things about anyone anywhere" are the cowards for not expressing an opinion. The fact that you took my sentiment about the British and the Americans literally, suggests that you are also a bunch of humourless bast4rds who cannot laugh at yourselves.
The fact that I am well travelled and was born in a different culture where having a spine was mandatory will completely pi$$ the 'he only ever watched Eastenders' and 'pinarello is a coward' brigade right off.seanoconn - gruagach craic!0 -
pinarello001 wrote:What a giggle. What a load of nonsense people spout.
Firstly, my first stepfather was a man called Stirling Doughty. He sold his farm in Napa valley California. Sold out because of an acrimonious divorce and the mafia. Walked away from it all. Died in Januray 1979. He was a good man. Much missed.
During this time, there was a large hippy colony in Kenya mostly made up of vietnam vets. These vets were smuggling drugs to finance the PLO such was their resentment towards the US and US foreign policy as well as the fact that a lot of vets were treated badly by the wider American public in America. I always remember Stirling being at complete odds with these people. I always found them friendly and approachable but so laissez-faire and their kids ran wild.
On the other end of the spectrum we had to deal with the 'yankee' tourists in the wildlife parks. I call them yanks because they were the worst of Americans. They paid 'big bucks to come see wildlife'. So much so, that they bribed the drivers of the Combi wagons to get too close to big game especially the cats. One of Leakeys gamekeepers was once threatened and held up against the wall of a Safari lodge when he was telling the yank to keep away from a Cheetah who had a cub but was actually starving to death because she couldn't move and hunt without the constant clattering of camera shutters, plethora of combi vans and totally uncaring tourists.
Most people climb up Mount Kenya, the Americans pay $400 to fly by helicopter.
My sister went the International School of Kenya which was predominantly American. I know and correspond with many of them, now scattered far and wide. Dr Shapiro, an American Jew was our neighbour for a while. He was in Kenya working on sleeping sickness (Trypanosomiasis). Great Guy - cannot fault him. The American Jewish community were a tightly knit bunch and of the most accomodating people I have ever met. The super rich Ambassadors to the US were crass, vulgar, overpaid and nauseatingly arrogant.
One of our long time friends is Alan Mussell - published a Historical novel, married my mothers work colleague from Durham:
http://www.amazon.co.uk/Last-Crusade-Novel-Alan-Mussell/dp/0595379443/ref=sr_1_1?s=books&ie=UTF8&qid=1368882640&sr=1-1&keywords=alan+mussell
Alan is an American through and through.
I have met Americans from all walks: From the over rich and over paid to the disenfranchised.
So those silly naval gazing dissenters and sit-on-the-fence "omg, don't dare say nasty things about anyone anywhere" are the cowards for not expressing an opinion. The fact that you took my sentiment about the British and the Americans literally, suggests that you are also a bunch of humourless bast4rds who cannot laugh at yourselves.
The fact that I am well travelled and was born in a different culture where having a spine was mandatory will completely pi$$ the 'he only ever watched Eastenders' and 'pinarello is a coward' brigade right off.
I am not too sure how you can tell a story of how your late step-father sold his farm due to divorce and the mob as a way of hating Americans. Divorce means things didn't work out, and the mob do not come after you unless you have done something to piss them off, in whatever capacity. I don't know your step father, but it could very well be possible that the 2 things leading to his sale of the farm are related, or one caused the other.
You do realise that the UK also has the same reactions towards acts of terrorism as the states does, and that during the London bombings many UK citizens (more specifically people living in affected areas) expressed the same views the American government did. So turn around and say to us that we are all twats bar a few is ridiculous, and unfounded.
The super rich Ambassadors to the US were crass, vulgar, overpaid and nauseatingly arrogant.
You are picking out the problems that Americans have, which are also present with UK embassies worldwide, and are not constrained to the two. The ambassadors on post in places of high tension, or in war ridden regions, are the ones who are like this.
The reason I took it so seriously is because:
A) Those types of thought processes do not belong in a modern world, especially one as educated as now and
They are sweeping generalisations that carry no weight judging by the stories you have just told. So they spend money on getting close to animals in safari parks, and pay to be helicopter lifted somewhere, and that makes us all twats? Or is this just a bit of jealousy on your part at the standard of living?
I can very well laugh at myself, but only with good cause, and not because some person on a forum posts unfounded conclusions that are not actually proving his point that we are twits. Humourless bastards part really did make me laugh though, since you are a joke in this case, but you miss the irony. If I would have turned around and said all British people are twats I highly doubt you would laugh, this is normally just a way for the ignorant to get something off their chest that should not be said, but make it "better" by adding "that was a joke". Of course the British are not twits, nor are the American, nor are any societies to be fair. To be someone who is well travelled it is shocking that traveling has not taught you anything about life. Countries have their great people (in most places many more that the arseholes) and they also have their complete twats. Saying whole societies are twits shows a serious lack of education and thinking power, and your only way to lash out is by saying those things. It is a shame people still exist with generalisation, unfounded mindsets> if people like you were not around there would be a lot less problems in the world.0 -
MountainMonster wrote:WTF is this cr4p?!?!?: - "I am not too sure how you can tell a story of how your late step-father sold his farm due to divorce and the mob as a way of hating ?? Americans. Divorce means things didn't work out, and the mob do not come after you unless you have done something to wee-wee them off, in whatever capacity. I don't know your step father, but it could very well be possible that the 2 things leading to his sale of the farm are related, or one caused the other.
I was simply countering the argument that I had not met many Americans - I was not making or providing a reason to hate them.
Qualify your statement saying that I 'hate' the Americans, go on.
Boy, you take yourself too seriously and what I said too seriously too.
It was a loose, humoured generalisation in Cake Stop with a wink icon at the end of it. How you can jump to conclusions about me or be offended by it, I do not know.
What I do dislike about the US is the incidious global capitalism and so called 'democracy' that has been exported which is obligating people into poverty - Noam Chomsky would concur with this. Have you read any of his stuff?, pretty good and he is an American.
I can make the distinction between some great intellects (which the UK is sadly missing), US foreign policy and those Americans which mainstream US would unfortunately call 'woolly liberals'.seanoconn - gruagach craic!0 -
MountainMonster wrote:I'm guessing he came from a council estate watching East Enders in his youth, as those are the types to say those things.
So let me get this right, you accuse someone of stereotyping by doing the exact same thing yourself! I'm assuming you didn't grow up on a council estate, so how do you explain your ignorance then?0 -
pinarello001 wrote:Boy, you take yourself too seriously and what I said too seriously too.
It was a loose, humoured generalisation in Cake Stop with a wink icon at the end of it. How you can jump to conclusions about me or be offended by it, I do not know.
There is so much irony in this paragraph I'm nearly lost for words, but just to say you don't always have to put a smiley or wink at the end of a sentence to let people know that you're being humorous. Some people are intelligent and can work it out for themselves. If they can't it's probably because it's not funny! There are the odd occasions when a person is just too stupid to get some jokes though.0 -
I think if you are going to accuse Americans of any stupidity it has to start with their gun laws, which nearly brings this thread back on topic.0
