The cycling industry are a bunch of

Valy

MonkeyMonster wrote:

Jay dubbleU wrote:

Valy wrote:

Why are hybrids looked down on?

They're not - except by people who see a commute as a sporting event and not a journey to work

very very true

lol, since when do you need a road bike for CRC? :P

MaxwellBygraves

Valy wrote:

Why are hybrids looked down on?

They're not, but people get very very upset if you suggest they're not the best bike for the job.

snailracer

MonkeyMonster wrote:

Jay dubbleU wrote:

Valy wrote:

Why are hybrids looked down on?

They're not - except by people who see a commute as a sporting event and not a journey to work

very very true

And there are no medals for a winning performance on the commute

Valy

MaxwellBygraves wrote:

Valy wrote:

Why are hybrids looked down on?

They're not, but people get very very upset if you suggest they're not the best bike for the job.

What is the best then?

It's just retarded. I used to do everything on a MTB and never had any problems. (okay, did spin out on downhills! :P)

Hybrids (with no actual experience of them) seem like a pretty good bike for those who have been out for a while or just wanna get a bike to get to work. True they may have a bit of an unhip image, but, at the end of the day - it's a bike. I mean look at Amsterdam for example, who gives a shit about what bike they have as long as the wheels turn?

I dono, maybe people that moan about hybrids think that everyone should be lycra clad and that if you ride a bike you must be a "cyclist" - wtf does that even mean?

Talk about live and let live...

Ooops. :P

snailracer

^^^
Just about any bike can be used as a commuter, the efficacy depends IMO more on how the the rider uses them, and their ancillary kit, than the bike.

The Dutch bike, despite its archaic appearance, is an awesome bike. It has many plus points (speed is not one of them ) but I am particularly impressed with their ability to survive outdoors for 20 years, regularly being blown to the ground and knocked against other bikes, and still work in the face of abject neglect.

We are having the commuting equivalent of the Catholic church's debate on how many angels can fit on the head of a pin. However, heretics must still be burned

jonny_trousers

snailracer wrote:

Jonny_Trousers wrote:

snailracer wrote:

OK so was he close? What did you end up buying?

I bought a Specialized hybrid, but that’s beside the point.

You’d just love that to be true wouldn’t you? No. I took further, very helpful advice from people here. I then went to Pearson who gave me an excellent, non-patronising service and I decided that although I liked their Touché single speed and that it suited my purposes well, it wasn’t worth 650 quid. I then bought a steel framed single speed from Ebay that with a certain amount of customizing, and a run on using a second hand Touché in-between, I still love. Defend the boy in Evans all you like, but the bottom line is he lost a potential sale because he didn’t engage my needs as a customer fully, for whatever reason.

So you bought a ss frame off ebay and "customized" it? Into what? Are you normally this opaque?
Perhaps the "boy" in Evans decided they didn't have what you wanted and didn't want to waste everyone's time?

You are kidding right? I thought I had made it patently clear that the boy in Evans didn’t bother to find out what I wanted. He also worked for one of the biggest bicycle retailers in the country and will have had a huge selection of bikes to offer me.

I really don’t see the relevance of me telling you what my bike is beyond it being a steel framed single speed (and therefore not an entry level Specialized, aluminium road bike), but if you really do need such clarity to prove whatever point it is you are trying to make...

My single speed is made up of a 2008 Fuji track frame. It now has a carbon fork added and a Sugino 75 chainset with a Miche cog at the rear. The handlebars are ITM and the brakes are Shimano 105s. The seat comes from my old Touche. The rear rim is an Ambrosio and the front, a Mavic. Do please forgive me, and I suspect your entire argument may hinge on this, but I cannot recall what the hubs or the brake cables are. I will endeavour to find out at my earliest convenience.

chilling

It now has a carbon fork

Just the one? What's the other made of Titanium? You really do like customizing don't you?

I'd let this strand of the thread die if I was you.


Anyway, our minister in charge of cycle safety doesn't wear a helmet when cycling. Discuss........

jonny_trousers

chilling wrote:

It now has a carbon fork

Just the one? What's the other made of Titanium? You really do like customizing don't you?

I'd let this strand of the thread die if I was you.

And I would look up the definition of 'fork' before I tried to be clever if I was you.

P_Tucker

Jonny_Trousers wrote:

chilling wrote:

It now has a carbon fork

Just the one? What's the other made of Titanium? You really do like customizing don't you?

I'd let this strand of the thread die if I was you.

And I would look up the definition of 'fork' before I tried to be clever if I was you.

Sssshh, I want to see a bike with two forks.

EKE_38BPM

P_Tucker wrote:

Jonny_Trousers wrote:

chilling wrote:

It now has a carbon fork

Just the one? What's the other made of Titanium? You really do like customizing don't you?

I'd let this strand of the thread die if I was you.

And I would look up the definition of 'fork' before I tried to be clever if I was you.

Sssshh, I want to see a bike with two forks.

You know the rules, pics or it didn't happen!

EKE_38BPM

Chilling's 'bike'?

chilling

Stalker.

snailracer

Jonny_Trousers wrote:

... I then went to Pearson who gave me an excellent, non-patronising service and I decided that although I liked their Touché single speed and that it suited my purposes well, it wasn’t worth 650 quid...

...Defend the boy in Evans all you like, but the bottom line is he lost a potential sale because he didn’t engage my needs as a customer fully, for whatever reason....

OK, so you went to Evans and was disappointed with the service - "sale fail", as you put it. Then you went to Pearson, which gave you better service as you would expect from an independent, upmarket bike shop (they claim to be "the world's oldest bike shop", no less), but you didn't like the upmarket prices - result being another "sale fail". Conclusion: cheaper bike shops have crappier service, upmarket shops have better service (but higher prices). Isn't this how things work?

Jonny_Trousers wrote:

...You are kidding right? I thought I had made it patently clear that the boy in Evans didn’t bother to find out what I wanted. He also worked for one of the biggest bicycle retailers in the country and will have had a huge selection of bikes to offer me...

Ever been to Halfords? Apparently they're big and have a huge selection, but size doesn't translate into quality service.

Jonny_Trousers wrote:

I then bought a steel framed single speed from Ebay that with a certain amount of customizing...My single speed is made up of a 2008 Fuji track frame. It now has a carbon fork added and a Sugino 75 chainset with a Miche cog at the rear. The handlebars are ITM and the brakes are Shimano 105s...

BTW your bike is nice, I'm pretty sure you can't just walk into any bike shop and get something like it for any sensible money. IMO your requirements were too specific for any bike shop to economically cater for.

notsoblue

EKE_38BPM wrote:

Chilling's 'bike'?

Awesome. Pop some deep V's on that = Perfect Bike.

snailracer

Monofork AND monostays:

snailracer

Monocrank and, er, monoleg:

Agent57

I just bought my wife this:



She loves it. Says it's far more comfortable than her other bike, and she can't wait to get a wicker basket for the front.

vorsprung

Il Principe wrote:

Down the Road wrote:

FCN number - what a load of crap!!!!

There's a whole load of "missing the point" going on in this forum these days.

So business as usual then

vorsprung

Valy wrote:

Why are hybrids looked down on?

Most really awful bikes, the £50 from Tesco bikes with brakes that don't work- the ones we call "BSO" (Bike Shaped Object) are hybrids

There are some great hybrids about but simply because most of the truely bad bikes are hybrids, most hybrids are not good.

Kieran_Burns

vorsprung wrote:

Il Principe wrote:

Down the Road wrote:

FCN number - what a load of crap!!!!

There's a whole load of "missing the point" going on in this forum these days.

So business as usual then

I've kind of lost the point in amongst all the comments. What was it again exactly?

rjsterry

The bike industry is primarily interested in selling bikes - any bikes and as many as possible. From a business point of view, they couldn't care less whether we all ride dutch bikes, road bikes, hybrids, MTBs, 'bents or whatever, so long as there's a good margin to be made. All this guff about whether they are selling us the right kind of bike is beside the point - as long as people keep buying hybrids and supermarket FS MTBs, someone will keep making them. It'll only change when bike fashions change (and they will eventually) and [people start demanding some other kind of bike (cf the rise of mass market FG/SS bikes).

Sure you will find some bike shops that take great care in finding the right kind of bike for you, but that is the niche service they decided to provide, probably as a response to not being able to compete with the mass market suppliers. They are doing it to survive as a business, not because they are nice people or 'believe in finding the right bike for you' or whatever their slogan says.

[/cynic]

Cafewanda

@ EKE. I'm now on my third hybrid. I sold the first two and have added a road bike to my collection.

Having ridden in the London Classic yesterday and struggled up a few of the hills, walked up two and completely missed out one (error), my ideal 'everyday' bike would be one that's my size, with as many gears a weak great-grandmother could use to get up Canonbie and Maze Hills, even if I never went near them again and a rack for panniers. Weight is also important as I live on the 3rd floor and now have a weak right-shoulder which makes load-carrying problematic.

When I bought the first two bikes, none of the shop staff where I made the purchases took arm length into consideration, focussing more on leg position when seated. As a titch adult, I have a very narrow bike range to choose from. Fortunately I now know what to look for.

tailwindhome

Cafewanda wrote:

As a titch adult, I have a very narrow bike range to choose from. Fortunately I now know what to look for.

Not trying to be smart (for a change) but you should check out IslaBikes. They are very well thought of and the road bikes aimed at teenagers may well be exactly what you need

http://www.islabikes.co.uk/bike_pages/luath700lrg.html


http://www.islabikes.co.uk/bike_pages/p ... rt_web.pdf

If my maths is right the Large in the Luath is sized for a 5'0" rider

snailracer

rjsterry wrote:

The bike industry is primarily interested in selling bikes - any bikes and as many as possible. From a business point of view, they couldn't care less whether we all ride dutch bikes, road bikes, hybrids, MTBs, 'bents or whatever, so long as there's a good margin to be made. All this guff about whether they are selling us the right kind of bike is beside the point - as long as people keep buying hybrids and supermarket FS MTBs, someone will keep making them. It'll only change when bike fashions change (and they will eventually) and [people start demanding some other kind of bike (cf the rise of mass market FG/SS bikes)...

[/cynic]

+1
It's more a fashion thing what sort of bike happens to sell at any given time. The cheap mass-market road bike (called a "race" bike back then) last had it's day back in the 70's, and they were even more rubbish than the cheap MTB/hybrid BSO's that are popular now. If you wait a few years, the road bike's turn to be popular will come around again. Or the cruiser. Maybe even the chopper...

kingmho

snailracer wrote:

rjsterry wrote:

The bike industry is primarily interested in selling bikes - any bikes and as many as possible. From a business point of view, they couldn't care less whether we all ride dutch bikes, road bikes, hybrids, MTBs, 'bents or whatever, so long as there's a good margin to be made. All this guff about whether they are selling us the right kind of bike is beside the point - as long as people keep buying hybrids and supermarket FS MTBs, someone will keep making them. It'll only change when bike fashions change (and they will eventually) and [people start demanding some other kind of bike (cf the rise of mass market FG/SS bikes)...

[/cynic]

+1
It's more a fashion thing what sort of bike happens to sell at any given time. The cheap mass-market road bike (called a "race" bike back then) last had it's day back in the 70's, and they were even more rubbish than the cheap MTB/hybrid BSO's that are popular now. If you wait a few years, the road bike's turn to be popular will come around again. Or the cruiser. Maybe even the chopper...

I'm waiting for the penny-farthing. Can't stand oiling chains

k.

jonny_trousers

snailracer wrote:

Jonny_Trousers wrote:

... I then went to Pearson who gave me an excellent, non-patronising service and I decided that although I liked their Touché single speed and that it suited my purposes well, it wasn’t worth 650 quid...

...Defend the boy in Evans all you like, but the bottom line is he lost a potential sale because he didn’t engage my needs as a customer fully, for whatever reason....

OK, so you went to Evans and was disappointed with the service - "sale fail", as you put it. Then you went to Pearson, which gave you better service as you would expect from an independent, upmarket bike shop (they claim to be "the world's oldest bike shop", no less), but you didn't like the upmarket prices - result being another "sale fail". Conclusion: cheaper bike shops have crappier service, upmarket shops have better service (but higher prices). Isn't this how things work?

Jonny_Trousers wrote:

...You are kidding right? I thought I had made it patently clear that the boy in Evans didn’t bother to find out what I wanted. He also worked for one of the biggest bicycle retailers in the country and will have had a huge selection of bikes to offer me...

Ever been to Halfords? Apparently they're big and have a huge selection, but size doesn't translate into quality service.

Jonny_Trousers wrote:

I then bought a steel framed single speed from Ebay that with a certain amount of customizing...My single speed is made up of a 2008 Fuji track frame. It now has a carbon fork added and a Sugino 75 chainset with a Miche cog at the rear. The handlebars are ITM and the brakes are Shimano 105s...

BTW your bike is nice, I'm pretty sure you can't just walk into any bike shop and get something like it for any sensible money. IMO your requirements were too specific for any bike shop to economically cater for.

Oh dear, you still don't get it do you? Like I already said, my requirements, when I walked into Evans' that day, were no more than a fast, drop-bar bike for commuting.Too specific a request? Really? I only ended up considering a single speed because of the helpful advice of people here. Even if I had wanted a single speed similar to the one I ended up with when I entered Evans, do they not sell such bikes? The Kona Paddy Wagon perhaps? The Genesis Day One? The Specialized Langsters? The lad serving me just didn't bother to offer me anything more than that one entry level road bike or nothing.

You know what I really suspect? I think I just got unlucky with that particular salesman. Maybe he was bored, maybe he was tired. Maybe he saw me as just the next idiot in a long line of customers without a clue who decide they want to commute by bike now that the sun is out. Whatever, he did not serve me well and he failed in his job. The experience has put me off Evans, but I am sure they have wonderful salespeople on their payroll too. Do they push Specialized bikes for any particular reason beyond them being the best choice for the customer? I have no idea, but like someone said above, they certainly wouldn't be the first company to do such a thing.

Cafewanda

TailWindHome wrote:

Cafewanda wrote:

As a titch adult, I have a very narrow bike range to choose from. Fortunately I now know what to look for.

Not trying to be smart (for a change) but you should check out IslaBikes. They are very well thought of and the road bikes aimed at teenagers may well be exactly what you need

http://www.islabikes.co.uk/bike_pages/luath700lrg.html


http://www.islabikes.co.uk/bike_pages/p ... rt_web.pdf

If my maths is right the Large in the Luath is sized for a 5'0" rider

Already looked at and will go visit the shop later in the year. Cheers

snailracer

Jonny_Trousers wrote:

...

You know what I really suspect? I think I just got unlucky with that particular salesman. Maybe he was bored, maybe he was tired. Maybe he saw me as just the next idiot in a long line of customers without a clue who decide they want to commute by bike now that the sun is out. Whatever, he did not serve me well and he failed in his job. The experience has put me off Evans, but I am sure they have wonderful salespeople on their payroll too. Do they push Specialized bikes for any particular reason beyond them being the best choice for the customer? I have no idea, but like someone said above, they certainly wouldn't be the first company to do such a thing.

Ultimately it is the shop that failed, the salesman is just a small, underpaid cog in the Evans machine. If he was tired, bored or had too many customers lining up, then the shop should have motivated him, employed someone else or hired more sales staff.

Note that Pearson, as a shop, also failed. But apparently you didn't feel it necessary to single out and criticize the person who set their pricing policy for the bike you thought was overpriced.

jonny_trousers

snailracer wrote:

Note that Pearson, as a shop, also failed. But apparently you didn't feel it necessary to single out and criticize the person who set their pricing policy for the bike you thought was overpriced.

Not really, the lad in Pearson took the time to show me their entire range and it was up to me to decide what was in my budget and whether I thought it was worth it or not. I'm sure Pearson bikes are perfectly decent value for money. Whether or not I feel they are suitable for me, given their price, is an entirely different matter.

Just out of interest, which branch of Evans do you work in?

snailracer

Jonny_Trousers wrote:

snailracer wrote:

Note that Pearson, as a shop, also failed. But apparently you didn't feel it necessary to single out and criticize the person who set their pricing policy for the bike you thought was overpriced.

Not really, the lad in Pearson took the time to show me their entire range and it was up to me to decide what was in my budget and whether I thought it was worth it or not. I'm sure Pearson bikes are perfectly decent value for money. Whether or not I feel they are suitable for me, given their price, is an entirely different matter.

Just out of interest, which branch of Evans do you work in?

Heheh, I am not in the bike biz. And, IMO, a lost sale is a lost sale, whether by bad service, unsuitable products, poor presentation, or unfavourable pricing.