First Crash folks, serious leasons learned

Pross

This has to be my favourite ever gripe:-

Now I don’t care what nationality he was, he could have been another diehard Geordie for all I care. This guy came off as a complete ponce, and for a Doctor, who couldn’t even put his own chain on, didn’t ask if I was ok and had a tiny little scuff on his arm bandaged for him, is what is winding me up, that and all the hateful posts aimed at me.

I hadn't realised cycle mechanic training was an essential to becoming a doctor. Personally I'd sacrifice my GP, who may well be able to put a chain back on his bike, for a doctor who could adequately diagnose a serious illness. Maybe no-one had made him crash and lose his chain before so he didn't have experience of putting it back on.

I think the phrase "when in a hole stop digging" may have been invented for the OP as the latest version of events sounds worse than the original post!

redddraggon

Pross wrote:

This has to be my favourite ever gripe:-

Now I don’t care what nationality he was, he could have been another diehard Geordie for all I care. This guy came off as a complete ponce, and for a Doctor, who couldn’t even put his own chain on, didn’t ask if I was ok and had a tiny little scuff on his arm bandaged for him, is what is winding me up, that and all the hateful posts aimed at me.

I hadn't realised cycle mechanic training was an essential to becoming a doctor. Personally I'd sacrifice my GP, who may well be able to put a chain back on his bike, for a doctor who could adequately diagnose a serious illness. Maybe no-one had made him crash and lose his chain before so he didn't have experience of putting it back on.

I think the phrase "when in a hole stop digging" may have been invented for the OP as the latest version of events sounds worse than the original post!

To be honest a "doctor" should know how basic stuff work. If they can't comprehend a simple device, how can they cope with a complex device like a human body? A human is a machine after all. Getting a female to put a chain back on your bike for you, sounds like a pr!ck to me.

Sheptastic

I think Flanker might just be regretting starting this thread now..

Pross

Does that mean you would expect someone with an understanding of complex mechanics to be able to fix a person Not saying the guy wasn't a pr!ck though - just that the relevance of him being a doctor unable to put a chain on is about the same as him being Indian.

redddraggon

Pross wrote:

Does that mean you would expect someone with an understanding of complex mechanics to be able to fix a person Not saying the guy wasn't a pr!ck though - just that the relevance of him being a doctor unable to put a chain on is about the same as him being Indian.

Putting a chain on is not complex mechanics though, it's basic.

salsarider79

He may also as said before not have lost his chain before. Or he may have been going to work, or anything.
We don't know if he knew how to put his chain on (It may be basic to you, but not everyone's going to know how), or wether he asked if someone could help him. If he was a doctor think about that. Would you want a doctor examing you with oil stained hands?

redddraggon

salsarider79 wrote:

Would you want a doctor examing you with oil stained hands?

If he was doctor one would hope he'd give his hands a good wash, whether or not they had oil on them.

disquieting_museeuws

Possibly the guy that Flanker hit was in a bit of shock, especially as a 'non-cyclist' taken by surprise and out of his normal comfort zone - that may be why he stood around not saying anything much. And the 'after-you-Claude' both turning the same way to avoid each other thing just happens on cyclepaths from time to time - it shouldn't in theory but it's just one of life's mysteries, and you learn after a while to plan an exit route if the worst happens and you come face to face.

careful

I am ashamed to admit that I hadnt read the original post carefully enough to notice the racist reference to the fact that the other guy was Indian. I was more concerned about Flanker 37s injuries. It does seem that racism is everywhere - one reply proclaimed that "BTW I am white - as though that makes it some way more credible. I am grateful though that even on a humble cycling forum there are people who are vigilant enough, and who have a the moral compass to correct the transgressions of others.

Chip \'oyler

careful wrote:

I am ashamed to admit that I hadnt read the original post carefully enough to notice the racist reference to the fact that the other guy was Indian. I was more concerned about Flanker 37s injuries. It does seem that racism is everywhere - one reply proclaimed that "BTW I am white - as though that makes it some way more credible. I am grateful though that even on a humble cycling forum there are people who are vigilant enough, and who have a the moral compass to correct the transgressions of others.

That was my comment and it was meant to be sarcastic :roll:

Percy Vera

Mothyman wrote:

...when I first read the post I pictured the author in a stetson with spurs on....
:roll:

how about we ask the author exactly what he meant...

Me too!
And I thought the OP mentioned it because he was surprised he was on a bike and not on a horse!

deptfordmarmoset

I fear there may be a joke about cowboys and indians approaching....

John C.

Look at the title. Serious lessons learnt.

I think they have been . Let's move on.

mfin

The discussion as to whether the original post is racist going on for pages and pages is absolutely incredible!!! At very most, anyone who thought it was racist should have just tutted and rolled their eyes.

No-one's gonna change the world by arguing so much over one person mentioning 'he was indian btw', its hardly strong stuff... or maybe it is, maybe you should all petition the forum to have him barred for being abusive and racist??? Oh no, that wouldn't work cos the moderators would probably have looked at it too and had the common sense not to be so 'put-out' by it.

Is it really that offensive that it warrants this kind of reaction?? Whilst I AGREE its wrong to be prejudiced the over-reaction in this case is mental... you can think its wrong but how the hell you can be offended so much by it when you're not indian yourself is beyond me, its more like 'oh boo-hooo, I just read something that might have offended someone else'.

Bet most of you lot might not stop in the street to defend someone of colour if someone was hurling real abuse at them when it might be an effort or risk for you to do something about it, but.... when it comes to a tiny questionable bit of wording thats NOT even aimed directly at an individual you all go off like a pan-full of popcorn.

fungus_the_muffin_man

It could've been worse at least he didn't call him a p*ki.

The problem with the OP is whether he thinks he is or not, like many people I know, he's racist by ignorance not by spite/ hateful behaviour.
He probably still goes to the chinky for his chippy etc etc......

People like him need to have the error of their ways pointed out. But you lot have hung drawn and quartered the poor guy. Some of you need to get a grip FFS!

guinea

Not sure if you're racist? Do the test.

https://implicit.harvard.edu/implicit/

I've done two, the first showed no difference between light and darker skinned people. However, the second suggested I have a slight automatic preference for white people over black people.

knedlicky

Flanker37 wrote:

Just before the closed the ambulance doors I … apologized to the Indian chap for hitting him … I’m still the victim

Perhaps you should have apologised earlier, not just when about to leave?

And in assigning fault, it matters less that the bloke you ploughed down was on the same side of the path as you, what counts more is that you lost control and thus caused the collision.

You can think yourself lucky you didn’t plough down someone who ended up less shaken or less meek, some burley ruffian like Byker used to have some of, or you or your bike might have had had more damage.

redddraggon wrote:

Getting a female to put a chain back on your bike for you, sounds like a pr!ck to me.

Surely in such circumstances everyone should help each other.

I also think with your remark you may be doing a disservice to the woman (a) anyway, and (b) since, unlike some, she’s capable of not crashing when descending a path covered with wet leaves.

Fungus The Muffin Man wrote:

The problem with the OP is whether he thinks he is or not, like many people I know, he's racist by ignorance not by spite/ hateful behaviour.
People like him need to have the error of their ways pointed out. But you lot have hung drawn and quartered the poor guy. Some of you need to get a grip FFS!

Tend to agree with this, but the OP is so full of self-pity/self-righteousness he probably deserved a roasting about something.

fungus_the_muffin_man

He's full of self pity as he's gettng none elsewhere due to his comment. He's obviously going to get defensive. If people had been easier on him instead of going for the throat. Perhaps this whole thread could've ended pages ago with one more better educated person in he world.

Instead keyboard warriors have used this as an excuse to puff up their "I'm morally better than you" ego's.

mfin

Fungus The Muffin Man wrote:

If people had been easier on him instead of going for the throat. Perhaps this whole thread could've ended pages ago with one more better educated person in he world.

Absolutely dead on.

alfablue

Fungus The Muffin Man wrote:

It could've been worse at least he didn't call him a p*ki.

The problem with the OP is whether he thinks he is or not, like many people I know, he's racist by ignorance not by spite/ hateful behaviour.
He probably still goes to the chinky for his chippy etc etc......

People like him need to have the error of their ways pointed out. But you lot have hung drawn and quartered the poor guy. Some of you need to get a grip FFS!

I agree he is probably not a malicious racist, however it is this form of unwitting racism that is most insidious and harder to rectify. The message has to come out loud and clear that this is unacceptable, and even if the individual intends no harm, it does indeed cause harm. The OP has been reluctant (or unable) to see the error of his ways, so the thread has continued - it is his very "deafness" to the issue that suggests he hasn't learned. He certainly hasn't been hung, drawn and quartered, merely been told in straight forward terms that he is wrong by a number of posters. If you feel that he has suffered too much by a little constructive feedback on this thread, consider the cumulative suffering that someone of an ethnic minority suffers in our society where they suffer such "unwitting" discrimination on a daily basis, for all of their lives - no contest.

fungus_the_muffin_man

alfablue wrote:

Fungus The Muffin Man wrote:

It could've been worse at least he didn't call him a p*ki.

The problem with the OP is whether he thinks he is or not, like many people I know, he's racist by ignorance not by spite/ hateful behaviour.
He probably still goes to the chinky for his chippy etc etc......

People like him need to have the error of their ways pointed out. But you lot have hung drawn and quartered the poor guy. Some of you need to get a grip FFS!

I agree he is probably not a malicious racist, however it is this form of unwitting racism that is most insidious and harder to rectify. The message has to come out loud and clear that this is unacceptable, and even if the individual intends no harm, it does indeed cause harm. The OP has been reluctant (or unable) to see the error of his ways, so the thread has continued - it is his very "deafness" to the issue that suggests he hasn't learned. He certainly hasn't been hung, drawn and quartered, merely been told in straight forward terms that he is wrong by a number of posters. If you feel that he has suffered too much by a little constructive feedback on this thread, consider the cumulative suffering that someone of an ethnic minority suffers in our society where they suffer such "unwitting" discrimination on a daily basis, for all of their lives - no contest.

We agree on some points but there are ways of doing things and the way most on here have gone about it is wrong IMO.
I also don't believe that that his form of rascism is harder to rectify. If posters on here had used a decently given interlectual reasoning to the OP instaed of just screaming RASCIST! at him he may have seen the error of his ways. I have used this approach many times against people like him with success on most occasions straight away. Without needing to raise my voice or castigate the person it's aimed at.
His deafness over the issue has come about due to the nature of evryone ganging up on him, quite aggressively in some posts. This kind of attack will make him defensive and more likely to not take in whats being said to him.
Also how can you judge the suffering of others? As suffering is a very subjective matter. The character assassinationof the OP by posters on here could have an affect on the OP. But thats ok as the suffering he has had to be submitted to is less than those you insinuate to? Thats the most ludicrous thing I've ever heard. Since when has suffering ever been a contest?

cee

meh...i was gonna say how i was reading some really interesting stuff about cuturalism, racism, a sense of other and human nature.....

however I fear this is not what this thread is about.

hope your arms and legs heal mucker...

erm...advice on disc brakes.....if they lock up...release them a wee bit...

Anonymous

mfin wrote:

The discussion as to whether the original post is racist going on for pages and pages is absolutely incredible!!! At very most, anyone who thought it was racist should have just tutted and rolled their eyes.

No-one's gonna change the world by arguing so much over one person mentioning 'he was indian btw', its hardly strong stuff... or maybe it is, maybe you should all petition the forum to have him barred for being abusive and racist??? Oh no, that wouldn't work cos the moderators would probably have looked at it too and had the common sense not to be so 'put-out' by it.

Is it really that offensive that it warrants this kind of reaction?? Whilst I AGREE its wrong to be prejudiced the over-reaction in this case is mental... you can think its wrong but how the hell you can be offended so much by it when you're not indian yourself is beyond me, its more like 'oh boo-hooo, I just read something that might have offended someone else'.

Bet most of you lot might not stop in the street to defend someone of colour if someone was hurling real abuse at them when it might be an effort or risk for you to do something about it, but.... when it comes to a tiny questionable bit of wording thats NOT even aimed directly at an individual you all go off like a pan-full of popcorn.

OOh get you, telling us all off in a very similar stylee, who are you, my dad? :roll:

rake

volvicspar

See Bompingtons new thread

mfin

dmclite wrote:

mfin wrote:

The discussion as to whether the original post is racist going on for pages and pages is absolutely incredible!!! At very most, anyone who thought it was racist should have just tutted and rolled their eyes.

No-one's gonna change the world by arguing so much over one person mentioning 'he was indian btw', its hardly strong stuff... or maybe it is, maybe you should all petition the forum to have him barred for being abusive and racist??? Oh no, that wouldn't work cos the moderators would probably have looked at it too and had the common sense not to be so 'put-out' by it.

Is it really that offensive that it warrants this kind of reaction?? Whilst I AGREE its wrong to be prejudiced the over-reaction in this case is mental... you can think its wrong but how the hell you can be offended so much by it when you're not indian yourself is beyond me, its more like 'oh boo-hooo, I just read something that might have offended someone else'.

Bet most of you lot might not stop in the street to defend someone of colour if someone was hurling real abuse at them when it might be an effort or risk for you to do something about it, but.... when it comes to a tiny questionable bit of wording thats NOT even aimed directly at an individual you all go off like a pan-full of popcorn.

OOh get you, telling us all off in a very similar stylee, who are you, my dad? :roll:

Might be, DNA test?? ...tis all a bit Daily Mail reader though to me, getting all offended on a race issue when what's been said could just wash over anyone with a raise of the eyebrows at most. I thought the bloke got a harsh reaction, and like another guy said on here, no-one sat down and chose to constructively ask him to consider 'whether he thought he should have written what he'd written' they just labelled him and wanted to take him to bits for it ...and for who's benefit? ...Indian people, I don't think so.

Anonymous

mfin wrote:

dmclite wrote:

mfin wrote:

The discussion as to whether the original post is racist going on for pages and pages is absolutely incredible!!! At very most, anyone who thought it was racist should have just tutted and rolled their eyes.

No-one's gonna change the world by arguing so much over one person mentioning 'he was indian btw', its hardly strong stuff... or maybe it is, maybe you should all petition the forum to have him barred for being abusive and racist??? Oh no, that wouldn't work cos the moderators would probably have looked at it too and had the common sense not to be so 'put-out' by it.

Is it really that offensive that it warrants this kind of reaction?? Whilst I AGREE its wrong to be prejudiced the over-reaction in this case is mental... you can think its wrong but how the hell you can be offended so much by it when you're not indian yourself is beyond me, its more like 'oh boo-hooo, I just read something that might have offended someone else'.

Bet most of you lot might not stop in the street to defend someone of colour if someone was hurling real abuse at them when it might be an effort or risk for you to do something about it, but.... when it comes to a tiny questionable bit of wording thats NOT even aimed directly at an individual you all go off like a pan-full of popcorn.

OOh get you, telling us all off in a very similar stylee, who are you, my dad? :roll:

Might be, DNA test?? ...tis all a bit Daily Mail reader though to me, getting all offended on a race issue when what's been said could just wash over anyone with a raise of the eyebrows at most. I thought the bloke got a harsh reaction, and like another guy said on here, no-one sat down and chose to constructively ask him to consider 'whether he thought he should have written what he'd written' they just labelled him and wanted to take him to bits for it ...and for who's benefit? ...Indian people, I don't think so.

Maybe just raising eyebrows isnt enough nowadays. Maybe if less eyebrows were raised and nothing said, no ones ignorance would be highlighted.

alfablue

Fungus The Muffin Man wrote:

alfablue wrote:

Fungus The Muffin Man wrote:

It could've been worse at least he didn't call him a p*ki.

The problem with the OP is whether he thinks he is or not, like many people I know, he's racist by ignorance not by spite/ hateful behaviour.
He probably still goes to the chinky for his chippy etc etc......

People like him need to have the error of their ways pointed out. But you lot have hung drawn and quartered the poor guy. Some of you need to get a grip FFS!

I agree he is probably not a malicious racist, however it is this form of unwitting racism that is most insidious and harder to rectify. The message has to come out loud and clear that this is unacceptable, and even if the individual intends no harm, it does indeed cause harm. The OP has been reluctant (or unable) to see the error of his ways, so the thread has continued - it is his very "deafness" to the issue that suggests he hasn't learned. He certainly hasn't been hung, drawn and quartered, merely been told in straight forward terms that he is wrong by a number of posters. If you feel that he has suffered too much by a little constructive feedback on this thread, consider the cumulative suffering that someone of an ethnic minority suffers in our society where they suffer such "unwitting" discrimination on a daily basis, for all of their lives - no contest.

We agree on some points but there are ways of doing things and the way most on here have gone about it is wrong IMO.
I also don't believe that that his form of rascism is harder to rectify. If posters on here had used a decently given interlectual reasoning to the OP instaed of just screaming RASCIST! at him he may have seen the error of his ways. I have used this approach many times against people like him with success on most occasions straight away. Without needing to raise my voice or castigate the person it's aimed at.
His deafness over the issue has come about due to the nature of evryone ganging up on him, quite aggressively in some posts. This kind of attack will make him defensive and more likely to not take in whats being said to him.
Also how can you judge the suffering of others? As suffering is a very subjective matter. The character assassinationof the OP by posters on here could have an affect on the OP. But thats ok as the suffering he has had to be submitted to is less than those you insinuate to? Thats the most ludicrous thing I've ever heard. Since when has suffering ever been a contest?

I don't really understand your point here, maybe it is just the way it is phrased. The point I was making about suffering is that in the scheme of things, millions of people suffer daily discrimination such as the OP has contributed to, and therefore I am not going to shed any tears for his potential suffering at being told some home truths on an internet forum. (i.e. he causes others to suffer, and also brought his own suffering upon himself in doing so - seems like justice to me).

Of course you are right that suffering is subjective, however it is reasonable and necessary to anticipate the suffering of others sometimes, this is called empathy (likewise you have probably not suffered birthing pain / traumatic amputation / anything else you care to mention, but you know it's going to hurt).

I think those defending the OP are going over the top - the attitudes held and expressed by him are part of the problem of racism in this country - if you are not part of the solution you are part of the problem, to quote someone . . .

mfin

I for one am not defending what the OP said in the slightest... I think it's completely wrong, just can't see how the abrasive attacks on him can be the best way to educate him (or whatever is trying to be achieved?) that's all. When's the last time anyone here was called 'ignorant' for example and then thought to think more deeply about the topic concerned rather than just feeling like they're on the end of some aggression? just all seems so negative to me.

alfablue

mfin wrote:

I for one am not defending what the OP said in the slightest... I think it's completely wrong, just can't see how the abrasive attacks on him can be the best way to educate him (or whatever is trying to be achieved?) that's all. When's the last time anyone here was called 'ignorant' for example and then thought to think more deeply about the topic concerned rather than just feeling like they're on the end of some aggression? just all seems so negative to me.

An analogy - mum tells you nicely, the oven is hot, don't touch it! You still touch it. Oven burns your fingers, you don't touch it again! I don't think we should be hugging the OP to our motherly bosums and saying "its all right sweetheart, mummy knows you didn't mean it". Pussy footing doesn't work, especially with those lacking basic social sensitivities.