santa cruz bit of a mystery?

Anonymous

we're not telling you NOT to buy a SC bike. We're just discussing the whys and wherefores of warranties. It's the SC fanboys who've jumped in with the defensive stance.

milfredo

karen44 wrote:

milfredo looks like you have been shafted twice then lol!

Now you are contradicting yourself.

mattyboy199

my 11year old mk1 chameleon is solid as a rock, although a little heavy compared to modern day bikes it never needed a warranty un-breakable, its bullet proof !

Mark_K

I was looking to buy a full sus 29er and the SC tallboy was top of the list BUT it was a fairly new model/design and i wasn't confident that the 2 year warranty would cover any faults that may show up in later use! Seeing as i have had many Treks in the past and had a few frame/swinging arm faults replaced under their warranty without any problems at all i opted for the Garry Fisher Superfly more money but this is a one off buy with some inheritance money so i just cant afford to splash a big wad of cash on a bike that may fail in a few years only to be told ahh yer sorry bout that it's going to cost you £xxxx to replace it now !!!!
So in short yer the warranty swayed me on my buy and i guess I'll keep buying Trek because they do great bikes i trust ! Ohh and looking at some of the SC fanboys replies to this topic i don't think i would have been welcomed to their little exclusive club anyhow :P

x-isle

Bignige wrote:

Craggers wrote:

...Kia cars come with 7 year warranties FFS, do you think that means they're better quality than an Audi or Jaguar which come with 3 year warranties as standard?

Errr...actually in Jaguars case yes, Kia are waaaay more reliable !!!!!!! :shock:

He said quality not reliability! :P

mackie1

The difference in cars is that it's all about perceived quality. This is something VAG are very good at even if the car isn't actually as reliable as a modern Hyundai or Kia.

santacrews

Well,

I,ve just read the whole thread !!!!!
If you want WARRANTY then do what i did when i bought a CANNONDALE ! SNAPANDFAIL you will love these MO FO's i had a Gemini back in about 94 ?
Ride the Peaks and Wharncliffe with one of these and youre LBS will loathe you forever !
By the time i had finished snapping frames they had to have rear swing arms coated to match the front triangle and vice versa..................

SPECIALIZED ! SPECIALNEEDZ oh what a warranty they provide ! Rear swing arm heaven 7 in less than 12 Months ! two front triangles ! but if you like warranties GO PLAY
Me personally i would rather be out riding !

SANTA CRUZ ! :roll:
4 year old Bullit, Countless peaks rides, endless trips to Wharncliffe ! and every trail centre in the UK, DH at Hamsterley Inners, Fort William, Les Gets Morzine........ Theres not a lot ive not done on this little bike, Not one fault, no cracks and NO snapping swing arms, no shock mountings letting go and NO DAYS MISSED RIDING MY BIKE !

I've ordered a BUTCHER from Stif ! its due in about now, i dont want Warranty and replacement frames i want what most people on here are failing to grasp !

What i dont want is to tell the blokes i ride with i cant ride again this week cos my frames still not been replaced ! Ive been there its SH!T !

I do hope you Warranty Obsessed people never experience the absolute frustration i had to endure !
:evil:

capoz77

Concur lifetime warranties are great if the frame quality is so bad you've got to constantly RMA it for repair/replace!

Give me a bulletproof frame with no warranty anyday over a 100 year warrantied frame of fail!

Penylope

when you read Marins warranty though it is not quite the 'lifetime warranty of joy' that it first appears.

.

Additional Limited Lifetime Frame Warranty from ATB Sales Ltd
Bikes registered for Platinum Care will automatically extend the cover to a limited lifetime warranty, again covering defects in materials and workmanship.
The above limited lifetime frame warranty is for the original owner only and must be regularly serviced and well maintained.
Depending on the frame materials used and the frame technology involved the Additional Limited Lifetime Frame Warranty works in one of 2 ways.
For all rigid aluminium frames constructed from 6000 and 7000 series alloys, the Warranty covers 100% of the replacement frame value, whatever the age of the bike.
All other frame styles, built using exotic alloys or composites, or featuring suspension systems are at the sharp end of our line and subject to a relentless development programme, which can make supplying an original equivalent difficult. Therefore, these frames are covered by a different Limited Lifetime Trade‐up Frame Warranty, allowing us to supply the original owner with an equivalent, more contemporary product, in the event that an original replacement is not available.
The Additional Limited Lifetime Trade‐up Frame Warranty works on a sliding scale.
Age Value subsidised by Marin UK
Up to 3 years 100% of equivalent replacement frame SRP
Up to 5 years 75% of equivalent replacement frame SRP
Up to 10 years 50% of equivalent replacement frame SRP
Over 10 years 25% of equivalent replacement frame SRP
Any payment due from the original owner will be made directly to the Marin Warranty Trade‐up scheme. Delivery and labour are not covered by this warranty. All claims need to be made through an authorised Marin dealer.

So it would appear that the cheaper end of their range is covered by a lifetime warranty (makes sense, cheap to maufacture/replace) but the more exotic bikes (alloy/carbon and full sus frames) are covered by a trade up scheme because your specific model may have changed since you bought it (again,makes sense, cutting edge designs can change year on year).

BUT, you only get a 100% equivalent replacement for the first 3 years of the bikes life (on the more expensive models), after that it becomes in effect a subsidised replacement, whereby you chip in a percentage against retail price (which increases as time goes on). You do however get lifetime bearing replacement on full sus frames.

milfredo

Penylope wrote:

BUT, you only get a 100% equivalent replacement for the first 3 years of the bikes life (on the more expensive models), after that it becomes in effect a subsidised replacement, whereby you chip in a percentage against retail price (which increases as time goes on). You do however get lifetime bearing replacement on full sus frames.

This sounds remarkably like SC but you get an extra year - not all that ground breaking. SC bearings are covered for life and repairs to frames past warenty date are offered at a discounted rate.

Anonymous

That makes sense, but is very different to my experience with Marin. I broke a swingarm in a bad crash, when the bike was about 5 or 6 years old, and had a newer singarm fitted with no hassle. I even told them it had been damaged in a crash, but they didn't want proof of ownership or anything.

milfredo

I'm sure there would be cases of the same happening at SC.

meesterbond

As I said before - a good reputation for customer service is worth a load more than a lifetime warranty (which will always be limited in some way) from a company who will attempt to get out of it...

Anonymous

meesterbond wrote:

As I said before - a good reputation for customer service is worth a load more than a lifetime warranty (which will always be limited in some way) from a company who will attempt to get out of it...

Definitely true.

homers_double

SC would have (and did the first time around) warrantied my bearings, but quite franky the ones they supply have similar internals to a tub of humous so I gladly sort my own replacements.

From a business point of view lifetime warranties are a pile of crap, yes you lot playing on your toys might like it but how many times do you see "i crashed into a wall and am going to blag a frame off X" type threads?

I'm fine with my out-of-warranty frame as I know its built well and will withstand eveything I'm capable of throwing at it.

karen44

santacrews you are a bullshitter 7 broken swingarms in 12 months pull the other one! what were you jumping off a multi storey car park in those 12 months you had the bike. get real!

mcj78

karen44 - why so angry, don't people have a right to buy/ride whatever they like, regardless of the warranty?

Northwind

yeehaamcgee wrote:

That makes sense, but is very different to my experience with Marin. I broke a swingarm in a bad crash, when the bike was about 5 or 6 years old, and had a newer singarm fitted with no hassle. I even told them it had been damaged in a crash, but they didn't want proof of ownership or anything.

You're happy with Marin because they go beyond their warranty. So are the Santa Cruz guys Doesn't seem to be that much difference after all.

palerider

whatever! all you santa cruz haters.

ive had no problem with there warranty policy, i bought a second hand mk1 blur lt and snapped the rear suspension linkage which wore a hole into the seatpost tube. i took it to my lbs (santa cruz dealer) who spoke to santa cruz and without a reciept i was offered a new front triangle for free or a complete new frame for £200. I took the brand new frame offer and have just recently sold it for double the money and bought a new blt2.

warranty seems alright to me, whats your problem.?

and if it goes after two years (which i doubt it will) i will buy another.

santacrews

Karen thanks for your Bold scathing comment !

Bike Rider YES ! Bullshitter Erm NO !

4 cracked seam welds and 3 direct FAILS ! No not multi storey car parks but i can throw a bike about a bit and have been known to do a few miles in between breaking bikes !

I average 130 miles a week all off road ! its up to you ! call me a bullshitter........
But i,d beg to differ ! i,m sorry you find it difficult to embrace reality maybe you should try riding more and stop making assumptions on people based solely on your own experiences !

supersonic

What model of Specialized was it?

capoz77

karen44 wrote:

bullshit, trust me i have been to the far eastern factories and seen the quality first hand, the spesh and trek full sus bike range is the best value for money on the planet! i rest my case.

KAREN GO AND BUY A SPESH OR TREK AND DO US ALL A FAVOUR!
[/b]

Anonymous

sigh, there are no santa cruz haters here. We're just discussing the merits or lack of of warranties.
You really must have some seriosu insecurity issues, claiming that everyone is hating you, and brandishing your "boutique" frames around like some kind of dick extension.

Northwind

I rate this thread an F. Minus.

karen44

so palerider you paid £200 for a santa cruz frame and yet the retail value on some santa cruz frames is £2000 with a 2 year warranty you did very well but this backs my point up perfectly the consumer is being shafted for a boutique piece of jewellery with a crap warranty, i rest my case.

Penylope

To be fair i think all manufacturer warranties are much the same, maybe 3 years for one, 2 years for another, but once you get down to the small print they all have a 'limited' policy and with certain clauses that the owner must comply with (e.g. marin say that you should have your bike serviced every 6 months by your main dealer, also that any lightwheight handlebars MUST be replaced every 2 years :shock: ).
It is entirely down to their own discretion as to weather they honour the warranty (they would be perfectly within their rights to ask for proof of regular servicing, proof of purchase etc) and refuse if you couldn't produce any.

Its only recently that SC have started offering lifetime warranty on bearings for full sus frames (probably only because Marin/other big manufacturers have, not because they have any more confidence in the bearings themselves )

Northwind

karen44 wrote:

the consumer is being shafted for a boutique piece of jewellery with a crap warranty, i rest my case.

Not a particularily good case, you pay for stuff besides warranties. The SC one isn't particularily crap, just not generous, you don't hear many people moaning about Orange like I mentioned earlier in the thread.

Personally I'd sooner have a bike that's less likely to break than have a great warranty, even the best warranties are still a total pain in the balls when you have to make use of them. That's where Marin win twice I reckon since the bikes are rock solid and the warranty's also good, but you just don't see a lot of people needing the SC warranty.

Bottom line for me is that a 2 year and a lifetime warranty amount to the same thing if you never need it. I'd sooner have a Heckler or a Wolf Ridge with no warranty than something weaker with an amazing warranty that you need to use every 6 months.

Penylope

The current shape Heckler had an issue with the swingarm on the first few batches i believe, something to do with cracks around the pivot point on the swingarm. SC isolated the problem, redesigned the swingarm and replaced current rear ends without any problems (hastle if you already had one admitedly ) now if you buy a 2010 frame they have the new swingarm on.

Knowing this already i still ordered a Heckler, i like living dangerously :twisted: :P

RevellRider

FAO everyone BUT karen44

santacrews

Supersonic,

it was a 2005 ENDURO SX TRAIL with the split seat stay,
I didnt mention earlier but i also kinked the downtube near where the shock mounting point was !