Training for Steep Hills
Comments
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I've driven over these passes in the car and they are mega steep!
Steepest roads i've ever been on and the car can struggle in places!
I know the lad from my LBS that won last year and to look at him and chat to him i wouldn't of guessed he was that awesome at riding a bike, very friendly chatty lad that must be super fit!
Thought about trying riding over one of these for training on my MTB but maybe i won't bother!!
Got a couple of mates in this year so i'm coming to spectate!!
Good luck to all entering!0 -
chill888 wrote:degress and percent are not the same thing. Keep it simple with percent and forget trigonometry
I don't know the climb but really doubt there are sections at 33% - at least for long.
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Yes it sounds unbelievable - probably just the hairpins you'd think - but no someone did actually decide to build a road with proper 1 in 3 stretches - I made the mistake of stopping my mums VW polo to look at the view about 20 years ago on a camping trip and nearly burnt the clutch out trying to get it going again and that was with 3 people pushing it.
it's a hard life if you don't weaken.0 -
popette wrote:John C. wrote:RICHYBOYcp wrote:John C. wrote:
I may be training on 28/21 but my bail out for Hardknott on The Fred will be something like 28/32 or 26/30. Just because a manufacturer puts high gearing on it's road bike doesnt mean you have to stick with it. Last year I used a 12-25 road cassette took out the 23 and put a 32 as a bottom gear. giving a cassette with 12-13-15-17-19- 21-25-32. The result was a nice reasonably tight cassette for the flat but I had big bail out gears for the hills late on in the day. I swapped my rear mech for a Deore XT and everything worked perfectly. No reason why you couldn't do this with 9 speed although you may have problems with the spacing with 10 speed
Can you just put anything you like on the back? for example if you had a compact 50/34 on the front, could I ask my bike shop to put either a 32 or 34 on the back as a bale out gear? Would I need to change the chain or any other parts? I haven't a clue what is possible in terms of gearing and it sounds like you know what you're on about
Respect to anyone doing the FWC - I can feel my legs hurting and lungs burning just reading the descriptions of some of the big hills.
To run a 32 or 34 you may have to fit a different rear mech. But basically apart from 10 speed if you stick with the same number of gears then you should be able to run a dinner plate bale out for any system provided your rear mech will cope.0 -
Yes...There are parts of Hardknott definately 1:3...and the rest maybe just fall into the 1:4 and 1:5 category
Heres a real nice nightime photo of Hardknott with a nice wet road for great definition:-
http://www.flickr.com/photos/roystonvasey/1113066821
Another 'Full' Photo
http://webhome.csc.uvic.ca/~msanseve/en ... G_1630.JPG
And why not just have a look at the video...in the 2006 FWC...and thats only the upper steep stretches...
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7PKbLIr-2Oo
Its pure murder...but after 100miles of totaly brutal predecessors the suffering becomes legendary...
Whilst not as difficult a climb...there is even steeper...Rosedale Chimney in the NY Moors...now that is Tarmac Madness at a grand scale...its averages 32.4% for 400meters solid...another which needs seen to be beleived and this is another climb in the UK which could have you off the bike in a nanosecond...0 -
great video
looks like FUN
does anyone have the climb's total distance and ascent?
cheers0 -
chill888 wrote:great video
looks like FUN
does anyone have the climb's total distance and ascent?
cheers
http://www.salite.ch/hardknott1.asp?map ... priseH=4000 -
RICHBOY thanks for link
metric? yes?
tasty but short!!0 -
Maybe a fun thread would be similar epic climbs.
Near me probably the closest would be Col du Grand Colombier (Artemare France) - not to be confused with Col de la Colombiere. It's the toughest climb in the Jura Mountains.
It's a climb to no-where so always traffic free - yet virtually unknown for cyclo-tourists as never in Tour de France.
It has two consecutive kilometres at 15 and 13 % average - with one stretch at 22%
So 14% average versus 14.6 average for Hardknott over 2 kilometres.
On the other hand it is surrounded by 3 kilometres at 10% and is 15.5 kilometres long.
There are 4 ways up this great climb and to become a Confrérie des Fêlés du Grand Colombier (translated: Brotherhood of Loons (freaks, crackpots) of Grand Colombier) one needs to climb all four in one day.
The history: A local cycling coach was yelling at his team one day saying how he used to cycle all three sides of Ventoux in a day - this is roughly equivalent to all 4 sides of Colombier.
Elevation Chart and details0 -
RICHYBOYcp wrote:chill888 wrote:great video
looks like FUN..does anyone have the climb's total distance and ascent?
cheers
http://www.salite.ch/hardknott1.asp?map ... priseH=400
chill888, this doesn't really do justice to Hardknott
-it's longer than that, and there two difficult sections with a "rest" in between
-the steep sections are 25% and 30%, and not just for a few yards
-riding it as part of the Fred Whitton sportif, it comes at 100miles/160k
Here is some information on the Madmen of Ventoux Club-I aspire to membership- so should Richyboy
http://les.cingles.du.mont-ventoux.club.fr/menu.htm“It is by riding a bicycle that you learn the contours of a country best..." Ernest Hemingway0 -
cheers
thanks for perspective. I wasn't trying to minimize it. I would love to ride it
Nice ventoux link. thanks -- frankly everytime I have climbed Ventoux - once has been enough for the day. I will have to give up celebration beers at the bar just below top if doing multiple times. 0 -
chill888 wrote:cheers
thanks for perspective. I wasn't trying to minimize it. I would love to ride it
Nice ventoux link. thanks -- frankly everytime I have climbed Ventoux - once has been enough for the day. I will have to give up celebration beers at the bar just below top if doing multiple times.
Yes Chilli, you must understand what Ken Knight is saying...I've climbed Ventoux,Tourmalet etc and i'm more afraid of Hardknott...its just on the very border of my abilities and I know that even on the best of days I'll only JUST survive it...I read a good article off a Guy who toured the Pyrenees and the Asturias...he cycled up L'Angliru! now along with Zoncolan thats the most feared climb in Procycling...his remark was he felt he had just enough gears for L'Angliru with its 23% avg kilometer and managed, he said he could manage most climbs but remembered the only climb he failed on - Hardknott Pass,
Le Patron from this forum did Mortorolo last year, he managed ok on that but failed on Hardknott Pass! Forget the avg 15% for 2kms...this climb is no ordinary climb!
P.s Ken Night - I've did Ventoux from Bedoin and Maulecene...no way would I try multiple ascents in one day...well maybe on a Kawazaki 0 -
love hills0
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Ken Night wrote:RICHYBOYcp wrote:chill888 wrote:great video
looks like FUN..does anyone have the climb's total distance and ascent?
cheers
http://www.salite.ch/hardknott1.asp?map ... priseH=400
chill888, this doesn't really do justice to Hardknott
-it's longer than that, and there two difficult sections with a "rest" in between
-the steep sections are 25% and 30%, and not just for a few yards
-riding it as part of the Fred Whitton sportif, it comes at 100miles/160k
Here is some information on the Madmen of Ventoux Club-I aspire to membership- so should Richyboy
http://les.cingles.du.mont-ventoux.club.fr/menu.htm
I wanted to have a go at the 3 in a day this year but could noit get any mates to join me so doing Marmotte instead
Maybe we could get a "forum" team to have a go nexct year?
I would have a go, if not I will go to USA and do one of the week rides in Coloroad, some "big" clims on that also 0 -
I've just come back from the Lakes; on Monday I followed the Fred Whitton route from Braithwaite down to Hardknott and Wrynose. I've seen (and been scared by!) many pictures of Hardknott on the 'net, but when I saw it in the flesh I have to say my heart dropped; it just doesn't look possible! I'd been up Wrynose east the day before and that looked (and was) seriously tough, but this looked in a different league.
Anyway, I'm glad to say I managed to get up the first steep section in the saddle without resorting to bottom gear, but when it came to the 35% section between the hairpins the 30-25 was engaged and standing was the only option. Once I'd done that I knew there was no way I was going to be beat, and I wasn't! I crawled along the valley to Wrynose and really suffered on that but again got up it without stopping. It was such a good feeling knowing that I'd managed the toughest climb in Britain - and a big confidence booster for the FWC.
I'd previously climbed most of the other notorious climbs in northern England (Park Rash, Honister, Wrynose east, Rosedale etc), but Hardknott is definitely the hardest I've ever done - it's unreal.0 -
oldwelshman wrote:
I wanted to have a go at the 3 in a day this year but could noit get any mates to join me so doing Marmotte instead
Maybe we could get a "forum" team to have a go nexct year?
I would have a go, if not I will go to USA and do one of the week rides in Coloroad, some "big" clims on that also
Hi oldwelshman, your post appeared as I was typing mine.
I too have been plotting to join the Madmen of Ventoux for a while now; I've got half a mind to have a pop at it in July as I'm going to be in Provence anyway. Unfortunately it's a family holiday so I'll be doing it on my lonesome, but whether or not I do I'd definitely be interested in a forum outing!0 -
nasahapley wrote:I've just come back from the Lakes; on Monday I followed the Fred Whitton route from Braithwaite down to Hardknott and Wrynose. I've seen (and been scared by!) many pictures of Hardknott on the 'net, but when I saw it in the flesh I have to say my heart dropped; it just doesn't look possible! I'd been up Wrynose east the day before and that looked (and was) seriously tough, but this looked in a different league.
Anyway, I'm glad to say I managed to get up the first steep section in the saddle without resorting to bottom gear, but when it came to the 35% section between the hairpins the 30-25 was engaged and standing was the only option. Once I'd done that I knew there was no way I was going to be beat, and I wasn't! I crawled along the valley to Wrynose and really suffered on that but again got up it without stopping. It was such a good feeling knowing that I'd managed the toughest climb in Britain - and a big confidence booster for the FWC.
I'd previously climbed most of the other notorious climbs in northern England (Park Rash, Honister, Wrynose east, Rosedale etc), but Hardknott is definitely the hardest I've ever done - it's unreal.
I must say I laughed when I saw your entry
Its a different ballgame in the flesh aint it? Its just the most gobsmacking climb ever, I too have did most of all the other real toughies in the UK...I've also did Park rash,Honister,Bealach Na Ba,Rosedale Chimney,Boltby bank and the list goes on...I must say you should experience the Struggle from Ambleside..I'd say thats the 4th toughest I've did in the UK...
I agree, Wrynose East is another monster, I wouldnt fancy that at 100miles either!
But whats worse on the FWC as when you hit the small climb of Irton Pike at 93miles your legs really feel the pain and thats a tiddler for whats coming next...having THAT climb at 100miles after just so many disgracefully hard climbs is what the FWC is all about, I really respect the other climbs on the FWC, especially Honister immediatley followed by Newlands...but Hardknott is where its at...its the only one I really worry about as I know it could beat me...it hasnt yet but I think one day it may smile maybe this May?
P.s IMO I reckon Bwlch Y Groes from Dinas Mawddwy in North Wales is every bit as tough, its just so unrelentingly steep and long and you can see the whole thing laid out straight in front of you...that also had near everyone off there bikes on the Wild Wales Challenge...this and Hardknott West are the top 2 in the UK for me...
You can see photo's of the infamous Bwlch Y Groes...
http://will49.zenfolio.com/p562427729/? ... #105896676
Have a scroll through, you should be able to get an idea....0.4km at 12%, 1 km at 14%, 1 km at 16%...brutal.0 -
Great posts about Hardknott-it really does deserve respect on the FWColdwelshman wrote:I wanted to have a go at the 3 in a day this year but could noit get any mates to join me so doing Marmotte instead
Maybe we could get a "forum" team to have a go nexct year?
I would have a go, if not I will go to USA and do one of the week rides in Coloroad, some "big" clims on that also
I'd be up for that-I know the area well having been a cycle guide there the last couple of years-take spouses if you like. I can recommend an intinerary to keep them happy if you need an excuse-and you will be in serious need of brownie points after the Treviso trip
Avignon is a lovely town not too far away-best of all for me, Flybe do Exeter (about 40mins away) to Avignon
oh, and btw, don't think you're getting off lightly by doing the Marmotte instead of the Cingles de Ventoux-there is 500m more climbing on the Marmotte.
Look forward to getting your ride report. Have you a target time?“It is by riding a bicycle that you learn the contours of a country best..." Ernest Hemingway0 -
Ken Night wrote:Great posts about Hardknott-it really does deserve respect on the FWColdwelshman wrote:I wanted to have a go at the 3 in a day this year but could noit get any mates to join me so doing Marmotte instead
Maybe we could get a "forum" team to have a go nexct year?
I would have a go, if not I will go to USA and do one of the week rides in Coloroad, some "big" clims on that also
I'd be up for that-I know the area well having been a cycle guide there the last couple of years-take spouses if you like. I can recommend an intinerary to keep them happy if you need an excuse-and you will be in serious need of brownie points after the Treviso trip
Avignon is a lovely town not too far away-best of all for me, Flybe do Exeter (about 40mins away) to Avignon
oh, and btw, don't think you're getting off lightly by doing the Marmotte instead of the Cingles de Ventoux-there is 500m more climbing on the Marmotte.
Look forward to getting your ride report. Have you a target time?
Well as its only my second year back I have no idea of times for Marmotte, only target is to complete it withoug getting off, may be 8hrs ish.
Last year I did Pinarello Gran Fondo and did 6:33 and was pretty fit for that, so if I can get right training in would hopt to get inder 6:30 for that but it will take some doing.
I always struggle for first 40 miles or so In Pinarello they give split times and for first two was in the top 600 but for last two was in the top 200 so would be nice if I could feel better at start of rides 0 -
The region around Hardknott certainly looks like a lovely place to ride. Lots of open space and green rolling hills.
But as this is a training for steep hills thread, I thought I'd add that I've just discovered a positively LETHAL road/street combination here in Tenerife. If you're looking for steep inclines I think I have the next "world's steepest street" candidates. I challenge anyone to get up that on any bicycle.
Link a few streets up & we are talking 292 - 997 metres in 2.9km, for a 24.3% average gradient. It makes Tierra del Trigo look flat.
Monroy Street:
Here's the top section of Monroy st with its ~40% incline: :twisted: :twisted: :twisted:
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urban_winter wrote:I'm signed up for the Frank Whitton challenge. My aim is simply to finish and not to walk. I'll be riding a compact chainset - so lowest gear will be 34x27. I am moderately fit but heavy (93kg) and not good at hills. I live in Wimbledon so I'm a bit short of long 1:4 hills on which to practice.
What kind of specific training is going to help me to get up the hills?
My thoughts so far:
- lots of hill repeats on smaller hills
- build leg strength by climbing in much higher gears than usual
- lose as much weight as possible before the event
Ideas?
U.
I've said this many times before so what the hell I'll say it again. TA Speciaties sells
a 33 tooth compact front ring if you're looking for just a little extra edge.
Dennis Noward0
