I need a solution...

tailwindhome

StuAff wrote:

DonDaddyD wrote:

You missed my point. If you have 5s then there is no point getting 3s you should get 1s as there is a noticable difference in weight between 5s and 1s but not 5s and 3s.

If you have 3s you should get 0s.

5s and 7s share the same hub.

Ahem.....something wrong with your maths there. You save more weight going from Fulcrum 5 to 3 than from 3 to 1 .
3 2 Way Fits= 165g lighter than F5 (2010 specs, from fulcrumwheels.com). Zondas another 15g lighter, btw.
1 2 Way Fits= 90g lighter than 3s. And 255g lighter than 5s. A whole half-a-pound lighter for £450 extra....

Or DDD could do a dump in the morning weighing more than 255g and save his money.

FACT

stuaff

TailWindHome wrote:

StuAff wrote:

DonDaddyD wrote:

You missed my point. If you have 5s then there is no point getting 3s you should get 1s as there is a noticable difference in weight between 5s and 1s but not 5s and 3s.

If you have 3s you should get 0s.

5s and 7s share the same hub.

Ahem.....something wrong with your maths there. You save more weight going from Fulcrum 5 to 3 than from 3 to 1 .
3 2 Way Fits= 165g lighter than F5 (2010 specs, from fulcrumwheels.com). Zondas another 15g lighter, btw.
1 2 Way Fits= 90g lighter than 3s. And 255g lighter than 5s. A whole half-a-pound lighter for £450 extra....

Or DDD could do a dump in the morning weighing more than 255g and save his money.

FACT

rjsterry

greg66_tri_v2.0

rjsterry wrote:

Greg66 wrote:

Something seems a bit different about the forum. Have I missed anything?

Long story, but Commuting General has split into General and Chat, with the OT and social stuff in Chat and the more serious stuff in General. Some got a bit upset about this, but it seems to have settled down now.

This going to have to be explained again and again with everything happening while people are on holiday.

That sounds like a really dumb ass idea. Did some decide to employ the maxim "it ain't broke, but let's try to fix it"?

Is there a sweepstake running on how long before "General" acquires the sub-nom "Graveyard".

tailwindhome

Greg66 wrote:

rjsterry wrote:

Greg66 wrote:

Something seems a bit different about the forum. Have I missed anything?

Long story, but Commuting General has split into General and Chat, with the OT and social stuff in Chat and the more serious stuff in General. Some got a bit upset about this, but it seems to have settled down now.

This going to have to be explained again and again with everything happening while people are on holiday.

That sounds like a really dumb ass idea. Did some decide to employ the maxim "it ain't broke, but let's try to fix it"?

Is there a sweepstake running on how long before "General" acquires the sub-nom "Graveyard".

That's *so* last week

Do we have to explain it all to ITB when he gets back too???

You won't be hearing too much from Always Tyred either, he took it very badly and well lets just say "is no longer with us".

greg66_tri_v2.0

TailWindHome wrote:

Greg66 wrote:

rjsterry wrote:

Greg66 wrote:

Something seems a bit different about the forum. Have I missed anything?

Long story, but Commuting General has split into General and Chat, with the OT and social stuff in Chat and the more serious stuff in General. Some got a bit upset about this, but it seems to have settled down now.

This going to have to be explained again and again with everything happening while people are on holiday.

That sounds like a really dumb ass idea. Did some decide to employ the maxim "it ain't broke, but let's try to fix it"?

Is there a sweepstake running on how long before "General" acquires the sub-nom "Graveyard".

That's *so* last week

Do we have to explain it all to ITB when he gets back too???

You won't be hearing too much from Always Tyred either, he took it very badly and well lets just say "is no longer with us".

What, so he flounced off in a huff?

I knew it. I always had him figured as a real prima donna.

Who's ITB? :twisted:

Wait till I really get back... It's my bedtime now ...

Clever Pun

JonGinge wrote:

TailWindHome wrote:

Clever Pun wrote:

Clever Pun wrote:

TailWindHome wrote:

Planet X have Fulcrum 3s for £275

http://www.planet-x-bikes.co.uk/i/q/WPF ... her-wheels

I hate you

Here's a question.. What hubs to these use, currently I'm running chorus hubs. Would these make for good bling/race wheels?

Ahem.. don't make me start bitching about a clique now

Sorry i wasn't here to answer your question, thankfully JonGinge, who used google to find information stepped in.

To be fair I was distracted by having to go to my daughters birthday party.

You have my full attention for the next 364 days

FTFY. All hail t'interweb

thanks for the replies but I knew that as have read it... I'll try a different tact
are they an upgrade from hand built mavic cx33's with a chorus hub

go

tailwindhome

Clever Pun wrote:

JonGinge wrote:

TailWindHome wrote:

Clever Pun wrote:

Clever Pun wrote:

TailWindHome wrote:

Planet X have Fulcrum 3s for £275

http://www.planet-x-bikes.co.uk/i/q/WPF ... her-wheels

I hate you

Here's a question.. What hubs to these use, currently I'm running chorus hubs. Would these make for good bling/race wheels?

Ahem.. don't make me start bitching about a clique now

Sorry i wasn't here to answer your question, thankfully JonGinge, who used google to find information stepped in.

To be fair I was distracted by having to go to my daughters birthday party.

You have my full attention for the next 364 days

FTFY. All hail t'interweb

thanks for the replies but I knew that as have read it... I'll try a different tact
are they an upgrade from hand built mavic cx33's with a chorus hub

go

Dunno

All I know is they are upgrade from 5's as like 3 is better than 5 and 7, but like not as good as 1 or 0.

You really need someone who knows about this stuff. I'm just the snot nose part timer in for the weekend, it was either this or McDonalds.

Clever Pun

well you tried and that's the important thing *pats head*

holybinch

Greg T wrote:

TailWindHome wrote:

(What about putting a ring on that Irish girl's finger instead?)

MODS!

If that's not a reason to ban a man i don't know what is......

So here we are seriously plotting how D cubed is going to get a new bike and you have to bring up spending his bike money on a wedding ring....

I'm a broad minded guy but kids can read this forum!

Not to mention, brrr, women!

DonDaddyD

StuAff wrote:

DonDaddyD wrote:

You missed my point. If you have 5s then there is no point getting 3s you should get 1s as there is a noticable difference in weight between 5s and 1s but not 5s and 3s.

If you have 3s you should get 0s.

5s and 7s share the same hub.

Ahem.....something wrong with your maths there. You save more weight going from Fulcrum 5 to 3 than from 3 to 1 .
3 2 Way Fits= 165g lighter than F5 (2010 specs, from fulcrumwheels.com). Zondas another 15g lighter, btw.
1 2 Way Fits= 90g lighter than 3s. And 255g lighter than 5s. A whole half-a-pound lighter for £450 extra....

Its like you're saying what I've been saying and using that to tell me I'm wrong.

The (general everyday market) Fulcrum range goes Fulcrum 7, Fulcrum 5, Fulcrum 3, Fulcrum 1 and Fulcrum Zero (0 hereafter).

If you want to upgrade your Fulcrums, here is the following rule.

If you have Fulcrum 7s get Fulcrum 3s
If you have Fulcrum 5s get Fulcrum 1s.
If you have Fulcrum 3s get Fulcrum 0s
If you have either Fulcrum 1s or 0s live happily ever after.

You do this because:

(i) You will not find much difference if you upgrade to the next model up in the range. (ii) You will notice a difference if you go two models up.

Also you should really compare like for like. Here is the math:

According to Wiggle
Fulcrum Racing 5s clinchers weigh: 1760g
Fulcrum Racing 3s clinchers weigh: 1659g
Fulcrum Racing 1s clinchers weigh: 1478g

There is 101g difference in weight between Fulcrum 5 and 3
There is 282g difference in weight between Fulcrum 5 and 1
There is 181g difference in weight between Fulcrum 3 and 1

So if you have Fulcrum 5s and want to upgrade, which is going to give you more comparitive difference from your Fulcrum 5s: Racing 1s or Racing 3s?

Hence the rule.

Lord'a'mercy

prawny

I got some rigida chrina wheels from Parkers for about £105 last christmas, they're not perfectly round any more but they don't rub or owt so they're fine for commuting.

Tiagra cassettes are £15 from CRC or were and a 9sp chain costs £15. So I can't imagine an 8 sp one costing more. Front mech is what £30?

DonDaddyD

So, because this thread needs closure.

My solution:

I cleaned the SCR (Donovan) and replaced the brake pads with the coolstops I had intended for my Kharma. I tighted the brakes but have found that the front (where the quick release is need tightening).

I put the Fulcrum 5s onto my SCR, which involved a cassette change.

It means the Kharma is now in mothballs (upside down and with a towel over the drivetrain) until I buy new lighter wheels for it. Also I can spend longer improving the Kharma for next seasons sportives.

I'll probably ride the 5s to oblivion now and then get cheaper wheels as and when the need demands. I have a shopping list for both bikes.

I quite like fettling.

stuaff

DonDaddyD wrote:

So, because this thread needs closure.

My solution:

I cleaned the SCR (Donovan) and replaced the brake pads with the coolstops I had intended for my Kharma. I tighted the brakes but have found that the front (where the quick release is need tightening).

I put the Fulcrum 5s onto my SCR, which involved a cassette change.

It means the Kharma is now in mothballs (upside down and with a towel over the drivetrain) until I buy new lighter wheels for it. Also I can spend longer improving the Kharma for next seasons sportives.

I'll probably ride the 5s to oblivion now and then get cheaper wheels as and when the need demands. I have a shopping list for both bikes.

I quite like fettling.

Good luck with the shopping, As to what you buy...you and I quoted different sets of figures and reached different conclusions from them, I'm not going to carry that on, but whatever you get, hope that you get a product that suits at a price to match.

tailwindhome

DonDaddyD wrote:

Also I can spend longer improving the Kharma for next seasons sportives.

Is the season over?

So, because this thread needs closure.

Sorry

DonDaddyD

TailWindHome wrote:

DonDaddyD wrote:

Also I can spend longer improving the Kharma for next seasons sportives.

Is the season over?

So, because this thread needs closure.

Sorry

No worries.

I like to open my threads with a strapline, I'm a little anally-pompous like that.

My season is. it was OK, didn't go completely to plan - I didn't do the New Forest sportive. But I did do the Spring Onion and London2Brighton. Two things I've always wanted to do (a Sportive and the London2Brighton). I'm also a hell of a lot fitter, stronger and a better all round rider (still my strength is the flat/rouleur).

Now I'm going to take what I've learned, work on my core and master the technique of climbing. Can't wait for next year, I hope to have a full scheldule of sportives.

Stuaff,

Fair enough, would you mind answering this:

If you have Fulcrum 5s and want to upgrade, which Fulcrum clinchers is going to give you more comparitive difference from your Fulcrum 5s: Racing 1s or Racing 3s?

Is the outcome the same when you factor price?

desweller

Sod the Fulcrums. Get these: http://www.planet-x-bikes.co.uk/i/q/WPPXCAR70082101/planet-x-pro-carbon-82-101--wheelset-700c

stuaff

DonDaddyD wrote:

Stuaff,

Fair enough, would you mind answering this:

If you have Fulcrum 5s and want to upgrade, which Fulcrum clinchers is going to give you more comparitive difference from your Fulcrum 5s: Racing 1s or Racing 3s?

Is the outcome the same when you factor price?

OK....
I stand by my original figures regarding weights- all the figures I quoted (and which I use below) were from fulcrumwheels.com & for 2010 spec wheelsets, the numbers you used from Wiggle were for 2009 models, I think?
To recap: F5s (clincher only): 1760g (my F5 Evos come in a whole 5g lighter!)
F3 2-Way Fit: 1595g (clincher/tubeless). The standard clincher-only version is another 65g, 1650g. I would suggest the 2-Way version is the obvious pick- weight saving straight out of the box even if you run the exact same tyres and tubes, plus the option of going tubeless and saving even more weight. F5 isn't available in 2-Way, but then that's not terribly surprising.
F1 2-Way Fit: 1505g. Oddly, the 2-ways are heavier than the clincher for both F1s and Zeroes. Clincher-only saves you a whole 20g.
And last but not least, Racing Zero 2-way fit 1460g, clincher 1435g.

I'd argue that given the difference in price, going by weight & nothing else, you get the biggest improvement going from 5s to 3 2-way fits. £150 or so extra over the 5s gets you 3s (or Zondas) and saves you 165g. My Zondas (identical apart from spoke pattern & 15g lighter still than F3s) came in at £325. Spend at least £300 more over the 3s to get the 2010 1s (2009 models are cheaper of course!) and you only lose another 90g (110 for clincher-only). Zeroes even worse for bang--for-buck, only another 40 or so g over 1s.
Now, how much weight you need to lose for one to actually notice, and the value of the other improvements, i.e. hubs, spokes, etc, is a whole other matter. It's the Team Sky thing, 'aggregation of marginal gains'. And the more you spend, the more marginal those gains are!

Bassjunkieuk

@DDD - If you want to improve the climbing you could always MAKE damn sure you'll get better and sign up for a nice hilly sportive in the North/South Downs area. I'm sure Evans ran a hilly sportive that started from near Gatwick.

Heck my whole cycling "season" this year started when I signed up for the full Magnficat all the way back in January and just threw myself at a rather basic training programme with a bit of determination to bl00dy well finish!

rolf_f

DesWeller wrote:

Sod the Fulcrums. Get these: http://www.planet-x-bikes.co.uk/i/q/WPPXCAR70082101/planet-x-pro-carbon-82-101--wheelset-700c

They weigh more than the wheels he's already got on the bike.......

stuaff

Bassjunkieuk wrote:

@DDD - If you want to improve the climbing you could always MAKE damn sure you'll get better and sign up for a nice hilly sportive in the North/South Downs area. I'm sure Evans ran a hilly sportive that started from near Gatwick.

Heck my whole cycling "season" this year started when I signed up for the full Magnficat all the way back in January and just threw myself at a rather basic training programme with a bit of determination to bl00dy well finish!

+1. 'Fail to prepare, prepare to fail'. Start the training programme for next year's sportives now No substitute for mileage, unfortunately....!!! And just because you've mothballed the Kharma doesn't mean you have to give up on doing sportives in the rest of the year- what about the New Forest one in October, for example? I did the Spring one on my Cadenza (Viner was out of action, hadn't got the Squadra then), and in a sense it was more fun, not less, doing it on a 12.5 kg folding hybrid than the Viner would have been. No pressure to keep up with roadies, no shame to be overtaken, and a broad grin when I passed someone who punctured (the joy of tough tyres!). I was actually slower on the Meon one with the Squadra :oops: . The SCR's more than up to the job, even more so with F5s.

DonDaddyD

Bassjunkieuk wrote:

@DDD - If you want to improve the climbing you could always MAKE damn sure you'll get better and sign up for a nice hilly sportive in the North/South Downs area. I'm sure Evans ran a hilly sportive that started from near Gatwick.

Heck my whole cycling "season" this year started when I signed up for the full Magnficat all the way back in January and just threw myself at a rather basic training programme with a bit of determination to bl00dy well finish!

My season is over which means I go back into training for next years sportives. Hopefully, I will confident enough to have a whole schedule of them. 200miles a week isn't bad to begin with.

Stuaff,

How about these:

Easton EA90 SL

Reynolds Solitude

jonginge

These are awesome:
http://www.merlincycles.co.uk/Bike+Shop ... s_1492.htm

Low spoke count, though, so shed some weight over the winter and use as your climbing hoops next season...

stuaff

DonDaddyD wrote:

Bassjunkieuk wrote:

@DDD - If you want to improve the climbing you could always MAKE damn sure you'll get better and sign up for a nice hilly sportive in the North/South Downs area. I'm sure Evans ran a hilly sportive that started from near Gatwick.

Heck my whole cycling "season" this year started when I signed up for the full Magnficat all the way back in January and just threw myself at a rather basic training programme with a bit of determination to bl00dy well finish!

My season is over which means I go back into training for next years sportives. Hopefully, I will confident enough to have a whole schedule of them. 200miles a week isn't bad to begin with.

Stuaff,

How about these:

Easton EA90 SL

Reynolds Solitude

Pass, they should both do you fine I think. Specs look very similar to F3/Zonda, so if it's between those, looks/feel etc are going to be key. CRC have the EA90SLs for £384 right now, btw...
If it was me, the DAs would be tempting.....

stuaff

DonDaddyD wrote:

200miles a week isn't bad to begin with

Bit of an understatement......!!!!

desweller

Rolf F wrote:

DesWeller wrote:

Sod the Fulcrums. Get these: http://www.planet-x-bikes.co.uk/i/q/WPPXCAR70082101/planet-x-pro-carbon-82-101--wheelset-700c

They weigh more than the wheels he's already got on the bike.......

Aye but they're low drag. He lives in London. There Are No Hills.

biondino

DDD, I'm sorry, but you're forgetting:

70g lighter than the Zero is the Fulcrum Racing Speed - 1360g, on sale at Wiggle for £1,350

35g lighter than the Speed is the Fulcrum Racing Speed XLR - 1325g, on sale at Wiggle for £1,980

DonDaddyD

I'm not ready for Racing Speed or Racing Speed XLR

itboffin

So alrighty then, here you go ...

Shimano R500 wheelset @ £68
http://www.ribblecycles.co.uk/sp/road-t ... HIMWHFR200

Conti hard-bastard-shell tyres 25c rear / 23c front @ £24 each
http://www.parker-international.co.uk/1 ... -Tyre.html

Campag Xenon 10 speed shifters with cables @ £53 (yes they'll work perfectly with a mixed Shimano wheel and mechs)
http://www.ribblecycles.co.uk/sp/road-t ... 0000000000

total = £169 + delivery

Replacement BBB jockey wheels @ £10

DonDaddyD

Thanks!

What are Gatorskins like in the wet. Reason I swear by 4seasons for commuting despite the expense is because they offer the same levels of grip in the wet as GP4000s and are hard bastard shell tyres.