Now Ricco gets busted for EPO

campagsarge

The worrying thing is, can these be isolated incidents? If riders thought a strain of rEPO to be undetectable, which then in fact turns out to be detectable things could get really ugly.

PutneyJoe

the fact that a supposedly untraceable EPO came out that was in fact testable is almost like a brilliant sting operation....

DaveyL

cougie wrote:

I dont really understand that.

How would that help them say - use this undetectable EPO if the tests pick it up anyway ?

Theyd still get busted.

I don't quite understand it either. Which is why I'm asking for the allegation to be explained...

SteveR_100Milers

andrewgturnbull wrote:

SteveR_100Milers wrote:

I reckon Valverde must be wearing an ironic smile.

Yup - he's just picked up another stage win!

Well you might expect him to be completely de-motivated, since his form despite allegedly targetting the tour is way off GC pace, and now that he is *probably* clean after having come so close to being caught. However, if he is in any way an optimist, he might hope that a significant number of riders ahead on the GC might also be busted, thus propelling him back to the top of the peloton, and voila all without having to serve a 2+ year ban plus public disgrace that the other cheats will have (had) to endure.

alanmcn1

This proves UCI arent fit to run the game any more. How many times have they been responsible for testing Ricco and SD??? AFLD and ASO take over, and catch him three times in their first attempt. I think SD are about to be exposed as organised dopers, and reckon more to follow. Sad sad sad state fo affairs, Cupid stunts pro's are

DaveyL

PutneyJoe wrote:

the fact that a supposedly untraceable EPO came out that was in fact testable is almost like a brilliant sting operation....

It might be better if they'd designed it so it had the side-effect of turning your skin green or something. That'd be cool.

cougie

Isnt the teams testing put in place to stop the rogue riders doping themselves without the teams knowledge ? I mean - without that - you'll always get one or two guys who try to cheat.

Just like in any workplace - theres a few who slope off work early, or borrow stationery etc...

cougie

DaveyL wrote:

PutneyJoe wrote:

the fact that a supposedly untraceable EPO came out that was in fact testable is almost like a brilliant sting operation....

It might be better if they'd designed it so it had the side-effect of turning your skin green or something. That'd be cool.

Green like a cobra ?

(I'm guessing there must be some green cobras out there ?)

DanielFriebe

http://www.bikeradar.com/blogs/article/ ... tive-17595

Pirahna

DaveyL wrote:

Yes. The implication was that teams like CSC and Astana (and by association, Columbia and Garmin) are using thei anti-doping medical programmes not to combat doping, but to make sure their riders can dope and pass all the controls. At least this is they way I read it. If the OP is correct, this is incredibly serious.

This gets covered every time there is a major race and somebody gets busted. Very few people sit on the fence on this issue, some believe that teams are trying clean up others that, as you said, teams are using their anti doping programs to assist doping.

I personally subscribe to the latter view, a view that is proved to be correct time after time.

DaveyL

alanmcn1 wrote:

This proves UCI arent fit to run the game any more. How many times have they been responsible for testing Ricco and SD??? AFLD and ASO take over, and catch him three times in their first attempt. I think SD are about to be exposed as organised dopers, and reckon more to follow. Sad sad sad state fo affairs, Cupid stunts pro's are

Not really - this could be the first time they've looked for a CERA-epo. You don't find something if you either don't know to look for it, or don't know how to look for it.

afx237vi

gematkinson wrote:

oh man! i put money on him winning and winning the white GRRRRRRR

I had Nibali for the white at 30/1 Great day for cycling!

alanmcn1

DaveyL;

but AFLD tested for UCI so the people at AFLD obviously knnew about it and that they could test for it??? It's not as if AFLD invented the test and discovered this was being used without telling anyone! UCI not looking for it is more the case

ricadus

It will be interesting to see how the UK media pair this news with the result of the Dwain Chambers hearing due today.

andrewgturnbull

DaveyL wrote:

PutneyJoe wrote:

the fact that a supposedly untraceable EPO came out that was in fact testable is almost like a brilliant sting operation....

It might be better if they'd designed it so it had the side-effect of turning your skin green or something. That'd be cool.

Hi there.

So, the test for this 3rd generation stuff Cera, is this a new test, or is it the same test as for rEpo?

If it's a new test, has it been ratified by WADA and the UCI, or just the AFDL? If not can we look forward to another two years of Tyler-style legal challenges - or longer knowing the intransigence previously shown by the Spanish authorities?

Cheers, Andy

ps I just noticed that Saunier Duval were holding 4 out of the top 7 places in the King of the Mountains competition! Looks like a battle between Bernhard Kohl and frank Schleck now.

cougie

So remind me please, of the teams that we know have got their own testing plans in place - who has outfoxed their system and tested positive in a race ?

I cant think of anyone off the top of my head ?

DaveyL

alanmcn1 wrote:

DaveyL;

but AFLD tested for UCI so the people at AFLD obviously knnew about it and that they could test for it??? It's not as if AFLD invented the test and discovered this was being used without telling anyone! UCI not looking for it is more the case

According to the expert in Daniel's blog, it's only been available since the start of the year. And he's even not sure about a valid test. Bit too early to use it as a stick with which to beat the UCI.

Kléber

Interesting to note that Daniel Friebe's blog says the sport administrators detected Micera use during the Giro. I wonder who was using it?

afx237vi

andrewgturnbull wrote:

Hi there.

So, the test for this 3rd generation stuff Cera, is this a new test, or is it the same test as for rEpo?

If it's a new test, has it been ratified by WADA and the UCI, or just the AFDL? If not can we look forward to another two years of Tyler-style legal challenges - or longer knowing the intransigence previously shown by the Spanish authorities?

Cheers, Andy

ps I just noticed that Saunier Duval were holding 4 out of the top 7 places in the King of the Mountains competition! Looks like a battle between Bernhard Kohl and frank Schleck now.

Jeff Jones posted this a few pages back:

http://www.bikeradar.com/blogs/article/ ... tive-17595

Supposedly no WADA validated test for Cera / Micera.

iainf72

DanielFriebe wrote:

http://www.bikeradar.com/blogs/article/doping-expert-stunned-by-ricco-positive-17595

Oooof. So there is no validated test for it?

Will be interesting to see what the actual dilly-oh is!

cougie

Maybe they've called their bluff.

Ricco - we've busted you for EPO.

'Oh mama mia - its a fair cop'

andrewgturnbull

DanielFriebe wrote:

http://www.bikeradar.com/blogs/article/doping-expert-stunned-by-ricco-positive-17595

Sorry, this thread is moving too fast to keep up!

The above article answers my own question:

"Wow. I'm stunned. I'm amazed they're saying it's Micera, simply because there's no validated test for that yet. The World Anti-Doping Agency is working on a test, but it certainly doesn't exist yet."

Where does this situation stand legally?

Cheers, Andy

alanmcn1

ASO is making the rules now, like it or not. If this is how they are going to catch cheats, that's how it's going to be. It's a better system than the piss poor one that every cheat and his dog has managed to circumvent for the last 20 years

andrewgturnbull

alanmcn1 wrote:

ASO is making the rules now, like it or not. If this is how they are going to catch cheats, that's how it's going to be. It's a better system than the wee-wee poor one that every cheat and his dog has managed to circumvent for the last 20 years

Yeahbut, without consistent rules we have uncertainty.

So Ricco is out of the tour but may not face sanctions by his CONI or the UCI because there is no validated test?

Cheers, Andy

calvjones

andrewgturnbull wrote:

DanielFriebe wrote:

http://www.bikeradar.com/blogs/article/doping-expert-stunned-by-ricco-positive-17595

Sorry, this thread is moving too fast to keep up!

The above article answers my own question:

"Wow. I'm stunned. I'm amazed they're saying it's Micera, simply because there's no validated test for that yet. The World Anti-Doping Agency is working on a test, but it certainly doesn't exist yet."

Where does this situation stand legally?

Cheers, Andy

I suspect ASO don't care where they stand legally - they don't have to ban an athlete as they're not (yet) a governing body. They can however ban an athlete from ASO events because of any reason they wish. Ricco can't go to CAS to force ASO to invite him to the Tour next year!

blazing_saddles

Yates has been talking about "3rd Generation EPO" being detected. Anybody know exactly what this means? :? Yates obviously knows what he's talking about.

As for proof that the "programming" teams being clean, I can only offer this.
Speculation has accompanied every Tour performance of note. SD must be dirty and so it has proven.
The teams with these controls in place are getting results on a par with those they were getting, prior to setting up this system.

So, was Basso riding clean, while at CSC? Why have the Schlecks and Cancellara's name been muted in this speculative abnormal list?

andy_wrx

I guess they'll now expunge Ricco from the results and move everyone up the results in those two stages he won.

But if the team's out, presumably Piepoli and Cobo will remain in the Hautacam results - unless they test positive too of course...

andrewgturnbull

calvjones wrote:

andrewgturnbull wrote:

DanielFriebe wrote:

http://www.bikeradar.com/blogs/article/doping-expert-stunned-by-ricco-positive-17595

Sorry, this thread is moving too fast to keep up!

The above article answers my own question:

"Wow. I'm stunned. I'm amazed they're saying it's Micera, simply because there's no validated test for that yet. The World Anti-Doping Agency is working on a test, but it certainly doesn't exist yet."

Where does this situation stand legally?

Cheers, Andy

I suspect ASO don't care where they stand legally - they don't have to ban an athlete as they're not (yet) a governing body. They can however ban an athlete from ASO events because of any reason they wish. Ricco can't go to CAS to force ASO to invite him to the Tour next year!

Hi again.

My 7 year old has a chemistry set at home. Can I do the B-Sample analysis please?

Cheers, Andy

DaveyL

Blazing Saddles wrote:

Yates has been talking about "3rd Generation EPO" being detected. Anybody know exactly what this means? :? Yates obviously knows what he's talking about.

As for proof that the "programming" teams being clean, I can only offer this.
Speculation has accompanied every Tour performance of note. SD must be dirty and so it has proven.
The teams with these controls in place are getting results on a par with those they were getting, prior to setting up this system.

So, was Basso riding clean, while at CSC? Why have the Schlecks and Cancellara's name been muted in this speculative abnormal list?

My memory isn't as good as it used to be. Was Basso on CSC's books whilst the Damsgaard programme was in place?

giant_man

This one doesn't really surprise me after watching him so strong in the mountains the other day, I did think at the time.

Damn shame for a man I thought a fine athlete. But just another doping idiot.