Milan - San Remo *spoiler*

Yellow Peril

Above The Cows wrote:

Yellow Peril wrote:

Above The Cows wrote:

ddraver wrote:

So do you think that Canc has laid down a bit of a marker in terms of this years Classics? In a sort of a "I'm not towing you anywhere no more" sort of stylee?

It certainly does set up an interesting dynamic in the tactical-nous/mind-games/cycling is a game of chess/poker department between Canc, Sagan and others.

Agreed and it was interesting to note today that Cancellara was prepared to call Sagan's bluff. He probably realises that he no longer has anything to prove and isn't prepared to facilitate other's reputations

So can we conclude that Fabu has learned something? As you say he has nothing to prove, he has won his monuments and so in fact holds the power over Sagan who has yet to win one and has everything to prove in that department (as good a rider as he may be).

A wise man once said..."Experience is that thing you wish you had immediately before you get it" I sincerely suspect that Sagan will be reflecting upon his tactics today. Cancellara on the other hand probably now feels a little more empowered on the basis that he was not the predictable rider that many thought he would be.

I wonder what Sagan's thoughts will be when he closes his eyes tonight? If he isn't too knackered that he doesn't just pass out. I feel Sagan should learn something from today.

above_the_cows

ddraver wrote:

@AtC

I suspect Sagan has realised that it's big boy time now and he now has the whole peloton trying to stop him winning. How he comes out of this now is likely to define the rest of his career...Him and the England Rugby team should have a chat...

Yes. That. Exactly.

DeadCalm

Above The Cows wrote:

So can we conclude that Fabu has learned something? As you say he has nothing to prove, he has won his monuments and so in fact holds the power over Sagan who has yet to win one and has everything to prove in that department (as good a rider as he may be).

I wonder what Sagan's thoughts will be when he closes his eyes tonight? If he isn't too knackered that he doesn't just pass out. I feel Sagan should learn something from today.

The thing I'd guess they're both thinking about the most was the point when Fabu had 6 or 7 bike lengths. Historically, that would probably have been enough for him to get away. But Sagan managed to close him down in spite of having to practically go through Ciolek first. To me that was the defining moment of a cracking race. As I see it, absent Sagan Cancellara would probably have won that race and absent Cancellara, Sagan would almost certainly have won. I'm a big fan of them both but have a feeling they're going to cost each other wins for a while to come yet. And that's a good thing. It'll give a chance to others who are prepared to take a risk which should make for some exciting racing.

ddraver

LeicesterLad wrote:

ddraver wrote:

@AtC

I suspect Sagan has realised that it's big boy time now and he now has the whole peloton trying to stop him winning. How he comes out of this now is likely to define the rest of his career...Him and the England Rugby team should have a chat...

Harsh comparing Sagan to Englands performance yesterday :shock:

Sagan still finished second in a monument. He's 23 and smashes people for fun. Batter Cav and Greipel in a sprint one day, lead the bunch over a 27% climb the next. I doubt much worries Sagan.

Well True, but it's a similar case. I suppose that he only has to wait a week to try again though which is a benefit....

powerbookboy

frenchfighter wrote:

Ciolek racing with dark sunglasses...seems odd when it is so dark outside. Most of the riders weren't wearing any.

Knew he was gonna win. Wanted to look cool. Achieved.

FransJacques

It's hard to watch then the one Eurosport commentator cannot get the names of the hills correct.

Once and for all it's NOT "paw-GEE-oh" but "POE-joe". The 'I' before an 'A' in italian makes the preceeding consonant soft so is silent. Some further examples:

The coffee machine maker Gaggia is pronounced "GA-ja"
The car maker Lancia is "LAN-cha"

That feels better now

Yellow Peril

I see what your saying DeadCalm but in Flanders it will be different. We've all seen a Cancellara so strong that not even Boonen could hold him at P-R or RVV and again we've all seen a Boonen so strong that no-one else could stay with him at P-R.

I don't think Cancellara will be losing much sleep over Sagan tonight as it was more Sagan's missed opportunity than Cancellara's. Cancellara will be looking to Flanders and thinking of Boonen.

DeadCalm

Cavendish on Ciolek:

“It wasn’t a surprise,” Cavendish said. “He’s incredible, he was the under-23 world champion and he’s one of the most talented bike riders I know. He’s lost a few years but he’s definitely come back this year and won a few races. He’s a super good guy as well, so I’m really happy for him.”

powerbookboy

Above The Cows wrote:

Yellow Peril wrote:

Above The Cows wrote:

ddraver wrote:

So do you think that Canc has laid down a bit of a marker in terms of this years Classics? In a sort of a "I'm not towing you anywhere no more" sort of stylee?

It certainly does set up an interesting dynamic in the tactical-nous/mind-games/cycling is a game of chess/poker department between Canc, Sagan and others.

Agreed and it was interesting to note today that Cancellara was prepared to call Sagan's bluff. He probably realises that he no longer has anything to prove and isn't prepared to facilitate other's reputations

So can we conclude that Fabu has learned something? As you say he has nothing to prove, he has won his monuments and so in fact holds the power over Sagan who has yet to win one and has everything to prove in that department (as good a rider as he may be).

I wonder what Sagan's thoughts will be when he closes his eyes tonight? If he isn't too knackered that he doesn't just pass out. I feel Sagan should learn something from today.

Isn't it also possible that Canc knows he hasn't got the top end anymore to ride people off his wheel, so is relying on other weapons? He can still descend better than almost anyone, can TT away from most and has a half decent sprint. If he actually bothered to stand up he might even be quick!

DeadCalm

Yellow Peril wrote:

I see what your saying DeadCalm but in Flanders it will be different. We've all seen a Cancellara so strong that not even Boonen could hold him at P-R or RVV and again we've all seen a Boonen so strong that no-one else could stay with him at P-R.

I don't think Cancellara will be losing much sleep over Sagan tonight as it was more Sagan's missed opportunity than Cancellara's. Cancellara will be looking to Flanders and thinking of Boonen.

Maybe YP. I have my doubts that Fabu is anywhere near the dominant rider he once was but I could (and probably will) be hopelessly wrong. That's why I love this sport so much. No matter how hard I analyse it, I can always be surprised.

powerbookboy

Yellow Peril wrote:

frenchfighter wrote:

Great photo. I hope the other classics live up to this in terms of unpredictability and excitement (and I don't mean the midway taxi ride).

The question in my mind is can Stannard now hang on to the coat tails of the likes of Cancellara and Boonen in the cobbled classics? I still sense that that is yet another league above what we saw today.

I think the cobbled classics will suit him even more. He's a great beast who'll plough through the rough better than most. The real issue for him is going to be team support, or lack thereof. He damn well deserves full protected status on the rumbly roads.

I predict at some pointin the next few years I'll be going ape-pooh crazy at a British rider on the velodrome, just like I did with Roger Hammond.

Cannot flippin' wait.

Pross

What a fantastic ride by Stannard and also by Ciolek who looked in trouble on the Cipressa. The final group selection really made it hard for Sagan with Cancellara leaving him to chase and knowing that in Ciolek he had a real sprinter against him. Decent sprint by Canc as well and Phinney did an excellent ride to cross to the lead group on the line. Cav must have been rueing the lack of team support and having Chav in front as he was obviously in good form. It was the first time I've watched more than highlights of MSR and it turned out to be an excellent race. Role on the Ronde, can't wait now

greasedscotsman

powerbookboy wrote:

frenchfighter wrote:

Ciolek racing with dark sunglasses...seems odd when it is so dark outside. Most of the riders weren't wearing any.

Knew he was gonna win. Wanted to look cool. Achieved.

Looks like a VR28, maybe a persimmon or G30 lens. Flat to medium light.

Macaloon

frenchfighter wrote:

Thanks for the avi ammo, FF. Seems that G (at OHN), Stannard & Eisel did OK on the Tenerife plan. Not so EBH. Or were the conditions so unusual that comparisons are invalid?

DeadCalm

DeadCalm wrote:

Yellow Peril wrote:

I see what your saying DeadCalm but in Flanders it will be different. We've all seen a Cancellara so strong that not even Boonen could hold him at P-R or RVV and again we've all seen a Boonen so strong that no-one else could stay with him at P-R.

I don't think Cancellara will be losing much sleep over Sagan tonight as it was more Sagan's missed opportunity than Cancellara's. Cancellara will be looking to Flanders and thinking of Boonen.

Maybe YP. I have my doubts that Fabu is anywhere near the dominant rider he once was but I could (and probably will) be hopelessly wrong. That's why I love this sport so much. No matter how hard I analyse it, I can always be surprised.

Apologies for quoting my own post, but I'd like to expand a little.

As I see it, in his peak Fabu could set such a fierce pace that, if he got more than a few lengths, the only people who could catch him would be guys with a decent sprint. But he could maintain that pace long enough to put most of those guys under real pressure even riding on his wheel and usually he'd wait until the sprinters were dropped before making the break anyway. To counteract a Fabu break you need to be lucky and in the right place at the right time (e.g. Gerrans last year) or you need to be able to sprint to make up the ground and you need the endurance to live with the pace. There aren't that many riders that fit into that category. Boonen is one. The evidence before today was that Sagan would be another. I think he proved that today.

Pross

frenchfighter wrote:

Might be time to change my avatar!

DeadCalm

Macaloon wrote:

Nice avatar.

alihisgreat

Yellow Peril wrote:

frenchfighter wrote:

Great photo. I hope the other classics live up to this in terms of unpredictability and excitement (and I don't mean the midway taxi ride).

The question in my mind is can Stannard now hang on to the coat tails of the likes of Cancellara and Boonen in the cobbled classics? I still sense that that is yet another league above what we saw today.

He wasn't exactly hanging onto the coat tails was he? I think its a bit insulting to call it that... he was pulling a few back in the main bunch before and after the crash.. then attacked... did his pulls in the break.. attacked again etc.

and lets not forget that him and Chavanel were in the break for the longest (or been in multiple breaks in Chavanel's case) and did the most work so can't have been expected to look like anything other than hangers on at the finish.

greasedscotsman

Is that Sagan's lippy Ciolek has on his cheek?

Cleat Eastwood

greasedscotsman wrote:

see that man at the back - its freddy parrot face davies

Coriander

FransJacques wrote:

It's hard to watch then the one Eurosport commentator cannot get the names of the hills correct.

Once and for all it's NOT "paw-GEE-oh" but "POE-joe". The 'I' before an 'A' in italian makes the preceeding consonant soft so is silent. Some further examples:

The coffee machine maker Gaggia is pronounced "GA-ja"
The car maker Lancia is "LAN-cha"

That feels better now

You've not accounted for the double consonants, both of which are clearly pronounced, the first at the end of the first syllable and the second at the start of the 2nd syllable. So, it's (impossible to replicate with English sounds) Pioj-jo. And Gaj-ja.

And, I really need to get this of my chest because I've ground my teeth down with irritation - surely if you're going to be commentating on tv, you'd research the correct pronunciation of those you'd expect to be the main protagonists - there is no 's' sound in Cancellara. That second syllable sounds like 'Che' as in Che Guevara, but then quickly stick an 'l' on it.

rick_chasey

greasedscotsman wrote:

"I under-evaluated him a little bit. I was watching Cancellara, who was trying to break free, and maybe I did too much work," Sagan said. "Ciolek stayed in the wheels and he took my wheel to do the sprint and was able to beat me. I went too early in the sprint and I left it on a plate for Ciolek."

http://www.cyclingnews.com/news/sagan-r ... n-san-remo

At least he gets it. He's young and he'll learn.

rob churchill

frenchfighter wrote:

With the fairly blank zone at the left of the shot (for icons), that would make a good wallpaper FF. If you have a high res, maybe post it to the wallpaper thread in this forum section?

alihisgreat

rob churchill wrote:

frenchfighter wrote:

With the fairly blank zone at the left of the shot (for icons), that would make a good wallpaper FF. If you have a high res, maybe post it to the wallpaper thread in this forum section?

who would want Ian Stannard crying at them every time they look at their computer?

Richmond Racer

If the story's true of Stannard's rear mech cable snapping and him having to do last part of race including Poggio climb in his 11...i'll proudly have his MSR race face as my wallpaper

iainf72

Biggles had food poisoning from Tenerife it seems.

So stomach again

symo

Stannard was just legend for yesterday, absolutely killing it.
If he really was forced to be in a single gear for that length of time, he is beyond legend.

simon_e

Richmond Racer wrote:

If the story's true of Stannard's rear mech cable snapping and him having to do last part of race including Poggio climb in his 11...i'll proudly have his MSR race face as my wallpaper

I thought he rode brilliantly, was so impressed to see him going for it out at the front, gears or no gears.

disgruntledgoat

That'll be Shimano for you eh?

Edit: Hang on, aren't Sky all on Di2?

greasedscotsman

iainf72 wrote:

Biggles had food poisoning from Tenerife it seems.

So stomach again

Who is Biggles? Need a nickname sticky so I can look up who people are talking about!