Forum home Road cycling forum The bottom bracket

Do Youngsters Spend too much ?

fenixfenix Posts: 5,437
edited August 2017 in The bottom bracket
I've seen talk of this in the press - people not able to afford a deposit on a house as they've gone up ridiculously over the years - but at the same time having the latest phone, take out coffees etc etc.

I know when we got our first house we couldnt do much for a couple of years - but now there is more to pay for. Mobiles. Broadband etc etc.

Are the young seeing the dream life portrayed by Instagram and living it up with stag parties in Vegas and weekends in Marbella, the latest 4x4 and forgetting to save ?

If you save and put into your pension from early on - you soon forget you even had that money.

Maybe I'm just of a different mindset to the young. Things have changed dramatically over the decades.

Are they storing up trouble for the future ?
«13456

Posts

  • hopkinbhopkinb Posts: 7,074
    Have I stumbled onto MailOnline by mistake?
  • daniel_bdaniel_b Posts: 9,646
    Not sure it is just the young, would suggest it is a reasonable percentage of the population.

    Most people I work with, think nothing of buying a coffee on the way to work, and going out for lunch every single day - or at the very least going and buying a sandwich, or visiting subway etc.

    Bizarre they do not tot up what they are spending on a daily basis, and multiply it out across a year to give them the figure.
    I guess either they do not want to, or they genuinely want to spend their money in that way, which is of course up to them, I just can't see the logic behind it.

    My parents never had that much money when I was growing up, so I was always brought up that you made, and took your lunch\snacks to work and that was it. It seems such an intelligent way to do things, that I have never deviated from that line of thinking - leaving\birthday lunches excluded of course.

    I am careful with my money in general, but do like to splash out on things that are dear to me, used to be cars, but now predominantly cycling related purchases.

    We run the house on a pretty tight reign, although some things you have to find the money for, so a new boiler the year before last, new windows throughout last year, and a new bathroom this year - would have done the bathroom ourselves, but with a 3 year old daughter, the time to do these things is extremely limited, so we had to pay someone.

    We run a 16 year old car, that has covered 116K, and is converted to run on LPG - big luxurious auto barge, that carries us (And bikes) in comfort, and hopefully has another 80k at least to run before needing to be replaced.
    This car is probably worth 2K at max, probably more like 1.5, and owes us nothing.

    We do not have Sky or BT, or any fancy channels, we just have freeview, and due to my love of cycling I spent £20 on a years worth of Eurosport player coverage, which I can watch on the TV, or laptop\phone etc, brilliant it is.

    We do both have £210 smart phones, one of which coincidentally died whilst on holiday, but that is going back for a refund (Covered under warranty) and we found a bargain prime deal on Amazon for a Motorola something or other, reduced to £135, so we'll be £70 up on the deal, as well as having one phone with a new 2 year warranty - so not too bad at all.

    I have fibre at home, but that's not pricey, and I use it for working from home, and also for streaming ES player etc, and we carry out Skype calls to family around the world, so it justifies it's moderate expense in my eyes.

    Sorry, bit of a monologue there :oops:
    Felt F70 05 (Turbo)
    Marin Palisades Trail 91 and 06
    Scott CR1 SL 12
    Cannondale Synapse Adventure 15 & 16 Di2
    Scott Foil 18
  • joey54321joey54321 Posts: 1,297
    I think it's a bit of both. There are always people who save and people who don't, it's not just a generational thing.

    There is also an element of 'hopelessness' amongst many younger people (at least that I know). Saving £50 a month seems pretty futile when you need £300k to get a house deposit. A friend was looking at houses and the 'affordable homes' started at £500k. If you've on £26k/year (I think the national average, at least close) that is pretty out of reach.
  • capt_slogcapt_slog Posts: 3,602
    It's true that they have higher expectations, but in some ways, it would be a shame if they didn't. My father certainly expected that I would 'get on better' than he did. He wanted me to have a better job, with more prospects and pay, and I wanted the same for my kids. My eldest son was the first in my line to get a degree, his first job earns him more than I'm getting paid 40+ years in.

    So whilst I see them spending on things which might have seemed ridiculous to me, and are still extravagant by any standard I can apply, what did I (and Fenix) really "expect"?

    They keep the money moving around, which has to be good for the economy, I can only hope that they are sensible in how they are preparing for the long term.


    The older I get, the better I was.

  • sungodsungod Posts: 13,779
    poor/no return on saving accounts
    suspicion of more complex products (sometimes well founded!)
    property prices (at least in london) far higher multiplier of average salary than 20-30 years ago
    exposure to media/entertainment that present consumption without consequence as normal
    zero hours/'gig economy' impact on income stability
    etc.

    maybe they enjoy life and wait for the parents to snuff it so they can inherit the family home
    my bike - faster than god's and twice as shiny
  • fenixfenix Posts: 5,437
    300k for a deposit ?

    Bloody crazy that an affordable home is half a million.

    It's true that my generation spend more than our parents did - so I guess the next will be more spendy too. But you should only be spending what you have...
  • pblakeneypblakeney Posts: 16,809
    edited July 2017
    Just as concerning - Those complaining about having to work an extra year before collecting their pension. As if the State pension on it's own will be enough for a comfortable life.
    The above may be fact, or fiction, I may be serious, I may be jesting.
    I am not sure. You have no chance.
    Veronese68 wrote:
    PB is the most sensible person on here.
  • ryan_w-2ryan_w-2 Posts: 1,162
    I'm 32 and trying to buy in the SW boroughs of London.

    Sad state when £600k gets you a tiny 2 bed terraced house.

    Now account for a 10% deposit, stamp duty and legal fees, you need IRO £83k, and not having wealthy parents, where the f**k am I meant to pull that from?!

    We're saving hard but property prices are going up faster than we can save.

    Doesn't help paying extortionate rent, but needs must.
    Specialized Allez Sprint Disc --- Specialized S-Works SL7

    IG: RhinosWorkshop
  • hopkinbhopkinb Posts: 7,074
    Ryan_W wrote:
    I'm 32 and trying to buy in the SW boroughs of London.

    Sad state when £600k gets you a tiny 2 bed terraced house.

    Now account for a 10% deposit, stamp duty and legal fees, you need IRO £83k, and not having wealthy parents, where the f**k am I meant to pull that from?!

    We're saving hard but property prices are going up faster than we can save.

    Doesn't help paying extortionate rent, but needs must.

    Puts old man voice on...

    "Let's have a look at that list of bikes shall we Sonny Jim?"

    Which I think is the OP's point...

    :D
  • trek_dantrek_dan Posts: 1,366
    Maybe young to young-ish folk have realised life is short and there's more to life than buying a house and sitting in it watching the tele every night, or perhaps watched our parents/grandparents work and save their entire life to buy a house and put savings away just for them have to use it all paying for care in their old age*

    *says the 30 year old who lives in a rented house and has just returned from the aforementioned young person USA/Las Vegas trip and has been on 3 or 4 holidays a year for the last decade

    Plus plenty of us 30 somethings or younger don't have kids and never intent to have any.
  • hopkinbhopkinb Posts: 7,074
    PBlakeney wrote:
    Just as concerning - Those complaining about having to work an extra year before collecting their pension. As if the State pension on it's own will be enough for a comfortable life.

    What's the state pension now? £150 per week? Best part of £8k per annum? I know the national average salary is only as high as £25/26k because it's dragged up there by London & the SE.

    I would think £16k is an average salary in large parts of the country. £8k is 50% of that. What do they say your pension should be in relation to your income while in work? 50/60%? That sort of area?
  • pblakeneypblakeney Posts: 16,809
    Fenix wrote:
    300k for a deposit ?

    Bloody crazy that an affordable home is half a million.

    It's true that my generation spend more than our parents did - so I guess the next will be more spendy too. But you should only be spending what you have...
    Just what the housing market needs. More people to simply say sod paying that much.
    Too many people are slaves to their mortgage.
    The above may be fact, or fiction, I may be serious, I may be jesting.
    I am not sure. You have no chance.
    Veronese68 wrote:
    PB is the most sensible person on here.
  • hopkinbhopkinb Posts: 7,074
    I'm not, by the way, suggesting that £8k per annum is enough for a comfortable life, just that compared to salary levels, it's quite a high proportion. I don't suppose the state pension in its current form will exist for too much longer anyway, especially with auto-enrolment.
  • pblakeneypblakeney Posts: 16,809
    hopkinb wrote:
    PBlakeney wrote:
    Just as concerning - Those complaining about having to work an extra year before collecting their pension. As if the State pension on it's own will be enough for a comfortable life.

    What's the state pension now? £150 per week? Best part of £8k per annum? I know the national average salary is only as high as £25/26k because it's dragged up there by London & the SE.

    I would think £16k is an average salary in large parts of the country. £8k is 50% of that. What do they say your pension should be in relation to your income while in work? 50/60%? That sort of area?
    Just think what that £150 gets you, even if you have paid off your mortgage. What are your weekly household and grocery bills? Rates, gas, electricity, t'internet, phone, insurance. And that's before you get to car costs...
    A £16k salary will be topped up by working credits and quite possibly dual earnings.
    I have low expectations of collecting my State pension.
    The above may be fact, or fiction, I may be serious, I may be jesting.
    I am not sure. You have no chance.
    Veronese68 wrote:
    PB is the most sensible person on here.
  • fenixfenix Posts: 5,437
    I've seen 2/3 of your wage to be comfortable - but I'm not so sure about that - you'll not have a mortgage or long term savings to make - I guess it depends what you're used to - I think I'd be OK on under 50% of my salary in old age.

    Everyone's different though.
  • hopkinbhopkinb Posts: 7,074
    PBlakeney wrote:
    I have low expectations of collecting my State pension.

    Me too..
  • ryan_w-2ryan_w-2 Posts: 1,162
    hopkinb wrote:
    Ryan_W wrote:
    I'm 32 and trying to buy in the SW boroughs of London.

    Sad state when £600k gets you a tiny 2 bed terraced house.

    Now account for a 10% deposit, stamp duty and legal fees, you need IRO £83k, and not having wealthy parents, where the f**k am I meant to pull that from?!

    We're saving hard but property prices are going up faster than we can save.

    Doesn't help paying extortionate rent, but needs must.

    Puts old man voice on...

    "Let's have a look at that list of bikes shall we Sonny Jim?"

    Which I think is the OP's point...

    :D

    I know, I've been on some amazing holidays too over the past few years (Mexico, Australia, Hawaii, Maldives), got engaged, bought a car, puppy, and now paying for a wedding in Maui...

    I was in the RAF for 9 years and didn't save a penny, life was for living back then, now I see that may not have been the best choice, however, we can't change the past.

    We're still sitting on a nice nest egg that is our growing house deposit, but I fear it will never be enough at this rate!

    The interest on 95% LTV mortgages just scares me, but I think it may be the only way to go just to get on the ladder.

    As for my pension, I have a small RAF pension and have always put in the maximum my company will match (8% each a year).
    Specialized Allez Sprint Disc --- Specialized S-Works SL7

    IG: RhinosWorkshop
  • okgookgo Posts: 4,368
    Probably yes, but also its hugely dependent on where you live. Many folks will never do it in London as they will never earn enough. Why anyone bothers working in London in careers that do not end up paying properly I have no idea really (unless they're happy with that and do not moan about not being able to afford to buy).

    Anyway, I saved quite hard when I was 23-25 and bought a place with my partner, people I worked with at the time did not, and they're still renting, and they will be until someone dies or they move to Chatham.

    Many people in this country are struggling, and much of it is down to their own decisions from what I've seen of people I know. There is a huge sense of entitlement lurking, and the advent of various finance models means everyone is one monthly payment away from everything they've always wanted :roll:
    Blog on my first and now second season of proper riding/racing - www.firstseasonracing.com
  • joey54321joey54321 Posts: 1,297
    okgo wrote:
    Probably yes, but also its hugely dependent on where you live. Many folks will never do it in London as they will never earn enough. Why anyone bothers working in London in careers that do not end up paying properly I have no idea really (unless they're happy with that and do not moan about not being able to afford to buy).

    Anyway, I saved quite hard when I was 23-25 and bought a place with my partner, people I worked with at the time did not, and they're still renting, and they will be until someone dies or they move to Chatham.

    Many people in this country are struggling, and much of it is down to their own decisions from what I've seen of people I know. There is a huge sense of entitlement lurking, and the advent of various finance models means everyone is one monthly payment away from everything they've always wanted :roll:

    Me too. I have a 35% share in a shared ownership house (no partner so just by myself). Saved hard and still track all my financial ingoings and outgoings in some software so regardless of what my bank account balance is I know if I can/can't afford something. I am sure many 'older' people don't take this much care with their finances though. I think the sense of entitlement is not a generational thing. It's just a culture we seem to collectively be steering towards with buy now pay later, interest-free credit, lease deals (sounding like an intro to trainspotting) etc...
  • kingstongrahamkingstongraham Posts: 17,783
    Ryan_W wrote:

    The interest on 95% LTV mortgages just scares me, but I think it may be the only way to go just to get on the ladder.

    If it scares you now, what happens when the base rate goes up?
  • mrfpbmrfpb Posts: 4,542
    When I was a teen/ealry tewenties I spent my money on music and hi-fi. Friends spent there money on cars or other hobbies. It's just what people do. Mobile phones are just the new toy. If your paying your rent and bills and not maxing out your crdit/debt then it's a choice of how you see your future. Most young people don't think about the future until they start contemplating marriage or parenthood, and I don't think that is any different now than it has been since the "birth of the Teenager" in the 50's.
  • haydenmhaydenm Posts: 2,934
    The hopelessness point raised further up is definitely at play with a lot of people I know. A coffee on the way to work or even a new phone is a drop in the ocean in comparison to a house deposit. Also, in reality how often do you actually see the people the OP describes with holidays and cars and how much of that is perception? My friends who live back home/in the south really can't afford a house unless they are very lucky and not one of them owns a new 4x4. Definitely have higher expectations from life though I would say

    When my parents were young if you had a degree and a professional job you should have been able to buy a nice-ish house. Luckily I live somewhere where I can still do that between the GF and I (jobs in our degree fields), but our house would be over double if I tried to buy something similar at home. I can count on one hand how many of our friends own houses at 24/25 and most of those are the GF's friends from Hull... That and I don't have many friends
  • weezyswissweezyswiss Posts: 123
    i feel fortunate. Came out of Uni with no debt as I did not have fees etc and lived within my means and worked during summers to pay off accrued through the year. Still had a cracking laugh and plenty of perceived money.

    Made the jump long time ago in one of the property crashes to get on the ladder with my then partner. Found a cheap 4 bed detached (sorry Londoners) for a great price back then in need of serious repair and decorate. Put the labour in myself to renovate and saved hard and paid off the mortgage.

    Separated, moved out and started life again. Bought new house 10 years ago with old as collateral, fortunate I have a great job that pays well. House almost paid off again. It is amazing how it comes down once you sort out that interest and get the capital payments increased. I still have holidays, buy nice things and bikes, but I know what I spend and don't just give money away on things I can do myself easily (cleaners etc) like some people do.

    I've come form a line of little money, budgeted, worked hard and reap the reward of almost a debt free life again (amazing how good it feels to have no mortgage left). I never buy things I cannot pay off at that moment (or on the next credit card bill. I never have CC interest). You just have to be sensible and oh not live in London ! But I do count my blessings I did Uni when the guberment paid the fees.
  • haydenmhaydenm Posts: 2,934
    WeezySwiss wrote:
    I do count my blessings I did Uni when the guberment paid the fees.

    My younger brother failed his first year and owes as much in fees as I do over 3 years. I was the last year that could have a gap year and still pay £3k/year. At that rate I couldn't be less bothered about it, at £9k I would have thought harder about it
  • okgookgo Posts: 4,368
    But its a small price to pay (even at 9k per year) if you use it properly and do a worthwhile degree from a good uni.

    There are many sectors in London where if you've done the above you will start on 50k a year and be on 6 figures not too much longer after. Suddenly the 27k seems like a fairly small price to pay.

    Obviously if you go to a censored uni, and do a censored degree, and get a censored mark, like most things, do it properly or don't bother IMO.
    Blog on my first and now second season of proper riding/racing - www.firstseasonracing.com
  • ryan_w-2ryan_w-2 Posts: 1,162
    No degree and tripled my salary in 4 years... ;)

    It's ok not to go to uni, just don't be a censored in life and you'll make it.
    Specialized Allez Sprint Disc --- Specialized S-Works SL7

    IG: RhinosWorkshop
  • step83step83 Posts: 4,107
    I think it varies where you are, I work with a number of these younger folk. I know what they earn, not exactly easy 24K an houses starting at around 220K so its a case of get with a partner, help to by which you have to pay back in X number of years and take pretty much a 100% mortgage on a new property which is what I know at least three people have done.
  • okgookgo Posts: 4,368
    Ryan_W wrote:
    No degree and tripled my salary in 4 years... ;)

    It's ok not to go to uni, just don't be a censored in life and you'll make it.

    That'll be why you only tripled it then.
    Blog on my first and now second season of proper riding/racing - www.firstseasonracing.com
  • LookyhereLookyhere Posts: 987
    okgo wrote:
    But its a small price to pay (even at 9k per year) if you use it properly and do a worthwhile degree from a good uni.

    There are many sectors in London where if you've done the above you will start on 50k a year and be on 6 figures not too much longer after. Suddenly the 27k seems like a fairly small price to pay.

    Obviously if you go to a censored uni, and do a censored degree, and get a censored mark, like most things, do it properly or don't bother IMO.

    Whats a good degree? things change and nothing worse than being stuck in a career that you dont like, i know plenty of unhappy GP's earning a lot of money.

    Outside of London, even a so called top degree wont get you a job quite so easily.

    My GF has 2 sons, one works hard at his Uni course, has no money and is miserable! the other jacked uni after a year, got a job in a bar (on a zero hours contract) works every hour he can get and every few weeks goes of travelling around Europe, he is living life, he also spent his mtce grant on an iphone 6 !!!
    Of course its irresponsible but he is 19 and has his whole life in front of him and quite frankly, he ll never be able to afford a house, they are 10x the avg Devon salary.
  • ryan_w-2ryan_w-2 Posts: 1,162
    okgo wrote:
    Ryan_W wrote:
    No degree and tripled my salary in 4 years... ;)

    It's ok not to go to uni, just don't be a censored in life and you'll make it.

    That'll be why you only tripled it then.

    censored :lol:
    Specialized Allez Sprint Disc --- Specialized S-Works SL7

    IG: RhinosWorkshop
Sign In or Register to comment.