Who is the greatest British (male) road cyclist?

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  • if he really wanted the
    jdee84 said:

    redvision said:

    jdee84 said:

    redvision said:

    jdee84 said:

    Obviously this could be done for anyone almost, but the only reason Thomas has a TDF win rather than 1 2nd place and 2 3rd place is that Froome and Dumoulin went to the 2018 Giro rather than just doing the tour.

    Nonsense. He won the tour because he was the best rider in that tour.

    Tbh I think G would have won more if he wasn't so fond of crashing!

    I would actually question wiggins win more than G's. If froome hadn't respected team orders I think he may well have taken the yellow.



    That's actually bollocks he sat on Dumoulin up every mountain pass and then sprinted to the line in the last couple hundred metres.
    So he was not only able to keep up with Tom D's pace but was able to outpace him at the finish. You've just completely proven my point, in that tour G was the strongest rider.
    No he was able to wheel suck day after day and then sprint for some bonus seconds as boring a tour win as he is an interviewee
    Much better to lose with "panache" than to win boringly.
  • RichN95.
    RichN95. Posts: 27,150



    Much better to lose with "panache" than to win boringly.


    No-one who wins things says that.
    Twitter: @RichN95
  • redvision
    redvision Posts: 2,958
    edited August 2022
    jdee84 said:

    redvision said:

    jdee84 said:

    redvision said:

    jdee84 said:

    Obviously this could be done for anyone almost, but the only reason Thomas has a TDF win rather than 1 2nd place and 2 3rd place is that Froome and Dumoulin went to the 2018 Giro rather than just doing the tour.

    Nonsense. He won the tour because he was the best rider in that tour.

    Tbh I think G would have won more if he wasn't so fond of crashing!

    I would actually question wiggins win more than G's. If froome hadn't respected team orders I think he may well have taken the yellow.



    That's actually bollocks he sat on Dumoulin up every mountain pass and then sprinted to the line in the last couple hundred metres.
    So he was not only able to keep up with Tom D's pace but was able to outpace him at the finish. You've just completely proven my point, in that tour G was the strongest rider.
    No he was able to wheel suck day after day and then sprint for some bonus seconds as boring a tour win as he is an interviewee
    Name me one TDF winner in the recent past, who hasn't sat on the wheel of either a teammate or another rider for the majority of the race!

    It's tactics. If Tom D was the strongest rider he would have dropped G.
  • RichN95. said:



    Much better to lose with "panache" than to win boringly.


    No-one who wins things says that.
    Sorry. I was being ironic. Rule 70 applies at all times other than post-Tour crits.
  • jdee84
    jdee84 Posts: 282
    redvision said:

    jdee84 said:

    redvision said:

    jdee84 said:

    redvision said:

    jdee84 said:

    Obviously this could be done for anyone almost, but the only reason Thomas has a TDF win rather than 1 2nd place and 2 3rd place is that Froome and Dumoulin went to the 2018 Giro rather than just doing the tour.

    Nonsense. He won the tour because he was the best rider in that tour.

    Tbh I think G would have won more if he wasn't so fond of crashing!

    I would actually question wiggins win more than G's. If froome hadn't respected team orders I think he may well have taken the yellow.



    That's actually bollocks he sat on Dumoulin up every mountain pass and then sprinted to the line in the last couple hundred metres.
    So he was not only able to keep up with Tom D's pace but was able to outpace him at the finish. You've just completely proven my point, in that tour G was the strongest rider.
    No he was able to wheel suck day after day and then sprint for some bonus seconds as boring a tour win as he is an interviewee
    Name me one TDF winner in the recent past, who hasn't sat on the wheel of either a teammate or another rider for the majority of the race!

    It's tactics. If Tom D was the strongest rider he would have dropped G.
    My principle point which was glossed over was that dumoulin had raced a tough giro 5 weeks previously so was understandably tired and most likely not at full strength.
  • Pross
    Pross Posts: 40,480
    jdee84 said:

    redvision said:

    jdee84 said:

    redvision said:

    jdee84 said:

    redvision said:

    jdee84 said:

    Obviously this could be done for anyone almost, but the only reason Thomas has a TDF win rather than 1 2nd place and 2 3rd place is that Froome and Dumoulin went to the 2018 Giro rather than just doing the tour.

    Nonsense. He won the tour because he was the best rider in that tour.

    Tbh I think G would have won more if he wasn't so fond of crashing!

    I would actually question wiggins win more than G's. If froome hadn't respected team orders I think he may well have taken the yellow.



    That's actually bollocks he sat on Dumoulin up every mountain pass and then sprinted to the line in the last couple hundred metres.
    So he was not only able to keep up with Tom D's pace but was able to outpace him at the finish. You've just completely proven my point, in that tour G was the strongest rider.
    No he was able to wheel suck day after day and then sprint for some bonus seconds as boring a tour win as he is an interviewee
    Name me one TDF winner in the recent past, who hasn't sat on the wheel of either a teammate or another rider for the majority of the race!

    It's tactics. If Tom D was the strongest rider he would have dropped G.
    My principle point which was glossed over was that dumoulin had raced a tough giro 5 weeks previously so was understandably tired and most likely not at full strength.
    So Thomas was stronger than him in the Tour then? Sounds like you're arguing for the sake of arguing.
  • For me, and I don't think this has been mentioned yet, Cav just shaves it for his longevity at the highest level in road racing.
    Although it could be argued that GC riders have a shorter window in which to shine,
    Cav has been winning WT races since 2007 and GT stages since 2008 (2 in Giro and 4 in TdF) and he's not finished yet...... that's at least 15 years of winning at the highest level.
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  • phreak
    phreak Posts: 2,905

    For me, and I don't think this has been mentioned yet, Cav just shaves it for his longevity at the highest level in road racing.
    Although it could be argued that GC riders have a shorter window in which to shine,
    Cav has been winning WT races since 2007 and GT stages since 2008 (2 in Giro and 4 in TdF) and he's not finished yet...... that's at least 15 years of winning at the highest level.

    At least a few of those years he was finished and should have retired though.
  • rick_chasey
    rick_chasey Posts: 72,589
    edited August 2022
    RichN95. said:

    Results adjustments? eh?


    Armstrong's DQ in 2009 Tour, I assume. I think Wiggins was officially upgraded to 3rd, but I'm never sure.
    I cannot stand results adjustments, especially years after the fact.

    I sat and watched it and Wiggins was not on the podium. Surely he stays 4th with no one at third?
  • TheBigBean
    TheBigBean Posts: 20,571

    RichN95. said:

    Results adjustments? eh?


    Armstrong's DQ in 2009 Tour, I assume. I think Wiggins was officially upgraded to 3rd, but I'm never sure.
    I cannot stand results adjustments, especially years after the fact.

    I sat and watched it and Wiggins was not on the podium. Surely he stays 4th with no one at third?
    I struggle with Scarponi winning the 2011 Giro and Froome winning the Vuelta
  • rick_chasey
    rick_chasey Posts: 72,589
    Not wanting to take anything away from Wiggins here. He rode a good race and Armstrong was a cheat - it just does my head in. In this context it was a 4th place ride, surely? Not least as he now guest appears on The Move.
  • kingstongraham
    kingstongraham Posts: 26,224

    Not wanting to take anything away from Wiggins here. He rode a good race and Armstrong was a cheat - it just does my head in. In this context it was a 4th place ride, surely? Not least as he now guest appears on The Move.

    But that 3rd/4th place is surely equal to Thomas' 3rd (a long way back) this year.

    2019 was an abomination of a result because of the stage they cancelled but still took time on, and that's maybe the one you can bring in to say Thomas has a slightly better record in grands tours GC.