Just how crucial to road cycling is THE BRAND ?

Raffles

There are pricy products out there in road cycling land that are no better than other products which cost dramatically less....................thats not opinion, its fact. Ive been driven nuts by riders "who just cant wear anything less than Assos" and its individuals like that which make me think just how crucial is branding in road cycling.

Ive observed some amazing riders who own real world bikes and ive seen mediocre cyclists who are full of it as they ride on their italian carbon steeds . Other riders watch in awe as plonker pat parades around on his italian whilst there are far superior cyclists on much cheaper equipment who would absolutely destroy him..........obviously branding is playing a part.

I would never ever hand over the asking prices that Assos, Rapha or Oakley charge as I just dont think the goods are worth it and I could get as good or better at much more realistic pricing levels . There are of course individuals who wouldnt blink handing over the money, so I guess that branding influences the decision to make those purchases.

Does branding play a substantial role or none at all in your decisions what to ride , wear, buy or be seen using ? If you were riding in a pack of Assos clad Pinarello Dogma 2 bike owners ......would it make you feel intimidated or any less of a rider because of it ?

LegendLust

Raffles wrote:

There are pricy products out there in road cycling land that are no better than other products which cost dramatically less....................thats not opinion, its fact. Ive been driven nuts by riders "who just cant wear anything less than Assos" and its individuals like that which make me think just how crucial is branding in road cycling.

Ive observed some amazing riders who own real world bikes and ive seen mediocre cyclists who are full of it as they ride on their italian carbon steeds . Other riders watch in awe as plonker pat parades around on his italian whilst there are far superior cyclists on much cheaper equipment who would absolutely destroy him..........obviously branding is playing a part.

I would never ever hand over the asking prices that Assos, Rapha or Oakley charge as I just dont think the goods are worth it and I could get as good or better at much more realistic pricing levels . There are of course individuals who wouldnt blink handing over the money, so I guess that branding influences the decision to make those purchases.

Does branding play a substantial role or none at all in your decisions what to ride , wear, buy or be seen using ? If you were riding in a pack of Assos clad Pinarello Dogma 2 bike owners ......would it make you feel intimidated or any less of a rider because of it ?

Have you ever tried any of these 'brands' products that makes you think they're not worth it?

Raffles

LegendLust wrote:

Raffles wrote:

There are pricy products out there in road cycling land that are no better than other products which cost dramatically less....................thats not opinion, its fact. Ive been driven nuts by riders "who just cant wear anything less than Assos" and its individuals like that which make me think just how crucial is branding in road cycling.

Ive observed some amazing riders who own real world bikes and ive seen mediocre cyclists who are full of it as they ride on their italian carbon steeds . Other riders watch in awe as plonker pat parades around on his italian whilst there are far superior cyclists on much cheaper equipment who would absolutely destroy him..........obviously branding is playing a part.

I would never ever hand over the asking prices that Assos, Rapha or Oakley charge as I just dont think the goods are worth it and I could get as good or better at much more realistic pricing levels . There are of course individuals who wouldnt blink handing over the money, so I guess that branding influences the decision to make those purchases.

Does branding play a substantial role or none at all in your decisions what to ride , wear, buy or be seen using ? If you were riding in a pack of Assos clad Pinarello Dogma 2 bike owners ......would it make you feel intimidated or any less of a rider because of it ?

Have you ever tried any of these 'brands' products that makes you think they're not worth it?

Of course I have, Ive tried Assos and Castelli.............preferred the Castelli and no way in gods earth would I pay what Assos were asking when Castelli were that good. Id take Castelli over Assos or Rapha in a heartbeat personally and be laughing all the way to the bank too.

My opening post is my opinion, your reply was condescending and patronising, just thought id let you know this.

lc1981

Raffles wrote:

Of course I have, Ive tried Assos and Castelli.............preferred the Castelli and no way in gods earth would I pay what Assos were asking when Castelli were that good. Id take Castelli over Assos or Rapha in a heartbeat personally and be laughing all the way to the bank too.

It's not as if Castelli is a cheap brand though. In fact, there are Castelli products that are more expensive than Rapha ones.

Mikey41

The brand is not the be-all and end-all for me, it's far more important that the item does a good job at a good price. Value-for-money is what drives me, so if a particular brand consistently delivers that, I will tend to prefer it. Some brands will be excluded simply because they cost too much though, I am on a budget and can't afford to spend £200 on a jersey, when one for £25 will do the job.

That's not to say I will always choose the cheapest gear though, if there is good reason to spend a bit more, I will spend it, but good quality is not always very expensive.

So if I went for a Club run on my entry level Giant, with my £15 Altura shorts and a jersey for £20, it would make no difference to me if others were on £7K bikes wearing Assos. Good on them if they've got the money. As long as I enjoy my riding, that's all that matters to me.

me-109

Some are very worth it. I had a couple of pairs of Assos bibs years ago and the quality of padding, fit and apparent crashworthiness were worth the asking. Can't afford them now and how bought a few Mavic items this year. Again, they have been a better fit than many other brands at similar prices. Nice materials and useful design touches that seem to reflect testing and experience.

I also bought some Oakleys in the Middle East years ago - cheaper than shops here could buy at trade - and they are still going strong. Expensive shades though, tbh.

I'm sure you are right, there are some manufacturers selling items at a price point because they can, not because the item is 'worth' it. Some though are worth that bit extra. I don't buy because of a label but it wouldn't worry me going out with those with the gear.

declan1

I've got a bike that nobody in the world has ever heard of, and I ride around kit from Lidl. Apart from the fact the pad in my bibs has basically disappeared, it's not bad stuff, and for around £10 per item it's considerably cheaper than Assos or Castelli. I've never gone on a ride and moaned about my kit the whole way so it can't be bad!

Raffles

declan1 wrote:

I've got a bike that nobody in the world has ever heard of, and I ride around kit from Lidl. Apart from the fact the pad in my bibs has basically disappeared, it's not bad stuff, and for around £10 per item it's considerably cheaper than Assos or Castelli. I've never gone on a ride and moaned about my kit the whole way so it can't be bad!

loads of people have heard of BSA dec, I owned one myself at one time .

declan1

Raffles wrote:

declan1 wrote:

I've got a bike that nobody in the world has ever heard of, and I ride around kit from Lidl. Apart from the fact the pad in my bibs has basically disappeared, it's not bad stuff, and for around £10 per item it's considerably cheaper than Assos or Castelli. I've never gone on a ride and moaned about my kit the whole way so it can't be bad!

loads of people have heard of BSA dec, I owned one myself at one time .

Did you? I've not met anyone yet (apart from you) that knew that made bikes!

chrisaonabike

Raffles wrote:

Does branding play a substantial role or none at all in your decisions what to ride , wear, buy or be seen using ? If you were riding in a pack of Assos clad Pinarello Dogma 2 bike owners ......would it make you feel intimidated or any less of a rider because of it ?

None, and no.

If I'm in the pack, they're going no faster than I am, are they.

Which isn't to say the expensive gear isn't better - it may be. It may last longer, feel more comfortable, whatever. As my dad says, 'just good enough isn't good enough, better is better, the best is too expensive'.

Grill

Raffles wrote:

LegendLust wrote:

Raffles wrote:

There are pricy products out there in road cycling land that are no better than other products which cost dramatically less....................thats not opinion, its fact. Ive been driven nuts by riders "who just cant wear anything less than Assos" and its individuals like that which make me think just how crucial is branding in road cycling.

Ive observed some amazing riders who own real world bikes and ive seen mediocre cyclists who are full of it as they ride on their italian carbon steeds . Other riders watch in awe as plonker pat parades around on his italian whilst there are far superior cyclists on much cheaper equipment who would absolutely destroy him..........obviously branding is playing a part.

I would never ever hand over the asking prices that Assos, Rapha or Oakley charge as I just dont think the goods are worth it and I could get as good or better at much more realistic pricing levels . There are of course individuals who wouldnt blink handing over the money, so I guess that branding influences the decision to make those purchases.

Does branding play a substantial role or none at all in your decisions what to ride , wear, buy or be seen using ? If you were riding in a pack of Assos clad Pinarello Dogma 2 bike owners ......would it make you feel intimidated or any less of a rider because of it ?

Have you ever tried any of these 'brands' products that makes you think they're not worth it?

Of course I have, Ive tried Assos and Castelli.............preferred the Castelli and no way in gods earth would I pay what Assos were asking when Castelli were that good. Id take Castelli over Assos or Rapha in a heartbeat personally and be laughing all the way to the bank too.

My opening post is my opinion, your reply was condescending and patronising, just thought id let you know this.

My Castelli Aero Race were more expensive than my Assos Unos, and are superior to my Craft, 2XU, Endura, Nike, and DHB bibs. My next set will probably be Shutt VR as I've been incredibly impressed with their kit. My expereince has been in the realm of "buy cheap and you buy twice", so now I just buy once.

Whether on my Scott or GT I don't see how my kit determines what kind of cyclist I am. My Plasma is my most expensive bike and I wear Endura skinsuits when I ride it. Does that make me a plonker or a badass? :roll:

alihisgreat

declan1 wrote:

I've got a bike that nobody in the world has ever heard of, and I ride around kit from Lidl. Apart from the fact the pad in my bibs has basically disappeared, it's not bad stuff, and for around £10 per item it's considerably cheaper than Assos or Castelli. I've never gone on a ride and moaned about my kit the whole way so it can't be bad!

Have ever ridden anything more expensive than the lidl stuff?

because if you haven't then you don't know what you're missing.

Neale1978

Ive observed some amazing riders who own real world bikes and ive seen mediocre cyclists who are full of it as they ride on their italian carbon steeds . Other riders watch in awe as plonker pat parades around on his italian whilst there are far superior cyclists on much cheaper equipment who would absolutely destroy him..........obviously branding is playing a part

Its crucial to a point of course. I bought a De rosa frame as a mark of respect to the Genre of road cycling and i find it can aid motivation a bit too.. Not to mention how the thing actually rides

You have to be careful as you'll end up sounding like a jealous knob tbh. I think if anyone rides their bike often off their own back whatever it is then they deserve some credit

As for clothing.. I wouldent buy anything by Assos or Castelli.. I just dont feel their stuff and some Rapha gear looks good but is overpriced. There are plenty of other options that are still worth going for so make your own mind up IMO

garethdavies

Raffles wrote:

There are pricy products out there in road cycling land that are no better than other products which cost dramatically less....................thats not opinion, its fact. Ive been driven nuts by riders "who just cant wear anything less than Assos" and its individuals like that which make me think just how crucial is branding in road cycling.

Ive observed some amazing riders who own real world bikes and ive seen mediocre cyclists who are full of it as they ride on their italian carbon steeds . Other riders watch in awe as plonker pat parades around on his italian whilst there are far superior cyclists on much cheaper equipment who would absolutely destroy him..........obviously branding is playing a part.

I would never ever hand over the asking prices that Assos, Rapha or Oakley charge as I just dont think the goods are worth it and I could get as good or better at much more realistic pricing levels . There are of course individuals who wouldnt blink handing over the money, so I guess that branding influences the decision to make those purchases.

Does branding play a substantial role or none at all in your decisions what to ride , wear, buy or be seen using ? If you were riding in a pack of Assos clad Pinarello Dogma 2 bike owners ......would it make you feel intimidated or any less of a rider because of it ?

Not really sure why you have an issue with anyone wearing whatever they like. They don't seem to have a problem it's you that has the problem and for the only reasons being prices. I don't understand why you think novice riders should not wear expensive clothing because they are no pro riders, i couldn't care less if someone with a shopping basket on their bike was wearing HTC it's their ride and their life and I am sure they arn't to fond of people who have a chip on their shoulder judging them. Me I am a decent neough rider not great but not bad and I have all the expensive stuff and I bought just because it's cool no other reason. You have now inspired me to upgrade my bike for no reason from trek madone 4.9 to 5.2 so thanks for early present. Enjoy and check with your doctor if PMS exists in you.

Strith

Branding plays no role in what I buy, but generally you'll find the more you pay for stuf the nicer it is. Sure it's on a sliding scale the more you pay the more you get. I've owned kit from altura to rapha and there is a big difference. Plus I've never paid full price for rapha stuff anyway.

I think castelli stuff is at a good price balance point and that's what I use now, even if the sizing is daft. I think your general opinion of why people buy stuff is wrong. Branding plays a role yes, but not as much as you seem to think.

nunowoolmez

It all comes down to exposeable income doesn't it? My personal opinion has always been about getting the RIGHT product, not the best or most expensive. I do confess to having quite a bit of Castelli stuff & yes it can be expensive, but i find it the best quality & most comfy & the sizes i find fit me perfectly. Yes the kit looks nice too. Personally i really dislike the Assos kit, think it looks horrible & way way way too pricey. If i find something i need that is the best product for that happens to be made by one of the less expensive brands, then this is a bonus!

I also have Oakley prescription lenses for my Radar. I personally find Oakleys to be the best lens choice out there & getting the right lenses which aid my vision is not something i am willing to budget on.

jgsi

...

nawty

It isn't just cycling, EVERY hobby has a huge element of this - that's why magazines exist - to make you want the latest greatest, most swanky brand. I bet you there is a sewing machine magazine which rates sewing machines - there'll be brand snobbery in that too (how can that cheap Chinese machine be better than my Singer?!).

Brands are an incredibly powerful thing (I should know as I work for an FMCG company) and people BELIEVE in them, belief is a VERY powerful thing and can not be underestimated (and in fact, has been shown to be a positive thing, just look at the placebo effect). Think about pain killers - Neurofen has exactly the same ingredients as the 20p supermarket painkillers yet people will spend ten time the amount on the branded version and swear they're better when, as a chemist, I know they're not.

Some people see through it and others don't, it's not a big deal and it's for each individual to decide where the law of diminishing returns becomes too much.

By the way, I know of BSA too - Birmingham Small Arms, they used to make guns and motor cycles before making bikes too. I used to have one of their air rifles

declan1

ALIHISGREAT wrote:

declan1 wrote:

I've got a bike that nobody in the world has ever heard of, and I ride around kit from Lidl. Apart from the fact the pad in my bibs has basically disappeared, it's not bad stuff, and for around £10 per item it's considerably cheaper than Assos or Castelli. I've never gone on a ride and moaned about my kit the whole way so it can't be bad!

Have ever ridden anything more expensive than the lidl stuff?

because if you haven't then you don't know what you're missing.

I know what I'm missing, but at the moment I can't justify the huge amounts of money needed for the nice kit. I'm happy with the Lidl stuff, so there's not much point in upgrading yet!

Raffles

declan1 wrote:

ALIHISGREAT wrote:

declan1 wrote:

I've got a bike that nobody in the world has ever heard of, and I ride around kit from Lidl. Apart from the fact the pad in my bibs has basically disappeared, it's not bad stuff, and for around £10 per item it's considerably cheaper than Assos or Castelli. I've never gone on a ride and moaned about my kit the whole way so it can't be bad!

Have ever ridden anything more expensive than the lidl stuff?

because if you haven't then you don't know what you're missing.

I know what I'm missing, but at the moment I can't justify the huge amounts of money needed for the nice kit. I'm happy with the Lidl stuff, so there's not much point in upgrading yet!

dec what sort of reaction would you get from your other half if they knew you shelled out £239 :shock: (faint) on a pair of Assos bib shorts ?

Pross

I can't afford Assos kit any longer but wouldn't hesitate to buy their stuff if I could. I think they are a particularly poor example for an anti-brand rant as they are a prime example of getting the quality you are paying for. There are doubtless brands out there that charge for their name but most discerning cyclists are paying for the quality not the label. Comfort in cycling is paramount, especially when you are spending maybe 6 hours or more in the saddle. Unfortunately I lost my Assos kit in a house move and can't afford to replace it, nowadays I use Endura 'pro' kit which I have found to be the most comfortable in the price range I can afford.

declan1

Raffles wrote:

declan1 wrote:

ALIHISGREAT wrote:

declan1 wrote:

I've got a bike that nobody in the world has ever heard of, and I ride around kit from Lidl. Apart from the fact the pad in my bibs has basically disappeared, it's not bad stuff, and for around £10 per item it's considerably cheaper than Assos or Castelli. I've never gone on a ride and moaned about my kit the whole way so it can't be bad!

Have ever ridden anything more expensive than the lidl stuff?

because if you haven't then you don't know what you're missing.

I know what I'm missing, but at the moment I can't justify the huge amounts of money needed for the nice kit. I'm happy with the Lidl stuff, so there's not much point in upgrading yet!

dec what sort of reaction would you get from your other half if they knew you shelled out £239 :shock: (faint) on a pair of Assos bib shorts ?

Well, I'm 16 so I'm lucky enough not to have the other half yet, but I could imagine they would probably - actually I don't want to imagine.....

Critch

People live their lives based on their disposable income or inherited wealth. Snobbery certainly shows its ugly mug and plays its part for some. There are some people who can't afford the kind of bike and gear the OP purchases. There are some who can afford expensive brands. It doesn't really matter what the difference in quality is. If someone wants to buy a bike for £5k then they will, even if £2k of that is paying for the name. Its the same with clothing and accessories.

To answer the OP, its not crucial at all. But everyone knows that..... right?

dodgy

Raffles wrote:

LegendLust wrote:

Raffles wrote:

There are pricy products out there in road cycling land that are no better than other products which cost dramatically less....................thats not opinion, its fact. Ive been driven nuts by riders "who just cant wear anything less than Assos" and its individuals like that which make me think just how crucial is branding in road cycling.

Ive observed some amazing riders who own real world bikes and ive seen mediocre cyclists who are full of it as they ride on their italian carbon steeds . Other riders watch in awe as plonker pat parades around on his italian whilst there are far superior cyclists on much cheaper equipment who would absolutely destroy him..........obviously branding is playing a part.

I would never ever hand over the asking prices that Assos, Rapha or Oakley charge as I just dont think the goods are worth it and I could get as good or better at much more realistic pricing levels . There are of course individuals who wouldnt blink handing over the money, so I guess that branding influences the decision to make those purchases.

Does branding play a substantial role or none at all in your decisions what to ride , wear, buy or be seen using ? If you were riding in a pack of Assos clad Pinarello Dogma 2 bike owners ......would it make you feel intimidated or any less of a rider because of it ?

Have you ever tried any of these 'brands' products that makes you think they're not worth it?

My opening post is my opinion, your reply was condescending and patronising, just thought id let you know this.

Condescending and patronising? Eh? How? He asked a simple question.

So I now think I understand you, you have an inferiority complex, maybe?

MountainMonster

Raffles wrote:

declan1 wrote:

ALIHISGREAT wrote:

declan1 wrote:

I've got a bike that nobody in the world has ever heard of, and I ride around kit from Lidl. Apart from the fact the pad in my bibs has basically disappeared, it's not bad stuff, and for around £10 per item it's considerably cheaper than Assos or Castelli. I've never gone on a ride and moaned about my kit the whole way so it can't be bad!

Have ever ridden anything more expensive than the lidl stuff?

because if you haven't then you don't know what you're missing.

I know what I'm missing, but at the moment I can't justify the huge amounts of money needed for the nice kit. I'm happy with the Lidl stuff, so there's not much point in upgrading yet!

dec what sort of reaction would you get from your other half if they knew you shelled out £239 :shock: (faint) on a pair of Assos bib shorts ?

My wife encourages it, as we have the disposable income for it. I find these threads are only ever started by people who plain and simple can not afford it, which is pretty sad. Wait until you havethe disposable income and then your view will most likely change.

Pross

Raffles wrote:

declan1 wrote:

ALIHISGREAT wrote:

declan1 wrote:

I've got a bike that nobody in the world has ever heard of, and I ride around kit from Lidl. Apart from the fact the pad in my bibs has basically disappeared, it's not bad stuff, and for around £10 per item it's considerably cheaper than Assos or Castelli. I've never gone on a ride and moaned about my kit the whole way so it can't be bad!

Have ever ridden anything more expensive than the lidl stuff?

because if you haven't then you don't know what you're missing.

I know what I'm missing, but at the moment I can't justify the huge amounts of money needed for the nice kit. I'm happy with the Lidl stuff, so there's not much point in upgrading yet!

dec what sort of reaction would you get from your other half if they knew you shelled out £239 :shock: (faint) on a pair of Assos bib shorts ?

What Assos bib shorts cost £239? You seem to be using extremes here as most Assos shorts I've seen are in the £120 - £150 price range (although you can get them cheaper). Could you point me in the direction of these shorts as the most expensive I have seen is £190.

thegreatdivide

Why do people automatically think that if you can afford to buy Assos and Rapha and ride on a £6k bike you’re a) not worthy of it b) fat c) unfit and slow? Book yourself onto a Gran Fondo in Italy and watch your head exploded with confusion as a tannned 65 year old (man or woman) on an EPS loaded Pinerallo dressed in the latest Assos drops you like a stone.

Another week another thread loaded with snobbery.

iPete

I very rarely see anyone being snobbish/turning their nose up at lidl kit etc. but I frequently read people moaning about other people buying Assos/Rapha/Castelli etc.

Buy what you can afford, stop worrying about what other people have and ultimately pick what makes you happy.

I'll happily pay more for a higher quality product, especially bib shorts that don't try and erode the little man :shock: so far assos mille are the only ones that achieve near perfect comfort, you generally get what you pay for.

rolf_f

MountainMonster wrote:

Wait until you havethe disposable income and then your view will most likely change.

I have the disposable income. I have two carbon bikes (one quite expensive, the other less so) and, amongst others, a classic Raleigh that I got for £120. I also have quite a lot of Aldi clothing. But then I also have a fair bit of Santini and a Castelli jersey.

Conclusion - cycling is cycling. It doesn't matter what you are riding or what you are wearing; as long as everything actually fits you, it doesn't matter. That's not to say that there isn't a certain something to riding the posh bike with the posh gear but the conscious knowledge of all that stuff disappears by the tenth pedal stroke.

Just because you have the disposable income doesn't mean you have to dispose of it all

declan1

It's the same with anything, if you think about it. If you're, for example, a PC gamer you buy the best computer you can. Maybe it's faster, or maybe it's got fancy flashing lights that look good. If you have the money, why not spend it? I don't think people buy Castelli and Assos because they want to show off (well, some might) - they buy it because it's nice!

Raffles

dodgy wrote:

Raffles wrote:

LegendLust wrote:

Raffles wrote:

There are pricy products out there in road cycling land that are no better than other products which cost dramatically less....................thats not opinion, its fact. Ive been driven nuts by riders "who just cant wear anything less than Assos" and its individuals like that which make me think just how crucial is branding in road cycling.

Ive observed some amazing riders who own real world bikes and ive seen mediocre cyclists who are full of it as they ride on their italian carbon steeds . Other riders watch in awe as plonker pat parades around on his italian whilst there are far superior cyclists on much cheaper equipment who would absolutely destroy him..........obviously branding is playing a part.

I would never ever hand over the asking prices that Assos, Rapha or Oakley charge as I just dont think the goods are worth it and I could get as good or better at much more realistic pricing levels . There are of course individuals who wouldnt blink handing over the money, so I guess that branding influences the decision to make those purchases.

Does branding play a substantial role or none at all in your decisions what to ride , wear, buy or be seen using ? If you were riding in a pack of Assos clad Pinarello Dogma 2 bike owners ......would it make you feel intimidated or any less of a rider because of it ?

Have you ever tried any of these 'brands' products that makes you think they're not worth it?

My opening post is my opinion, your reply was condescending and patronising, just thought id let you know this.

Condescending and patronising? Eh? How? He asked a simple question.

So I now think I understand you, you have an inferiority complex, maybe?

Certainly not, I do however take great objection to be talked down to by an a55hole .