Cycling on Atkins diet
Comments
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There are LCHF athletes and there are plenty of HCLF athletes too.p929 wrote:mrfpb wrote:P929, I think we are similar in our approach as far as cycling goes. I'm finding I'm able to go 3 hrs plus without food ( or breakfast) in z2 or 3. This seems to be the alleged fat burning zone. However, my diet over the last year is just is bit less of eveything apartfrom more fruit and veg, rather than LCHF.
Although Z1-Z2 are the 'fat burning zones' you expend some amount of carbs, that's inevitable. However, the 1 million question is: how many carbs, and how much fat?
Fruits and vegs are Carbs, but different from simple processed carbs, which I think should be almost eliminated from diet. In fact, Fruits and carbs are the reason why I keep on a moderate LCHF, because I love the taste and I know they nourish my body properly, instead of processed flours (I must admit I still love the taste of bread, but I know that I just can't eat it). All in all I think another interesting view is the Paleo diet, which I find not as restrictive as others.mrfpb wrote:A lot of diet advice in cycling litrature is aimed at making people better/faster cyclists. But some of us cycle to be fitter, healthier people, so different advice applies
Well, be aware that most of high performance advice are based on the paradigm that athletes should/can only work at performance level when fully carb-loaded, which has been a disproved lately, for instance LeBron James follows a LCHF.
I think the carbs debate is confused, but the dieticians I've listened to seem consistent:
1. Eat whole foods, whole food complex carbs don't matter if the sugars are eaten with fiber.
2. Refined carbs and added sugar are a disaster. Factory produced carbs of any sort should be avoided...the worst thing ever would probably be a doughnut.
3. You don't usually need to worry about protein. There are more than enough amino acids in plants, you don't need to stuff down chicken or steak at every meal to avoid complex carbs or get your protein fix, that will do you more harm than good in the long term. Protein is really only good for children, body builders or those over 65 years old. Everyone should be careful to limit their protein intake.
So yes carbs are bad, but also carbs are good.
According to most dieticians and professors in nutrition their advice is to follow as closely as possible 'blue zone' diets, that's old news, and doesn't get much click-bait or sell many books, but it's consistent advice.0 -
ZMC888 wrote:There are LCHF athletes and there are plenty of HCLF athletes too.
I think the carbs debate is confused, but the dieticians I've listened to seem consistent:
1. Eat whole foods, whole food complex carbs don't matter if the sugars are eaten with fiber.
2. Refined carbs and added sugar are a disaster. Factory produced carbs of any sort should be avoided...the worst thing ever would probably be a doughnut.
3. You don't usually need to worry about protein. There are more than enough amino acids in plants, you don't need to stuff down chicken or steak at every meal to avoid complex carbs or get your protein fix, that will do you more harm than good in the long term. Protein is really only good for children, body builders or those over 65 years old. Everyone should be careful to limit their protein intake.
So yes carbs are bad, but also carbs are good.
According to most dieticians and professors in nutrition their advice is to follow as closely as possible 'blue zone' diets, that's old news, and doesn't get much click-bait or sell many books, but it's consistent advice.
I agree, there's too much to be yet researched that we can't just go black or white. We have to experiment with ourselves to find out what's more beneficial for us. For instance, my training (TSS~600/week @ IF~0.8 ) consists of 3 sessions of 1.5hrs and a 3+hrs ride on Sunday. So far I haven't found the need for eating during my rides and haven't hit the wall yet, which surprise me somehow because most people will tell you that after 90min riding you gotta eat something or take one of those bloody expensive gels. However, there's a chance that everything changes once in May as I'm planning to start racing for the first time in my life, but I hope that it won't be the case.
Regarding protein excess, AFAIU it's being debated if eating too much protein might lead also lead to glucose creation trough gluconeogenesys, which finally disrupt the whole idea of reducing carbs. However, when you search there's not a definitive rule of thumb about how much protein per day but usually 2 gr/day/kg with <120gr/day is found, which is what I try to follow.0 -
I have tried the low carb (Atkins) and the 5:2 diets!
I'm a 'put-on-weight-easy'type of guy....... late 40's and even during the racing season I can get a 'belly' from eating without restrictions.
This time last year I managed to get my weight down to 72 kg using a combination of low-carb and 5:2 though my training and racing suffered as a result!!!
Crashed in may and tore ligaments in my shoulder so I ended my racing season prematurely, in the meantime I allowed myself a few beers here and there and the odd takeaway but by the end of the summer I was 77.5 kg and mostly around the middle, so back to the drawing board for 2018.
Whilst wasting my life away on my laptop I came across an article about a guy called Dr. philip Maffatone and his approach to training and diet so I decided to purchase his book 'Endurance training and racing' and the principles have really helped me..... My initial dilemma is that carbs cause me to gain weight but if I don't take carbs then I can't perform so I needed a different approach!
My bellyfat was visceral which basically means it's not soft, flabby fat but harder fat attached to my organs and my research lead me to learn that a combination of complex carbs (sugars) and refined sugar in general 'could' be the bad guy. The Maffatone method required me to go clean for 2 weeks, very low carb basically to reset my system and after the two weeks to start gradually adding carbs to my diet and to take note of any changes as to how I felt.....
I wasn't training as such on the bike but just commuting 3 days a week to work but as soon as I started the 2 week low carb my heartrate on the bike went up 15 to 20 beats and I felt as though I was really unfit. Off the bike I actually felt better but my heartrate in the evenings when I went to bed actually prevented me from falling asleep!
Maffatone's approach is riding under your maximum aerobic limit, a diet involving no processed foods and eliminate as much stress from your life as possible!!
Last year after riding through the whole winter building a solid base of steady miles and some power training on the indoor trainer followed by interval training from the beginning of january gradually adding threshold training in early february. During February my first training race I could ride for 45 minutes within my category before getting dropped which didn't really bother me as it was only February!
This year I started 'The maffatone method' December 1st and after riding like a granny for six weeks my averages started to improve. My weight has gradually come down to 70 kg but I feel stronger than last year..... I'm no longer training using a coach or schedule or riding between zones 1-5, I only train within the MAF zone and I decided to start my racing season 3 weeks ago by riding training races to get some intensity and the effects compared to last year so far have been dramatic (for me!) My frist training race on 10th February I ended up (by accident!) in a breakaway of 3 and finished 3rd, my goal was to stay in the bunch for more than 45 minutes and here I was with a podium placing!! A week later I instigated a breakaway of 5 and finished 4th, that for me is a dramatic improvement on last year..... yesterday the numbers in my category (2nd) were low so my buddy suggested we ride with 1st cat for speed and if we got dropped we could just get lapped (course was 3.2 km) and jump back on for as long as we could...... to my amazement I finished!! The average speed was higher than last week and I struggled at times to follow the pace but I finished the full hour........ unbelievable!!!!!
My carb intake is 'dialed in' as they call it...... I only eat simple carbs before, during and after training or racing so I avoid the insulin peaks that cause me to store carbs as reserve fat and 'the belly' has shrunk as a result!! I eat an omlette for breakfast, ride 20 miles to the race venue, eat a banana half an hour before the race, eat nothing during as it's only of 1 hour duration and afterwards I eat another banana and ride 20 miles home whilst eating home made cereal bars (recipe in maffatone's book) and drinking water with electrolytes. In the evening after a race is the only times I eat carbs that have not been scourced from fruit or vegetables and that is 100 grams of brown rice with my evening dinner to replenish glycogen and help recovery.
I have reduced my stress levels I've noticed by not stressing about food, training or how my racing was going to pan out..... I had a book that pointed me in a certain direction so my plan was to follow it for 6 months to see if it helped as I had nothing to lose. I'm amazed at what I've learned about myself...... most of my stress was actually caused by 'cycling anxiety'! The stress of racing, the stress of training, diet, equipment etc. most of the time whilst going to a race I was extremely anxious but for some reason that is gone.
I wanted to share this on the forum because I've read a lot of usefull comments over the past few years that have helped me in some way and hopefully someone might benefit from my experience!!!'REMEMBER SOME PEOPLE ARE ALIVE
SIMPLY BECAUSE IT IS ILLEGAL TO SHOOT THEM'0 -
I cycle every morning on an empty stomach (before breakfast) it does slow you down, endurance is okay but not speed/power,
You really need carbs for any cycling exertion, but hopefully when you get down to your weight you can eat carbs an hour before cycling.
If your diet is working stick with it.
Regards0 -
IT takes time for our bodies to adjust to burning fat instead of glycogen.
Many athletes now train "fasted cardio" for improved endurance.
Keep at it you will get better with time.0 -
In my view, Atkins is a sledgehammer for cracking a nut. Very simply put, the insulin hormone suppresses the body's ability to use fat as fuel. When your insulin levels are high, then you can't loose weight.
Ketosis is an extreme way of working against that. You can do things similarly by eating good food that doesn't raise insulin levels hight (Low GI/GL). The good news is that insulin production is limited by ongoing exercise, so when you're on the bike, then is the time to eat carbs (alternatively, if it's low intensity, you can ride fasted or without carbs to get your body used to burning fat as fuel).
Also, eat carbs after exercise as you need them to rebuild muscles (as well as amino acids from proteins) - just don't binge on the stuff.
So eat the carbs when you're exercising - and avoid them when you're not.0 -
Mixing in fasted rides has worked really well for me
Started cycling around a year ago, weighing in at 82kg, am now sitting anywhere from 64-66kg depending on the time of day/depending on exact pattern of eating. I didn't diet constantly, as there were times where I just lost the motivation, or wanted to focus on training in general. However, fasted rides have been really sustainable and also seem to be beneficial for overall fitness.
As I tended to enjoy the feeling of being full, I opt to have one big meal a day, and perhaps another smaller one later on. This pretty much allows me to eat whatever I want, not the healthiest option, but dieting and cutting portion sizes only worked temporarily for me, or rather, one "big" treat meal on special occasions, or an evening out would throw everything out of balance.
With a fasted ride, i tend to jump straight on the bike in the morning for anywhere from 1 to 2 hours. I tend to ride quite intensely so burn around 700-1300 cals on these rides. I then eat when I get back and the bigger meal (~1500-2000) cals at that point keeps me full and feeling satisfied all day. Sometimes i'll then have a small snack late in the evening, but never really more than around 500 cals. On these days, I tended to run a calorie defecit of anywhere from 500 to 1500 and found this really sustainable. Discipline was easy if I knew I had something to look forward to each day. As a note, I would often not run a defecit, or only run a small deficit on rest days.0 -
I have tried all sorts of crap. However if you burn more than you eat, you lose weight. Its pretty simple. Unless you have a medical condition.
There is no trick really. I just try my best to ensure my Macros are fairly sorted and if I want to loss weight then go into a calorie deficit and not a huge one and it drops off and usually stays off. Especially when combined with cycling/exercise.
Its not rocket science really and still allows you to indulge. All these Atkins, Paleo, etc etc etc are no sustainable. So what is the point? Just change your habits and relationship with food.0
