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BNP

gtvlussogtvlusso Posts: 5,112
edited October 2009 in Commuting chat
Off topic,

Was it me or did Nick Griffin come across as a hateful, greasy little man. I believe in free speech and was glad the BBC was impartial enough to give him a shot - glad he screwed it up royally.

Give them a rope long enough.......
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  • Wallace1492Wallace1492 Posts: 3,707
    Smarmy, smiley, weasely hate filled slithering snake. Just hope everyone see's through this cad.
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  • _Brun__Brun_ Posts: 1,740
    I turned on the telly last night and saw this:

    sp_0804_08_v6.jpg

    Was a while before I realised it wasn't Question Time.
  • tgotbtgotb Posts: 4,714
    Loved the bit where claimed that it would be illegal for him to answer the question and Jack Straw responded, "I'm Minister for Justice and promise to let you say anything you like." Brilliant!
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  • atticaattica Posts: 2,362
    It's a damning inditement on the mainstream parties that the BNP have got to their current level of representation, people are looking for an alternative and that pranny is the only one. It's also a damning inditement on those daft enough to vote BNP as it's a far worse alternative IMHO.

    When is someone going to give us a viable alternative to New Labour and it's copycat sibling the Conservatives?

    @Brun, is that Cartman? Very apt
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  • "better a man think you a fool than you open your mouth and confirm his suspicions".

    The contrast was fabulous between the gentle eloquence of Baroness Warsi and Bonnie Greer, against his pompous faux- facts posturing.
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  • gtvlussogtvlusso Posts: 5,112
    Attica wrote:
    It's a damning inditement on the mainstream parties that the BNP have got to their current level of representation, people are looking for an alternative and that pranny is the only one. It's also a damning inditement on those daft enough to vote BNP as it's a far worse alternative IMHO.

    When is someone going to give us a viable alternative to New Labour and it's copycat sibling the Conservatives?

    @Brun, is that Cartman? Very apt

    I guess there are two schools of thought here - we either all ignore the BNP (do not feed the troll!) and hope it goes away. Or give them the exposure and hope they hang themselves in the process.....Last nigh Nick Griffin hanged himself!

    Either way, they represent Britain in the Europarl....sadly. Who or what voted for them?
  • Loved the bit where claimed that it would be illegal for him to answer the question and Jack Straw responded, "I'm Minister for Justice and promise to let you say anything you like." Brilliant!

    Didn't see it, but that is pretty funny, if at the same time a little alarming that Straw* thinks that is what being M for J allows him to do!*

    Much as I abhor the BNP and its politics, I think the clamour for censorship is deeply, deeply misguided and dangerous. Democracy and the rule of law doesn't mean silencing those whose views you don't like.


    In fact, although I'm not a fan of the third and fourth rate politicos who make up the present cabinet, I have a lot of time for Straw, who I think is a pretty decent man and more than a little too honest for this Govt.
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  • Wallace1492Wallace1492 Posts: 3,707
    Greg66 wrote:
    Loved the bit where claimed that it would be illegal for him to answer the question and Jack Straw responded, "I'm Minister for Justice and promise to let you say anything you like." Brilliant!

    Didn't see it, but that is pretty funny, if at the same time a little alarming that Straw* thinks that is what being M for J allows him to do!*

    Much as I abhor the BNP and its politics, I think the clamour for censorship is deeply, deeply misguided and dangerous. Democracy and the rule of law doesn't mean silencing those whose views you don't like.


    In fact, although I'm not a fan of the third and fourth rate politicos who make up the present cabinet, I have a lot of time for Straw, who I think is a pretty decent man and more than a little too honest for this Govt.

    Straw did not say that he could say anything he liked, he said that answering the question posed would not be illegal, and being Minister for Justice, he could assure him of this. The slimeball still did not answer the question.
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  • wgwarburtonwgwarburton Posts: 1,863
    Greg66 wrote:
    Loved the bit where claimed that it would be illegal for him to answer the question and Jack Straw responded, "I'm Minister for Justice and promise to let you say anything you like." Brilliant!

    Didn't see it, but that is pretty funny, if at the same time a little alarming that Straw* thinks that is what being M for J allows him to do!*
    .

    I think it's a slight misquote. My recollection was that Mr Straw phrased it as "As Minister of Justice I can promise you that you can say....". More along the lines of "I know what I'm talking about and you can say what you like" than "I can get you off if you say something illegal".

    I don't know whether Mr Griffin has a valid point, here, his contention was that as holocaust denial is illegal in some European countries he would lay himself open to prosecution there by explaining his position on UK TV.
    Presumably MEPs don't have an equivalent to the privilige that MPs can rely on in Parliament?

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  • fenboy369fenboy369 Posts: 425
    It was brilliant. To start with Nick Griffen came across like the cat that got the cream, he was all "look at the BNP now, on Question Time, aint we good!" But he very quickly had the look of a school boy being told off, then tried to ignore it all, then went for rabbit in the head lights look and finished off physically shaking at the end.
    Fair play to the Beeb for letting him on. It showed him up as a nothing more than a middle of the road public speaker who's only listeners are National Front pillocks.
    Bonnie Greer said the best thing with "The Britsh public have more common sense"
    What we need is a box on the ballot paper that says "None of the above" to show that we can be bothered to vote, but dont have to vote BNP, etc... as a protest vote because these votes only fuel their fire.
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  • GazzaputtGazzaputt Posts: 3,227
    Either way, they represent Britain in the Europarl....sadly. Who or what voted for them?

    About 1,000,000 people did 6% of the votes.

    I thought it was censored . It was just about the personal views it should have engaged him more on policies. It was to focused on the man not the party.
  • il_principeil_principe Posts: 9,152
    How on earth did that man manage to get a degree from Cambridge? Not the sharpest is he? Greasy little cockweasel. The fact that some people actually voted for him is v depressing.
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  • petejukpetejuk Posts: 235
    I thought it was censored . It was just about the personal views it should have engaged him more on policies. It was to focused on the man not the party.

    I happen to agree. Despite the BBC assurring us that it wasn't going to descend into the Nick Griffen show, it did. He was given a big rope to hang himself with, which he did with accomplishment. However, it could have been better if they started nailing him down on party policy. Entertaining though.
  • Greg TGreg T Posts: 3,266
    How on earth did that man manage to get a degree from Cambridge? .

    Selling secrets to the Russians is the normal way that Tabs earn "their degrees".
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  • SewinmanSewinman Posts: 2,131
    I thought it was disappointing - circus politics. I would rather have seen a proper examination of the why people are voting for the BNP, what has failed with immigration policy and what should be done to fix it. There is obviously a huge amount of dis-affected people out there and shouting at a hate figure is skirting the issue.

    But what can you expect from Question Time – it is just a platform for polarised ranting.
  • The fact that some people actually voted for him is v depressing.

    And quite a lot of Muslims support Osama Bin Laden's principles as well. Simple people look for simple answers to not so simple problems.
  • CorianderCoriander Posts: 1,326
    Greg66 wrote:
    Loved the bit where claimed that it would be illegal for him to answer the question and Jack Straw responded, "I'm Minister for Justice and promise to let you say anything you like." Brilliant!

    Didn't see it, but that is pretty funny, if at the same time a little alarming that Straw* thinks that is what being M for J allows him to do!*

    Much as I abhor the BNP and its politics, I think the clamour for censorship is deeply, deeply misguided and dangerous. Democracy and the rule of law doesn't mean silencing those whose views you don't like.


    In fact, although I'm not a fan of the third and fourth rate politicos who make up the present cabinet, I have a lot of time for Straw, who I think is a pretty decent man and more than a little too honest for this Govt.

    + lots to everything here.
  • kurakokurako Posts: 1,098
    fenboy369 wrote:
    What we need is a box on the ballot paper that says "None of the above" to show that we can be bothered to vote, but dont have to vote BNP, etc... as a protest vote because these votes only fuel their fire.

    If you want to register a protest vote you can just spoil your ballot paper. Put a tick in every box or write 'bollox' over it or do whatever suits. The number of spoiled papers is always recorded.
  • Clever PunClever Pun Posts: 6,778
    Loved the bit where claimed that it would be illegal for him to answer the question and Jack Straw responded, "I'm Minister for Justice and promise to let you say anything you like." Brilliant!

    yeah that made me chuckle... "oh I can put a word in for France and Germany too" :lol:

    I did like
    A question for censored Griff... sorry Nick Griffin
    Too easy, childish yet still funny

    The other guests all made sure to get cheap crowd pleasing diatribes in at his expense though which got a little tiresome
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  • georgeegeorgee Posts: 537
    Right he given the invite, free speech is key

    Good he made a fool of himself and came across as a tw*t, but remember he appeals to tw*ts with similar blighted views. As anyone who saw Panorama this week, the BNP market themselves in low income sink estates, appealing to those to lazy to find employments and are embittered that immigration has delivered successive waves of people to this country who have worked harder and achieve greater success.

    I think even daily mail readers who might lean and vote that way will have been put of by how he came across.
  • CorianderCoriander Posts: 1,326
    Kurako wrote:
    fenboy369 wrote:
    What we need is a box on the ballot paper that says "None of the above" to show that we can be bothered to vote, but dont have to vote BNP, etc... as a protest vote because these votes only fuel their fire.

    If you want to register a protest vote you can just spoil your ballot paper. Put a tick in every box or write 'bollox' over it or do whatever suits. The number of spoiled papers is always recorded.

    But that doesn't work because patronising politicians refuse to believe we don't want them and instead ascribe excessive stupidity to the voting public who are obvioulsy too stupid to manage to put a cross in a box. (This conviction of our stupidity then leads to other moves such as an increasing number of trials conducted without juries, etc.)

    If the greatest, or even a signification, proportion of votes went to 'None of the above' not even they could ignore that.
  • I think it should be a wake-up call to the current government and co that so many people did vote BNP, I know some who did, and they had their reasons within the BNP's policies.

    Although a few of them were put off by Griffin's rantings (I didn't see it) the feeling on my FB 'home' page was that although the guy's an idiot, the party's policies still hold some relevance.

    So perhaps the current government should look at their own policies and how they can adapt to prevent the BNP gaining any more votes.

    Oh and + another 1 to Greg66.
  • sarajoysarajoy Posts: 1,675
    Attica wrote:
    It's a damning inditement on the mainstream parties that the BNP have got to their current level of representation, people are looking for an alternative and that pranny is the only one. It's also a damning inditement on those daft enough to vote BNP as it's a far worse alternative IMHO.

    For the most part I think this country hangs itself through apathy. Lots of people who I imagine would heartily dislike the BNP coming to power just didn't bother to vote - making the numbers voting for the BNP proportionately more powerful. I wonder how many of the protesters and people annoyed at his appearance on TV actually exercised their right to vote - or maybe they are the kind that protest against all politics by not voting at all...

    Not sure how the numbers worked out, but wasn't it Labour losing a chunk of its majority (post expenses row) to the Tories just enough to let the BNP squeak through into the European parliament? I heard somewhere that the actual number BNP votes didn't actually increase by any significant amount.

    As for the show - not seen it yet - however the BNP voters are likely to be the kind to vote for a leader based on image and personality, as opposed to pure policy. So maybe the Anti-Nick-Griffin Show was the best route to take to show him up, rather than letting him waffle on and weasel out of actual politics questions with the kind of language that Al Murray uses (albeit in a satirical manner)..!
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  • sarajoysarajoy Posts: 1,675
    PS: I remember reading the BNP website some years ago - and I remember agreeing with their plans to bring daily milk back to primary school children. It was listed under their manifesto! So, they do have /some/ good policies...
    4537512329_a78cc710e6_o.gif4537512331_ec1ef42fea_o.gif
  • Wallace1492Wallace1492 Posts: 3,707
    I think it should be a wake-up call to the current government and co that so many people did vote BNP, I know some who did, and they had their reasons within the BNP's policies.

    Although a few of them were put off by Griffin's rantings (I didn't see it) the feeling on my FB 'home' page was that although the guy's an idiot, the party's policies still hold some relevance.

    So perhaps the current government should look at their own policies and how they can adapt to prevent the BNP gaining any more votes.

    Oh and + another 1 to Greg66.

    Fair points, but Gregg66 quoted incorrectly.
    "Encyclopaedia is a fetish for very small bicycles"
  • I think it should be a wake-up call to the current government and co that so many people did vote BNP, I know some who did, and they had their reasons within the BNP's policies.

    Although a few of them were put off by Griffin's rantings (I didn't see it) the feeling on my FB 'home' page was that although the guy's an idiot, the party's policies still hold some relevance.

    So perhaps the current government should look at their own policies and how they can adapt to prevent the BNP gaining any more votes.

    Oh and + another 1 to Greg66.

    Fair points, but Gregg66 quoted incorrectly.

    OK, I should have picked and chosen from Greg's post a bit more, everything other than the bit about Mr Straw.
  • FeynmanCFeynmanC Posts: 649
    sarajoy wrote:
    PS: I remember reading the BNP website some years ago - and I remember agreeing with their plans to bring daily milk back to primary school children. It was listed under their manifesto! So, they do have /some/ good policies...

    Not surprised - they like white stuff.

    Bonnie Greer was the star of the show, IMHO. She roundly whupped his fat censored with grace, poise, accuracy and devastating wit. Her jaw was on the floor at some of the things he was coming out with, especially about the KKK.
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  • stuaffstuaff Posts: 1,736
    I watched it, and I have to say that though, yes some of the point-scoring was childish, I found it highly entertaining and well-deserved. Griffin's numerous contradictions and poor arguments did his cause no good (thankfully). The man's a waste of a bullet.....
    Yes, there are reasons why people follow BNP policy when they're not racist (or prefer to think they're not). Immigration policy is a problem all the major parties have to address better than they have done. But it was the same in Germany in the early 30s.......The NSDAP had plenty of perfectly sensible-sounding policies on plenty of issues......
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  • SewinmanSewinman Posts: 2,131
    sarajoy wrote:
    As for the show - not seen it yet - however the BNP voters are likely to be the kind to vote for a leader based on image and personality, as opposed to pure policy. So maybe the Anti-Nick-Griffin Show was the best route to take to show him up, rather than letting him waffle on and weasel out of actual politics questions with the kind of language that Al Murray uses (albeit in a satirical manner)..!

    Can't agree with that - BNP voters are supporting the party for clear policy reasons, more so than mainstream voters.
  • stuaffstuaff Posts: 1,736
    FeynmanC wrote:
    Bonnie Greer was the star of the show, IMHO. She roundly whupped his fat censored with grace, poise, accuracy and devastating wit. Her jaw was on the floor at some of the things he was coming out with, especially about the KKK.

    +1. Baroness Warsi and Jack Straw did well too, but Bonnie was lethal :)
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