Forum home Road cycling forum Training, fitness and health

Training when not 100% recovered.

freehubfreehub Posts: 4,257
On Tuesday I did a hard training ride, that night, my legs were pretty trashed.

Today, they've being rather stiff and a little achy but seem to be recovering ok.

I think by tomorrow they'll either be fine or I might feel a slight hint that I'm not 100% recovered.

On Thursdays I do 2*20 interval session, if I'm not 100% recovered, should I not do it and take the day off, of should I do it anyway, and if I keep on with the same routine every week my body may adapt and recover quicker?

Thanks.
«13

Posts

  • freehubfreehub Posts: 4,257
    Well I know if I ride tomoz, I'll be more recovered by tomoz night and recovered for Saturday maybe even Friday, but I was just thinking would I get the same benefit out of the interval session if I'm going abit slower but at the same effort?
  • sturmeysturmey Posts: 964
    I was just thinking would I get the same benefit out of the interval session if I'm going abit slower but at the same effort?

    what does he mean by this i wonder...?
  • PseudonymPseudonym Posts: 1,032
    freehub wrote:
    , but I was just thinking would I get the same benefit out of the interval session if I'm going abit slower but at the same effort?

    interval training is about effort - not about speed. your speed is irrelevant.
  • freehubfreehub Posts: 4,257
    But if my legs are still recovering from a previous effort will I still get the full benefits from the interval session?

    I must admit though, some of my intervals are just over 25mph and some are like 23-24 and it sort of makes me wonder, if that's all I can manage how am I going to go under 1 hour for 25 miles.

    When I do the interval I do it at the sort of pace I could do for 25 miles, which is not much different than I do for 10 also.
  • PseudonymPseudonym Posts: 1,032
    freehub wrote:
    When I do the interval I do it at the sort of pace I could do for 25 miles, which is not much different than I do for 10 also.

    no offence, but it doesn't sound like you understand what you are doing, or why you are doing it...
  • freehubfreehub Posts: 4,257
    Well I know why I am doing it I've said loads I've got two twenty five mile time trials I am training for.

    Maybe I am doing two times twenty min intervals wrong I just push as hard as I can for the time and what I can sustain for twenty five miles.
  • twotyredtwotyred Posts: 822
    and if I keep on with the same routine every week my body may adapt and recover quicker?

    Au contraire. If you keep the same routine your body will get used to it and stop adapting. You need to constantly surprise your body by mixing up your training. I suggest you include some shorter more intense intervals than 2 x 20. I'd also suggest you seek some coaching advice. It doesn't sound like you know what you're doing in order to achieve your goal.
  • freehubfreehub Posts: 4,257
    I'm doing 4*5 too.

    I posted a big long thread on TT forums and there was not massive disagreements with what I do so I supposed that means it can't be that bad.

    As I said.

    I am training for 2*25 miles TT in September.

    I'm not doing long ride at the weekend now.
  • PokerfacePokerface Posts: 7,960
    You will get more benefit from doing your training when tired than not doing it at all. You will get the most benefit from doing it when fully recovered.

    But it's hard to get fully recovered all the time. So unless you are seriously trashed get out and do the work.
  • danowatdanowat Posts: 2,877
    cadseen wrote:
    If I waited till I was 100% recovered before I trained again I would not get out much. :D

    :lol: I was thinking the same!

    If you were stiff, you might have been better of having a very light 30min recovery ride, just to get the legs moving, shift some of the censored out of the muscles, sometimes I find a solid day of rest makes my legs worse.

    Also, do you have any recovery products after a hard session?
  • amaferangaamaferanga Posts: 6,789
    I sometimes wonder why freehub bothers asking questions because invariably he tells everyone who replies with something he doesn't want to hear that they're wrong....
    More problems but still living....
  • freehub wrote:
    Well I know why I am doing it I've said loads I've got two twenty five mile time trials I am training for.

    Think you missed the point with the question. The above is not why you are doing intervals. You appear to be doing intervals blindly in the belief they will get you your hour 25, but why are you doing intervals and not just riding steady?

    You need to train your body & mind to the kind of efforts you will need to sustain for a 25. This is going to be a mixture of your VO2 max and your Lactate Threshold (probably more the latter). You also need to sustain an even pace in the TT. It's no good ploughing off really quick and fading (blowing up) at the end. So if the speed of your intervals are tailing off towards the end, you're going too quick to start with. Each interval should be the roughly same speed (assuming wind direction / course profile are equal) and you should be capable of going marginally quicker on the final interval (that's a mental effect because you know you're at the end).

    What's the point in doing a session if you don't understand why you're doing it!
  • Keith1983Keith1983 Posts: 575
    If recovery is aproblem I would suggest getting some electrolyte powders or tablets to have during or after your sessions, they will help your recovery no end. As for intervals I'm not much help I'm afraid.
  • Tom DeanTom Dean Posts: 1,723
    freehub wrote:
    Maybe I am doing two times twenty min intervals wrong I just push as hard as I can for the time and what I can sustain for twenty five miles.

    Confused. This does not suggest a controlled interval session. Do you use a HRM?

    As far as recovery goes, it is an ongoing thing and you can't look at one session in isolation. 2x20 is not a super hard session - if you are too tired too finish or you think it will knock you out for even longer afterwards, give it a miss and have a look at the whole of your schedule.
  • Zoomer37Zoomer37 Posts: 725
    You probably dont train as hard as you think you do.

    Toughen up a bit and just get back on your bike and go nuts
  • freehubfreehub Posts: 4,257
    No it's not something I find too hard.

    Just Tuesday's group training ride was harder than I expected it to be, when it gets going for the last 10 miles my HR never really goes under 185, in fact it's near 190 most of the time and it trashed my legs, they're not actually that bad this morning though.

    As for training, I do the intervals on the road, now the problems between road and turbo for me are:

    Road:

    I can't keep a constant speed, if it's windy, this means I'm going to blow up going into the headwind and be cruising with my HR not far above recovery into the tailwind, when a hill comes, I will blow up trying to maintain say 25mph constant.

    As for HR???? Some people day bin it, ride on feel, some people say use it??

    Turbo:

    I can't use HR, because I can't get it up to the HR I'd be sustaining in a time trial which would be 180 or more, I can barely sustain 175 on the turbo for a couple of minutes.

    I don't have a cadence monitor, well I've got the speedo laying about in a shed but no magnets.


    I assumed 2*20 built speed and my training is trying to be focused towards building speed.

    Zoomer37 wrote:
    You probably dont train as hard as you think you do.

    Toughen up a bit and just get back on your bike and go nuts

    When I have my HR monitor on and I'm pushing hard the HR monitor says 185, on the group training ride when I was holding 190, I felt like death, at the end of it I felt abit censored .
  • Tom DeanTom Dean Posts: 1,723
    So you can sustain HR190 on the chaingang but only 2 mins at 175 on the turbo? Weird.
  • freehubfreehub Posts: 4,257
    Tom Dean wrote:
    So you can sustain HR190 on the chaingang but only 2 mins at 175 on the turbo? Weird.

    On my turbo that is the case, on some other turbos I can push as hard as on the road.
  • Zoomer37Zoomer37 Posts: 725
    edited August 2011
    Why not try riding on just 'feel' for a few weeks dude.

    When your riding at the point where you literally have nothing left in your legs, your dribbling over the top tube and your brain is screaming 'f*ck this' but you keep going - thats where its at.

    Not sure your HR monitor will tell you when your in that special place
  • PseudonymPseudonym Posts: 1,032
    these threads always seem to go the same way....
  • freehubfreehub Posts: 4,257
    Pseudonym wrote:
    these threads always seem to go the same way....



    **** off with troll posts goddamnit.

    amaferanga wrote:
    I sometimes wonder why freehub bothers asking questions because invariably he tells everyone who replies with something he doesn't want to hear that they're wrong....

    You're the same, posting shite in my threads, first it was moaning about Garmin Connect and how I'm trying to "show off" by posting my links, then you end up placing a Garmin Connect link to all your rides, how ironic.
    Zoomer37 wrote:
    Why not try riding on 'feel' for a few weeks dude.

    When your riding at the point where you literally have nothing left in your legs, your dribbling over the top tube and your brain is screaming 'f*ck this' but you keep going - thats where its at.

    Not sure your HR monitor will tell you when your in that special place

    But according to everyone that is wrong, because that's how I already do it.
  • Tom DeanTom Dean Posts: 1,723
    freehub wrote:
    Tom Dean wrote:
    So you can sustain HR190 on the chaingang but only 2 mins at 175 on the turbo? Weird.

    On my turbo that is the case, on some other turbos I can push as hard as on the road.

    Have you got a fan? I would expect a higher HR in hot conditions. Not 15 BPM difference though.

    Can you measure speed via the rear wheel on the turbo? If so this could be a better way of measuring your effort.
  • PseudonymPseudonym Posts: 1,032
    freehub wrote:
    Pseudonym wrote:
    these threads always seem to go the same way....

    **** off with troll posts goddamnit.

    I think that is what's known as a self-fulfilling prophecy....
  • Tom DeanTom Dean Posts: 1,723
    Zoomer37 wrote:
    Why not try riding on 'feel' for a few weeks dude.

    When your riding at the point where you literally have nothing left in your legs, your dribbling over the top tube and your brain is screaming 'f*ck this' but you keep going - thats where its at.

    Not sure your HR monitor will tell you when your in that special place

    That is not going to help him pace 20 minute training efforts is it?
  • amaferangaamaferanga Posts: 6,789
    freehub wrote:
    amaferanga wrote:
    I sometimes wonder why freehub bothers asking questions because invariably he tells everyone who replies with something he doesn't want to hear that they're wrong....

    You're the same, posting shite in my threads, first it was moaning about Garmin Connect and how I'm trying to "show off" by posting my links, then you end up placing a Garmin Connect link to all your rides, how ironic.

    Oh the irony....

    You post more shite in 'your' threads than everyone else put together.

    P.s. The Garmin Connect thing - do you see me posting links to my rides and fishing for compliments and/or reassurance? Nope, thought not.
    More problems but still living....
  • calm down girls.

    As amusing as Zoomer's comments are, I agree with Tom Dean. OP needs to measure his efforts it would seem. Combination of HR and speed should help achieve this.
  • PokerfacePokerface Posts: 7,960
    It's threads like this that make me thankful I have a coach and a power meter.

    That way I don't have to think for myself and someone much more qualified can tell me how censored I am.
  • danowatdanowat Posts: 2,877
    calm down girls.

    As amusing as Zoomer's comments are, I agree with Tom Dean. OP needs to measure his efforts it would seem. Combination of HR and speed should help achieve this.

    FFS :roll: speed is a ridiculous way of measuring effort, and HR is way too easily influenced by external forces, power meter is the way to go, but feel is a good second best.
    It's threads like this that make me thankful I have a coach

    Me too.
  • Zoomer37Zoomer37 Posts: 725
    Darth Vader worked on just feel and he was pretty badass
  • danowat wrote:
    calm down girls.

    As amusing as Zoomer's comments are, I agree with Tom Dean. OP needs to measure his efforts it would seem. Combination of HR and speed should help achieve this.

    FFS :roll: speed is a ridiculous way of measuring effort, and HR is way too easily influenced by external forces, power meter is the way to go, but feel is a good second best.

    I said "combination of HR and speed". Either one on their own are fairly meaningless, but together they can do the job in the absence of a power meter. People who have power meters seem to think it's acceptable to redicule the opinions of anybody that does not. Unless you're a very experienced rider, feel is a terrible way of measuring effort, far too easy to overcook things at the start.

    I use HR & speed to know how I'm getting on and it works fine. Would it be better to have a power meter? Of course, just like it would be better for me to have a better bike. I don't currently have the money for this stuff so make do with what I've got. I'm not doing too bad either
Sign In or Register to comment.