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Anna Kiesenhofer

curium99curium99 Posts: 19
I came here to read about the Women's Olympic Road Race but found nothing so thought I'd start one.

All the stars aligned for her. Did the Dutch team not have any radio coms to help keep track of the breakaway?
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  • ddraverddraver Posts: 22,936
    There's a whole thread on Olympic cycling...

    (and one for the rest)
    We're in danger of confusing passion with incompetence
    - @ddraver
  • curium99curium99 Posts: 19
    Cheers all!
  • pblakeneypblakeney Posts: 16,343
    curium99 said:

    I came here to read about the Women's Olympic Road Race but found nothing so thought I'd start one.

    All the stars aligned for her. Did the Dutch team not have any radio coms to help keep track of the breakaway?

    No radios.
    Makes for more unpredictable and better racing imo.
    The above may be fact, or fiction, I may be serious, I may be jesting.
    I am not sure. You have no chance.
    Veronese68 wrote:
    PB is the most sensible person on here.
  • MattFalleMattFalle Posts: 5,522
    pblakeney said:

    curium99 said:

    I came here to read about the Women's Olympic Road Race but found nothing so thought I'd start one.

    All the stars aligned for her. Did the Dutch team not have any radio coms to help keep track of the breakaway?

    No radios.
    Makes for more unpredictable and better racing imo.
    exactly as pb says - agree 100%
  • curium99curium99 Posts: 19
    I don't think anyone can argue that the absence radios affected the outcome of this race.

    Do you think that removing team radios will be back on the agenda for the World Tour now?
  • thejimmymethodthejimmymethod Posts: 233
    Not sure but would give cause for the teams/riders to fight doubly hard against it
  • ddraverddraver Posts: 22,936
    curium99 said:

    I don't think anyone can argue that the absence radios affected the outcome of this race.

    Do you think that removing team radios will be back on the agenda for the World Tour now?

    It will rumble on until the next race with no radios is super controlled and boring then it will dip until the next race with chaos, then rumble on....

    We're on about lap 45 by my count
    We're in danger of confusing passion with incompetence
    - @ddraver
  • MattFalleMattFalle Posts: 5,522
    Gives the fans cause to fight doubly hard for it.

    if anything its obvious racers have lost race craft by radios being in place (which is what people said would happen when radios were first introduced)
  • kingstongrahamkingstongraham Posts: 17,437
    Obvious benefit is more work for these guys
  • r0bhr0bh Posts: 1,586
    curium99 said:

    I don't think anyone can argue that the absence radios affected the outcome of this race.

    Do you think that removing team radios will be back on the agenda for the World Tour now?

    Nope. But you can definitely argue whether it affected the outcome in a positive or negative way.
  • ProssPross Posts: 28,975
    Riders managed for decades without radio contact. The key today was whether there was any accurate information, that doesn't require radios.

    Riders also have to be aware of what's going on, surely I'm not the only one who has been in amateur races with no formal time checks and you just have to try to keep check of who has gone and try to get spectators to give updates. As someone mentioned on the spoiler thread the lack of a lead car should have been a bit of a giveaway.
  • above_the_cowsabove_the_cows Posts: 11,278
    MattFalle said:

    Gives the fans cause to fight doubly hard for it.

    if anything its obvious racers have lost race craft by radios being in place (which is what people said would happen when radios were first introduced)

    Didn't seem to hurt Richard Carapaz's race craft, or Anne Kiesenhofer's.

    You could just as easily say that Dutch women's dominance has killed race craft. They just assumed they were the strongest and therefore would win.
    Correlation is not causation.
  • mididoctorsmididoctors Posts: 10,262
    There are a fair few pre radio stories of riders not getting information .. even for hardened pros of that era messed up or were misinformed
    "If I was a 38 year old man, I definitely wouldn't be riding a bright yellow bike with Hello Kitty disc wheels, put it that way. What we're witnessing here is the world's most high profile mid-life crisis" Afx237vi Mon Jul 20, 2009 2:43 pm
  • pblakeneypblakeney Posts: 16,343
    If the lead car is not behind you (or your group) maybe it’s time to push on a bit?
    The above may be fact, or fiction, I may be serious, I may be jesting.
    I am not sure. You have no chance.
    Veronese68 wrote:
    PB is the most sensible person on here.
  • MattFalleMattFalle Posts: 5,522

    MattFalle said:

    Gives the fans cause to fight doubly hard for it.

    if anything its obvious racers have lost race craft by radios being in place (which is what people said would happen when radios were first introduced)

    Didn't seem to hurt Richard Carapaz's race craft, or Anne Kiesenhofer's.

    You could just as easily say that Dutch women's dominance has killed race craft. They just assumed they were the strongest and therefore would win.
    2 out of 187 ain't bad I suppose.
  • MattFalleMattFalle Posts: 5,522
    But yeah, you've missed the point completely fella, so well done there.
  • above_the_cowsabove_the_cows Posts: 11,278
    MattFalle said:

    MattFalle said:

    Gives the fans cause to fight doubly hard for it.

    if anything its obvious racers have lost race craft by radios being in place (which is what people said would happen when radios were first introduced)

    Didn't seem to hurt Richard Carapaz's race craft, or Anne Kiesenhofer's.

    You could just as easily say that Dutch women's dominance has killed race craft. They just assumed they were the strongest and therefore would win.
    2 out of 187 ain't bad I suppose.
    Only one person can win the race. People actually riding the women's race have been very clear that the negative riding of the Dutch were a problem and no one else wanted to help because they are so strong. I don't know what radios would have done to change that scenario.

    The men's race, had lots of racing with obvious race craft i.e. no one wanting to help WvA, people expecting Pog to close down attacks.
    Correlation is not causation.
  • above_the_cowsabove_the_cows Posts: 11,278
    MattFalle said:

    But yeah, you've missed the point completely fella, so well done there.

    Don't know who this fella is. Obviously not me.
    Correlation is not causation.
  • orraloonorraloon Posts: 8,803
    Non gender specific 'fella' obvs 😉
  • MattFalleMattFalle Posts: 5,522
    edited 25 July
    yup - fella covers all genders in my neck of the woods fella, as if it needed to be pointed out anyway.

    well done on winding the clock back 20 years though.
  • above_the_cowsabove_the_cows Posts: 11,278
    MattFalle said:

    yup - fella covers all genders in my neck of the woods fella, as if it needed to be pointed out anyway.

    well done on winding the clock back 20 years though.

    Do you want a cookie? MattFalle warrior for feminism.
    Correlation is not causation.
  • above_the_cowsabove_the_cows Posts: 11,278
    You got caught out making gendered assumptions and now you're trying to make excuses for yourself while playing the white knight.

    It would be funny if it wasn't so desparatelty transparent.
    Correlation is not causation.
  • jimmyjamsjimmyjams Posts: 445
    Pross said:

    Riders managed for decades without radio contact. The key today was whether there was any accurate information, that doesn't require radios.

    Riders also have to be aware of what's going on, surely I'm not the only one who has been in amateur races with no formal time checks and you just have to try to keep check of who has gone and try to get spectators to give updates. As someone mentioned on the spoiler thread the lack of a lead car should have been a bit of a giveaway.

    Some years ago I did a short local cyclosportive in the Alps, short = 60 km/1400 hm, local = not many participants, 60 perhaps. The route was closed only for the first flattish 10 km or so, then we were on open, at first slightly hilly, roads. The last 25 km included two passes, the finish being at the top of the second, a climb of 10 km. By the time we were on the final pass, being so few, we also-rans (not the local elite) were all stretched out, mostly unable to see the rider either in front or behind.
    With about 5 km to go, a carload of 3-4 lads passed me, then slowed, and the passenger held out a piece of cardboard on which was written something like “coureur derrière à 2 min“ (rider behind at 2 mins). I felt really grateful for this info, I knew I wouldn't lose 2 mins during the last 5 km. But when I got to the finish, and spoke to other riders, it seemed they were all shown the same sign!
    So be wary of spectator info.
  • MattFalleMattFalle Posts: 5,522
    edited 25 July

    You got caught out making gendered assumptions and now you're trying to make excuses for yourself while playing the white knight.

    It would be funny if it wasn't so desparatelty transparent.

    oh dear oh dear oh dear.... you obviously don't know my environment and background and have therefore made your own gendered assumptions and are now trying to make excuses without knowing the full picture.

    oh dear oh dear oh dear .......
  • MattFalleMattFalle Posts: 5,522

    MattFalle said:

    yup - fella covers all genders in my neck of the woods fella, as if it needed to be pointed out anyway.

    well done on winding the clock back 20 years though.

    Do you want a cookie? MattFalle warrior for feminism.
    actually it wasn't me who pointed it out fella.

    but good try anyway.
  • MattFalleMattFalle Posts: 5,522

    MattFalle said:

    yup - fella covers all genders in my neck of the woods fella, as if it needed to be pointed out anyway.

    well done on winding the clock back 20 years though.

    Do you want a cookie? MattFalle warrior for feminism.
    as an aside, although I never saw myself as such I shall accept the nomenclature - thank you.

    MF - warrior for feminism.

    grazie.
  • salsiccia1salsiccia1 Posts: 3,693

    There are a fair few pre radio stories of riders not getting information .. even for hardened pros of that era messed up or were misinformed

    Sometimes deliberately. See Robert Millar's 'stolen' Vuelta.
    It's only a bit of sport, Mun. Relax and enjoy the racing.
  • salsiccia1salsiccia1 Posts: 3,693
    If they ban race radios it'll just be another thing for the doperati to get stiff about.

    The genie's out of the bottle on radios, there's no going back, as much as we may want to.
    It's only a bit of sport, Mun. Relax and enjoy the racing.
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