LEAVE the Conservative Party and save your country!

1…976977979981982…1128

Comments

  • pblakeney
    pblakeney Posts: 27,329
    TheBigBean said:

    rick_chasey said:

    TheBigBean said:

    First.Aspect said:

    Pross said:

    First.Aspect said:

    feelgoodlost said:

    First.Aspect said:

    Did anyone hear the (I think) education secretary on r4 this morning.

    She appeared to suggest that she was being hyper cautious because some ceilings indicated as not.in imminent need.of repair had in fact collapsed.

    It gets better...



    I quite like the honesty. Next leader in waiting right there.

    Unless honesty is not something the party wants.

    Poor woman had to defend how Sunak as chancellor took a report recommending thst the rate of school repairs be doubled or quadrupled, and decided to half it.

    Absolutely unfair to blame him now though.
    She needs to dress up in a costume and carry a sword if she wants that. I actually quite like her too, she does a better job of answering questions than most of them but whilst I can understand her frustration of having to take the flak on this she could always have turned down the offer to join the Cabinet in this laughing stock of a Government and kept her dignity.
    I think she knew fine well that they were still recording.
    Then doff your hat and say well played to her.
    Given the labour attack line is already juxtaposing the headline that hundreds of schools are literally crumbling and have had to be shut down next to her saying what a great job she's done, I doubt it's "well played"
    You can only play the hand you've been dealt.
    Tories have been dealt with this hand for 13 years.
    The above may be fact, or fiction, I may be serious, I may be jesting.
    I am not sure. You have no chance.
    Veronese68 wrote:
    PB is the most sensible person on here.
  • First.Aspect
    First.Aspect Posts: 17,167
    TheBigBean said:

    rick_chasey said:

    TheBigBean said:

    First.Aspect said:

    Pross said:

    First.Aspect said:

    feelgoodlost said:

    First.Aspect said:

    Did anyone hear the (I think) education secretary on r4 this morning.

    She appeared to suggest that she was being hyper cautious because some ceilings indicated as not.in imminent need.of repair had in fact collapsed.

    It gets better...



    I quite like the honesty. Next leader in waiting right there.

    Unless honesty is not something the party wants.

    Poor woman had to defend how Sunak as chancellor took a report recommending thst the rate of school repairs be doubled or quadrupled, and decided to half it.

    Absolutely unfair to blame him now though.
    She needs to dress up in a costume and carry a sword if she wants that. I actually quite like her too, she does a better job of answering questions than most of them but whilst I can understand her frustration of having to take the flak on this she could always have turned down the offer to join the Cabinet in this laughing stock of a Government and kept her dignity.
    I think she knew fine well that they were still recording.
    Then doff your hat and say well played to her.
    Given the labour attack line is already juxtaposing the headline that hundreds of schools are literally crumbling and have had to be shut down next to her saying what a great job she's done, I doubt it's "well played"
    You can only play the hand you've been dealt.
    She had a better grasp of numbers than any Tory politician I've heard in a long time. She was literally able to divide by 10 in real time.
  • TheBigBean
    TheBigBean Posts: 21,916
    pblakeney said:

    TheBigBean said:

    rick_chasey said:

    TheBigBean said:

    First.Aspect said:

    Pross said:

    First.Aspect said:

    feelgoodlost said:

    First.Aspect said:

    Did anyone hear the (I think) education secretary on r4 this morning.

    She appeared to suggest that she was being hyper cautious because some ceilings indicated as not.in imminent need.of repair had in fact collapsed.

    It gets better...



    I quite like the honesty. Next leader in waiting right there.

    Unless honesty is not something the party wants.

    Poor woman had to defend how Sunak as chancellor took a report recommending thst the rate of school repairs be doubled or quadrupled, and decided to half it.

    Absolutely unfair to blame him now though.
    She needs to dress up in a costume and carry a sword if she wants that. I actually quite like her too, she does a better job of answering questions than most of them but whilst I can understand her frustration of having to take the flak on this she could always have turned down the offer to join the Cabinet in this laughing stock of a Government and kept her dignity.
    I think she knew fine well that they were still recording.
    Then doff your hat and say well played to her.
    Given the labour attack line is already juxtaposing the headline that hundreds of schools are literally crumbling and have had to be shut down next to her saying what a great job she's done, I doubt it's "well played"
    You can only play the hand you've been dealt.
    Tories have been dealt with this hand for 13 years.
    She is not a party.
  • rick_chasey
    rick_chasey Posts: 75,661
    TheBigBean said:

    rick_chasey said:

    TheBigBean said:

    First.Aspect said:

    Pross said:

    First.Aspect said:

    feelgoodlost said:

    First.Aspect said:

    Did anyone hear the (I think) education secretary on r4 this morning.

    She appeared to suggest that she was being hyper cautious because some ceilings indicated as not.in imminent need.of repair had in fact collapsed.

    It gets better...



    I quite like the honesty. Next leader in waiting right there.

    Unless honesty is not something the party wants.

    Poor woman had to defend how Sunak as chancellor took a report recommending thst the rate of school repairs be doubled or quadrupled, and decided to half it.

    Absolutely unfair to blame him now though.
    She needs to dress up in a costume and carry a sword if she wants that. I actually quite like her too, she does a better job of answering questions than most of them but whilst I can understand her frustration of having to take the flak on this she could always have turned down the offer to join the Cabinet in this laughing stock of a Government and kept her dignity.
    I think she knew fine well that they were still recording.
    Then doff your hat and say well played to her.
    Given the labour attack line is already juxtaposing the headline that hundreds of schools are literally crumbling and have had to be shut down next to her saying what a great job she's done, I doubt it's "well played"
    You can only play the hand you've been dealt.
    Can fold, which she should have.
    _
  • TheBigBean
    TheBigBean Posts: 21,916
    rick_chasey said:

    TheBigBean said:

    rick_chasey said:

    TheBigBean said:

    First.Aspect said:

    Pross said:

    First.Aspect said:

    feelgoodlost said:

    First.Aspect said:

    Did anyone hear the (I think) education secretary on r4 this morning.

    She appeared to suggest that she was being hyper cautious because some ceilings indicated as not.in imminent need.of repair had in fact collapsed.

    It gets better...



    I quite like the honesty. Next leader in waiting right there.

    Unless honesty is not something the party wants.

    Poor woman had to defend how Sunak as chancellor took a report recommending thst the rate of school repairs be doubled or quadrupled, and decided to half it.

    Absolutely unfair to blame him now though.
    She needs to dress up in a costume and carry a sword if she wants that. I actually quite like her too, she does a better job of answering questions than most of them but whilst I can understand her frustration of having to take the flak on this she could always have turned down the offer to join the Cabinet in this laughing stock of a Government and kept her dignity.
    I think she knew fine well that they were still recording.
    Then doff your hat and say well played to her.
    Given the labour attack line is already juxtaposing the headline that hundreds of schools are literally crumbling and have had to be shut down next to her saying what a great job she's done, I doubt it's "well played"
    You can only play the hand you've been dealt.
    Can fold, which she should have.
    You mean not taken the job? Or followed the party line?
  • rick_chasey
    rick_chasey Posts: 75,661
    edited September 2023
    pblakeney said:

    rick_chasey said:

    Is there anything Gove has been involved with that isn’t now sh!t?

    The drug trade? Although I don't know so that could be sh!t too.

    https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-48572982
    Let’s go in reverse order.

    Currently minister for levelling up (cancelled) housing (absolute horror show of a rental squeeze) and communities (no idea)

    Previously minister for intergovernmental relations - they’re at an all time low.

    Ran DEFRA 17-19. I think we can all agree most farmers and fishermen feel shafted by Brexit and we currently can’t swim in half the beaches as the seas are full of waste. Good job.

    15-16 justice minister. Not his doing but courts are crumbling, black logs continued to grow during and after this short stint.

    14-15 chief whip. So disciplined he couldn’t force the party not to split on a Brexit referendum vote, so Cameron duly caved into one.

    10-14 education secretary. Kicked off the cuts that we are now seeing today across the education system. Return to all or nothing exams massively increased mental health problems, created academies which is at best a very mixed bag.

    Oh and issued a bible for every school with his own foreword, which had to be pulped after printing.

    Who issues their own foreword to the bible?

    And of course, key member of vote leave - blinding success that has been.
    _
  • First.Aspect
    First.Aspect Posts: 17,167
    TheBigBean said:

    rick_chasey said:

    TheBigBean said:

    rick_chasey said:

    TheBigBean said:

    First.Aspect said:

    Pross said:

    First.Aspect said:

    feelgoodlost said:

    First.Aspect said:

    Did anyone hear the (I think) education secretary on r4 this morning.

    She appeared to suggest that she was being hyper cautious because some ceilings indicated as not.in imminent need.of repair had in fact collapsed.

    It gets better...



    I quite like the honesty. Next leader in waiting right there.

    Unless honesty is not something the party wants.

    Poor woman had to defend how Sunak as chancellor took a report recommending thst the rate of school repairs be doubled or quadrupled, and decided to half it.

    Absolutely unfair to blame him now though.
    She needs to dress up in a costume and carry a sword if she wants that. I actually quite like her too, she does a better job of answering questions than most of them but whilst I can understand her frustration of having to take the flak on this she could always have turned down the offer to join the Cabinet in this laughing stock of a Government and kept her dignity.
    I think she knew fine well that they were still recording.
    Then doff your hat and say well played to her.
    Given the labour attack line is already juxtaposing the headline that hundreds of schools are literally crumbling and have had to be shut down next to her saying what a great job she's done, I doubt it's "well played"
    You can only play the hand you've been dealt.
    Can fold, which she should have.
    You mean not taken the job? Or followed the party line?
    In a way its like being a genuine republican. Right now, what are you actual options. Follow the idiots in ever decreasing circles or form the SDP?
  • rjsterry
    rjsterry Posts: 29,556
    laurentian said:

    Looking at the list of known affected schools on the BBC website, there seems to be a dispropotionately high number of them in Essex . . . anyone any ideas why?

    https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/education-66681227

    I would guess a coincidence of demographic changes and construction fashions and possibly a fan in the County Architect's office. A lot of movement out of London to Essex in that period.
    1985 Mercian King of Mercia - work in progress (Hah! Who am I kidding?)
    Pinnacle Monzonite

    Part of the anti-growth coalition
  • First.Aspect
    First.Aspect Posts: 17,167
    rick_chasey said:

    pblakeney said:

    rick_chasey said:

    Is there anything Gove has been involved with that isn’t now sh!t?

    The drug trade? Although I don't know so that could be sh!t too.

    https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-48572982
    Let’s go in reverse order.

    Currently minister for levelling up (cancelled) housing (absolute horror show of a rental squeeze) and communities (no idea)

    Previously minister for intergovernmental relations - they’re at an all time low.

    Ran DEFRA 17-19. I think we can all agree most farmers and fishermen feel shafted by Brexit and we currently can’t swim in half the beaches as the seas are full of waste. Good job.

    15-16 justice minister. Not his doing but courts are crumbling, black logs continued to grow during and after this short stint.

    14-15 chief whip. So disciplined he couldn’t force the party not to split on a Brexit referendum vote, so Cameron duly caved into one.

    10-14 education secretary. Kicked off the cuts that we are now seeing today across the education system. Oh and issued a bible for every school with his own foreword, which had to be pulped after printing.

    Who issues their own foreword to the bible?

    And of course, key member of vote leave - blinding success that has been.
    He's the politician equivalent of a wheel sucker.
  • pblakeney
    pblakeney Posts: 27,329
    TheBigBean said:

    pblakeney said:

    TheBigBean said:

    rick_chasey said:

    TheBigBean said:

    First.Aspect said:

    Pross said:

    First.Aspect said:

    feelgoodlost said:

    First.Aspect said:

    Did anyone hear the (I think) education secretary on r4 this morning.

    She appeared to suggest that she was being hyper cautious because some ceilings indicated as not.in imminent need.of repair had in fact collapsed.

    It gets better...



    I quite like the honesty. Next leader in waiting right there.

    Unless honesty is not something the party wants.

    Poor woman had to defend how Sunak as chancellor took a report recommending thst the rate of school repairs be doubled or quadrupled, and decided to half it.

    Absolutely unfair to blame him now though.
    She needs to dress up in a costume and carry a sword if she wants that. I actually quite like her too, she does a better job of answering questions than most of them but whilst I can understand her frustration of having to take the flak on this she could always have turned down the offer to join the Cabinet in this laughing stock of a Government and kept her dignity.
    I think she knew fine well that they were still recording.
    Then doff your hat and say well played to her.
    Given the labour attack line is already juxtaposing the headline that hundreds of schools are literally crumbling and have had to be shut down next to her saying what a great job she's done, I doubt it's "well played"
    You can only play the hand you've been dealt.
    Tories have been dealt with this hand for 13 years.
    She is not a party.
    No, but she's in the cabinet which has been in charge for 13 years.
    Or are you saying that she is the outlier in actually being competent?
    The above may be fact, or fiction, I may be serious, I may be jesting.
    I am not sure. You have no chance.
    Veronese68 wrote:
    PB is the most sensible person on here.
  • pblakeney
    pblakeney Posts: 27,329
    rick_chasey said:

    pblakeney said:

    rick_chasey said:

    Is there anything Gove has been involved with that isn’t now sh!t?

    The drug trade? Although I don't know so that could be sh!t too.

    https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-48572982
    Let’s go in reverse order.

    ...
    I think you took my reply a wee bitty too seriously.
    The above may be fact, or fiction, I may be serious, I may be jesting.
    I am not sure. You have no chance.
    Veronese68 wrote:
    PB is the most sensible person on here.
  • rjsterry
    rjsterry Posts: 29,556
    edited September 2023
    rick_chasey said:

    Is there anything Gove has been involved with that isn’t now sh!t?

    Don't think that's where the fault lies. The material is found across the public estate. Schools are just the flashpoint because the oh f*** moment coincided with the start of term. If an hospital ceiling had landed on people we'd all be asking about Health Secretaries past and present. The fault is in not setting up a register of this material as soon as the first one failed and systematically assessing all of them for water ingress/ rebar corrosion then planning renewals around the most urgent cases. That said, anyone in government from the mid 90s onwards could have picked this up and pushed it. Labour were replacing schools but not with any reference to RAAC.

    I'm sure head teachers don't want to become building managers as well, but the common thread in a lot of construction/maintenance failures is too great a distance between the end users of a building and the people responsible for their maintenance.
    1985 Mercian King of Mercia - work in progress (Hah! Who am I kidding?)
    Pinnacle Monzonite

    Part of the anti-growth coalition
  • surrey_commuter
    surrey_commuter Posts: 18,867
    rick_chasey said:

    Ha I used to have a boss who would say "what do you want me to say, well done for doing you job?"

    Did he add “as a reward you get to keep it”?
  • First.Aspect
    First.Aspect Posts: 17,167
    rjsterry said:

    rick_chasey said:

    Is there anything Gove has been involved with that isn’t now sh!t?

    Don't think that's where the fault lies. The material is found across the public estate. Schools are just the flashpoint because the oh f*** moment coincided with the start of term. If an hospital ceiling had landed on people we'd all be asking about Health Secretaries past and present. The fault is in not setting up a register of this material as soon as the first one failed and systematically assessing all of them for water ingress/ rebar corrosion then planning renewals around the most urgent cases. That said, anyone in government from the mid 90s onwards could have picked this up and pushed it. Labour were replacing schools but not with any reference to RAAC.

    I'm sure head teachers don't want to become building managers as well, but the common thread in a lot of construction/maintenance failures is too great a distance between the end users of a building and the people responsible for their maintenance.
    are we the only country dumb enough to use it? If not, what's happened elsewhere?


  • pblakeney
    pblakeney Posts: 27,329
    First.Aspect said:

    rjsterry said:

    rick_chasey said:

    Is there anything Gove has been involved with that isn’t now sh!t?

    Don't think that's where the fault lies. The material is found across the public estate. Schools are just the flashpoint because the oh f*** moment coincided with the start of term. If an hospital ceiling had landed on people we'd all be asking about Health Secretaries past and present. The fault is in not setting up a register of this material as soon as the first one failed and systematically assessing all of them for water ingress/ rebar corrosion then planning renewals around the most urgent cases. That said, anyone in government from the mid 90s onwards could have picked this up and pushed it. Labour were replacing schools but not with any reference to RAAC.

    I'm sure head teachers don't want to become building managers as well, but the common thread in a lot of construction/maintenance failures is too great a distance between the end users of a building and the people responsible for their maintenance.
    are we the only country dumb enough to use it? If not, what's happened elsewhere?


    I'd be guessing planned obsolescence and a replacement plan.
    How radical! Just a guess though.
    The above may be fact, or fiction, I may be serious, I may be jesting.
    I am not sure. You have no chance.
    Veronese68 wrote:
    PB is the most sensible person on here.
  • TheBigBean
    TheBigBean Posts: 21,916
    surrey_commuter said:

    rick_chasey said:

    Ha I used to have a boss who would say "what do you want me to say, well done for doing you job?"

    Did he add “as a reward you get to keep it”?
    Makes me think of "There's no I in team, but there is a U in c..."
  • rjsterry
    rjsterry Posts: 29,556
    edited September 2023
    First.Aspect said:

    rjsterry said:

    rick_chasey said:

    Is there anything Gove has been involved with that isn’t now sh!t?

    Don't think that's where the fault lies. The material is found across the public estate. Schools are just the flashpoint because the oh f*** moment coincided with the start of term. If an hospital ceiling had landed on people we'd all be asking about Health Secretaries past and present. The fault is in not setting up a register of this material as soon as the first one failed and systematically assessing all of them for water ingress/ rebar corrosion then planning renewals around the most urgent cases. That said, anyone in government from the mid 90s onwards could have picked this up and pushed it. Labour were replacing schools but not with any reference to RAAC.

    I'm sure head teachers don't want to become building managers as well, but the common thread in a lot of construction/maintenance failures is too great a distance between the end users of a building and the people responsible for their maintenance.
    are we the only country dumb enough to use it? If not, what's happened elsewhere?


    No. I can't find what remediation has been carried out elsewhere but it was widely used in Europe. It's fine for short term (30 years) use and if you need to build a lot of public buildings quickly and cheaply after WW2 it makes sense. The problem is after that 30 years expired a series of goverments passing the problem along until the music stops, at each step making the problem bigger as there's less time for replacement. TBF, this is the history of every big change in public safety. A long tail of increasingly anxious warnings, a crisis and then change. At least this time we didn't wait for the massive rail crash/sinking ship/towering inferno before doing something.
    1985 Mercian King of Mercia - work in progress (Hah! Who am I kidding?)
    Pinnacle Monzonite

    Part of the anti-growth coalition
  • tailwindhome
    tailwindhome Posts: 19,436
    Ouch
    “New York has the haircuts, London has the trousers, but Belfast has the reason!
  • First.Aspect
    First.Aspect Posts: 17,167
    tailwindhome said:

    Ouch

    Wasn't a blunder though. She knew exactly what she was doing.
  • kingstongraham
    kingstongraham Posts: 28,152
    Playing 4d chess, is she?
  • kingstongraham
    kingstongraham Posts: 28,152
  • Jezyboy
    Jezyboy Posts: 3,605
    kingstongraham said:

    Playing 4d chess, is she?

    I don't think it's a massive clever strategy, more an aggressive form of leak. Instead of a source from education claiming they were doing all they could, but being held up by treasury/no 10, then no 10 saying it was simply miscommunication from a disgruntled civil servant, we now just get a minister mouthing off.
  • pblakeney
    pblakeney Posts: 27,329
    What goads me is that she wants thanks before the job has even begun.
    The above may be fact, or fiction, I may be serious, I may be jesting.
    I am not sure. You have no chance.
    Veronese68 wrote:
    PB is the most sensible person on here.
  • tailwindhome
    tailwindhome Posts: 19,436
    'We're rebuilding 50 schools a year" isn't a great line when the allegation is that you knew more was required but Sunak cut the bid to 50
    “New York has the haircuts, London has the trousers, but Belfast has the reason!
  • rjsterry
    rjsterry Posts: 29,556
    tailwindhome said:

    'We're rebuilding 50 schools a year" isn't a great line when the allegation is that you knew more was required but Sunak cut the bid to 50

    Initial requirements were assessed at 400. Negotiated down to 100, then halved again by Sunak as Chancellor.

    Good explanation of the technical issues for anyone interested.

    https://www.sciencemediacentre.org/expert-reaction-to-situation-with-raac-in-school-buildings/
    1985 Mercian King of Mercia - work in progress (Hah! Who am I kidding?)
    Pinnacle Monzonite

    Part of the anti-growth coalition
  • rick_chasey
    rick_chasey Posts: 75,661
    First.Aspect said:

    tailwindhome said:

    Ouch

    Wasn't a blunder though. She knew exactly what she was doing.
    If you're in the tory party and the daily mail is calling it a blunder, it's a blunder.
    _
  • rjsterry
    rjsterry Posts: 29,556
    It's possible she meant to do it and it was still a bad decision.
    1985 Mercian King of Mercia - work in progress (Hah! Who am I kidding?)
    Pinnacle Monzonite

    Part of the anti-growth coalition
  • First.Aspect
    First.Aspect Posts: 17,167
    rick_chasey said:

    First.Aspect said:

    tailwindhome said:

    Ouch

    Wasn't a blunder though. She knew exactly what she was doing.
    If you're in the tory party and the daily mail is calling it a blunder, it's a blunder.
    Isn't it everyone for themselves over there at this stage?
  • rick_chasey
    rick_chasey Posts: 75,661
    First.Aspect said:

    rick_chasey said:

    First.Aspect said:

    tailwindhome said:

    Ouch

    Wasn't a blunder though. She knew exactly what she was doing.
    If you're in the tory party and the daily mail is calling it a blunder, it's a blunder.
    Isn't it everyone for themselves over there at this stage?
    Mail is about as core an audience as you want and if you're the star of a negative front page, it's not gonna help.
    _
  • First.Aspect
    First.Aspect Posts: 17,167
    rick_chasey said:

    First.Aspect said:

    rick_chasey said:

    First.Aspect said:

    tailwindhome said:

    Ouch

    Wasn't a blunder though. She knew exactly what she was doing.
    If you're in the tory party and the daily mail is calling it a blunder, it's a blunder.
    Isn't it everyone for themselves over there at this stage?
    Mail is about as core an audience as you want and if you're the star of a negative front page, it's not gonna help.
    I see this as about infighting. Seems to me the Tories stopped caring about beating anyone but themselves some time ago.

Categories