OT what X-mas present do you want?

jonginge

Il Principe wrote:

Stuey01 wrote:

I want a Garmin 705 road package. But at 29 I'm a bit old for presents from parents and the gf and I have set ourselves a limit of £50 each so we don't go and blow silly money on each other.

Think I'm gonna have to buy the Garmin myself... or a new snowboard... decisions decisions.

Both. I've always wanted to take the Garmin skiing but completely forgot when I had the opportunity. It'd be very cool to have a GPS log of a days skiing, and v interesting to see some of the speeds achieved.

It would be very cool. The new garmin 500 is a much handier size...

Eau Rouge

lost_in_thought wrote:

[
Navigate by? Well sort of, but the only feature of the watch needed for that is the time. And most watches have that.

Remember we're talking the dim and distant past here, before transistors and the like.

wikipedia wrote:

One slide rule remaining in daily use around the world is the E6B. This is a circular slide rule first created in the 1930s for aircraft pilots to help with dead reckoning. With the aid of scales printed on the frame it also helps with such miscellaneous tasks as converting time, distance, speed, and temperature values, compass errors, and calculating fuel use. The so-called "prayer wheel" is still available in flight shops, and remains widely used. While GPS has reduced the use of dead reckoning for aerial navigation, and handheld calculators have taken over many of its functions, the E6B remains widely used as a primary or backup device and the majority of flight schools demand that their students have some degree of its mastery.

In 1952, Swiss watch company Breitling introduced a pilot's wristwatch with an integrated circular slide rule specialized for flight calculations: the Breitling Navitimer. The Navitimer circular rule, referred to by Breitling as a "navigation computer", featured airspeed, rate/time of climb/descent, flight time, distance, and fuel consumption functions, as well as kilometer–nautical mile and gallon–liter fuel amount conversion functions.

Stuey01

Il Principe wrote:

Stuey01 wrote:

I want a Garmin 705 road package. But at 29 I'm a bit old for presents from parents and the gf and I have set ourselves a limit of £50 each so we don't go and blow silly money on each other.

Think I'm gonna have to buy the Garmin myself... or a new snowboard... decisions decisions.

Both. I've always wanted to take the Garmin skiing but completely forgot when I had the opportunity. It'd be very cool to have a GPS log of a days skiing, and v interesting to see some of the speeds achieved.

It would be cool. As I already have a perfectly good snowboard that would only necessitate purchase of the garmin. Doesn't stop me wanting a new board though...

If I get offered VR tomorrow i might celebrate by buying myself one or t'other.

lost_in_thought

Eau Rouge wrote:

lost_in_thought wrote:

[
Navigate by? Well sort of, but the only feature of the watch needed for that is the time. And most watches have that.

Remember we're talking the dim and distant past here, before transistors and the like.

wikipedia wrote:

One slide rule remaining in daily use around the world is the E6B. This is a circular slide rule first created in the 1930s for aircraft pilots to help with dead reckoning. With the aid of scales printed on the frame it also helps with such miscellaneous tasks as converting time, distance, speed, and temperature values, compass errors, and calculating fuel use. The so-called "prayer wheel" is still available in flight shops, and remains widely used. While GPS has reduced the use of dead reckoning for aerial navigation, and handheld calculators have taken over many of its functions, the E6B remains widely used as a primary or backup device and the majority of flight schools demand that their students have some degree of its mastery.

In 1952, Swiss watch company Breitling introduced a pilot's wristwatch with an integrated circular slide rule specialized for flight calculations: the Breitling Navitimer. The Navitimer circular rule, referred to by Breitling as a "navigation computer", featured airspeed, rate/time of climb/descent, flight time, distance, and fuel consumption functions, as well as kilometer–nautical mile and gallon–liter fuel amount conversion functions.

I'm familiar with vintage aviation...

A slide rule is used for ground planning, prior to departure, you wouldn't see any pilot getting out the slide rule en-route, they need to fly the plane, and a slide rule proper is always going to be more useful than one on a watch. I'd be interested to see how that worked.

Navigation was (and is) done with a line on a map (which you put there after doing your workings with a slide rule), a compass, and a watch. Maintain heading for a specific time, and you should theoretically get where you were going. That's where the map comes in.

Even in the '30s aircraft had airspeed indicators and altimeters, and the rest of the Breitling's functions you really ought to know before you set off on your flight.

Eau Rouge

lost_in_thought wrote:

Eau Rouge wrote:

lost_in_thought wrote:

[
Navigate by? Well sort of, but the only feature of the watch needed for that is the time. And most watches have that.

Remember we're talking the dim and distant past here, before transistors and the like.

wikipedia wrote:

One slide rule remaining in daily use around the world is the E6B. This is a circular slide rule first created in the 1930s for aircraft pilots to help with dead reckoning. With the aid of scales printed on the frame it also helps with such miscellaneous tasks as converting time, distance, speed, and temperature values, compass errors, and calculating fuel use. The so-called "prayer wheel" is still available in flight shops, and remains widely used. While GPS has reduced the use of dead reckoning for aerial navigation, and handheld calculators have taken over many of its functions, the E6B remains widely used as a primary or backup device and the majority of flight schools demand that their students have some degree of its mastery.

In 1952, Swiss watch company Breitling introduced a pilot's wristwatch with an integrated circular slide rule specialized for flight calculations: the Breitling Navitimer. The Navitimer circular rule, referred to by Breitling as a "navigation computer", featured airspeed, rate/time of climb/descent, flight time, distance, and fuel consumption functions, as well as kilometer–nautical mile and gallon–liter fuel amount conversion functions.

I'm familiar with vintage aviation...

A slide rule is used for ground planning, prior to departure, you wouldn't see any pilot getting out the slide rule en-route, they need to fly the plane, and a slide rule proper is always going to be more useful than one on a watch. I'd be interested to see how that worked.

Navigation was (and is) done with a line on a map (which you put there after doing your workings with a slide rule), a compass, and a watch. Maintain heading for a specific time, and you should theoretically get where you were going. That's where the map comes in.

Even in the '30s aircraft had airspeed indicators and altimeters, and the rest of the Breitling's functions you really ought to know before you set off on your flight.

You're ruining my romantic notion of the past here with your knowledge and common sense.
That romatic notion of the past has it that these watches were essential to fly vintage aircraft/fly to the moon/be a '00' MI6 agent and so by having such a watch I must have the same spirit of adventure and superior ability as the romantic view of the pilots/astronauts/spies who would have done anything for a watch like this.
Deep down I know it all nonsense, but I don't need people with actual experience of the real things coming along and telling me it is.

What about a sudden need to change destination and course while your in flight....you'd need to recalculate, but you've left you slide rule back at the airport cause you didn't think you'd need it again. Lucky you have a pilot's watch, eh?

(Air Forces did still isuue watches to air crew around WW2, but they were the direct opposite of these Breitling's, they were plain timepieces with clear, easy to read dials and no fancy functions, because, as you say, they didn't need to be anything more)

il_principe

Eau Rouge wrote:

You've sort of hit the whole point of the watch though. There was a time when a pilot needed a good watch to navigate by, and if it can help with a bunch of other stuff too, all the better because they hadn't got around to building it into the planes yet.
Mechanical watches in general are a throwback too, more about nostalgia than telling the time. £5 Casio's have done that perfectly well since the 70's.
So, if having a mechanical watch is a throwback to the past, it may as well be a throwback to the time when a watch that did all these extra things would actually have been useful.

Exactly, basically it comes down to whether you'd prefer this:



Or this:




Horses for courses.

lost_in_thought

Eau Rouge wrote:

You're ruining my romantic notion of the past here with your knowledge and common sense.
That romatic notion of the past has it that these watches were essential to fly vintage aircraft/fly to the moon/be a '00' MI6 agent and so by having such a watch I must have the same spirit of adventure and superior ability as the romantic view of the pilots/astronauts/spies who would have done anything for a watch like this.
Deep down I know it all nonsense, but I don't need people with actual experience of the real things coming along and telling me it is.

What about a sudden need to change destination and course while your in flight....you'd need to recalculate, but you've left you slide rule back at the airport cause you didn't think you'd need it again. Lucky you have a pilot's watch, eh?

(Air Forces did still isuue watches to air crew around WW2, but they were the direct opposite of these Breitling's, they were plain timepieces with clear, easy to read dials and no fancy functions, because, as you say, they didn't need to be anything more)

Sorry about that

All you need is the time, time elapsed can be handy too, but pilots are taught to navigate with a normal, basic watch.

My mother, for example, uses a casio digital watch very similar to the one IP posted, as do many others. The ones with the little dials are dismissed as being too hard to see at a glance.

Oh and if you had to re-route mid-flight you sure wouldn't use a slide rule!

DonDaddyD

OK, on watches.

The thing about a chronometer, which all Breitlings are, is this. It is tested under various conditions over a number of days that include but not limited to tempreture, pressure and position. The watch must maintain a time having lost or gained only a slight varience for it to pass this test.

Once passed the watch will then be certificated as a chronometer.

A standard digital watch like a Casio, while functionally more accurate than an automatic/mechanical watch will not withstand tempreture and pressure changes as well as a automaticmechanical watch can. Therefore under extreme conditions a digital watch will become prone to loosing or gaining time more so than a automatic/mechanical watch.

It is not the case that a automatic/mechanical watches are built for nostalgic reasons, and this playing a heavy part in their cost. It is not utterly the case that a digital watch is the best kind of watch. It is very dependant on the use of said watch. I.e. most (if not all) divers watches are automatic/mechanical for reason. Or as a better example, if James took his Planet Ocean (god i love that watch) and I took my G-shock and decided to skinny dip 300meters down, despite my G-shock being marketed as robust, only the Omega would be coming back.

To back this up Breitling do have a digital chronometer, one of the few, known as Superquartz. Along with all the extra and robust stuff to make the watch durable it has to have an extra microchip to make the watch compensate for siad changes that could effect the electrical functions and digital display.

I know you lot are talking about aviation but a little information won't hurt. The rationale also still apples.

Edit: I'm not sure if it is necessary to have or even beneficial to have a chronograph on a chronometer. But making sure that the measurement of time is accurate is important and usually those needing that level of time measurement (usually on a professional level), would find use from a chronograph - so the makers determined. Incidentally a digital watch usually does all the chronograph functions i.e. dual time, stop watch countdown timer.

Edit +2: I'll find the white paper... :P

Fireblade96

Stuey01 wrote:

Il Principe wrote:

Stuey01 wrote:

I want a Garmin 705 road package. But at 29 I'm a bit old for presents from parents and the gf and I have set ourselves a limit of £50 each so we don't go and blow silly money on each other.

Think I'm gonna have to buy the Garmin myself... or a new snowboard... decisions decisions.

Both. I've always wanted to take the Garmin skiing but completely forgot when I had the opportunity. It'd be very cool to have a GPS log of a days skiing, and v interesting to see some of the speeds achieved.

It would be cool. As I already have a perfectly good snowboard that would only necessitate purchase of the garmin. Doesn't stop me wanting a new board though...

If I get offered VR tomorrow i might celebrate by buying myself one or t'other.

I took my old GArmin GPS snowboarding last year, kinda thinking that it would be cool to look at the ascent/descent per day and all that.
Bugg*r that idea...it's a speedo. It got used to measure highest speeds, and passed around members of the group to see who could get the highest. The challenge was to at least beat your age in mph.

I tied for fastest snowboard at 39.6 mph. Gotta do better this year :-)

biondino

I just strap a lump of caesium to my wrist and count the hyperfine transitions.

biondino

DonDaddyD wrote:

OK, on watches.

The thing about a chronometer, which all Breitlings are, is this. It is tested under various conditions over a number of days that include but not limited to tempreture, pressure and position. The watch must maintain a time having lost or gained only a slight varience for it to pass this test.

Once passed the watch will then be certificated as a chronometer.

A standard digital watch like a Casio, while functionally more accurate than an automatic/mechanical watch will not withstand tempreture and pressure changes as well as a automaticmechanical watch can. Therefore under extreme conditions a digital watch will become prone to loosing or gaining time more so than a automatic/mechanical watch.

It is not the case that a automatic/mechanical watches are built for nostalgic reasons, and this playing a heavy part in their cost. It is not utterly the case that a digital watch is the best kind of watch. It is very dependant on the use of said watch. I.e. most (if not all) divers watches are automatic/mechanical for reason. Or as a better example, if James took his Planet Ocean (god i love that watch) and I took my G-shock and decided to skinny dip 300meters down, despite my G-shock being marketed as robust, only the Omega would be coming back.

To back this up Breitling do have a digital chronometer, one of the few, known as Superquartz. Along with all the extra and robust stuff to make the watch durable it has to have an extra microchip to make the watch compensate for siad changes that could effect the electrical functions and digital display.

I know you lot are talking about aviation but a little information won't hurt. The rationale also still apples.

Edit: I'm not sure if it is necessary to have or even beneficial to have a chronograph on a chronometer. But making sure that the measurement of time is accurate is important and usually those needing that level of time measurement (usually on a professional level), would find use from a chronograph - so the makers determined. Incidentally a digital watch usually does all the chronograph functions i.e. dual time, stop watch countdown timer.

Edit +2: I'll find the white paper... :P

Last time I went even remotely off topic in your thread you chose that as an excuse to ignore everything I'd written. Please consider yourself ignored

biondino

Stuey01 wrote:

I want a Garmin 705 road package. But at 29 I'm a bit old for presents from parents

WHAT?!? NEVER!!!!1!11

DonDaddyD

biondino wrote:

Last time I went even remotely off topic in your thread you chose that as an excuse to ignore everything I'd written. Please consider yourself ignored

So you're telling me that you're going to ignore me? :roll:

Are you my girlfriend? Or at the very least, female... :shock: