Giro 2021:- Stage 16: Sacile – Cortina d’Ampezzo 212 km **Spoilers**

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Comments

  • salsiccia1
    salsiccia1 Posts: 3,725
    ugo.santalucia said:

    Bad weather makes for good racing... shame we didn't see much racing on TV

    It does, but not if it's bad weather all the time.

    It's fair to say there has been some exceptional weather conditions across Europe this May, but it does seem that bad weather in the north of Italy come the 3rd week of the Giro is pretty common.
    It's only a bit of sport, Mun. Relax and enjoy the racing.
  • blazing_saddles
    blazing_saddles Posts: 21,952
    lettingthedaysgoby said:

    Bernal is on another level. So impressive.

    The opposition are on a different level too.
    Bahrain's back up to the back up, GC rider looking good to finish second.
    "Science is a tool for cheaters". An anonymous French PE teacher.
  • ugo.santalucia
    ugo.santalucia Posts: 28,290
    womack said:

    How did Bernal get down that descent on rim brakes in the wet?

    I have been told this is impossible!

    Let's hope he didn't have full carbon wheels as well.

    It is refreshing, once again, to see innovation making zero difference in a race, just like all the other "must have"

    left the forum March 2023
  • ugo.santalucia
    ugo.santalucia Posts: 28,290
    salsiccia1 said:

    ugo.santalucia said:

    Bad weather makes for good racing... shame we didn't see much racing on TV

    It does, but not if it's bad weather all the time.

    It's fair to say there has been some exceptional weather conditions across Europe this May, but it does seem that bad weather in the north of Italy come the 3rd week of the Giro is pretty common.
    Wet and cold May was quite common back in the days (Hampsten anyone?)... more recently we had 30+ degrees on some stages... so nice to see some proper spring weather this year... sorts the men from the boys...
    left the forum March 2023
  • phreak
    phreak Posts: 2,919
    ugo.santalucia said:

    womack said:

    How did Bernal get down that descent on rim brakes in the wet?

    I have been told this is impossible!

    Let's hope he didn't have full carbon wheels as well.

    It is refreshing, once again, to see innovation making zero difference in a race, just like all the other "must have"

    Even £3-400 rain jackets and £140 gloves don't seem capable of keeping riders riding in the rain.
  • amrushton
    amrushton Posts: 1,257
    edited May 2021
    Everyone feels it differently. Bernal was in shorts others in leg warmers. Shocked @ rim brakes and carbon wheels. Surely rider safety was a consideration. Ordinary riders will be trying to descend in the wet on rim brakes and then what? Grinta! What a great adjective.
  • pblakeney
    pblakeney Posts: 26,089
    amrushton said:

    Everyone feels it differently. Bernal was in shorts others in leg warmers. Shocked @ rim brakes and carbon wheels. Surely rider safety was a consideration. Ordinary riders will be trying to descend in the wet on rim brakes and then what? Grinta! What a great adjective.

    Ordinary riders have been descending in the wet on rim brakes for decades.
    The above may be fact, or fiction, I may be serious, I may be jesting.
    I am not sure. You have no chance.
    Veronese68 wrote:
    PB is the most sensible person on here.
  • shirley_basso
    shirley_basso Posts: 6,195
    That's the joke.
  • pblakeney
    pblakeney Posts: 26,089
    edited May 2021
    woosh!
    ..me
    The above may be fact, or fiction, I may be serious, I may be jesting.
    I am not sure. You have no chance.
    Veronese68 wrote:
    PB is the most sensible person on here.
  • dabber
    dabber Posts: 1,928
    So how do we recken Bernal will do when he comes up against Pogačar and Roglič ?
    “You may think that; I couldn’t possibly comment!”

    Wilier Cento Uno SR/Wilier Mortirolo/Specialized Roubaix Comp/Kona Hei Hei/Calibre Bossnut
  • blazing_saddles
    blazing_saddles Posts: 21,952
    edited May 2021
    Apparently 4G was working just fine at the summit of the Giau, as a fan had it all set up to "watch" the final descent on ES Player.
    So maybe the cameraman's phone ran out of battery.

    At least in the old days we would have had a recording to watch.
    Innovation making a lot of difference in this case: all worse.
    "Science is a tool for cheaters". An anonymous French PE teacher.
  • pblakeney
    pblakeney Posts: 26,089
    dabber said:

    So how do we recken Bernal will do when he comes up against Pogačar and Roglič ?

    Good.
    If you can ignore the TTs.
    The above may be fact, or fiction, I may be serious, I may be jesting.
    I am not sure. You have no chance.
    Veronese68 wrote:
    PB is the most sensible person on here.
  • lettingthedaysgoby
    lettingthedaysgoby Posts: 1,732
    blazing_saddles said:

    Apparently 4G was working just fine at the summit of the Giau, as a fan had it all set up to "watch" the final descent on ES Player.
    So maybe the cameraman's phone ran out of battery.

    At least in the old days we would have had a recording to watch.
    Innovation making a lot of difference in this case: all worse.

    Receiving a compressed stream to work on a phone isn't quite the same as transmitting a full broadcast level feed.

    Reading Twitter today really shows how little (quite understandably really) most people know about the technicalities of live TV broadcast tech, and how tricky cycling coverage is in particular.
  • kingstongraham
    kingstongraham Posts: 26,573
    lettingthedaysgoby said:

    blazing_saddles said:

    Apparently 4G was working just fine at the summit of the Giau, as a fan had it all set up to "watch" the final descent on ES Player.
    So maybe the cameraman's phone ran out of battery.

    At least in the old days we would have had a recording to watch.
    Innovation making a lot of difference in this case: all worse.

    Receiving a compressed stream to work on a phone isn't quite the same as transmitting a full broadcast level feed.

    Reading Twitter today really shows how little (quite understandably really) most people know about the technicalities of live TV broadcast tech, and how tricky cycling coverage is in particular.
    I'd have settled for a phone quality live stream.
  • jimmyjams
    jimmyjams Posts: 750
    edited May 2021
    kingstongraham said:

    TheBigBean said:

    kingstongraham said:

    TheBigBean said:

    Worth noting this bit. Never understand it when riders have to wait for their leaders.

    TheBigBean said:


    GC

    10 João Almeida (Por) Deceuninck-QuickStep 0:10:01

    Just think, without that, he'd be as high as ninth, maybe.
    I suspect he will finish above 9th anyway. How many minutes are you crediting him for leader nursing?
    I was adding on 2 minutes, but being generous, maybe 3. So he might be 8th.

    I don't see him staying with Bernal even if he was allowed to. And his biggest loss was all his own doing.
    I think you are too hard, or at least somewhat inaccurate, in your assessment.

    If Almeida hadn't had Evenepoel care-duties, he would only be 4 mins back.
    He lost 4-20 on stage 4 because he had a bad day, but on the other hand he did a 20 sec faster TT than Bernal.
    All his other lost time (6 mins) was because of his Evenepoel care-duties, bringing a poor Remco home okay, or doing the work for Remco then easing off the last couple of kms (stage 6, when Almeida lost 30 secs). Without those Evenepoel duties, Almeida would be 4th now.

    I picked Almeida as GC winner for PTP because although I'd heard it rumoured that the team might be set up for Evenepoel, I thought the idea too foolish to be true.
    Fool me!

    Edit: I compared Almeida's lost time to Bernal, but like Kingstongraham said, Almeida perhaps couldn't have stayed with Bernal. However, since he came in today with Ciccione and Carthy, other days he could have probably stayed with them. In that case he would now be 6 mins back, so currently 8th.

  • mididoctors
    mididoctors Posts: 17,610
    ugo.santalucia said:

    Is Simon Yates a bit soft? Discuss...

    Brittle? But only because he over extends ...
    "If I was a 38 year old man, I definitely wouldn't be riding a bright yellow bike with Hello Kitty disc wheels, put it that way. What we're witnessing here is the world's most high profile mid-life crisis" Afx237vi Mon Jul 20, 2009 2:43 pm
  • amrushton
    amrushton Posts: 1,257
    People would have complained it wasn't HD 4K IN blizzard sound. Just getting the signal from the ground to the mast is hard enough. Signal from a transmitter pack on a motorbike to a helicopter to plane to mast. That's before it goes to the studio thro the processing and out to the tv
  • shirley_basso
    shirley_basso Posts: 6,195
    Why not use Periscope or Twitter/Instagram live? That'll do wherever 4g exists
  • pblakeney
    pblakeney Posts: 26,089
    shirley_basso said:

    Why not use Periscope or Twitter/Instagram live? That'll do wherever 4g exists

    That was pretty much what they were doing for the bits you saw.
    The bits you didn't was where there was no 4G.
    The above may be fact, or fiction, I may be serious, I may be jesting.
    I am not sure. You have no chance.
    Veronese68 wrote:
    PB is the most sensible person on here.
  • andyp
    andyp Posts: 10,181
    shirley_basso said:

    Why not use Periscope or Twitter/Instagram live? That'll do wherever 4g exists

    I'm not a proper expert, but getting good mobile coverage is especially hard in mountainous terrain. Given how few people are there, the focus is on ensuring the villages and towns get coverage, not a pass where no-one lives.
  • shirley_basso
    shirley_basso Posts: 6,195
    edited May 2021
    andyp said:

    shirley_basso said:

    Why not use Periscope or Twitter/Instagram live? That'll do wherever 4g exists

    I'm not a proper expert, but getting good mobile coverage is especially hard in mountainous terrain. Given how few people are there, the focus is on ensuring the villages and towns get coverage, not a pass where no-one lives.
    Selfish if you ask me.

    What about satellite as cover?
  • shirley_basso
    shirley_basso Posts: 6,195


    Great little thread. Worth 2 secs of your time.
  • blazing_saddles
    blazing_saddles Posts: 21,952
    shirley_basso said:



    Great little thread. Worth 2 secs of your time.
    Some good stuff in there. If anybody missed Gorka's save of the day for instance.

    Yup.
    A load of riders took an unofficial day off and strolled in three quarters of an hour behind Bernal.

    I see that Vengi has already started the blame game........................again.
    "Science is a tool for cheaters". An anonymous French PE teacher.
  • jimmyjams
    jimmyjams Posts: 750
    blazing_saddles said:

    shirley_basso said:



    Great little thread. Worth 2 secs of your time.
    Some good stuff in there. If anybody missed Gorka's save of the day for instance.

    Yup.
    A load of riders took an unofficial day off and strolled in three quarters of an hour behind Bernal.

    I see that Vengi has already started the blame game........................again.

    Not sure, but I think 5 riders were outside the time limit, one Alpecin, two Qhubeka and two FDJ, De Bondt and Campenaerts among them. If the two FDJ were eliminated, it would have been a bad day for FDJ, since Reichenbach dropped out before the Giau.
    However I haven't seen any notification that they were OTL. Maybe they got a weather dispensation?
  • Pross
    Pross Posts: 41,170
    edited May 2021
    jimmyjams said:


    blazing_saddles said:

    shirley_basso said:



    Great little thread. Worth 2 secs of your time.
    Some good stuff in there. If anybody missed Gorka's save of the day for instance.

    Yup.
    A load of riders took an unofficial day off and strolled in three quarters of an hour behind Bernal.

    I see that Vengi has already started the blame game........................again.

    Not sure, but I think 5 riders were outside the time limit, one Alpecin, two Qhubeka and two FDJ, De Bondt and Campenaerts among them. If the two FDJ were eliminated, it would have been a bad day for FDJ, since Reichenbach dropped out before the Giau.
    However I haven't seen any notification that they were OTL. Maybe they got a weather dispensation?
    Last 2 home were FDJ riders at 49:00 (Guglielmi and Van Den Berg). Camapanaerts and Wisniowski were less than a minute in front. By my reckoning the average speed today was 34.9kph and a d) ranked stage so cut off should have been 18% which would be somewhere around 47:20 (Dries De Bont of Alpecin would have also been a few seconds over as well).

    Looks like there was some leniency granted as they aren't shown as OTL. This may be as it was only just over 150km and the limit increases to 22% if the stage is less than 150km.
  • blazing_saddles
    blazing_saddles Posts: 21,952
    jimmyjams said:


    blazing_saddles said:

    shirley_basso said:



    Great little thread. Worth 2 secs of your time.
    Some good stuff in there. If anybody missed Gorka's save of the day for instance.

    Yup.
    A load of riders took an unofficial day off and strolled in three quarters of an hour behind Bernal.

    I see that Vengi has already started the blame game........................again.

    Not sure, but I think 5 riders were outside the time limit, one Alpecin, two Qhubeka and two FDJ, De Bondt and Campenaerts among them. If the two FDJ were eliminated, it would have been a bad day for FDJ, since Reichenbach dropped out before the Giau.
    However I haven't seen any notification that they were OTL. Maybe they got a weather dispensation?
    I checked the results before I posted and there were no OTLs.
    Whether time time limit % was changed or they just went with weather dispensation, I know not.
    If De Bondt and Campenaerts had officially been OTL'd it would have been because both have invested too much in breakaway raids. (although I doubt Campenaerts would be too despondent.)
    "Science is a tool for cheaters". An anonymous French PE teacher.
  • gweeds
    gweeds Posts: 2,575

    Napoleon, don't be jealous that I've been chatting online with babes all day. Besides, we both know that I'm training to be a cage fighter.
  • ddraver
    ddraver Posts: 26,416
    We're in danger of confusing passion with incompetence
    - @ddraver
  • mididoctors
    mididoctors Posts: 17,610
    lettingthedaysgoby said:

    blazing_saddles said:

    Apparently 4G was working just fine at the summit of the Giau, as a fan had it all set up to "watch" the final descent on ES Player.
    So maybe the cameraman's phone ran out of battery.

    At least in the old days we would have had a recording to watch.
    Innovation making a lot of difference in this case: all worse.

    Receiving a compressed stream to work on a phone isn't quite the same as transmitting a full broadcast level feed.

    Reading Twitter today really shows how little (quite understandably really) most people know about the technicalities of live TV broadcast tech, and how tricky cycling coverage is in particular.
    Fixed camera at a pass was doable in the 1990s even when the rest of the stage was weathered out .. that's over 20 years ago
    "If I was a 38 year old man, I definitely wouldn't be riding a bright yellow bike with Hello Kitty disc wheels, put it that way. What we're witnessing here is the world's most high profile mid-life crisis" Afx237vi Mon Jul 20, 2009 2:43 pm
  • phreak
    phreak Posts: 2,919


    The date of the race probably has played a part. They covered a very similar route in 1993 (but with 20km more), but the race didn't even get started until May 23rd, and the ride through the Dolomites was on the 5th June. It was still wet, as it often is in the afternoons in the area, but perhaps not quite as cold, but I've been in the Dolomites at the end of June and been caught in freezing temperatures and blizzards. The mountains provide unpredictable weather.

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