Antonio Tiberi Cat Killer

DeVlaeminck
DeVlaeminck Posts: 8,738
Bit of an unusual one this - Trek Sega Fredo rider suspended for shooting a cat.
[Castle Donington Ladies FC - going up in '22]
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  • blazing_saddles
    blazing_saddles Posts: 21,812
    edited March 2023
    I read about this on the site that only prints stories that involves cycling scandal: the BBC.
    Test fired an air gun into his neighbour’s cat. His neighbour being the San Marino minister for tourism.

    21 and dumb.
    Strange how he recognises that his actions were shameful after the fact.
    "Science is a tool for cheaters". An anonymous French PE teacher.
  • flite
    flite Posts: 219
    "The 21-year-old rider reportedly said he was trying out an air rifle and pointed it at the cat's head and fired."
    Speechless...
  • First.Aspect
    First.Aspect Posts: 14,626
    Suspended?
  • orraloon
    orraloon Posts: 12,675
    A step on down from Kurt Zouma then.
  • Pross
    Pross Posts: 40,490
    I wonder if he fancies coming on safari to my house to bag a trophy with whichever cat it is that keeps s***ing on my lawn.
  • kingstongraham
    kingstongraham Posts: 26,231
    I'm not certain that if I were a cat charity he's exactly who I'd want helping out in person.
  • First.Aspect
    First.Aspect Posts: 14,626
    Pross said:

    I wonder if he fancies coming on safari to my house to bag a trophy with whichever cat it is that keeps s***ing on my lawn.

    Yeah hilarious.
  • First.Aspect
    First.Aspect Posts: 14,626

    I'm not certain that if I were a cat charity he's exactly who I'd want helping out in person.

    Animal cruelty often signals deeper psychological problems.

    Or he could just be a cnut.

    And is in any case sufficiently bad that it merits him being fired and sponsors washing their hands of him anyway.
  • ugo.santalucia
    ugo.santalucia Posts: 28,244
    Pross said:

    I wonder if he fancies coming on safari to my house to bag a trophy with whichever cat it is that keeps s***ing on my lawn.

    I have already signed him up, sorry…

    left the forum March 2023
  • DeVlaeminck
    DeVlaeminck Posts: 8,738
    My first thought was surely they are going to sack him - in a sport that is funded almost entirely by sponsors shooting a pet cat is pretty toxic.

    I've seen the argument on twitter that he's apologised and it would be harsh to basically end his career for this one incident. Also others argue that if we eat farmed meat we are hypocrites if we react strongly to this - presumably those people are wanting us to stop eating meat rather than start shooting cats.

    It's a difficult one - my gut instinct is anyone who can point a gun at their neighbour's cat and kill it just for fun has something in their psychology that is unpleasant and dangerous.
    [Castle Donington Ladies FC - going up in '22]
  • ugo.santalucia
    ugo.santalucia Posts: 28,244
    My point is that his cycling career has nothing to do with this and unless the sponsor pulls out, then I see no reason to sack him.
    There is a judicial system, and that should not be in addition to but should replace the social media tribunal…
    It is time to fuxxing mind our own business a bit more, don’t you think?
    left the forum March 2023
  • redvision
    redvision Posts: 2,958
    Sorry Ugo but have to disagree.
    The only reason you would shoot at a living creature is to kill it. This incident is absolutely appalling and there is no justification.
    If he had shot a human would you still be saying it shouldn't affect his career??

    I just think this is another example of a sportsman who has the god complex and thinks he can do what he wants.

    Oh, and his apology seemed pretty forced to me. I don't think it was at all sincere and just a reflection of his desperate attempt to save his contract.
  • pblakeney
    pblakeney Posts: 25,750
    edited March 2023

    My point is that his cycling career has nothing to do with this and unless the sponsor pulls out, then I see no reason to sack him.
    There is a judicial system, and that should not be in addition to but should replace the social media tribunal…
    It is time to fuxxing mind our own business a bit more, don’t you think?

    Not these days. The court of public opinion trumps all. 🤪
    Pitchforks at the ready, off with his head...
    The above may be fact, or fiction, I may be serious, I may be jesting.
    I am not sure. You have no chance.
    Veronese68 wrote:
    PB is the most sensible person on here.
  • ugo.santalucia
    ugo.santalucia Posts: 28,244
    redvision said:

    Sorry Ugo but have to disagree.
    The only reason you would shoot at a living creature is to kill it. This incident is absolutely appalling and there is no justification.
    If he had shot a human would you still be saying it shouldn't affect his career??

    I just think this is another example of a sportsman who has the god complex and thinks he can do what he wants.

    Oh, and his apology seemed pretty forced to me. I don't think it was at all sincere and just a reflection of his desperate attempt to save his contract.

    So precluding him from doing his job is a good outcome for society then?
    What is he going to do? Is driving a fork lift instead of riding a bicycle a just punishment?
    If I was to shoot my neighbour’s cat, I would not expect to lose my job as a result… it would be stupid of society to put me on benefits for a crime that has nothing to do with my daily job… I think this trend of social media deciding what is the right punishment for a crime has to end. It will be a judge to decide the right punishment, not people on forums
    left the forum March 2023
  • redvision
    redvision Posts: 2,958
    As far as I'm concerned animal cruelty should be severely punished. Simple as that. And not with a pathetic mickey mouse slap on the wrist.

    He is a sportsman doing a job many people would give anything to do. Too many of these 'stars' believe they are above the law and can do what they want. He's brought the sport in to disrepute and should be punished according by the UCI, as well as by the police/ justice system.

    I'm not saying stop his career full stop, but he should be punished to a degree that he sincerely regrets his actions, not just losing his pay packet for a short period.

  • DeVlaeminck
    DeVlaeminck Posts: 8,738

    My point is that his cycling career has nothing to do with this and unless the sponsor pulls out, then I see no reason to sack him.
    There is a judicial system, and that should not be in addition to but should replace the social media tribunal…
    It is time to fuxxing mind our own business a bit more, don’t you think?


    No not really - in a sport that relies on publicity killing a cat in that way is relevant.

    As I say I can see both sides to it - is it fair to destroy a career over it but at the same time with the way we look at pets in our society he's brought a lot of bad publicity to the brand.

    Whether he deserves to be sacked - I think I'd say yes but with the opportunity to come back if his results deserve it - of course that may be unrealistic as unless he is outstanding it'll always be easier to employ another rider of similar ability who hasn't killed a cat and for that reason alone I might say fair enough give him a second chance at Trek.
    [Castle Donington Ladies FC - going up in '22]
  • ugo.santalucia
    ugo.santalucia Posts: 28,244
    redvision said:

    As far as I'm concerned animal cruelty should be severely punished. Simple as that. And not with a pathetic mickey mouse slap on the wrist.

    He is a sportsman doing a job many people would give anything to do. Too many of these 'stars' believe they are above the law and can do what they want. He's brought the sport in to disrepute and should be punished according by the UCI, as well as by the police/ justice system.

    I'm not saying stop his career full stop, but he should be punished to a degree that he sincerely regrets his actions, not just losing his pay packet for a short period.

    If you feel strongly about it, campaign to change the law. But the law does not say that you have to lose your job over a crime that is unrelated, so let us stick to the law, rather than throw stones when we feel like.

    As for starts doing what they want.. they do face the justice like everybody else… ask once superstar Ronaldinho… among others

    left the forum March 2023
  • ugo.santalucia
    ugo.santalucia Posts: 28,244

    My point is that his cycling career has nothing to do with this and unless the sponsor pulls out, then I see no reason to sack him.
    There is a judicial system, and that should not be in addition to but should replace the social media tribunal…
    It is time to fuxxing mind our own business a bit more, don’t you think?


    No not really - in a sport that relies on publicity killing a cat in that way is relevant.

    As I say I can see both sides to it - is it fair to destroy a career over it but at the same time with the way we look at pets in our society he's brought a lot of bad publicity to the brand.

    Whether he deserves to be sacked - I think I'd say yes but with the opportunity to come back if his results deserve it - of course that may be unrealistic as unless he is outstanding it'll always be easier to employ another rider of similar ability who hasn't killed a cat and for that reason alone I might say fair enough give him a second chance at Trek.
    Some think he is the new Nibali…
    We have (not) seen a few Pantani already, so don’t hold your breath

    left the forum March 2023
  • redvision
    redvision Posts: 2,958
    A punishment should act to deter others from committing the same crime. Last year there was the kurt Zouma incident and he got a slap on the wrist and continued his career. This latest incident of a sports star committing a similar offence of animal cruelty shows that the punishment handed to Zouma was not sufficient to stop others doing the same or similar.

    Sorry but he has deliberately shot a living creature, which is wrong, just cruel, and against the law. Therefore he should face the consequences and if that means his career is affected or stopped then so be it.
  • First.Aspect
    First.Aspect Posts: 14,626

    redvision said:

    Sorry Ugo but have to disagree.
    The only reason you would shoot at a living creature is to kill it. This incident is absolutely appalling and there is no justification.
    If he had shot a human would you still be saying it shouldn't affect his career??

    I just think this is another example of a sportsman who has the god complex and thinks he can do what he wants.

    Oh, and his apology seemed pretty forced to me. I don't think it was at all sincere and just a reflection of his desperate attempt to save his contract.

    So precluding him from doing his job is a good outcome for society then?
    What is he going to do? Is driving a fork lift instead of riding a bicycle a just punishment?
    If I was to shoot my neighbour’s cat, I would not expect to lose my job as a result… it would be stupid of society to put me on benefits for a crime that has nothing to do with my daily job… I think this trend of social media deciding what is the right punishment for a crime has to end. It will be a judge to decide the right punishment, not people on forums
    Not that I'm advocating you try it Ugo, but if you did something criminal but not related to your job, you may in fact get sacked. It would depend on the severity of the offense and the effect on your employer and your relationship with the employer. There have been many cases of people getting into hot water through social media, for example.

    If you are a cycling team funded by sponsorship, and an animal cruelty conviction or admission by one of your high profile employees would be damaging to the company, dismissal is both a distinct possibility and pretty reasonable.
  • ugo.santalucia
    ugo.santalucia Posts: 28,244
    redvision said:

    A punishment should act to deter others from committing the same crime. Last year there was the kurt Zouma incident and he got a slap on the wrist and continued his career. This latest incident of a sports star committing a similar offence of animal cruelty shows that the punishment handed to Zouma was not sufficient to stop others doing the same or similar.

    Sorry but he has deliberately shot a living creature, which is wrong, just cruel, and against the law. Therefore he should face the consequences and if that means his career is affected or stopped then so be it.

    Point is, it should not be you or else to decide. A judge will decide the punishment and his team will decide his fate. If his team manager decided that he is fit to continue, then you have to accept it. Support another rider or another team, by all means, but do not get in the way of other people lives and decisions… live and let live. I am sick of people having to make decisions based on social media pressure. Social media do not even represent the majority of views… just the loudest slice of society

    left the forum March 2023
  • webboo
    webboo Posts: 6,087

    redvision said:

    Sorry Ugo but have to disagree.
    The only reason you would shoot at a living creature is to kill it. This incident is absolutely appalling and there is no justification.
    If he had shot a human would you still be saying it shouldn't affect his career??

    I just think this is another example of a sportsman who has the god complex and thinks he can do what he wants.

    Oh, and his apology seemed pretty forced to me. I don't think it was at all sincere and just a reflection of his desperate attempt to save his contract.

    So precluding him from doing his job is a good outcome for society then?
    What is he going to do? Is driving a fork lift instead of riding a bicycle a just punishment?
    If I was to shoot my neighbour’s cat, I would not expect to lose my job as a result… it would be stupid of society to put me on benefits for a crime that has nothing to do with my daily job… I think this trend of social media deciding what is the right punishment for a crime has to end. It will be a judge to decide the right punishment, not people on forums
    As a nurse I would have lost my job and been struck of the nursing register for shooting a neighbours cat. I would be appalled that if you did the same and as an educator of young people you did not lose your job.
  • blazing_saddles
    blazing_saddles Posts: 21,812
    edited March 2023
    redvision said:

    A punishment should act to deter others from committing the same crime. Last year there was the kurt Zouma incident and he got a slap on the wrist and continued his career. This latest incident of a sports star committing a similar offence of animal cruelty shows that the punishment handed to Zouma was not sufficient to stop others doing the same or similar.

    Sorry but he has deliberately shot a living creature, which is wrong, just cruel, and against the law. Therefore he should face the consequences and if that means his career is affected or stopped then so be it.

    Out of interest, how do you stand on Chris Froome feeding live rabbits to his pet snakes?

    As a boy, Chris Froome had two unusual pets: a pair of pythons. They needed feeding, and their meals had to be alive. Mice at first, then rats. But as they grew they needed something more filling. So he raided the rabbit hutches in the kindergarten across the road.

    “Young children would arrive at the class next day and their little baby bunny rabbits would be gone,” he wrote in last year’s autobiography....


    https://www.independent.co.uk/news/people/chris-froome-rider-on-the-storm-10415129.html

    4 times TDF champion, or random manual labourer?
    "Science is a tool for cheaters". An anonymous French PE teacher.
  • ugo.santalucia
    ugo.santalucia Posts: 28,244

    redvision said:

    Sorry Ugo but have to disagree.
    The only reason you would shoot at a living creature is to kill it. This incident is absolutely appalling and there is no justification.
    If he had shot a human would you still be saying it shouldn't affect his career??

    I just think this is another example of a sportsman who has the god complex and thinks he can do what he wants.

    Oh, and his apology seemed pretty forced to me. I don't think it was at all sincere and just a reflection of his desperate attempt to save his contract.

    So precluding him from doing his job is a good outcome for society then?
    What is he going to do? Is driving a fork lift instead of riding a bicycle a just punishment?
    If I was to shoot my neighbour’s cat, I would not expect to lose my job as a result… it would be stupid of society to put me on benefits for a crime that has nothing to do with my daily job… I think this trend of social media deciding what is the right punishment for a crime has to end. It will be a judge to decide the right punishment, not people on forums
    Not that I'm advocating you try it Ugo, but if you did something criminal but not related to your job, you may in fact get sacked. It would depend on the severity of the offense and the effect on your employer and your relationship with the employer. There have been many cases of people getting into hot water through social media, for example.

    If you are a cycling team funded by sponsorship, and an animal cruelty conviction or admission by one of your high profile employees would be damaging to the company, dismissal is both a distinct possibility and pretty reasonable.
    it would indeed depend on the severity of the offence. Currently, in Italy, killing a cat is not a particularly severe offence.
    left the forum March 2023
  • redvision
    redvision Posts: 2,958
    edited March 2023

    redvision said:

    A punishment should act to deter others from committing the same crime. Last year there was the kurt Zouma incident and he got a slap on the wrist and continued his career. This latest incident of a sports star committing a similar offence of animal cruelty shows that the punishment handed to Zouma was not sufficient to stop others doing the same or similar.

    Sorry but he has deliberately shot a living creature, which is wrong, just cruel, and against the law. Therefore he should face the consequences and if that means his career is affected or stopped then so be it.

    Out of interest, how do you stand on Chris Froome feeding live rabbits to his pet snakes?

    As a boy, Chris Froome had two unusual pets: a pair of pythons. They needed feeding, and their meals had to be alive. Mice at first, then rats. But as they grew they needed something more filling. So he raided the rabbit hutches in the kindergarten across the road.

    “Young children would arrive at the class next day and their little baby bunny rabbits would be gone,” he wrote in last year’s autobiography....


    https://www.independent.co.uk/news/people/chris-froome-rider-on-the-storm-10415129.html

    4 times TDF champion, or random manual labourer?
    Different situation. He was a child and not a high profile athlete.
    For info though, I would consider this animal cruelty as well although I accept that many would not, as it is feeding one animal by sacrificing another - so not just killing something for the sake of it (like shooting a cat)
  • ugo.santalucia
    ugo.santalucia Posts: 28,244
    webboo said:

    redvision said:

    Sorry Ugo but have to disagree.
    The only reason you would shoot at a living creature is to kill it. This incident is absolutely appalling and there is no justification.
    If he had shot a human would you still be saying it shouldn't affect his career??

    I just think this is another example of a sportsman who has the god complex and thinks he can do what he wants.

    Oh, and his apology seemed pretty forced to me. I don't think it was at all sincere and just a reflection of his desperate attempt to save his contract.

    So precluding him from doing his job is a good outcome for society then?
    What is he going to do? Is driving a fork lift instead of riding a bicycle a just punishment?
    If I was to shoot my neighbour’s cat, I would not expect to lose my job as a result… it would be stupid of society to put me on benefits for a crime that has nothing to do with my daily job… I think this trend of social media deciding what is the right punishment for a crime has to end. It will be a judge to decide the right punishment, not people on forums
    As a nurse I would have lost my job and been struck of the nursing register for shooting a neighbours cat. I would be appalled that if you did the same and as an educator of young people you did not lose your job.
    I wonder why speeding, which in my opinion is at least as bad an offence, does not carry anywhere near the same weight and in fact nobody cares much about… I am confident I have colleagues who have such offences on their CVs, only a few points on the licence, redeemable by going to a one day course

    left the forum March 2023
  • webboo
    webboo Posts: 6,087
    It might be different if they had killed someone by their speeding. They would probably go to jail if they did.
    If he had just fired the gun randomly and no one was hurt, that would be more like speeding. Not shooting something with intent.
    That’s unless your colleagues go round speeding with intent to kill someone.
  • N0bodyOfTheGoat
    N0bodyOfTheGoat Posts: 5,845
    edited March 2023
    Car related offences, where punishments are ridiculously light due to "driving being critical to their job," is a more than trivial thing that annoys me at times.
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  • ugo.santalucia
    ugo.santalucia Posts: 28,244
    webboo said:

    It might be different if they had killed someone by their speeding. They would probably go to jail if they did.
    If he had just fired the gun randomly and no one was hurt, that would be more like speeding. Not shooting something with intent.
    That’s unless your colleagues go round speeding with intent to kill someone.

    Crucially, they might end up getting a shorter sentence, as compared to someone killing a cat...
    I wasn't aware you can get 5 years for that in this country now, as it recently changed...
    TV are very keen to tell you stuff you don't give a monkey about, like the absence of tomatoes from the shelves, but fail to tell you these fundamental changes in the law
    left the forum March 2023
  • First.Aspect
    First.Aspect Posts: 14,626
    What if someone's o ertly racist or something like that, Ugo?

    Nothing to do with their abilities as an athlete. Live and let live?