Whose fault...? Discuss

thefd

Whose to blame here? Cyclist in wrong lane....or lorry driver for nearly killing cyclist?

https://youtu.be/GHvIhC4rcXA

norvernrob

TheFD wrote:

Whose to blame here? Cyclist in wrong lane....or lorry driver for nearly killing cyclist?

https://youtu.be/GHvIhC4rcXA

Cyclists using a left turn lane only to go straight on, half of them completely invisible to the HGV driver as they're alongside him. If the driver hit the cyclist on purpose then obviously that's dangerous driving, but those cyclists are complete idiots and certainly don't ride with self-preservation in mind. 'It's London, everybody does it' won't do much good when you've been turned into a loose bag of crushed bones by a HGV.

bendertherobot

If I found myself in that lane I'd do two things, given that lorry.

One, stick myself no further over than half way in that lane.

Two, turn left.

sloppyschleckonds

TheFD wrote:

Whose to blame here? Cyclist in wrong lane....or lorry driver for nearly killing cyclist?

https://youtu.be/GHvIhC4rcXA

What do you think, you posted it?

The girl behind who slowed had some sense.

tubaonwheels

The lorry was obviously going straight on so I'd stay the f*ck away from his inside!!

w00dster

The cyclist should have seen the rather large truck that was in the correct lane to go straight on. The cyclist was in a lane to turn left and was very likely to be in the blind spot of the truck driver.
Not good riding at all. Put himself in a very dangerous position.

Joshgav

Simple rule, never pull up on the left hand side of a lorry unless you fancy getting flattened.

cougie

That's the cyclists fault. All the time we see him he's in the blind spot of the lorry.

Not very aware on his part. Not really sure what the lorry driver could have done to avoid it.

A scary moment for everyone.

thefd

SloppySchleckonds wrote:

TheFD wrote:

Whose to blame here? Cyclist in wrong lane....or lorry driver for nearly killing cyclist?

https://youtu.be/GHvIhC4rcXA

What do you think, you posted it?

The girl behind who slowed had some sense.

100% the cyclists fault. Saw it on Daily Mail website which seemed to be blaming the lorry driver.

First.Aspect

The thing is, if the guy in red had been in the blind spot, truck wouldn't have stopped at all. He was far enough ahead to be visible as he went across the junction.

Yes, they all went straight on from a left only lane - cocks, the lot of them. But is that punishable by death?

The truckie knew that's what they'd done, he leapt out and told him. He didn't leap out and say, where did you come from, or I had no idea you were there. No, he knew the guy was there, and jumped out and effectively said, because you did wrong, it was okay for me to drive as though you'd turned left like you should have done.

He was irritated and making a point. At work, with an HGV.

cougie

I don't think you can be sure he's visible when he's ahead of the lorry. It looks close to me and I don't really think the driver would see him and then try to kill him. That's a lot of paper work.

First.Aspect

cougie wrote:

I don't think you can be sure he's visible when he's ahead of the lorry. It looks close to me and I don't really think the driver would see him and then try to kill him. That's a lot of paper work.

No, you can't be sure.

I think he was visible. It looks to me that the driver thinks about overtaking twice, aborts once and hits him the second time.

But my god all of those cyclists make me cringe.

shortfall

Bikes fault.

pblakeney

Cyclists. All of them.
100%.

mfin

The cyclists are thick as pig shît and completely in the wrong. Actually it is completely inconsiderate of them to ride in a way that a driver might have to live with having been involved in them getting hurt. Twats.

Palladium

When I saw the title I thought it would be: Sagan vs Cavendish

Cyclist at fault.

Sutton_Rider

The Cyclist at fault.

First.Aspect

Its really more subtle. If a pedestrian crosses a road when the little red man is on, he is doing something wrong. Does that entitle the traffic with a green light to make no effort to avoid running them over? Would a court take the view that they shouldn't have been there in the first place, so that is okay? No.

On the proviso that the driver could see the guy in red (which I maintain that his response suggests he did), then the same principle applies.

The more I watch it, the more I'm convinced that the driver is "teaching him a lesson" about HGV dangers - i.e. red guy was just about visible, he came from a blind spot, here's what can happen if you are in an HGV blind spot, ergo, I'm in the right. What he ACTUALLY did was intentionally drive into someone.

Don't confuse the fact that the cyclist should have known better, with what the driver actually chose to do. They can both be in the wrong.

For any cyclist he couldn't see, I don't have the same view. That's what it hinges on.

kevin_stephens

Cyclists' fault, the only way to get away with that safely (if not legally) is to get to the front and be able to sprint to out accelerate the lorry when the lights change. The lorry driver was in an impossible position. He may well have seen the cyclists at the front (those who did accelerate away) but those who lagged behind, including the one who got hit would have been in the blind spot. The Lorry had nowhere to go; busy traffic and narrow lanes so not possible to move right due to traffic in next lane, or stop quickly.

fat daddy

100% cyclists fault .... its tw4ts like him that give cyclists a bad name.

seriously what numpty sits in a left hand lane, in the blind spot of a lorry and then goes straight ahead into a narrowing ... to be honest I am surprised he didn't blame disc brakes and Sagan as well

kingstongraham

Cyclist

DeVlaeminck

It shows the herd mentality in people doesn't it - everyone else was doing it so I did it - and the reaction afterwards the sense of entitlement many people have.

Agree the rider that hung back seemed to have a bit more awareness but even then by using the wrong lane they are contributing to the problem by encouraging others to use it too who may not have the experience to know when to hang back.

N0bodyOfTheGoat

If I had accidentally ended up in that left-turn only lane with the lorry on my right, I would let the lorry go before carefully merging with other traffic that was in the right-hand lane.

While the lights were red, the lorry driver had no idea how many (crazy IMO) cyclists were queuing up on his left, intending to go straight on.

I'd struggle to remember the last time I had a lorry beside me on a bike, it would scare the bejesus out of me!

mamba80

It does go to show the benefit of jumping Red lights, if you r going to ride with a complete disregard for your own well being, go the whole hogg.

sometimes, i think some of the hate we cyclists generate from other drivers is totally deserved.

joe2008

Cyclist's actions are indefensible, left hand turn only from that lane, just plain stupidity to head for that gap with a lorry that you know is beside you.

Cyclist saying "it's London, everyone does it"... some don't get away with it.

Idiots all of them; I don't believe the driver did anything wrong.

lettingthedaysgoby

Cycling in London just looks utterly horrible on so many levels.

laurentian

Can't see that that is anything other than the cyclists fault. I'm not used to driving in heavy traffic but there's no way I'd pull up alongside an artic, even in the "straight on" lane.

As for ". . . it's London mate . . . " what a daft excuse.

guy.spartacus

laurentian wrote:

Can't see that that is anything other than the cyclists fault. I'm not used to driving in heavy traffic but there's no way I'd pull up alongside an artic, even in the "straight on" lane.

As for ". . . it's London mate . . . " what a daft excuse.

Yeah 'it's London - everyone does it'

That's fine then - chuck yourself under a 40 tonne artic

First.Aspect

Cyclist certainly at fault. No doubt.

But, *if* the driver could see him then I have serious concerns about the driving also.

Don't get me wrong, cyclist is lucky to be alive and should stick to groups rides up Box Hill, and "spring training" in Mallorca with fellow active professionals.

dyrlac

I go through that junction every day, a nightmare piece of road engineering. No ASL, noticeably uphill and very narrow on the approach, with an ever-present traffic queues which takes at least 2-3 light sequences to clear. The end result is that *every*single*cyclist* filters up to the rarely used left turn lane to go straight (between 730 and 930, there will always be at least 5, and often as many as 20 cyclists waiting there). This is one of the few situations where an ASL box would actually be useful, but the local council hates painting its streets. The situation is exacerbated as in addition to the centre lane, the right turn lane allows traffic to go straight on as well and the road ahead isn't really two lanes wide: so motorised traffic jockeys for position going straight.

So yes, the cyclist should have seen what was developing and either accelerated away from the lights faster to get ahead of the traffic or hung back. The lorry driver was taking the p*ss though, unfathomable that he would not have known plenty of folk were in his blind spot (having seen scores of cyclists coming through as he sat on the approach to the junction).

But the "it's London mate" isn't a daft excuse, it's an accurate statement of the lunacy required to shove too many road users into too small of a space.

mamil314

The cyclist baffles me. After it his error was pointed out to him (don't go straight from left-turn-only-lane!), he just kept repeating 'London', 'all London' and 'you HGV drivers'. It's like his mind completely shut down. As it would, i guess, after he 'd tried his damnest to get under the lorry.
And the knob behind 'i've got this on camera, we'll file a complaint'.

Just watched a Space X launch and regained some hope for humanity, but afterwards i am brought out of it in a rapid manner.