Think i've finally lost all respect for Liggett...
Comments
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By the way, does Liggett still think Landis is innocent? Because I lost all respect for him around August 2006...0
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afx237vi wrote:By the way, does Liggett still think Landis is innocent? Because I lost all respect for him around August 2006...
Remember AFX, he's a mennonite so he wouldn't do that. And is quite manly, so his testosterone is naturally higher than us mortals."In many ways, my story was that of a raging, Christ-like figure who hauled himself off the cross, looked up at the Romans with blood in his eyes and said 'My turn, sock cookers'"
@gietvangent0 -
disgruntledgoat wrote:afx237vi wrote:By the way, does Liggett still think Landis is innocent? Because I lost all respect for him around August 2006...
Remember AFX, he's a mennonite so he wouldn't do that. And is quite manly, so his testosterone is naturally higher than us mortals.
Yeah, that was basically the crux of Liggett's defence.0 -
I've just watched that interview and I'm Dumbfounded !!
I can not believe how biased in favour Lance he seems to be.
It's as if Alberto spoiled Lance's race by grabbing time where he could and not by being better than him. You have to grab time where you can in order to win a stage race. This is something Lance was good at. I have always thought Ligget fine as a commentator and accept it's a difficult job I would not want BUT I simply can not believe what he is saying. It's as if Lance had written the script for him. I have lost all respect for Ligget now !!!!!!!!0 -
disgruntledgoat wrote:andy_wrx wrote:Why don't you all ride on Sunday and discuss this with Phil personally ?
http://www.ctc.org.uk/desktopdefault.aspx?tabid=3691
Always wondered about that. Does he ride along going "Look, I'm literally going backwards! I'm saying 'bridge to engine room more power!' and there isn't any! What do you make of it Paul? Paul?"
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So you lose all respect for someone because his opinion does not match yours?
Do people even speak to you anymore? Do you have any friends left after "losing all
respect" for them because they disagree with you? Take it easy. Enjoy life. It's too
short to hate everyone.0 -
dennisn wrote:So you lose all respect for someone because his opinion does not match yours?
Do people even speak to you anymore? Do you have any friends left after "losing all
respect" for them because they disagree with you? Take it easy. Enjoy life. It's too
short to hate everyone.
No-one mentioned hating anyone, Dennis. We are talking about Liggett's work as a professional sports commentator - which is supposed to be informative and impartial, which it is clearly not. Sherwen and Liggett are nothing more than cheerleaders. They crossed the line of impartiality a long time ago.
Do you actually have an opinion on anything, by the way?0 -
afx237vi wrote:dennisn wrote:So you lose all respect for someone because his opinion does not match yours?
Do people even speak to you anymore? Do you have any friends left after "losing all
respect" for them because they disagree with you? Take it easy. Enjoy life. It's too
short to hate everyone.
No-one mentioned hating anyone, Dennis. We are talking about Liggett's work as a professional sports commentator - which is supposed to be informative and impartial, which it is clearly not. Sherwen and Liggett are nothing more than cheerleaders. They crossed the line of impartiality a long time ago.
Do you actually have an opinion on anything, by the way?
Name me one person in this world who's impartial. And everyone has opinions, even Ligget & Sherwen. And c'mon, you're telling me that all this is not about hating LA???0 -
dennisn wrote:afx237vi wrote:No-one mentioned hating anyone, Dennis. We are talking about Liggett's work as a professional sports commentator - which is supposed to be informative and impartial, which it is clearly not. Sherwen and Liggett are nothing more than cheerleaders. They crossed the line of impartiality a long time ago.
Do you actually have an opinion on anything, by the way?
Name me one person in this world who's impartial. And everyone has opinions, even Ligget & Sherwen. And c'mon, you're telling me that all this is not about hating LA???
Of course they have opinions, are they're perfectly entitled to have them. But it's another thing altogether when those opinions get COMPLETELY in the way of their work. It's wholly unprofessional and detracts from their reputation.
And how can it NOT be about LA when that's all Liggett and Sherwen ever talk about?0 -
afx237vi wrote:dennisn wrote:afx237vi wrote:No-one mentioned hating anyone, Dennis. We are talking about Liggett's work as a professional sports commentator - which is supposed to be informative and impartial, which it is clearly not. Sherwen and Liggett are nothing more than cheerleaders. They crossed the line of impartiality a long time ago.
Do you actually have an opinion on anything, by the way?
Name me one person in this world who's impartial. And everyone has opinions, even Ligget & Sherwen. And c'mon, you're telling me that all this is not about hating LA???
Of course they have opinions, are they're perfectly entitled to have them. But it's another thing altogether when those opinions get COMPLETELY in the way of their work. It's wholly unprofessional and detracts from their reputation.
And how can it NOT be about LA when that's all Liggett and Sherwen ever talk about?
And the hatred of LA, that I mentioned. Isn't that what this is about? Tell the truth now.0 -
For the love of god, Dennis. Why don't you go and do something constructive, it'll come as a refreshing change!0
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dennisn wrote:Name me one person in this world who's impartial. And everyone has opinions, even Ligget & Sherwen. And c'mon, you're telling me that all this is not about hating LA???
Dennis - Find a local teenager and ask them if they can't help you with "torrents"
Then download something with David Harmon doing commentry. There you go, someone who can talk over a race and not whittle on about 1 person.Fckin' Quintana … that creep can roll, man.0 -
dennisn wrote:afx237vi wrote:dennisn wrote:afx237vi wrote:No-one mentioned hating anyone, Dennis. We are talking about Liggett's work as a professional sports commentator - which is supposed to be informative and impartial, which it is clearly not. Sherwen and Liggett are nothing more than cheerleaders. They crossed the line of impartiality a long time ago.
Do you actually have an opinion on anything, by the way?
Name me one person in this world who's impartial. And everyone has opinions, even Ligget & Sherwen. And c'mon, you're telling me that all this is not about hating LA???
Of course they have opinions, are they're perfectly entitled to have them. But it's another thing altogether when those opinions get COMPLETELY in the way of their work. It's wholly unprofessional and detracts from their reputation.
And how can it NOT be about LA when that's all Liggett and Sherwen ever talk about?
And the hatred of LA, that I mentioned. Isn't that what this is about? Tell the truth now.
Dennis I don't hate Armstrong, I might dislike his apparant bullying etc, but there's enough debate around this, I may think he doped, but so did lots of other people... But this doesn't colour my belief that in a professional commentator, whom people look to to explain the sport to them, bias is unappealing whomever it is towards. This is teh first year in ages I probably wont buy a DVD of the Tour, because the commentary is all about 1 rider. There are nearly 200 riders, there are tens of fascinating stories every day, and we got to hear about one rider and the internal politics of his team. For 3 weeks."In many ways, my story was that of a raging, Christ-like figure who hauled himself off the cross, looked up at the Romans with blood in his eyes and said 'My turn, sock cookers'"
@gietvangent0 -
Dennis you seem to have a very entrenched mentality when it comes to anything even remotely critical of Lance Armstrong. It sometimes seems like you see it as your place as an American to defend LA regardless of the topic for discussion or dismiss opinions with bizarre put-downs like "when was the last time you rode the TdF?"
The guy here is talking about losing respect for a commentator who is, in the opinion of a lot of followers of cycling, gone so far beyond impartial as to make it annoying and insulting to the intelligence of the viewers.
I usually like Liggett's and Sherwin's commentary and accept that commentators have to fill gaps in the time slot but, honestly mate, the stuff they were coming out with this year was quite infuriating at times and misleading to the casual viewer as well.
Having a pop at Lance Armstrong does not equate to having a pop at America but sometimes you need to call it like it is and the arse-licking of Armstrong this year has put off a lot of fans who are probably ambivalent towards Lance Armstrong.0 -
dennisn wrote:afx237vi wrote:Of course they have opinions, are they're perfectly entitled to have them. But it's another thing altogether when those opinions get COMPLETELY in the way of their work. It's wholly unprofessional and detracts from their reputation.
And how can it NOT be about LA when that's all Liggett and Sherwen ever talk about?
And the hatred of LA, that I mentioned. Isn't that what this is about? Tell the truth now.
No, and you're really missing the point if you think it is. It's about Liggett and his place in the English-language media as the well-respected "voice of cycling".
For some bizarre reason, a lot of cycling fans actually do respect Liggett for his commentary. Maybe it's a nostalgia thing, I don't know. But the linked interview on page 1 clearly demonstrates that the guy has lost the plot and is incapable of being impartial where LA is concerned.
So sure, LA is involved, but it's not about LA. It could just as easily be "about" Floyd Landis, like I said earlier in the thread. When your commentaries become about friendships rather than the sport you're being paid to talk about, then I'm afraid your credibility goes down the toilet.0 -
disgruntledgoat wrote:dennisn wrote:afx237vi wrote:dennisn wrote:afx237vi wrote:No-one mentioned hating anyone, Dennis. We are talking about Liggett's work as a professional sports commentator - which is supposed to be informative and impartial, which it is clearly not. Sherwen and Liggett are nothing more than cheerleaders. They crossed the line of impartiality a long time ago.
Do you actually have an opinion on anything, by the way?
Name me one person in this world who's impartial. And everyone has opinions, even Ligget & Sherwen. And c'mon, you're telling me that all this is not about hating LA???
Of course they have opinions, are they're perfectly entitled to have them. But it's another thing altogether when those opinions get COMPLETELY in the way of their work. It's wholly unprofessional and detracts from their reputation.
And how can it NOT be about LA when that's all Liggett and Sherwen ever talk about?
And the hatred of LA, that I mentioned. Isn't that what this is about? Tell the truth now.
Dennis I don't hate Armstrong,...........
Please spare me all the denial.
Hate(from Websters) To feel an intense aversion to; .... to dislike exceedingly. It goes on a bit more but it sure sounds like what I have been reading. There is nothing abnormal about people hating other people. Everyone has someone on that list. So why all the denial?0 -
dennisn wrote:disgruntledgoat wrote:dennisn wrote:afx237vi wrote:dennisn wrote:afx237vi wrote:No-one mentioned hating anyone, Dennis. We are talking about Liggett's work as a professional sports commentator - which is supposed to be informative and impartial, which it is clearly not. Sherwen and Liggett are nothing more than cheerleaders. They crossed the line of impartiality a long time ago.
Do you actually have an opinion on anything, by the way?
Name me one person in this world who's impartial. And everyone has opinions, even Ligget & Sherwen. And c'mon, you're telling me that all this is not about hating LA???
Of course they have opinions, are they're perfectly entitled to have them. But it's another thing altogether when those opinions get COMPLETELY in the way of their work. It's wholly unprofessional and detracts from their reputation.
And how can it NOT be about LA when that's all Liggett and Sherwen ever talk about?
And the hatred of LA, that I mentioned. Isn't that what this is about? Tell the truth now.
Dennis I don't hate Armstrong,...........
Please spare me all the denial.
Hate(from Websters) To feel an intense aversion to; .... to dislike exceedingly. It goes on a bit more but it sure sounds like what I have been reading. There is nothing abnormal about people hating other people. Everyone has someone on that list. So why all the denial?
Ummm Dennis, care to point me to something i've posted that leads you to believe I hate Armstrong? Or are you just putting words in my mouth?"In many ways, my story was that of a raging, Christ-like figure who hauled himself off the cross, looked up at the Romans with blood in his eyes and said 'My turn, sock cookers'"
@gietvangent0 -
Back in the 80's L & S were the voice(s) of cycling to us in the UK. And whatever they said in the commentary stood because there was no alternative to it.
I cannot recall any incident during this time where they were so biased toward one particular rider to the detriment of 199 other guys. Even the Lemond/Hinault duel in 86 was handled with impartiality. If my memory serves.
What happend to them? What happened to that pair of guys who inspired us so during the 80's?! Where did it all go wrong??!!
But now the only word to describe their once interesting and illuminating comed, sorry, commentary double act is appalling.
They're so far up Lances' butt that they think his digestive tract mirrors the hairpins on Alpe D'Huez.Dave Van Der Thourenhout. Legend.
http://blogs.myspace.com/index.cfm?fuse ... apped=true0 -
disgruntledgoat wrote:dennisn wrote:disgruntledgoat wrote:dennisn wrote:afx237vi wrote:dennisn wrote:afx237vi wrote:No-one mentioned hating anyone, Dennis. We are talking about Liggett's work as a professional sports commentator - which is supposed to be informative and impartial, which it is clearly not. Sherwen and Liggett are nothing more than cheerleaders. They crossed the line of impartiality a long time ago.
Do you actually have an opinion on anything, by the way?
Name me one person in this world who's impartial. And everyone has opinions, even Ligget & Sherwen. And c'mon, you're telling me that all this is not about hating LA???
Of course they have opinions, are they're perfectly entitled to have them. But it's another thing altogether when those opinions get COMPLETELY in the way of their work. It's wholly unprofessional and detracts from their reputation.
And how can it NOT be about LA when that's all Liggett and Sherwen ever talk about?
And the hatred of LA, that I mentioned. Isn't that what this is about? Tell the truth now.
Dennis I don't hate Armstrong,...........
Please spare me all the denial.
Hate(from Websters) To feel an intense aversion to; .... to dislike exceedingly. It goes on a bit more but it sure sounds like what I have been reading. There is nothing abnormal about people hating other people. Everyone has someone on that list. So why all the denial?
Ummm Dennis, care to point me to something i've posted that leads you to believe I hate Armstrong? Or are you just putting words in my mouth?
Somehow, overlapping posts, punched the wrong key. I was trying to address "afx237vi". Sorry if I somehow got you in the middle. :oops: :oops: Think I'll back off and try and discover who I am trying to talk to before I open my big mouth.0 -
Even if you were trying to address me, you've still completely ignored my point. So what if I dislike Armstrong? (Hate is way OTT.) It has nothing to do with my opinion of Liggett, which is based entirely on his unprofessionalism.
I have exactly the same opinion of Clive Tyldesley (google him Dennis) for his slavish devotion towards English clubs in the Champions League.0 -
...and he never liked Robert Millar.Scottish and British...and a bit French0
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afx237vi wrote:Even if you were trying to address me, you've still completely ignored my point. So what if I dislike Armstrong? (Hate is way OTT.) It has nothing to do with my opinion of Liggett, which is based entirely on his unprofessionalism.
I have exactly the same opinion of Clive Tyldesley (google him Dennis) for his slavish devotion towards English clubs in the Champions League.
Can add to that... jamie Redknapp, Fred Truman, Phil Clarke, ITV's Britocentric F1 coverage, Steve Ryder and so on and so forth."In many ways, my story was that of a raging, Christ-like figure who hauled himself off the cross, looked up at the Romans with blood in his eyes and said 'My turn, sock cookers'"
@gietvangent0 -
Anyone remember the time that Ligget almost came in his pants when he saw Roche emerging through the mist on Sestriere in 87?
Compare that to how he is now ...
I agree that he never had much good to say about Millar despite his achievements.Dave Van Der Thourenhout. Legend.
http://blogs.myspace.com/index.cfm?fuse ... apped=true0 -
afx237vi wrote:So what if I dislike Armstrong? (Hate is way OTT.) It has nothing to do with my opinion of Liggett, which is based entirely on his unprofessionalism.
O.K. let's try again here.
I don't really care who you like or dislike. That's your business.
I'm not one way or another about LA, or anyone else, that I haven't met, for that matter.
I take that back. I just can't stand Tom Cruise or Kevin Costner. Not sure why but that's the way it is.
Anyway, I'm just pointing out that this "dislike" of a person colors your judgement of
said person. Making pretty much anything you hear or read about them, "the truth", as long as it's bad, and anything that you hear or read that might be good or positive has got to be "false". I'll leave it at that.0 -
dennisn wrote:afx237vi wrote:So what if I dislike Armstrong? (Hate is way OTT.) It has nothing to do with my opinion of Liggett, which is based entirely on his unprofessionalism.
O.K. let's try again here.
I don't really care who you like or dislike. That's your business.
I'm not one way or another about LA, or anyone else, that I haven't met, for that matter.
I take that back. I just can't stand Tom Cruise or Kevin Costner. Not sure why but that's the way it is.
Anyway, I'm just pointing out that this "dislike" of a person colors your judgement of
said person. Making pretty much anything you hear or read about them, "the truth", as long as it's bad, and anything that you hear or read that might be good or positive has got to be "false". I'll leave it at that.
Is it because they're bloody Americans Dennis?Pictures are better than words because some words are big and hard to understand.
http://www.flickr.com/photos/34335188@N07/3336802663/0 -
disgruntledgoat wrote:afx237vi wrote:Even if you were trying to address me, you've still completely ignored my point. So what if I dislike Armstrong? (Hate is way OTT.) It has nothing to do with my opinion of Liggett, which is based entirely on his unprofessionalism.
I have exactly the same opinion of Clive Tyldesley (google him Dennis) for his slavish devotion towards English clubs in the Champions League.
Can add to that... jamie Redknapp, Fred Truman, Phil Clarke, ITV's Britocentric F1 coverage, Steve Ryder and so on and so forth.
Well, yeah, but Tyldesley and David Pleat really take the biscuit.
Player from English club falls over = that really was an unnecessary tackle and the ref ought to have a word.
Player from non-English club falls over = despicable dive, really has no part in the game, the ref really ought to have a word.
They hate foreigners almost as much as Mark Cavendish.0 -
afx237vi wrote:[
They hate foreigners almost as much as Mark Cavendish.
They hate Mark Cavendish?Pictures are better than words because some words are big and hard to understand.
http://www.flickr.com/photos/34335188@N07/3336802663/0 -
Robmanic1 wrote:dennisn wrote:afx237vi wrote:So what if I dislike Armstrong? (Hate is way OTT.) It has nothing to do with my opinion of Liggett, which is based entirely on his unprofessionalism.
O.K. let's try again here.
I don't really care who you like or dislike. That's your business.
I'm not one way or another about LA, or anyone else, that I haven't met, for that matter.
I take that back. I just can't stand Tom Cruise or Kevin Costner. Not sure why but that's the way it is.
Anyway, I'm just pointing out that this "dislike" of a person colors your judgement of
said person. Making pretty much anything you hear or read about them, "the truth", as long as it's bad, and anything that you hear or read that might be good or positive has got to be "false". I'll leave it at that.
Is it because they're bloody Americans Dennis?
I think it's because all their movies seem really bad to me.0 -
dennisn wrote:I think it's because all their movies seem really bad to me.
.....or is it because they're both gay (apart from Costner)?Pictures are better than words because some words are big and hard to understand.
http://www.flickr.com/photos/34335188@N07/3336802663/0
