TDF 2018, Stage 3: Cholet > Cholet 09/07/2018 - 35,5 km - Team Time-Trial *Spoilers*

Vino'sGhost

how technical is the course? its hard to tell from the road book.

smithy21

The Dauphiné in my recollection is one for the few times Sky have actually nailed a TTT. They were not against a BMC “A”team though.

I would expect BMC to take this.

Has Bardet done any TT training or does he still just find it boring?

whatleytom

From what Dumoulin was saying he felt the speeds were going to be so high due to the untechnical nature, that the time gaps were going to be very small.

Lanterne_Rogue

Vino'sGhost wrote:

how technical is the course? its hard to tell from the road book.

Inrng suggests that the gradients might cause some issues in terms of cohesion; they've not mentioned anything about the course being particularly tight or twisty despite (iirc) having ridden it a few times themselves. I've seen other comments elsewhere that suggest it'll favour the teams with big firepower, so that also implies that there's plenty of wide open stuff to really take advantage of.

rick_chasey

whatleytom wrote:

From what Dumoulin was saying he felt the speeds were going to be so high due to the untechnical nature, that the time gaps were going to be very small.

You sure that wasn't a clip from the last TT in the Giro? :P

I read the opposite; rolling hills would create bigger time gaps.

But then Dumolin is usually pretty accurate with this stuff.

RichN95.

A technical course with gradients makes it harder to keep the team together so strength in depth will be important.

Movistar are an interesting one because presumably their plan must be to get all of the three amigos to the finish in the front 4

No_Ta_Doctor

Wind looks to be pretty stable over the whole timeframe, at 17km/h from NE, gusting to 28-29km/h. Not more than a stiff breeze, but maybe enough to give power teams an edge.

Start times:
Timings in local time zone. Subtract one hour for UK time.

1. Mitchelton-Scott (Aus) 15:10
2. Team Sky (GBr) 15.15
3. Movistar Team (Esp) 15.20
4. Groupama-FDJ (Fra) 15.25
5. BMC Racing Team (USA) 15.30
6. EF Education First-Drapac (USA) 15.35
7. UAE Team Emirates (UAE) 15.40
8. Ag2r La Mondiale (Fra) 15.45
9. Fortuneo-Samsic (Fra) 15.50
10. Direct Energie (Fra) 15.55
11. Lotto-Soudal (Bel) 16.00
12. LottoNL-Jumbo (Ned) 16.05
13. Cofidis, Solutions Credits (Fra) 16.10
14. Team Sunweb (Ger) 16.15
15. Team Dimension Data (RSA) 16.20
16. Katusha-Alpecin (Sui) 16.25
17. Bahrain-Merida (Brn) 16.30
18. Trek-Segafredo (USA) 16.35
19. Astana Pro Team (Kaz) 16.40
20. Wanty-Groupe Gobert (Bel) 16.45
21. Quick-Step Floors (Bel) 16.50
22. Bora-Hansgrohe (Ger) 16.55

No_Ta_Doctor

RichN95 wrote:

A technical course with gradients makes it harder to keep the team together so strength in depth will be important.

Movistar are an interesting one because presumably their plan must be to get all of the three amigos to the finish in the front 4

Yes, doesn't leave much room for error, unless they decide to sacrifice one of them. Presumably puts quite a lot of the workload onto the rest of the team.

No_Ta_Doctor

I think the "climbs" are a bit overplayed on this, though it's small details that make or break TTTs.
700m at 5% then the same again, then 1500m at 5% for first half and 3% for second. None of that would look out of place in the last few kms of a sprint stage. I think what's most interesting about them is that the first climb is right near the start of the course, there's definitely a possibility of going out too hard. And I can definitely see teams sacrificing a rider on the last climb to make a big effort there.

Lanterne_Rogue

No tA Doctor wrote:

I think the "climbs" are a bit overplayed on this, though it's small details that make or break TTTs.
700m at 5% then the same again, then 1500m at 5% for first half and 3% for second. None of that would look out of place in the last few kms of a sprint stage. I think what's most interesting about them is that the first climb is right near the start of the course, there's definitely a possibility of going out too hard. And I can definitely see teams sacrificing a rider on the last climb to make a big effort there.

Climbs max out at 10% and 12% though, so a bit stiffer in places - even if only temporarily - than the total figures suggest. If this were the run in to the sprint stage we'd be talking about teams using it to dislodge pure sprinters and force a smaller selection, rather than the peloton barrelling over it with sprint trains intact.

tailwindhome

Cannondale videoed their recon

https://www.facebook.com/CannondaleProC ... z1_jM4Mr4s

People still 'video' stuff yeah?

No_Ta_Doctor

underlayunderlay wrote:

No tA Doctor wrote:

I think the "climbs" are a bit overplayed on this, though it's small details that make or break TTTs.
700m at 5% then the same again, then 1500m at 5% for first half and 3% for second. None of that would look out of place in the last few kms of a sprint stage. I think what's most interesting about them is that the first climb is right near the start of the course, there's definitely a possibility of going out too hard. And I can definitely see teams sacrificing a rider on the last climb to make a big effort there.

Climbs max out at 10% and 12% though, so a bit stiffer in places - even if only temporarily - than the total figures suggest. If this were the run in to the sprint stage we'd be talking about teams using it to dislodge pure sprinters and force a smaller selection, rather than the peloton barrelling over it with sprint trains intact.

Trust me to have missed that bit of info.

As you were, everyone.

cygnet

No tA Doctor wrote:

RichN95 wrote:

A technical course with gradients makes it harder to keep the team together so strength in depth will be important.

Movistar are an interesting one because presumably their plan must be to get all of the three amigos to the finish in the front 4

Yes, doesn't leave much room for error, unless they decide to sacrifice one of them. Presumably puts quite a lot of the workload onto the rest of the team.

If 7 finish in a "bunch" don't they all get the same time as the 4th man?

yorkshireraw

Rick Chasey wrote:

We're confident QS aren't going to be challenging?

I mean, that team ain't slow.

Jungels, Lampaert, Terpstra, DeClerq, Gilbert to drive it...

My thoughts exactly (although still think Sky will edge it) - that QS team is stuffed with classics champs / units. Along with BMC and Orica Scott-Edge theyve been the one of the top TTT teams of the last few yrs.

No_Ta_Doctor

cygnet wrote:

No tA Doctor wrote:

RichN95 wrote:

A technical course with gradients makes it harder to keep the team together so strength in depth will be important.

Movistar are an interesting one because presumably their plan must be to get all of the three amigos to the finish in the front 4

Yes, doesn't leave much room for error, unless they decide to sacrifice one of them. Presumably puts quite a lot of the workload onto the rest of the team.

If 7 finish in a "bunch" don't they all get the same time as the 4th man?

Yes, time is taken at 4th man, unless you're dropped. Movistar just need to get three leaders - none of whom is a renowned TTer - over the line. They've got far less leeway than other teams.

yorkshireraw

RichN95 wrote:

A technical course with gradients makes it harder to keep the team together so strength in depth will be important.

Movistar are an interesting one because presumably their plan must be to get all of the three amigos to the finish in the front 4

Bennati will be key at keeping them organised you'd think. Valverde will just wheel suck Landa all the way probably...

No_Ta_Doctor

Quickstep should get a good time, and have reason to ride to try and get Gaviria back into yellow. I'm more interested in the GC here though, this stage has to be a part of any contender's strategy.

yorkshireraw

No tA Doctor wrote:

cygnet wrote:

No tA Doctor wrote:

RichN95 wrote:

A technical course with gradients makes it harder to keep the team together so strength in depth will be important.

Movistar are an interesting one because presumably their plan must be to get all of the three amigos to the finish in the front 4

Yes, doesn't leave much room for error, unless they decide to sacrifice one of them. Presumably puts quite a lot of the workload onto the rest of the team.

If 7 finish in a "bunch" don't they all get the same time as the 4th man?

Yes, time is taken at 4th man, unless you're dropped. Movistar just need to get three leaders - none of whom is a renowned TTer - over the line. They've got far less leeway than other teams.

Valverde has decent TT pedigree when he needs to.

No_Ta_Doctor

YorkshireRaw wrote:

No tA Doctor wrote:

cygnet wrote:

No tA Doctor wrote:

RichN95 wrote:

A technical course with gradients makes it harder to keep the team together so strength in depth will be important.

Movistar are an interesting one because presumably their plan must be to get all of the three amigos to the finish in the front 4

Yes, doesn't leave much room for error, unless they decide to sacrifice one of them. Presumably puts quite a lot of the workload onto the rest of the team.

If 7 finish in a "bunch" don't they all get the same time as the 4th man?

Yes, time is taken at 4th man, unless you're dropped. Movistar just need to get three leaders - none of whom is a renowned TTer - over the line. They've got far less leeway than other teams.

Valverde has decent TT pedigree when he needs to.

I wonder how much our perception is skewed by most TTs of importance being in the third week of a GT? There's far more in play there than merely having power and technique, first week TTs must surely favour real TT talents.

RichN95.

Half an hour left for PTP picks

No_Ta_Doctor

Astana could be in trouble today, having lost Sanchez yesterday.

No_Ta_Doctor

Danish TV2 has Riis playing with some fancy graphics, pointing out that if there are side winds then the last man is always in danger of going in the ditch if the lead doesn't use the whole road, also Brian Holm suggesting it's more technical than we might think and the wind is a definite factor.

Wind is NE which looks to me like quite a lot of crosswind today.

Lanterne_Rogue

I watched the BMC recon video and thought 'flipping heck, those hills are worse than advertised". Took a very long time for the penny to drop and realise the camera was pointing downwards...

Pross

RichN95 wrote:

A technical course with gradients makes it harder to keep the team together so strength in depth will be important.

Movistar are an interesting one because presumably their plan must be to get all of the three amigos to the finish in the front 4

A chance for Valverde to gain time on his rivals before the mountains. Expect to see him drilling it in the crosswinds as Landa and Quintana are trying to get back on after their turn rolling through.

FocusZing

Can't the radios be built in the larger helmets? Stuffed down the back looks crazy when they go to the extreme of wind tunnels.

Lanterne_Rogue

Want a Mitchelton-Scott helmet but only have a limited budget? Never fear...

blazing_saddles

Interesting.
Yates taking a pull, but Nieve is being allowed to sit at the back as a passenger.

No_Ta_Doctor

Movistar definitely have the dodgy dimples on their skinsuits. Sky going with a new one without.

No_Ta_Doctor

Blazing Saddles wrote:

Interesting.
Yates taking a pull, but Nieve is being allowed to sit at the back as a passenger.

Doesn't look like he's enjoying it much

No_Ta_Doctor

They're slotting in in front of both Yates and Nieve now.