What makes hardtails so much fun?!
Comments
-
Like any of this thread is a sensible argument?bike-a-swan wrote::roll:
Now there's a sensible argument.0 -
yeehaamcgee wrote:It's funny how in Motocross, or Rallying the discussion of "suspension or no suspension" never comes up.
i do wonder why folk think they need sus on the front of their bikes but there is no need for it on the back :?0 -
Subjective is the whole of this thread really lol.
You say people have never tried a decent full susser - have you tired a decent HT though? No offence, but the Summer Season and p7 are heavy, fairly basic steel which I wouldn't touch with a bargepole.0 -
bike-a-swan wrote::roll:
Now there's a sensible argument.
the internet is hardly the place for any sensible argument surely.0 -
I don't know, I like to think it could be from time to time.Rock Lobster 853, Trek 1200 and a very old, tired and loved Apollo Javelin.0
-
yeehaamcgee wrote:It's funny how in Motocross, or Rallying the discussion of "suspension or no suspension" never comes up.
You may have noticed the lack of engine on a push bike and the fact that a push bike is ever so slightly lighter?0 -
sheepsteeth wrote:supersonic wrote:How much do people think we have to pay then to get a 'decent' full susser? Say for allround XC use, dare I say it, a trail bike?
decent is subjective i suppose but id rather ride a 1000 quid fs bike than any ht worth twice as much, but thats all to do with the fact that i cant abide ht bikes, lord knows ive tried my best to see what the fuss is.
mind you, ive never ridden a truly light ht bike, im led to believe they are ace fun but i dont fancy it, i think they would feel unweildly and un forgiving especially with my 19 odd stone heft pummelling through it.
and in that one statement....you have revealed your true reason for thinking full sussers are better....its just because you think they are better.....and thats fine.
Personally...I have both (I know...the problems of the bourgeoise..its pure gallus). I love my hardtail...I also love my full susser...one is not better than the other. They are just different.
I still say that someone who spouts on about how something that they have is so much better than the thing they really want but can't have because they can't afford it...has issues.Whenever I see an adult on a bicycle, I believe in the future of the human race.
H.G. Wells.0 -
supersonic wrote:Subjective is the whole of this thread really lol.
You say people have never tried a decent full susser - have you tired a decent HT though? No offence, but the Summer Season and p7 are heavy, fairly basic steel which I wouldn't touch with a bargepole.
i have already stated:
"mind you, ive never ridden a truly light ht bike, im led to believe they are ace fun but i dont fancy it, i think they would feel unweildly and un forgiving especially with my 19 odd stone heft pummelling through it."
the ht bikes i owned were well specced and great fun for a short while, they werent light admitedly but i was never looking for a 100mm race whippet type bike. i was after bikes which suited my enomous hulk bashing along on top of them. i want the same from my fs bikes but i enjoy riding them a whole lot more.0 -
Thing is you can get light tough bikes nowadays. The Zaskar is a tough xc bike that will happily take 130mm up front. The OnOne 456 Carbon and Ti too, the latter winning allsorts of awards. Then the Ragley MMMBop. All these are sub 4lbs.
Lightweight need not mean racy bred xc bikes anymore. I think you could get a 25lbs do it all bike that will take your weight. But it will cost... oh, the money argument again LOL.
On the same wavelength I want to try more full sussers out, and want a long test on a DW bike as a i love the thought gone in it. Simialrly the Spark and Genius.
But doesn't mean you will like it of course. If you like FS more, then no one can say that is not the perfect bike for you.
I will keep an open mind, but the HTs seem to suit me best at the minute.0 -
sheepsteeth wrote:yet these people still refuse to buy a proper bike.
"Proper" bikes are fully rigid surely?
0 -
nickfrog wrote:yeehaamcgee wrote:It's funny how in Motocross, or Rallying the discussion of "suspension or no suspension" never comes up.
You may have noticed the lack of engine on a push bike and the fact that a push bike is ever so slightly lighter?
No it's not. He's got an FS remember!
Joke0 -
On the DW link, I'd love to try one long term, but it seems it's (like most suspension designs) still just another original way of avoiding patent infringements.
It's the exact same background concept as Marin/Whyte's quad link, but with the pivots in different locations.0 -
so sonic, how much do you reckon a sub25lb 130mm forked ht would cost?0
-
sheepsteeth wrote:so sonic, how much do you reckon a sub25lb 130mm forked ht would cost?
Damn, I've got my Boardman's forks at 120mm. Close, but no cigar. Apparently the Pro HTs are now £850. Plus you could get a 10% discount due to who your wife works for. So that's £765.
If you don't mind 120mm, and if the 09 bikes have the spacer in the forks.0 -
It's a silly argument, but it makes a point, in a really round about kind of way.bails87 wrote:
No it's not. He's got an FS remember!nickfrog wrote:
You may have noticed the lack of engine on a push bike and the fact that a push bike is ever so slightly lighter?yeehaamcgee wrote:It's funny how in Motocross, or Rallying the discussion of "suspension or no suspension" never comes up.
If no suspension was "better" then motorized vehicles would be making more use of rigid chassis.
I have more than enough power to muscle a heavy duty full suss up a hill. Why would I compromise and use a hardtail full time?0 -
Dunno, will have to tot it up lol.
There has been short link 4 bars for a while, the Schwinn Rocket was one of the first if I remember, but has totally different anti squat characteristics to the DW. That is what DW patented I believe.0 -
yeehaamcgee wrote:
It's a silly argument, but it makes a point, in a really round about kind of way.bails87 wrote:
No it's not. He's got an FS remember!nickfrog wrote:
You may have noticed the lack of engine on a push bike and the fact that a push bike is ever so slightly lighter?yeehaamcgee wrote:It's funny how in Motocross, or Rallying the discussion of "suspension or no suspension" never comes up.
If no suspension was "better" then motorized vehicles would be making more use of rigid chassis.
I have more than enough power to muscle a heavy duty full suss up a hill. Why would I compromise and use a hardtail full time?
I was joking yeehaa. You really think I'd genuinely suggest that your bike weighs as much as a rally car.
Edit: nevermind.0 -
sheepsteeth wrote:so sonic, how much do you reckon a sub25lb 130mm forked ht would cost?
as a reference...the 17" 2010 Orange crush is reportedy just over 26lb's, has a 140mm fork and retails at £1100.Whenever I see an adult on a bicycle, I believe in the future of the human race.
H.G. Wells.0 -
NOW what are you on about?bails87 wrote:yeehaamcgee wrote:
It's a silly argument, but it makes a point, in a really round about kind of way.bails87 wrote:
No it's not. He's got an FS remember!nickfrog wrote:
You may have noticed the lack of engine on a push bike and the fact that a push bike is ever so slightly lighter?yeehaamcgee wrote:It's funny how in Motocross, or Rallying the discussion of "suspension or no suspension" never comes up.
If no suspension was "better" then motorized vehicles would be making more use of rigid chassis.
I have more than enough power to muscle a heavy duty full suss up a hill. Why would I compromise and use a hardtail full time?
I was joking yeehaa. You really think I'd genuinely suggest that your bike weighs as much as a rally car.
Edit: nevermind.
Sweet zombie jesus, you're a moron.0 -
sheepsteeth wrote:supersonic wrote:How much do people think we have to pay then to get a 'decent' full susser? Say for allround XC use, dare I say it, a trail bike?
decent is subjective i suppose but id rather ride a 1000 quid fs bike than any ht worth twice as much, but thats all to do with the fact that i cant abide ht bikes, lord knows ive tried my best to see what the fuss is.
mind you, ive never ridden a truly light ht bike, im led to believe they are ace fun but i dont fancy it, i think they would feel unweildly and un forgiving especially with my 19 odd stone heft pummelling through it.
I get it. FS is only better for you because you're a fatty bum bum. I now understand your sweeping statements against HT and your repeated but absurd claims that they're only used by people who can't afford FS. Clearly you can't afford to ride a HT for risk of bending it, unlike average sized people. Pathetic but quite amusing though. Thanks for the laugh.0 -
Some people like fs's. They ride fs's.
Some people like ht's. They ride ht's.
Some people like both. They ride both.
Some people like neither. They are ghey and fat.
get over it. basic facts of life people.0 -
I'm not convinced the particular anti squat theory is unique though. In fact, none of the claims of DWlink seem original.supersonic wrote:There has been short link 4 bars for a while, the Schwinn Rocket was one of the first if I remember, but has totally different anti squat characteristics to the DW. That is what DW patented I believe.
Each design is a balancing act of different effects, and each bike design will work better for certain rider weights and riding positions.
I mentioned the Whyte design primarily because it to achieves very similar feedback and progression curves to the DW system.0 -
He was the first to specifically mention in a patent levels of dropping anti squat through the travel, as far as I know [and he claims this].
I'll graph you the curves of some designed so you can see the difference. But as you say, what works best has a lot to do with the rider.0 -
First to specifically mention in a patent doesn't mean a lot in the real world these days, sadly. But I can see why he's done it. If he hadn't then someone else would have, and he'd have to pay a fee to use his own design :roll:
I mean, Specialized patented a link they never designed. Audi do it all the time.
It's become a matter of great concern in the states apparently, when people decide to patent things just because nobody else has, to extract as much money from things as possible.0 -
sheepsteeth wrote:nickfrog wrote:i'm poor and jealous
so it seems.
LOL. Jealous of a fatso who lives in a sh!thole? Again, thanks for the laugh.
0 -
i love it when discerning forum members can spot a wind up a trillion miles off. 8) 0
-
I like mountain bikes. They are good. They are better than road bikes. But I quite like road bikes too.Closet jockey wheel pimp whore.0
-
I used to ride hardtail mountain bike, but after a while started doing a lot more city riding where I can't even imagine riding anything but a rigid frame.0
-
Of course, I am not adverse to FS... or Orange
0
