Team Sky to end in 2019
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So the 25m teams all disappear and we're left with the 15m teams. But just as now sponsors will work out that they can get value for money with 7m. So we have 15m teams dominating 7m teams. And then 15m teams fail and every says how good it is . And sponsors look to see what they can get for 4m.Gweeds wrote:It’s the same logic Vaughters applies.
When sponsors look at Sky and see they’d need £25m+ to get a seat at the GT tables they look elsewhere.
£12-15m with a number of teams at that level equalises things and makes it more appealing overall. Similar concept to a salary cap.
What the sport needs is the 15m teams upgrading to 25m. But due to the fragile nature of the sports financial model if a team has a solid 15m sponsor they're not going to jeopardise that by shopping around for an upgrade.Twitter: @RichN950 -
Gweeds wrote:It’s the same logic Vaughters applies.
When sponsors look at Sky and see they’d need £25m+ to get a seat at the GT tables they look elsewhere.
£12-15m with a number of teams at that level equalises things and makes it more appealing overall. Similar concept to a salary cap.
I think a budget cap would be great for the sport.
He isn't the best example but this situation is exactly what bjarne riis predicted a couple of years back. A budget cap could help stabilise and secure the long term future of teams, whilst also levelling out the playing field. Nfl is a good example as the salary cap pretty much ensures a different side wins the superbowl every year.
All this said, after reading various reports and comments, I suspect DB will be able to find a replacement sponsor who is willing to invest a similar amount. I would keep an eye on Amazon who seem desperate to make a plunge in to sport broadcasting and also even Facebook.0 -
I wonder if Branson is interested?0
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RichN95 wrote:
So the 25m teams all disappear and we're left with the 15m teams. But just as now sponsors will work out that they can get value for money with 7m. So we have 15m teams dominating 7m teams. And then 15m teams fail and every says how good it is . And sponsors look to see what they can get for 4m.Gweeds wrote:It’s the same logic Vaughters applies.
When sponsors look at Sky and see they’d need £25m+ to get a seat at the GT tables they look elsewhere.
£12-15m with a number of teams at that level equalises things and makes it more appealing overall. Similar concept to a salary cap.
What the sport needs is the 15m teams upgrading to 25m. But due to the fragile nature of the sports financial model if a team has a solid 15m sponsor they're not going to jeopardise that by shopping around for an upgrade.
There's no easy answer.
What was interesting was the point that it's the numbers around the likes of Red Bull and F1 title sponsorship. Because of the prize money and TV revenues it only costs them around £8m net annually for an entire F1 team (despite an annual spend of around £250m). The costs are huge but so are the financial rewards. Add in the global audience for F1 and what would you choose. £8m on F1 or £20m on cycling?Napoleon, don't be jealous that I've been chatting online with babes all day. Besides, we both know that I'm training to be a cage fighter.0 -
I agree, if only because Sky bankrolled the "hard part" of actually getting the team up and running and into their current leading position. Anyone coming in is pretty much onto a dead cert in terms of exposure and results.redvision wrote:All this said, after reading various reports and comments, I suspect DB will be able to find a replacement sponsor who is willing to invest a similar amount0 -
When was there a time when different people won the Tour every year?redvision wrote:
I think a budget cap would be great for the sport.
He isn't the best example but this situation is exactly what bjarne riis predicted a couple of years back. A budget cap could help stabilise and secure the long term future of teams, whilst also levelling out the playing field. Nfl is a good example as the salary cap pretty much ensures a different side wins the superbowl every year.
Was it when Contador won three despite bans and exclusions? Or was it when Armstrong won seven in a row? No it must have been when Indurain won five in a row? Of course there was a period in the late 80s that many hark back to, but LeMond still won three despite being shot? Before that there was Hinault with 11 Grand Tour wins and before that the golden age of Merckx winning absolutely everything. Anquetil, Bobet, Coppi?Twitter: @RichN950 -
True. Put into that context cycling's business model really is archaic for a global sport in the 21st century.Gweeds wrote:What was interesting was the point that it's the numbers around the likes of Red Bull and F1 title sponsorship. Because of the prize money and TV revenues it only costs them around £8m net annually for an entire F1 team (despite an annual spend of around £250m). The costs are huge but so are the financial rewards. Add in the global audience for F1 and what would you choose. £8m on F1 or £20m on cycling?0 -
RichN95 wrote:When was there a time when different people won the Tour every year?
Was it when Contador won three despite bans and exclusions? Or was it when Armstrong won seven in a row? No it must have been when Indurain won five in a row? Of course there was a period in the late 80s that many hark back to, but LeMond still won three despite being shot? Before that there was Hinault with 11 Grand Tour wins and before that the golden age of Merckx winning absolutely everything. Anquetil, Bobet, Coppi?
That's true, however you can't deny that there is currently no team who can compete (realistically) with sky at the moment. As far as I can remember there has never been a team who had such resources that they could win different gt's each year with different riders.
A budget cap would mean no team could have all the best riders (unless those riders were willing to take a lower salary), allowing other teams to strengthen and compete.
In an ideal world of course.0 -
lettingthedaysgoby wrote:
I agree, if only because Sky bankrolled the "hard part" of actually getting the team up and running and into their current leading position. Anyone coming in is pretty much onto a dead cert in terms of exposure and results.redvision wrote:All this said, after reading various reports and comments, I suspect DB will be able to find a replacement sponsor who is willing to invest a similar amount
Is it actually Brailsford can do though? My understanding is that in most teams his equivalent holds the WT licence themselves but in this case isn't it Sky that own the licence so it's more than just bringing in a new sponsor to take on the 'naming rights' otherwise there's a WT licence going spare for another team (existing Pro Conti or new team) to take over. Is that the case?0 -
Yeah, there are.redvision wrote:That's true, however you can't deny that there is currently no team who can compete (realistically) with sky at the moment. As far as I can remember there has never been a team who had such resources that they could win different gt's each year with different riders.
There are plenty of strong teams around (best GC result in brackets)
Movistar: Quintana (1), Valverde (1), Landa (3), Amador (4), Carapaz (5) + Soler
Mitchelton: S.Yates (1), Chaves (2), A.Yates (4), Kreuziger (5), Nieve (8) + Haig
Lotto J: Roglic (4), Krijswijk (4), Bennett (8), Gesink (5) + Kuss
The problem is that many teams spread their best 8 around rather or support a sprinter rather than committing fully (which they understandably don't do because they understand that the best rider usual wins, and they don't have the best rider).Twitter: @RichN950 -
I would assume, given SDB's attention to detail and considerations for everything (I mean this genuineley, not being a sark) that he has some kind of business continuity plan for this eventuality?
He may have been surprised by the actual announcement, but he's not daft enough to think it would never happen.
My guess would be that he could well have potential sponsors waiting in the wings ... or any type of consortium that could step up.2020/2021/2022 Metric Century Challenge Winner0 -
that would be a big step up for an organisation that doesnt even have a decent medical records system in place.CarbonClem wrote:I would assume, given SDB's attention to detail and considerations for everything (I mean this genuineley, not being a sark) that he has some kind of business continuity plan for this eventuality?
He may have been surprised by the actual announcement, but he's not daft enough to think it would never happen.
My guess would be that he could well have potential sponsors waiting in the wings ... or any type of consortium that could step up.0 -
Vino'sGhost wrote:
that would be a big step up for an organisation that doesnt even have a decent medical records system in place.CarbonClem wrote:I would assume, given SDB's attention to detail and considerations for everything (I mean this genuineley, not being a sark) that he has some kind of business continuity plan for this eventuality?
He may have been surprised by the actual announcement, but he's not daft enough to think it would never happen.
My guess would be that he could well have potential sponsors waiting in the wings ... or any type of consortium that could step up.
They want to get the logistical side of things sorted firstI'm sorry you don't believe in miracles0 -
RichN95 wrote:
When was there a time when different people won the Tour every year?redvision wrote:
I think a budget cap would be great for the sport.
He isn't the best example but this situation is exactly what bjarne riis predicted a couple of years back. A budget cap could help stabilise and secure the long term future of teams, whilst also levelling out the playing field. Nfl is a good example as the salary cap pretty much ensures a different side wins the superbowl every year.
Was it when Contador won three despite bans and exclusions? Or was it when Armstrong won seven in a row? No it must have been when Indurain won five in a row? Of course there was a period in the late 80s that many hark back to, but LeMond still won three despite being shot? Before that there was Hinault with 11 Grand Tour wins and before that the golden age of Merckx winning absolutely everything. Anquetil, Bobet, Coppi?
There are far more structural differences with NFL than a salary cap - the way the ownership, franchise system, drafts and fixtures etc etc work in NFL also conspires to level things.
Also doesn't hurt that it is the richest sports league in the world and supported by a massive college football system and wall to wall TV coverage.
The structure of NFL is fundamentally completely different to cycling - not suggesting that an NFL type model is necessarily something to aspire to, but if we wanted that for cycling it would have to be a complete structural reform of the sport not just playing around the edges with salary caps.0 -
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Vino'sGhost wrote:
I didn't think the piece actually read too badly once you got past the headline. Unlike the drivel that Roan keeps spouting over and over and over again.0 -
IMrB123 wrote:Vino'sGhost wrote:
I didn't think the piece actually read too badly once you got past the headline. Unlike the drivel that Roan keeps spouting over and over and over again.
I think youre right. but mostly because fro a relatively long piece by BBC standards it doesn't really say much at all.0 -
I wonder if Elon Musk would consider sponsoring, he appears to not be daunted by lack of profit, and would be good exposure.
Team Tesla 8)Felt F70 05 (Turbo)
Marin Palisades Trail 91 and 06
Scott CR1 SL 12
Cannondale Synapse Adventure 15 & 16 Di2
Scott Foil 180 -
Theyd turn up lateDaniel B wrote:I wonder if Elon Musk would consider sponsoring, he appears to not be daunted by lack of profit, and would be good exposure.
Team Tesla 8)
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Vino'sGhost wrote:
Theyd turn up lateDaniel B wrote:I wonder if Elon Musk would consider sponsoring, he appears to not be daunted by lack of profit, and would be good exposure.
Team Tesla 8)
But wear solar panel helmets, and potentially have electric motors?
EDIT: Tuther Mr B beat me to it!Felt F70 05 (Turbo)
Marin Palisades Trail 91 and 06
Scott CR1 SL 12
Cannondale Synapse Adventure 15 & 16 Di2
Scott Foil 180 -
Daniel B wrote:I wonder if Elon Musk would consider sponsoring, he appears to not be daunted by lack of profit, and would be good exposure.
Team Tesla 8)
Musk is at least as much of a stereotype Bond villain as the Murdochs, would be a good fit0 -
Daniel B wrote:I wonder if Elon Musk would consider sponsoring, he appears to not be daunted by lack of profit, and would be good exposure.
Team Tesla 8)
They are already a global name, not sure they need additional coverage?
I always thought that Hema would be a good once, Dutch company that was/is trying to expand into the UK.
But now, I think that Uniqlo would be a great shout.....Massive company, making a big push to get into Europe, They are paying Federer for 10 years the same as Sky would cost. Maybe Federer would give more coverage, but doubt it actually. You never mention Team Federer Uniqlo, you just see their logo on his t-shirt and him in their adverts, which also costs lots of money.Scott Addict 2011
Giant TCR 20120 -
lettingthedaysgoby wrote:
I agree, if only because Sky bankrolled the "hard part" of actually getting the team up and running and into their current leading position. Anyone coming in is pretty much onto a dead cert in terms of exposure and results.redvision wrote:All this said, after reading various reports and comments, I suspect DB will be able to find a replacement sponsor who is willing to invest a similar amount
And they can buy "grey area" and "ethical" problems and history without having to home grow them.0 -
While we all speculate as to where a new sponsor may come from, a possible avenue can be found in this photo:
Froome, Poels and Rosa with Cameron Wurf in black on the right. Also in black at back some bloke from Wells Fargo.
But the person in white? I mentioned him a few pages back. That's Kevin Systrom, billionaire founder of Instagram. While he's now left Instagram and Facebook, he's still Palo Alto royalty and a mad keen cyclist (half his own Instagram is bike related). He seems like the sort of person who might want to get involved.Twitter: @RichN950 -
thegreatdivide wrote:I wonder if Branson is interested?
Wasn't Virgin almost a sponsor once ? Apparently they were about to announce a team - kit was made and something fell through. Wasn't that how Team Brite came about ?0 -
Fernando Alonso?0
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cougie wrote:thegreatdivide wrote:I wonder if Branson is interested?
Wasn't Virgin almost a sponsor once ? Apparently they were about to announce a team - kit was made and something fell through. Wasn't that how Team Brite came about ?
Knowing how he dealt with his F1 sponsorship with BrawnGP and then his own team there is no way I'd see him getting involved.0 -
thegreatdivide wrote:I wonder if Branson is interested?
That is a good point!We're in danger of confusing passion with incompetence
- @ddraver0
