Midsomer Racist?

Aggieboy

I take exception to the fact that there's no nudity in it.

Cleat Eastwood

Aggieboy wrote:

I take exception to the fact that there's no nudity in it.

ah there was. I forget her name. A posh bird, got her baps out by the window.

Aggieboy

Cleat Eastwood wrote:

Aggieboy wrote:

I take exception to the fact that there's no nudity in it.

ah there was. I forget her name. A posh bird, got her baps out by the window.

I bet there hasn't been a gay bloke with his bolloxs dangling out of the rose covered bay window though, has there!!!!!? I hate those sexist and homophobic programmes.

Cleat Eastwood

Oi oi savaloy, and then there was this...

http://www.thesun.co.uk/sol/homepage/sh ... shots.html

Frank the tank

The programme is a work of fiction, the setting of which is based on a section of the community which is entirely white in this case, and it doesn't look odd.

Small villages in the countryside are not places ethnic minorities are automatically associated with. I,ve ridden through and stopped in many villages on my rides and I can say the number of the "ethnic minority" within them is ver,very low/non-existent. so also are "chavs", hoodie clad youths on BMX's/Mtb's, dodgy looking people in boy racer motors efc. However I do see lots of 4X4s, top marque motors, gals on horses and not a lot of litter etc. Just nice picturesque villages.

A bit like mid-somer but without the body count.

Good to see while there's a massive natural disaster in the far east and the middle east is in total turmoil, us here in the uk concern ourselves with tosh.

RichN95.

Frank the tank wrote:

Good to see while there's a massive natural disaster in the far east and the middle east is in total turmoil, us here in the uk concern ourselves with tosh.

There don't seem to be many black people cast in that one either. It's 98% Japanese as far as I can see.

EKE_38BPM

Frank the tank wrote:

Good to see while there's a massive natural disaster in the far east and the middle east is in total turmoil, us here in the uk concern ourselves with tosh.

You've missed out the war in Afghanistan, devestation in Haiti, earthquake in Christchurch, floods in Australia, deforestation in the Amazon basin, pollution in the oceans etc.

When ALL of the world's ills are sorted can we then discuss this?

guinea

Actors are chosen to fill a role. The look of that is of utmost importance. It is irrelevant if an actor is capable of the part, if he or she doesn't look the part, they aren't getting the job.

MM's characters are white. White actors should play them.

For example: I've never seen a black person in a Scottish bagpipe band. If ITV did a gritty pipe band based drama and didn't include any would it be realistic, racist or both?

Ollieda

Having been watching this story keep comming up in the news I just find it funny that the majority of those who call it "disgusting" or say its "unexceptable" are white, of the few coloured people i've seen interviewed about it they genrally seem chilled out about it refering more to the likelyhood of their being "ethnics" in the villages as opposed to just calling it racist.

I've dealt with racism most of my life, especially as a child where my brother, my dad and I were the only coloured people in our town, and all the time i've genrally found it's those uneffected by racism directly who tend to get most upset by it, odd that!

EKE_38BPM

guinea wrote:

Actors are chosen to fill a role. The look of that is of utmost importance. It is irrelevant if an actor is capable of the part, if he or she doesn't look the part, they aren't getting the job.

MM's characters are white. White actors should play them.

For example: I've never seen a black person in a Scottish bagpipe band. If ITV did a gritty pipe band based drama and didn't include any would it be realistic, racist or both?

Ever seen Shawshank Redemption? Ever wonder why the character played by Morgan Freeman is named 'Red'?
Well in the book, Red was a red-headed Irishman. I would guess that Morgan got the part because he was the best actor for the part.

wikipedia wrote:

Morgan Freeman as Ellis Boyd "Red" Redding: Andy's best friend and the film's narrator. Before Freeman was cast, Clint Eastwood, Harrison Ford, Paul Newman, and Robert Redford were each considered for the role. Although written as a middle-aged Irishman with greying red hair (as in the novella), Darabont cast Freeman for his authoritative presence and demeanor, because he could not see anyone else as Red.

He would never have got a job in Midsomer Murders purely due to his race, therefore, the policy and whoever set the policy, is racist.

Cleat Eastwood

EKE_38BPM wrote:

guinea wrote:

Actors are chosen to fill a role. The look of that is of utmost importance. It is irrelevant if an actor is capable of the part, if he or she doesn't look the part, they aren't getting the job.

MM's characters are white. White actors should play them.

For example: I've never seen a black person in a Scottish bagpipe band. If ITV did a gritty pipe band based drama and didn't include any would it be realistic, racist or both?

Ever seen Shawshank Redemption? Ever wonder why the character played by Morgan Freeman is named 'Red'?
Well in the book, Red was a red-headed Irishman. I would guess that Morgan got the part because he was the best actor for the part.

wikipedia wrote:

Morgan Freeman as Ellis Boyd "Red" Redding: Andy's best friend and the film's narrator. Before Freeman was cast, Clint Eastwood, Harrison Ford, Paul Newman, and Robert Redford were each considered for the role. Although written as a middle-aged Irishman with greying red hair (as in the novella), Darabont cast Freeman for his authoritative presence and demeanor, because he could not see anyone else as Red.

He would never have got a job in Midsomer Murders purely due to his race, therefore, the policy and whoever set the policy, is racist.

So are you saying that we are a cosmopolitan society in this country but if you watched midsomer you wouldn't think so. Is that one of the strands of this arguement.

cycladianpirate

EKE_38BPM wrote:

guinea wrote:

EKE_38BPM wrote:

I think the producer is a racist for deliberately having an all white (and therefore racist) policy.[/url]?

Are you for real?

Racist is a pretty strong word to throw around.

All white does not equal racist any more than all black does. Midsomer Murders is as racist as the Asian Network.

Shows are made for particular demographics to sell advertising. This one is for white middle Englanders, or those that want to mock them.

Yep, I'm for real.

I agree that racist is a strong word to throw around and I stick by it. If an organisation, any organisation, said "No ethnic minorities allowed" how can that not be described as racist?
Would advertisers run away if a black character turned up in the show? I doubt it, but if they did, good. I hope their business goes down the tubes.

A policy of all black is as racist as all white and that deserves a backlash too.

Say the words then...in your view the BBC Asian Network is racist.

EKE_38BPM

Ollieda wrote:

...it's those uneffected by racism directly who tend to get most upset by it.

I have to agree with Ollieda. I used to go out with a white, tree hugging, vegetarian, leftie, yoghurt knitter (as Jeremy Clarkson would describe her) and had a row with her about race. She was offended on my behalf about something that didn't really bother me. Me, a mixed race (half caste, bi-racial etc) friend and a white African friend were all trying to get her to calm down, but she was determined to be offended for me.

I can't even remember what she was offended about.

Cleat Eastwood wrote:

EKE_38BPM wrote:

guinea wrote:

Actors are chosen to fill a role. The look of that is of utmost importance. It is irrelevant if an actor is capable of the part, if he or she doesn't look the part, they aren't getting the job.

MM's characters are white. White actors should play them.

For example: I've never seen a black person in a Scottish bagpipe band. If ITV did a gritty pipe band based drama and didn't include any would it be realistic, racist or both?

Ever seen Shawshank Redemption? Ever wonder why the character played by Morgan Freeman is named 'Red'?
Well in the book, Red was a red-headed Irishman. I would guess that Morgan got the part because he was the best actor for the part.

wikipedia wrote:

Morgan Freeman as Ellis Boyd "Red" Redding: Andy's best friend and the film's narrator. Before Freeman was cast, Clint Eastwood, Harrison Ford, Paul Newman, and Robert Redford were each considered for the role. Although written as a middle-aged Irishman with greying red hair (as in the novella), Darabont cast Freeman for his authoritative presence and demeanor, because he could not see anyone else as Red.

He would never have got a job in Midsomer Murders purely due to his race, therefore, the policy and whoever set the policy, is racist.

So are you saying that we are a cosmopolitan society in this country but if you watched midsomer you wouldn't think so. Is that one of the strands of this arguement.

I'm saying that a policy to only allow white actors on screen is racist. If that was the producer's policy, it was a racist policy.

I can't put it more plainly than that.

I've never watched MM and don't really care that it had an all white cast. What I do care about is that under the policy there was no chance of a non white actor (no matter how good the actor) ever appearing on it.
The sight of an all white village does not offend me. A policy ensuring that it remains that way, does.

Jay dubbleU

TBH I've watched it for years and never really noticed what colour the characters were - more concerned about the body count

EKE_38BPM

cycladianpirate wrote:

Say the words then...in your view the BBC Asian Network is racist.

Does the Asian Network have a policy of only allowing Asian presenters? If so, then yes, it is racist.

However, if the only requirment of being a presenter is that they are au fait with Asian music then that is not racist.
David Rodigan is/was a white DJ who used to broadcast on BBC Radio London, Kiss FM and Capital FM as well as playing at clubs etc. He exclusively played reggae and was au fait with the music and culture.
If he could do it with Jamaican dancehall reggae, there is nothing stopping a non-Asian doing it with Asian music in my opinion. That may or may not exist on the Asian network at the moment, but I doubt the BBC have a policy preventing it from happening.

cycladianpirate

EKE_38BPM wrote:

cycladianpirate wrote:

Say the words then...in your view the BBC Asian Network is racist.

Does the Asian Network have a policy of only allowing Asian presenters? If so, then yes, it is racist.

However, if the only requirment of being a presenter is that they are au fait with Asian music then that is not racist.
David Rodigan is/was a white DJ who used to broadcast on BBC Radio London, Kiss FM and Capital FM as well as playing at clubs etc. He exclusively played reggae and was au fait with the music and culture.
If he could do it with Jamaican dancehall reggae, there is nothing stopping a non-Asian doing it with Asian music in my opinion. That may or may not exist on the Asian network at the moment, but I doubt the BBC have a policy preventing it from happening.

I'm pretty sure that it does. It has a specific remit for broadcasting for and by the population of asian descent living in the UK.

But fair play to you for your consistent point of view.

Ollieda

EKE_38BPM wrote:

I have to agree with Ollieda. I used to go out with a white, tree hugging, vegetarian, leftie, yoghurt knitter (as Jeremy Clarkson would describe her) and had a row with her about race. She was offended on my behalf about something that didn't really bother me. Me, a mixed race (half caste, bi-racial etc) friend and a white African friend were all trying to get her to calm down, but she was determined to be offended for me.

I can't even remember what she was offended about.

So many times I've been in similar situations and it makes me laugh so much!

Oh and I'm so going to use "bi-racial" as a way of describing myself in the future, that's brilliant that one! Bound to set some people off, very funny when I call myself a "half-cast" or "coloured" and someone will say "you can't say that, it's racist!"

Cleat Eastwood

Out of interest have any of you actually listened to the interview with mr May, becasue he does actually say

"we are a cosmopolitan society in this country but if you watched midsomer you wouldn't think so"

He also suggests that the creative decisions for midsomer are largely driven by market forces and a need to appeal to foreign markets with quaint stereotypical perceptions of englishnss.

He willingly acknowledges the shows cultural shortcomings.

Hardly racist.

And if you want to see real prejudice on the box just take a look at disabled representation. The Beeb especially must think the deaf community are a bunch of night owls. ah well. such is life.

EKE_38BPM

Ollieda wrote:

EKE_38BPM wrote:

I have to agree with Ollieda. I used to go out with a white, tree hugging, vegetarian, leftie, yoghurt knitter (as Jeremy Clarkson would describe her) and had a row with her about race. She was offended on my behalf about something that didn't really bother me. Me, a mixed race (half caste, bi-racial etc) friend and a white African friend were all trying to get her to calm down, but she was determined to be offended for me.

I can't even remember what she was offended about.

So many times I've been in similar situations and it makes me laugh so much!

Oh and I'm so going to use "bi-racial" as a way of describing myself in the future, that's brilliant that one! Bound to set some people off, very funny when I call myself a "half-cast" or "coloured" and someone will say "you can't say that, it's racist!"

I believe 'bi-racial' is the current PC term in Yankland for a someone who is a little bit of this and a little bit of that.
Bi-racial always makes me think of someone who is literally half one race and half another e.g negroid on their left side, caucasoid on their right side, like a bi-metallic strip is a strip of material that is half one metal and half another joined together.

Oh yeah, David Rodigan is still alive and, according to Wikipedia, he played a DJ on Grand Theft Auto: Episodes From Liberty City..

Weejie54

Brian True May was referring to a perception of a last bastion of englishness, not his perception but A perception that foreign audiences found appealing, and not of britishness but englishness as depicted in novels and stories from 70-80 years ago.

Thank you for your intepretation. He said "we're the last bastion of Englishness and I want to keep it that way". Note the article. I didn't realise it was a period drama - I thought the novels began with a publication in the late 80s. Does Caroline Graham describe the county as void of darker complexions - or is that a slant that the producer put on it?

I cant see how any aesthetic choices in a collaborative fictional work can be described as racist/sexist etc and it was interesting seeing ricks interpretation of that.

If there is a requirement to be white, without a suitable ground, for a part in the series - even as an extra, it falls foul of legislation. That makes it pretty close to racial discrimination.
It's not the actual programme that is claimed to be racist.

Cleat Eastwood

EKE_38BPM wrote:

Ollieda wrote:

EKE_38BPM wrote:

I have to agree with Ollieda. I used to go out with a white, tree hugging, vegetarian, leftie, yoghurt knitter (as Jeremy Clarkson would describe her) and had a row with her about race. She was offended on my behalf about something that didn't really bother me. Me, a mixed race (half caste, bi-racial etc) friend and a white African friend were all trying to get her to calm down, but she was determined to be offended for me.

I can't even remember what she was offended about.

So many times I've been in similar situations and it makes me laugh so much!

Oh and I'm so going to use "bi-racial" as a way of describing myself in the future, that's brilliant that one! Bound to set some people off, very funny when I call myself a "half-cast" or "coloured" and someone will say "you can't say that, it's racist!"

I believe 'bi-racial' is the current PC term in Yankland for a someone who is a little bit of this and a little bit of that.
Bi-racial always makes me think of someone who is literally half one race and half another e.g negroid on their left side, caucasoid on their right side, like a bi-metallic strip is a strip of material that is half one metal and half another joined together.

Oh yeah, David Rodigan is still alive and, according to Wikipedia, he played a DJ on Grand Theft Auto: Episodes From Liberty City..

just an aside. I've a friend whos dad is moroccan and mum is english. She has consequently a lovely olive skin. Thing is most people take her to be italian....and thats fine...people love italy, but when she mentions she's bi racial of north african stock theres a almost audible short intake of breath. most odd, ciao for now.

EKE_38BPM

Cleat Eastwood wrote:

Out of interest have any of you actually listened to the interview with mr May, becasue he does actually say

"we are a cosmopolitan society in this country but if you watched midsomer you wouldn't think so"

He also suggests that the creative decisions for midsomer are largely driven by market forces and a need to appeal to foreign markets with quaint stereotypical perceptions of englishnss.

He willingly acknowledges the shows cultural shortcomings.

Hardly racist.

And if you want to see real prejudice on the box just take a look at disabled representation. The Beeb especially must think the deaf community are a bunch of night owls. ah well. such is life.

I must confess that I haven't seen/heard the interview, just the hoo-haa. No matter the reason though, I just don't like the idea that a non-white actor would have no chance of getting a job on that show.

The Beeb pretty much pioneered and pushed through the 888 teletext subtitling service and getting teletext as standard on British TVs. In Yankland the best you would get is Closed Caption, but that is a seperate box you would have to buy. No idea about the rest of the world's provision for deaf viewers.

I can't argue with you about the Sign Zone being on really late though.
Better late than never?...

roger_merriman

the langage he used is clumsy, possibly taken out of context or he was trying to be clever?

in terms of midsomer well the uk is a very white country and out of the big cities is very much so.

the villages around my folks place if there is some one who is not white well i've yet to see them, even the towns are like that. uk is what 92% white the 8% mostly being urban and lets be honest even in cities it's areas within cities.

I think I'd like to see the full text of his interview to be honest.

Weejie54

the villages around my folks place if there is some one who is not white well i've yet to see them,

So countless seem to be saying - except the vicar in one of the villages - or the pub owner in another or.....


I think these claims are interesting. It was quite amusing reading the article in the independent where some bloke in Wallingford made such a claim:

In the market square, opposite the Corn Exchange, one man says: "You’d have to search pretty hard to find a dark face." Oblivious, sat on the bench behind him is Suzette Williamson, a 34-year-old Trinidadian nurse at the nearby care home (not the same home, mercifully, as featured in the 2000 Midsomer Murders episode "Blue Herrings": the unfortunate residents were dying out faster than the staff could make off with their expensive jewellery).

http://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/th ... 42914.html

As the pantomime cliche goes "behind you".

Another amusing article in the Torygraph tries to back up the claim that it is virtually white only by pinpointing the village of Haddenham - but does mention a Sri Lankan newsagent and points out an Indian restaurant, even talking to the waiter from Bangladesh.

de_sisti

Ollieda wrote:

Having been watching this story keep comming up in the news I just find it funny that the majority of those who call it "disgusting" or say its "unexceptable" are white, of the few black (we don't use coloured any more) people i've seen interviewed about it they genrally seem chilled out about it refering more to the likelyhood of their being "ethnics" in the villages as opposed to just calling it racist.

I've dealt with racism most of my life, especially as a child where my brother, my dad and I were the only black people in our town, and all the time i've genrally found it's those uneffected by racism directly who tend to get most upset by it, odd that!

You're from Cheltenham? Get yourself down to the Ice Cream hut on Central X Drive on
Saturday and Sunday mornings

EKE_38BPM

De Sisti wrote:

Ollieda wrote:

Having been watching this story keep comming up in the news I just find it funny that the majority of those who call it "disgusting" or say its "unexceptable" are white, of the few black (we don't use coloured any more) people i've seen interviewed about it they genrally seem chilled out about it refering more to the likelyhood of their being "ethnics" in the villages as opposed to just calling it racist.

I've dealt with racism most of my life, especially as a child where my brother, my dad and I were the only black people in our town, and all the time i've genrally found it's those uneffected by racism directly who tend to get most upset by it, odd that!

You're from Cheltenham? Get yourself down to the Ice Cream hut on Central X Drive on
Saturday and Sunday mornings

Is this some sort of blind date being arranged?

de_sisti

EKE_38BPM wrote:

De Sisti wrote:

Ollieda wrote:

Having been watching this story keep comming up in the news I just find it funny that the majority of those who call it "disgusting" or say its "unexceptable" are white, of the few black (we don't use coloured any more) people i've seen interviewed about it they genrally seem chilled out about it refering more to the likelyhood of their being "ethnics" in the villages as opposed to just calling it racist.

I've dealt with racism most of my life, especially as a child where my brother, my dad and I were the only black people in our town, and all the time i've genrally found it's those uneffected by racism directly who tend to get most upset by it, odd that!

You're from Cheltenham? Get yourself down to the Ice Cream hut on Central X Drive on
Saturday and Sunday mornings

Is this some sort of blind date being arranged?

You're invited too, if you visit the area. Bring a spare tube (just in case) as the last visitor
who punctured didn't have one. (He still hasn't given me a replacement tube yet.) :roll:

EKE_38BPM

After a little bit of Googlemap action, I see that it would be ~200+mile round trip. Its a little early in the year for that kind of ride.

Maybe in the summer though? And definitely not fixed. My only bike at the mo is a fixie and the thought of 200 fixed miles make my thighs quiver and quake.
I need a new roadbike and I think I deserve carbon. Need the £s first though.

roger_merriman

Weejie54 wrote:

the villages around my folks place if there is some one who is not white well i've yet to see them,

So countless seem to be saying - except the vicar in one of the villages - or the pub owner in another or.....


I think these claims are interesting. It was quite amusing reading the article in the independent where some bloke in Wallingford made such a claim:

In the market square, opposite the Corn Exchange, one man says: "You’d have to search pretty hard to find a dark face." Oblivious, sat on the bench behind him is Suzette Williamson, a 34-year-old Trinidadian nurse at the nearby care home (not the same home, mercifully, as featured in the 2000 Midsomer Murders episode "Blue Herrings": the unfortunate residents were dying out faster than the staff could make off with their expensive jewellery).

http://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/th ... 42914.html

As the pantomime cliche goes "behind you".

Another amusing article in the Torygraph tries to back up the claim that it is virtually white only by pinpointing the village of Haddenham - but does mention a Sri Lankan newsagent and points out an Indian restaurant, even talking to the waiter from Bangladesh.

yes you will get Indian restaurants in places that have takeaways, the little villages around my folks place don't the larger market town does, but even so thats a few famillies compared to a small town of white.

pottssteve

Bl00dy Hell,

This whole hand-wringing, self-analysing, guilt trip is SO Brititsh (or should I say English?).

FWIW, my view:

1. Some people who live in Britain are racists. Many people hold some views which may be perceived as racist but which they don't express.
2. Some people who live in Britain object to the extent to which immigration has altered the cultural make up of the country.
3. Some areas of Britain have relatively few immigrants living there while other areas have much higher numbers of people born overseas.
4. As has been mentioned, the show appeals to a certain demographic, in the same way that the Asian network, Phoenix TV or MTV does.

I've lived in a variety of countries and have seen examples of racism in ALL of those in some form or another. Non-white people can be racist too! However, apart from New Zealand (where a large proportion of the population are of British extraction, of course), Britain is the one place where racism has been a soul searching issue to this extent.

If you want multi-culturism, watch Eastenders. If you don't like Midsomer Murders (and personally I've never seen it), there are other programmes available....