BNP
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Always Tyred wrote:The policy has recently changed.
Do you think their beliefs have? Are you THAT naive?
I'd say the policy wording has changed, but since Nick Griffin said people identified by the BNP as non British (which includes people born in Britain) should be dropped out of a plane somewhere over Africa if it couldn't work out where to send them back to I don't think the policy has.0 -
PARIS75 wrote:
Doog442?“New York has the haircuts, London has the trousers, but Belfast has the reason!0 -
Yes you are right.pastryboy wrote:Always Tyred wrote:
or actually, if the £1million figure is nearer the mark, about 0.001%.
*Sigh*
The figure of £1m referred to a single trust.
Don't actually check your facts before making a post - 'it is surprisingly common'.
Mind you, I read more carefully.
Here are some quotes:
"Over the last three months, the number of patients identified as ineligible is 17," says Ian O'Connor, its director of finance.
"The cost of this treatment over that period is £32,000."
With an annual budget of £100m, this figure is practically negligible."
(I make that about 0.13%)
"There are pockets of places where the extra burden on the services has been quite significant," she says.
"Certain ministers seem to want to highlight this issue from time to time, usually when there is another story that they don't want to hit the news," he says.
Professor Maynard believes ministers should ask themselves if the policy is worthwhile.
"What we need is much better data and evaluation of whether it is worthwhile going to extraordinary lengths to pursue marginal amounts of money.
Margaret Lally, deputy chief executive of the Refugee Council, has accused ministers of acting irresponsibly over the issue.
"We think it is dangerous and irresponsible nonsense.
"The government is using figures which are inaccurate and have been poorly thought through.
"It may result in asylum seekers being denied the healthcare they need and also demonising them in the eyes of the public and also in the health community.
Why don't you get all upset about white collar tax evasion instead? Much bigger pots of money there I would have thought. No theiving foreigners, I'm afraid, though.0 -
Always Tyred wrote:
yes there are lots jumping out of lorries on a daily basis down here on the south coast....its a FACT
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I got treated for free in Tobago. The ambulance driver even stopped off at his mate's shop and bought me a can of coke.prj45 wrote:PARIS75 wrote:but its not free to UK residents...
Nonsense, within Europe it is.
You get sick in Poland and as long as you filled out your forms you'll get treated.0 -
PARIS75 wrote:Always Tyred wrote:
yes there are lots jumping out of lorries on a daily basis down here on the south coast....its a FACT
I'm right, aren't I?
Paris 75, joined October 13th is the one and only Doog 442. Banned 9th October
[Perry Mason] Isn't it true? Isn't it all true? [/Perry Mason]“New York has the haircuts, London has the trousers, but Belfast has the reason!0 -
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Doog was banned? What for?0
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Always Tyred wrote:Doog was banned? What for?
Being a troll probably?
Just read the other thread = the 3 feet one
You spotted him first. Damn“New York has the haircuts, London has the trousers, but Belfast has the reason!0 -
Nothing wrong with being a troll, as long as you are funny.WheezyMcChubby wrote:
Being a troll probably?Always Tyred wrote:Doog was banned? What for?
Just read the other thread = the 3 feet one
You spotted him first. Damn
He was very subtle, but I'm wearing my psychic underpants and devined his presence.0 -
Always Tyred wrote:
Nothing wrong with being a troll, as long as you are funny.WheezyMcChubby wrote:
Being a troll probably?Always Tyred wrote:Doog was banned? What for?
Just read the other thread = the 3 feet one
You spotted him first. Damn
He was very subtle, but I'm wearing my psychic underpants and devined his presence.
I miss him
Maybe he'll come back“New York has the haircuts, London has the trousers, but Belfast has the reason!0 -
We have NI card and passports/driving licenses with photos - show them once and job done.
Other posts - I don't disagree with anything you said. Again you're assuming I support the BNP and everything they stand for rather than what I actually said which is that they have some reasonable policies. Griffin wouldn't have been elected as an MEP if they had nothing that appealed to lots of people (to balance out all the stuff that doesn't appeal to people, like his face).prj45 wrote:PARIS75 wrote:but its not free to UK residents...
Nonsense, within Europe it is.
You get sick in Poland and as long as you filled out your forms you'll get treated.
There's no guarantee you would get what's free on the NHS free in Poland therefore you can be liable for some costs.
Let's not confuse health tourists who go somewhere for planned treatment with people who find themselves needing care on an emergency basis. You can't just nip on a plane and get an operation or a course of medication which is what was happening here.Always Tyred wrote:
Why don't you get all upset about white collar tax evasion instead? Much bigger pots of money there I would have thought. No theiving foreigners, I'm afraid, though.
How do you know I don't? - never came up in the thread. assumptions again.
On that note - good night bikeradar.0 -
no chance 0
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pastryboy wrote:Again you're assuming I support the BNP and everything they stand for rather than what I actually said which is that they have some reasonable policies.
You can possibly understand that saying that a "political" party with a clearly racist membership policy, links to far right militant groups (Combat 18 et al), a leader who was once in the National Front, a founder who was clearly a BIG fan of Hitler has some sensible policies really galls me.
Would you say Hitler had some sensible policies? Or the Aparthied government of South Africa, or Robert Mugabe?0 -
a rather good condensed version of his question time showboating
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_QAvkFS_cgkLe Cannon [98 Cannondale M400] [FCN: 8]
The Mad Monkey [2013 Hoy 003] [FCN: 4]0 -
Dropping out of this thread now. Politics, the best way to spoil everthing.
Douglas Adams had all right ideas you know. Basically, if you want to be a politician then you want to do it for the wrong reasons. Laters. '11 Cannondale Synapse 105CD - FCN 4
'11 Schwinn Corvette - FCN 15?
'09 Pitch Comp - FCN (why bother?) 11
'07 DewDeluxe (Bent up after being run over) - FCN 80 -
prj45 wrote:pastryboy wrote:Again you're assuming I support the BNP and everything they stand for rather than what I actually said which is that they have some reasonable policies.
You can possibly understand that saying that a "political" party with a clearly racist membership policy, links to far right militant groups (Combat 18 et al), a leader who was once in the National Front, a founder who was clearly a BIG fan of Hitler has some sensible policies really galls me.
Would you say Hitler had some sensible policies? Or the Aparthied government of South Africa, or Robert Mugabe?
All you need is a valid point in order to get people to listen... Indoctrination. That's how they get you. That's how Hitler got support (alongside other means) and how the Al Qaeda do it. Muslims aren't born hating the west, there are aspects some may non't like or agree with that may be valid (when compared to their own cultural practices) and that's what the Al Qaeda feed on into indroctinating (a very small number of) Muslims into hating the west completely and absolutely. It's what I can see the BNP doing.
With that in mind I'm going to go out on a limb here...
The BNP does have, in principle and on a very shallow surface, a valid point. They need to in order to be a legitimate party. Immigration, Europe, Euro et al does need to be addressed.
What is sick and vile is how they would implement those policies.
It is their intentions and 'proposed implementation' that should have been challenged on Question Time to expose the moronic racists that they are instead of merely throwing accusations and cheap insults at Nick Griffin.
To the lay person (well mostly the brainless) what the BNP is selling on a surface layer makes sense - Sh!t is does to me and I'm black. It is issues that Labour wouldn't address. Of those that raised concerns on these issues they were branded prejudice at best and racist at worst by a Government intollerant of anything marginally politically right of center and completely unwilling to address the public's concerns.
Now the real racists are out - who don't really care being branded racists - and speaking up about issues that aren't overly racist and people are listening while overlooking the deeper rooted hatred within the party. By the time those willing to (or ignorant enough to) listen to the BNP get to the racist stuff they're so far pre-programmed into the BNP way of thinking that they are susceptible into accepting the 'racist' stuff.
If the BNP had a more charismatic leader (say with a Blair or Cameron type persona) I'd be even more worried.Food Chain number = 4
A true scalp is not only overtaking someone but leaving them stopped at a set of lights. As you, who have clearly beaten the lights, pummels nothing but the open air ahead. ~ 'DondaddyD'. Player of the Unspoken Game0 -
Immigration like race is a emotive issue and one that is hyped to be more than it is.
mainly Immigration is on the down and emigration is on the up.
uk is very much a sea of white, some 90+ % to the best of my knowledge not a single london borough is any thing but a majority of white.
yet pub talk and daily hate etc would paint a quite differnet picture. It frankly is a non issue but then I'm a white male so would say that!0 -
roger merriman wrote:Immigration like race is a emotive issue and one that is hyped to be more than it is.
mainly Immigration is on the down and emigration is on the up.
uk is very much a sea of white, some 90+ % to the best of my knowledge not a single london borough is any thing but a majority of white.
yet pub talk and daily hate etc would paint a quite differnet picture. It frankly is a non issue but then I'm a white male so would say that!
Hi Roger!
I think the issue with immigration is now beyond mere ethnicity. I mean of course the BNP want to keep Britain white, but equally they want Britain filled with only white Britsh people and no white, black Asain or any other ethnicities from other countries.
My personal issues with immigration/emigration and/or migration (and whatever other 'grations') isn't with people who want to live in other countries legally and honestly*. It is with those that choose to do so illegally and at the expense (often through crime) of the citizens living in the Country.
*I do think that if you choose to live in another country you should at least learn to understand and respect the culture of the Country you're living in. This doesn't mean that those choosing to live in other Countries must lose their own Cultural identity. I am both blessed with English/British and Caribbean culture and can freely swap between the two.Food Chain number = 4
A true scalp is not only overtaking someone but leaving them stopped at a set of lights. As you, who have clearly beaten the lights, pummels nothing but the open air ahead. ~ 'DondaddyD'. Player of the Unspoken Game0 -
DDD wrote:I do think that if you choose to live in another country you should at least learn to understand and respect the culture of the Country you're living in.
What, all immigrants must immediately love the country, even the bits that are crap?
Would an immigrant for instance not be able to criticise the amount of taxpayer money the queen receives, or have to keep schtum about the expenses scandal becuase it shows many of our MPs in a bad light?0 -
Some really good points made by Alyways Tyred above, the immigration thing is emotive but its blown out of all proportion by the right wing press. Essentially, they don't like people who aren't like them (they even hate cyclists) and will whip up as many scare stories as they can so eventually it seeps into the national sub-conscious, and people start thinking: "You know what, I don't like the BNP but there are big issues with immigration" and it ends up being an accepted "fact". My personal view is that there are perhaps a few specific areas where the immigration process hasn't been properly managed but that on the whole the benefits immigrants bring to our society MASSIVELY outweigh any detriment they cause.0
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alfablue wrote:I don't want to live in a country that will tolerate racist policies as long as policies on schools, the economy, health etc are credible. IMHO the racism is an instant disqualification, the fact that their party may or may not have some other policies that are credible is an irrelevance.
I am late to the party (no pun intended) but this is the clearest thing written so far. They could borrow 99% of their policies from [insert favoured political party of your choice] and the 1% of batsh!t hate-filled lunacy would mean it's not even worth considering arguing with them in any context.0 -
petejuk wrote:I agree with most here that the policies of the BNP are dispicable and I would summise that there is a good cross section of society posting on this topic. The questions of who voted for them and why still haven't been answered. Aside from a few fascist, racist bigots there were a number of other people who must have voted BNP. This should send alarm bells ringing throughout government.
I believe that this is an indication that something in society is broken and no one has seen their way to fixing it. Only when the politicians of the major parties immerse themselves in the issues of the BNP voting electorate will they understand what possessed them to make a vote of desperation.
+100. Nail, head, hit.0 -
biondino wrote:alfablue wrote:I don't want to live in a country that will tolerate racist policies as long as policies on schools, the economy, health etc are credible. IMHO the racism is an instant disqualification, the fact that their party may or may not have some other policies that are credible is an irrelevance.
I am late to the party (no pun intended) but this is the clearest thing written so far. They could borrow 99% of their policies from [insert favoured political party of your choice] and the 1% of batsh!t hate-filled lunacy would mean it's not even worth considering arguing with them in any context.
Agree - it's like asking Hitler what he'd do about unsightly wheely bins - and they'd probably be more than happy to lie about almost everything anyway - and be populist - so let's just cut to the chase eh?0 -
Its not a mystery. Simply, never over estimate the intelligence and/or never underestimate the ignorance of the average member of the population.Sewinman wrote:petejuk wrote:I agree with most here that the policies of the BNP are dispicable and I would summise that there is a good cross section of society posting on this topic. The questions of who voted for them and why still haven't been answered. Aside from a few fascist, racist bigots there were a number of other people who must have voted BNP. This should send alarm bells ringing throughout government.
I believe that this is an indication that something in society is broken and no one has seen their way to fixing it. Only when the politicians of the major parties immerse themselves in the issues of the BNP voting electorate will they understand what possessed them to make a vote of desperation.
+100. Nail, head, hit.
Additionally, racism, or pretty much any difference-ism is possibly a lot more common than we would lke to admit. There are lots of people who basically don't like foreigners or indeed anyone unfamiliar. Its a pretty basic primate fear response.
The rest of the BNP's vote comes from people who don't really know or understand their policies and, similarly, don't know or understand the policies of anyone else. Since its pretty fashionable to hate anyone in government, or anyone likely to be in government, when operating in an information and cognitive vacuum, "anyone else" might seem a reasonable option.0 -
I am chuckling at the BNP's policy:Reject all asylum seekers who passed safe countries on their way to Britain.
Not only does this mean only line-of-sight countries would count (and I'm struggling to think of a repressive totalitarian regime in any of them - Cuba maybe? Western Sahara (is that even considered a country?)? Denmark?), but it means you'd accept asylum seekers from - UGH - France
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