Today's discussion about the news
Comments
-
-
So how do you solve the demographic problem of more dependents (old and young) and fewer people working?
0 -
It certainly costs a ****load if you don't process their applications and need to keep them in hotels, or many factors of that if you want to put them in a Daily Mail headline grabbing way like a barge or converted airfield base in the middle of nowhere.
If you sent back the ones with spurious claims and let the rest work, not so much.
1 -
I have no idea. If they are here illegally, they can't claim any benefits, cant register to use schools, GPs etc - what are they receiving from the state?
0 -
I'd say it's largely because, from the point of view of young people, Tories have largely been useless for the past 14 years, and poisoned the reputation of "right wing" policies.
Plus Farage is a pub bore and doesn't really even try to appeal to anyone young.
I could see more far right stuff among the young if Stephen Yaxley Lennon was to use his Tommy Robinson character to try and get more traction in mainstream politics.
0 -
I think it was a "bad interview". Her Twitterings on the subject are very good. Maybe someone else writes them for her!
I think the idea of the Tories' recent move in this area is to make it clear that the protected characteristic is biological sex, not sex on birth certificate etc. after getting a Gender Recognition Certificate.
My understanding is that the intention of the Equality Act is that biological sex is the protected characteristic, but with the waters being muddied somewhat in recent years.
But there's a court case due fairly soon, which will clarify the situation. The Tories' recent move is just bandwagon-jumping really, given there were several actions in and since the May era that have actually promoted the muddying of the waters.
0 -
I was actually referring to First Aspect, given their comment that explicitly referred to the "gender identify wars", not the general population of culture warriors.
0 -
Don't think they receive much themselves, but someone does nicely via renting out the barge and temporary accommodation etc.
0 -
I still don't want to go down the rabbit hole on this. My interpretation was that Tory HQ think it will be helpful in terms of their base support, but probably haven't thought too much past that.
0 -
How many trans people have people actually spoken to in their lives? And how many hands do you need to count it?
I meet people for a living so I think I meet people more than most and I can confidently say I've spoken to two transgender people in my entire life. It was fine.
Is it really an issue outside of sports and prisons?
0 -
Elections. It's an issue in elections.
And this is the thing. It is a small minority and, as we established earlier, the Tories aren't afraid to leverage a small out group for their own gain.
0 -
They are not illegal immigrants on the barge or staying hotels though
0 -
Ah but they've changed the law so that almost all asylum seekers get here illegally.
0 -
None. I believe it is an issue for changing rooms and toilets as well.
0 -
If you're not meeting a diverse set of people, then meeting people for a living doesn't really add much though?
The counter argument here is that you've met a couple that didn't pass, but could have met 10s/100s etc that did "pass".
I feel like it's a "debate" that takes up way too much political energy. I suspect most are pretty much live and let live, but with some pretty hard red lines, which internet activists would find distasteful.
0 -
To put it bluntly, if you have to try and come over in a small boat, you're less likely to have the sort of skills and qualifications to put you in a decent paying job. So many of them will be in jobs that means they are net recipients - that's if they can get jobs.
"I spent most of my money on birds, booze and fast cars: the rest of it I just squandered." [George Best]0 -
What do the data say on that Stevo?
0 -
No I don't think it's an issue outside of quite limited situations - though I do think that in those situations the rights of biological women should be protected.
I've spoken to quite a few more trans women than 2 - but yeah 2 or 20 it's not a big number - and I have seen them make a difference in sport but I did spend 7 years coaching womens football.
[Castle Donington Ladies FC - going up in '22]0 -
So you're saying they need a bigger boat?
- Genesis Croix de Fer
- Dolan Tuono0 -
What is it about finance that makes you think it filters for gender identity?
0 -
Sure, but we are talking about the difference between the UK and rest of Europe. Integration of immigrants in France or Germany or Italy is much poorer than the UK, with immigrant communities experiencing lower relative educational attainment, lower relative earnings and the immigrant population is just much more separate. So they are starting from a much more 'us and them' viewpoint and those concerns you mention are the situation rather than just a concern.
1985 Mercian King of Mercia - work in progress (Hah! Who am I kidding?)
Pinnacle Monzonite
Part of the anti-growth coalition0 -
It's negligible. We've been through all that before.
1985 Mercian King of Mercia - work in progress (Hah! Who am I kidding?)
Pinnacle Monzonite
Part of the anti-growth coalition0 -
Have we? Info please.
"I spent most of my money on birds, booze and fast cars: the rest of it I just squandered." [George Best]0 -
As a thought experiment, look forward a few years to when your then teenage daughter will be likely using public changing rooms and imagine how she, you and her Mum will feel if she's obliged to change next to a fully intact male, or else change in the toilets, or simply not bother doing what she'd planned on doing that required changing rooms.
Anything that potentially adversely affects 50% of the population to keep 0.1% of the population happy has to at least raise the odd eyebrow.
0 -
I could only find one source which conceded that they are a burden but was trying to soften it by saying 'but not as much as people think'. If you have any data to support there being boatloads of astrophysicist and sussessful entrepreneurs crossing the channel, let me know.
"I spent most of my money on birds, booze and fast cars: the rest of it I just squandered." [George Best]0 -
From what I've read, the overwhelming view in the UK is that blokes can do what they want (observing existing laws), dress how they want, call themselves what they want etc. but that they should keep out of female sports (but be welcomed in male sport even if they present as women) and keep out of female "spaces" (e.g. changing rooms and intimate medical care where a female practitioner is requested) and be kept out of female prisons.
And just on the basis of how human nature works, the vast majority of trans women have absolutely no nefarious intent, but unfortunately, there will be those who will exploit whatever legal / regulatory avenues they can in order to behave in a less "wholesome" way.
0 -
The entire budget to deal with all aspects of immigration is under a billion. This includes bunging cash to suspect African governments to pretend they will take asylum applicants. Out of a total of ~£1.15trn for all public spending. Less than 0.1%.
1985 Mercian King of Mercia - work in progress (Hah! Who am I kidding?)
Pinnacle Monzonite
Part of the anti-growth coalition0 -
My daughter is 21 and has lived a relatively 'normal' life, uni, socialising, dance societies, festivals etc. I'm just not sure where any of these communal changing areas are nowadays? Sports centres are all often cubicled or cordoned off. Shop changing rooms are never open areas any more. There is so much more danger just being outside in 'normal' society at night, but it seems much less of a concern for people.
I saw a clip of a comedian the other day, he was speculating that a person who was minded that he would commit a sexual assualt on someone would be put off doing so if they were not really meant to go into a changing room ....
2020/2021/2022 Metric Century Challenge Winner0 -
-
For trans women to potentially adversely affect all women there would need to be a lot more trans people and for all of them to be in it with some kind of ulterior motive.
We have a trans woman in my office. It's a complete non issue.
- Genesis Croix de Fer
- Dolan Tuono0
