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santa cruz bit of a mystery?

karen44karen44 Posts: 21
edited July 2010 in MTB general
why all the rage about santa cruz bikes if they are as good as what the bike industry claim then why do they only give a 2 year warranty on the frame? and when you consider that you can get a full suspension bike for less than the cost of a santa cruz frame alone the mind boggles as to why anyone would want to buy one of their frames? specialized trek cannondale back their warranty up with a lifetime guarantee on their frames.
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  • supersonicsupersonic Posts: 82,708 Lives Here
    Is that all frames are select ones?
  • karen44karen44 Posts: 21
    on all of their frames according to stiff cycles.
  • capoz77capoz77 Posts: 503
    edited June 2010
    I've ridden every brand under the sun in my quest for the perfect do it all bike.

    I settled on the Heckler,

    lifetime warranty on the bearings, not sure about the frame.

    "why all the rage about santa cruz bike"

    well for me i've yet to find a bike which flows as well, nails the trails so well, is at home on all terrain, i'd say Santa Cruz have every reason to get praised!
  • cat_with_no_tailcat_with_no_tail Posts: 12,981
    You'd think someone who owns one would know how to spell Santa Cruz. Especially after quoting it in the same post :lol:
  • GHillGHill Posts: 2,402
    They suffer from foreign boutique brand pricing in the UK. In the US Santa Cruz aren't much more expensive than the big brands.

    This doesn't excuse the warranty, which is two years in the US too.
  • Dick ScruttockDick Scruttock Posts: 2,533
    I love my Santa Cruz bikes :lol: So much so a LTc will be arriving soon.
  • NorthwindNorthwind Posts: 14,675
    2 years isn't an unreasonable warranty period, sure others do more but it's not unrealistic. It's all you get from Orange for the Blood, ST4 and Alpine, and the Five gives you only 3, just to give one close competitor's details.
    Uncompromising extremist
  • richg1979richg1979 Posts: 1,087
    im sure anta cruz would be quite helpfull if one of there frames broke through defective matirials ect and not crashed within the first few years.

    if one of there frames snapped in half after 2 1/2 years im sure they would sort somthing out.
  • weescottweescott Posts: 453
    Santacruz look after thier customers. They have a crash replacement scheme where if you break the frame after warranty is up they will replace it at cost price. £300 for a Heckler front triangle back in 2005.

    They can also afford to be more expensive as they are a tried and tested brand. Look at all the recent DH wins in recent years. The bikes win a lot of awards in various bike mags. You have to pay for quality. ;)
  • CraggersCraggers Posts: 185
    If you judge the quality of a bike by the length of warranty it comes with then you're gonna miss out on some real MTB masterpieces....

    ...Kia cars come with 7 year warranties FFS, do you think that means they're better quality than an Audi or Jaguar which come with 3 year warranties as standard?
  • karen44karen44 Posts: 21
    so craggers you would be happy to pay around £3000 for a santa cruz and then if the frame breaks after two years due to a manufacturing defect you havent a leg to stand on! i have known cannondales treks and specialized frames to crack after 15 years and you still get a brand new frame but obviously not many folk keep a bike that long anyway but if the frames are that good why only a 2 year warranty against a manufacturing defect,
  • capoz77capoz77 Posts: 503
    Karen if your not happy about it, why not look at a different brand of bike frame?

    for the millions of Santa Cruz owners it probably didn't even cross their mind
  • weescottweescott Posts: 453
    For a frame to break after 2 years of use it won't be a manufacturing defect unless you maybe bought it for nipping down to the shops on. In which case you should have bought a Trek anyway.


    Seriously, you are comparing warranties of a small company with some of the biggest in the business. And even then it's not unheard of for SC to replace frames well outside of warranty.
  • BignigeBignige Posts: 223
    Craggers wrote:
    ...Kia cars come with 7 year warranties FFS, do you think that means they're better quality than an Audi or Jaguar which come with 3 year warranties as standard?

    Errr...actually in Jaguars case yes, Kia are waaaay more reliable !!!!!!! :shock:
    Ride it like you stole it.........Yeah Baby!!!

    2008 Spesh Enduro SL Expert
    2010 Fuji Roubaix 1.0 Ltd Edition
  • jonnyc2420jonnyc2420 Posts: 557
    this is mine - taken today - a Santa Cruz Bullit - 10 years old and as sweet now as it was when it came out of the box - can't fault it for build or quality. has been a hardcore downhill rig as well as an all day trail rocket..........
    iphonepics1023.jpg
    Falcon Sierra - 80's
    Muddy Fox Courier - 80's
    GT Palomar 90's
    GT Zaskar LE - 90's
    Cannondale k v 900 90's
    Santa Cruz Bullit - now
    Orange Evo 8 STOLEN 26/09/10
    Orange P7 Pro
    Lots of kites.
  • AnonymousAnonymous Posts: 79,667
    weescott wrote:
    Seriously, you are comparing warranties of a small company with some of the biggest in the business.
    Not quite so. Marin are also one of the small players in the grand scheme of things, and they honour their lifetime warranty.

    I'm not saying they're likely to fail, but only having a 2 year warranty would definitely raise my curiosity as to why there's a time limit.
  • weescottweescott Posts: 453
    Good point. I always wondered what a lifetime warranty actually meant. Lifetime of the frame or the original user?

    I remember a pal who broke his Litespeed Sewanee frame (within warrantee), he told them what sort of riding he did "black grade XC Scottish trails" and they said the frame wasn't designed for that sort of riding. :shock: They still replaced the frame but my point is that manufacturers have different takes on warranties.
  • AnonymousAnonymous Posts: 79,667
    True, it varies. I know I got a swingarm replaced replaced no questions asked when it was broken in a bad crash though. They never even bothered asking if I was the original owner.
  • NorthwindNorthwind Posts: 14,675
    weescott wrote:
    For a frame to break after 2 years of use it won't be a manufacturing defect unless you maybe bought it for nipping down to the shops on.

    Exactly... Unless of course you leave it in a cupboard for 2 years before you ride it, but y'know, that's weird.
    Uncompromising extremist
  • P-JayP-Jay Posts: 1,478
    I'm not convinced..

    My mate got a crack on the front triangle of of Nomand frame (LBS notcied it) just before his 2 year warranty was up. LBS did all the talking with SC and after a bit of a push they agreed to change it. His frame had to be sent to them before they'd move, once it arrvied they OK'd the warranty, but because the model had changed they wanted him to pay for a whole new rear end as his wouldn't fit, can't remember the exact cost but is was a lot of money!

    They finally backed down, after a lot of calls from the LBS, but then only offered frames in really unpopular colours, unless he wanted to upgrade to an Ano frame for an extra couple of hundred.

    I was pretty disapointed, they sell a premium product that people have rightly said that cost the same for a frame as a lot of comparible full builds and it's fair to say that the cost of materials and manufacture are only a fraction of the R&D and Marketing costs of each bike, they should have been more flexible than they were.
  • paul.skibumpaul.skibum Posts: 4,068
    Sure - a manufacturing defect leading to an inherent flaw and weakness in the frame will show up pretty damn quick - the old bathtub failure rate graph. You don't need a lifetime warranty for a bike frame, you just need to know its covered at the start of its life in case it has a flaw in it.

    My Heckler is a 2001 and rides beautifully. It could do with a new rear shock but that's not really a fault of SC!
    Closet jockey wheel pimp censored .
  • AnonymousAnonymous Posts: 79,667
    But if someone honestly believes their frames are tough enough, why NOT offer a lifetime warranty?
  • monkeypantsmonkeypants Posts: 150
    They're still a small company, it's just too expensive for them to offer lifetime warranties. Name a similarly small bike company that will back you up for the same length of time as the big players.
  • AnonymousAnonymous Posts: 79,667
    Marin. Again. :roll:
  • lawmanlawman Posts: 6,868
    They're still a small company, it's just too expensive for them to offer lifetime warranties. Name a similarly small bike company that will back you up for the same length of time as the big players.

    ibis are suposidly great with their warrenty
  • njee20njee20 Posts: 9,613
    Marin are not on the same scale as Santa Cruz, they're knocking out some cheap bikes in volume, whilst SC remain solely a high end frame company.

    Titus was absolutely atrocious when it came to a warranty claim on my bent Racer X frame. To be honest I'd never buy another one because of it, and I was on the Titus UK racing team before it all went wrong, they really did screw up!

    Whilst not being 'boutique' a Trek/Specialized/Scott/Giant at least has very dependable after care, it won't take months to reach a resolution!
  • NorthwindNorthwind Posts: 14,675
    But if someone honestly believes their frames are tough enough, why NOT offer a lifetime warranty?

    Very good point. But then the exact same criticism goes to plenty of other manufacturers, it's not a Santa Cruz thing. Totally agree though
    Uncompromising extremist
  • AnonymousAnonymous Posts: 79,667
    njee20 wrote:
    Marin are not on the same scale as Santa Cruz, they're knocking out some cheap bikes in volume, whilst SC remain solely a high end frame company.
    Still a tiny company in the grand scheme of things though. Hell they even let Whtye design their bikes for them :lol:
  • If they sold them with a lifetime warranty would they ever sell any new ones?

    I've got a SC and I didn't take any notice of the warranty when I bought it - I figured if it's up to standard, it wont break. If there was a known design flaw, it would have to be replaced anyway. Any breakage would probably be down to me and wouldn't be covered.

    Warranties are quite often not worth the paper they are written on because companies always look for a get out clause. If I'd had a frame for 15 years, I wouldn't expect a replacement, any damage over that time would be caused by wear and tear surely?

    Really something I'm not bothered about - unless there was no warrenty at all, then I might be a bit worried! :D
  • AnonymousAnonymous Posts: 79,667
    If they sold them with a lifetime warranty would they ever sell any new ones?
    Well, the other manufacturers, who DO ofer a lifetime warranty do alright.

    I just see a two year warranty as a lack of faith on the manufacturer's behalf. If a frame fails due to fatigue after 4 years or so, then you're screwed. If you have a lifetime warrantied frame then there's no problem (provided the terms of that manufacturer's warranty of course!)
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