Handbuilt Wheels Frustration

bmxboy10

Hi, firstly I know there is a thread for this but I didn't want my query to get lost in that thread.

Been looking for a set of 24/28 wide rim tubeless ready wheels for my Tarmac for a while. The nearest I can get to my requirements within the budget of circa £400 is a set of Hunts or something from Cycleclinic based on Miche Hubs with R460 or Borg rims. The issue is they don't float my boat and are not inspiring me to part with the cash as they are really quite dull IMO.

I like the idea of a wheelset built around Hope hubs but finding an established wheelbuilder to build them is proving difficult. I find most of the wheel builders on line are now offering quite limited builds meaning the wheels are hardly bespoke. Also some builders are rebranding wheel components meaning I don't know what I am buying. Id like to build my own but wont risk it - perhaps Ugo could do a video tutorial!

Anyway can anyone recommend a builder that uses Hope hubs that can offer a truly bespoke and decent looking set of wheels to complement my Tarmac?

arlowood

Moonglu offer wheels based around Hope hubs with Stans Alpha rims

https://www.moonglu.com/products/handbu ... oad-wheels

Above your budget but if they float your boat then it might be worth going the extra mile.

I had some Moonglu disc wheels based on Hope hubs and Archetype rims - had no complaints with them

andcp

Never used him as my lbs has a good wheel builder, but Pete Matthews uses Hope hubs (amongst others): http://petematthews.com/home/

bmxboy10

arlowood wrote:

Moonglu offer wheels based around Hope hubs with Stans Alpha rims

https://www.moonglu.com/products/handbu ... oad-wheels

Above your budget but if they float your boat then it might be worth going the extra mile.

I had some Moonglu disc wheels based on Hope hubs and Archetype rims - had no complaints with them

Cheers but these are "pre built" only based on a 20/24 build in all black! The £600 price tag is too rich and is largely due to the wheels being built with CX rays which is don't need.

Bobbinogs

Most of the decent wheelbuilders will provide advice and build wheels. So if you know you want xx hubs in 24/28 then call someone like Malcolm (Cycle Clinic) or DCR, etc. I am sure they will give good advice on the build (rim/spoke choice and all that) and give you the option of sourcing the hubs and pinging them over so that the wheels can be built. No different to a rebuild.

ugo.santalucia

I know what you mean...

Most hubs look very dull, whereas Hope come in 6 colours without sacrificing reliability. TCC builds White industries, which also come in colours, but it's big money, too big if you ask me.
The fact they don't sell hubs doesn't mean they won't build them. As I understand Malcolm can't get a deal with Hope that works for him, it might be the same for others. Have you asked him if he would build on a pair of hubs you supply?

BTW, I just bought these for myself... :-)
The rear is the steel option, bit heavier but hopefully will never give me splines grief

bmxboy10

Malcolm is out of action for a while according to his website as he is injured. Get well soon.

mrb123

http://www.ptcycles.co.uk/

This place seems to offer a decent range of options with Hope hubs but I've no idea what they're like. Would be interested to hear from anyone on here who has ordered from them.

stueys

Talk to derek, wheelsmith.co.uk, he just made me a set of wheels for my winter bike on hope hubs (the same nifty colour as Ugo's above, they look great in the flesh..). He's got a good range of rims and can get most things, he'll also talk you through options on the phone based on what you want. Good guy.

Stradawheels.co.uk also have a good rep and seem like good guys. I've not used them myself though so can't endorse further than that, Derek has built a couple of sets for me and I've always been pleased.

bmxboy10

MrB123 wrote:

http://www.ptcycles.co.uk/

This place seems to offer a decent range of options with Hope hubs but I've no idea what they're like. Would be interested to hear from anyone on here who has ordered from them.

I agree but I tried to get some feedback from the forum and didn't get a response. I called the guy who was very nice and said he was DT Swiss qualified but I would still like proper feedback from customers

bmxboy10

Stueys wrote:

Talk to derek, wheelsmith.co.uk, he just made me a set of wheels for my winter bike on hope hubs (the same nifty colour as Ugo's above, they look great in the flesh..). He's got a good range of rims and can get most things, he'll also talk you through options on the phone based on what you want. Good guy.

Stradawheels.co.uk also have a good rep and seem like good guys. I've not used them myself though so can't endorse further than that, Derek has built a couple of sets for me and I've always been pleased.

Cheers it probably looks like I am being awkward here but Stradas website is useless. It seems to be marketing mainly wheel parts and a few non bespoke wheel sets none of which meet my needs and lots of items are out of stock.

I have called wheelsmith before and agree he is a good guy but again most of his wheels are Wheelsmith rebranded components and I think the prices are not very competitive. Also Derek is temporarily not taking orders according to his website.

bmxboy10

Anyone tried Noble Wheels?

lostboysaint

Where are you? My LBS has made up a couple of pairs of wheels for me with Hope hubs, but I'm on the South Coast and that may not be useful information to you! PM me if you want details.

stueys

solboy10 wrote:

Stueys wrote:

Talk to derek, wheelsmith.co.uk, he just made me a set of wheels for my winter bike on hope hubs (the same nifty colour as Ugo's above, they look great in the flesh..). He's got a good range of rims and can get most things, he'll also talk you through options on the phone based on what you want. Good guy.

Stradawheels.co.uk also have a good rep and seem like good guys. I've not used them myself though so can't endorse further than that, Derek has built a couple of sets for me and I've always been pleased.

Cheers it probably looks like I am being awkward here but Stradas website is useless. It seems to be marketing mainly wheel parts and a few non bespoke wheel sets none of which meet my needs and lots of items are out of stock.

I have called wheelsmith before and agree he is a good guy but again most of his wheels are Wheelsmith rebranded components and I think the prices are not very competitive. Also Derek is temporarily not taking orders according to his website.

Strada, call them and talk to them. They are very helpful on the phone, their website is a bit all over the place I agree

Derek can source whatever you want. He carries a range of wheelsmith branded rims but also has a chunk of other stuff and can source pretty much anything. He's on a semi-closedown during May I believe but I don't know entirely what the status is, might be worth checking with him

mrb123

What rims are you considering BTW?

bmxboy10

lostboysaint wrote:

Where are you? My LBS has made up a couple of pairs of wheels for me with Hope hubs, but I'm on the South Coast and that may not be useful information to you! PM me if you want details.

Gatwick

ugo.santalucia

solboy10 wrote:

Anyone tried Noble Wheels?

When I left London I recommended all my "customers" to talk to Jonathan at Noble, as he was local... he is good, not cheap though...

timothyw

solboy10 wrote:

MrB123 wrote:

http://www.ptcycles.co.uk/

This place seems to offer a decent range of options with Hope hubs but I've no idea what they're like. Would be interested to hear from anyone on here who has ordered from them.

I agree but I tried to get some feedback from the forum and didn't get a response. I called the guy who was very nice and said he was DT Swiss qualified but I would still like proper feedback from customers

Seems there are a few reviews on Facebook:
https://www.facebook.com/pg/custombikewheels/reviews/

Really though, you are covered by distance selling regs etc, if you do actually ride them in the first sixth months from purchase then you are totally covered by the law if anything goes wrong you can insist on a full refund.

Honestly though, wheelbuilding isn't that hard - the key ingredient is time. Since he is relatively new, you are almost safer as I would say it is established builders who are in a better position to dismiss dissatisfied customers when they have rushed a job, or trusted it to the new guy... he doesn't want you coming back on the forum saying how shoddy the build was.

If you really want to grill him, check what tension your wheels will be built to, ask how he pre stresses/stress relieves the wheels, ask how he avoids spoke wind up - his answers should either reassure you or put you off entirely.

ugo.santalucia

I tend to agree with Tim, you can have a go yourself, provided you don't start with a 20/24 or something equally silly

bmxboy10

ugo.santalucia wrote:

I tend to agree with Tim, you can have a go yourself, provided you don't start with a 20/24 or something equally silly

Paolo

Would love to but how do you know spoke lengths, tension and hub offsets are correct plus I only have a spoke wrench no gizmos

ugo.santalucia

solboy10 wrote:

Would love to but how do you know spoke lengths, tension and hub offsets are correct plus I only have a spoke wrench no gizmos

You seem to have an interest in handbuilt wheels, as you go on about them a lot... make it into a hobby... some initial investment that will pay dividends in the long run.

Your firends will ask you to fix their wheels, maybe even build wheels for them and your fridge will always be full of beer...

arthur_scrimshaw

ugo.santalucia wrote:

solboy10 wrote:

Would love to but how do you know spoke lengths, tension and hub offsets are correct plus I only have a spoke wrench no gizmos

You seem to have an interest in handbuilt wheels, as you go on about them a lot... make it into a hobby... some initial investment that will pay dividends in the long run.

Your firends will ask you to fix their wheels, maybe even build wheels for them and your fridge will always be full of beer...

Slightly OT but that Shepherd & Neame Double Stout is currently my fave beer, truly delicious.

arlowood

solboy10 wrote:

arlowood wrote:

Moonglu offer wheels based around Hope hubs with Stans Alpha rims

https://www.moonglu.com/products/handbu ... oad-wheels

Above your budget but if they float your boat then it might be worth going the extra mile.

I had some Moonglu disc wheels based on Hope hubs and Archetype rims - had no complaints with them

Cheers but these are "pre built" only based on a 20/24 build in all black! The £600 price tag is too rich and is largely due to the wheels being built with CX rays which is don't need.

Another avenue to explore could be Spokesman Wheels

http://www.spokesmanwheels.co.uk/technical-blurb/

Advertises mainly through Ebay but Ugo thinks Mark Pollard is sound based on a query I made on this forum some while back.

His "Technical Blurb" indicates that he builds mainly with Shimano and Novatec hubs but he will source others like Hope, Miche etc if that's what you're after. Might be worth giving him a call and posing some of the questions suggested above.

thistle_

I don't know if they have the hub/rim combo you want but http://www.chainreactioncycles.com/hope ... prod158787
I'm not sure if they are lovingly built by hand or if they just put the bits in a machine and it assembles them (I guess somewhere in between).

I've had 2 custom rear mountain bike wheels from CRC and they've been fine, both still going strong, ~ 9 years and 5 years old each.

Merlin do custom wheel builds but don't advertise them with Hope hubs on their website.

arthur_scrimshaw

arlowood wrote:

solboy10 wrote:

arlowood wrote:

Moonglu offer wheels based around Hope hubs with Stans Alpha rims

https://www.moonglu.com/products/handbu ... oad-wheels

Above your budget but if they float your boat then it might be worth going the extra mile.

I had some Moonglu disc wheels based on Hope hubs and Archetype rims - had no complaints with them

Cheers but these are "pre built" only based on a 20/24 build in all black! The £600 price tag is too rich and is largely due to the wheels being built with CX rays which is don't need.

Another avenue to explore could be Spokesman Wheels

http://www.spokesmanwheels.co.uk/technical-blurb/

Advertises mainly through Ebay but Ugo thinks Mark Pollard is sound based on a query I made on this forum some while back.

His "Technical Blurb" indicates that he builds mainly with Shimano and Novatec hubs but he will source others like Hope, Miche etc if that's what you're after. Might be worth giving him a call and posing some of the questions suggested above.

I had a pair of winter disc wheels built by Mark, Velocity Aileron rims with Novatec hubs and sapim race spokes, tubeless ready, not expensive, lighter than stock wheels and bullet proof (I went 32 f and r) He checks and re-greases the Novatec bearings before sending the wheels out which is a nice touch.

cycleclinic

Out of action is a bit much I have built a wheel today but it hard work injured. The issue with hope is they sound uninterested in selling me hubs and my attempts at getting an account have not been responded to. It is shame because the spare warranty people are extremely helpful.

White industries hubs come in colours in theory only. In practice it can take too long to get what you want.

veronese68

Sorry to hear you're injured Malcolm, heal fast.
Solboy, as Ugo says have a go yourself. I got the Roger Musson ebook and did it that way. Just built a new set of wheels for the MTB with Novatec hubs and offset rims then put my previous build onto my CX bike. Not had any problems (yet). Take your time and follow the instructions and it's not that hard, just be methodical. In Lieu of a wheelstand you could use the bike frame and tape markers on to gauge alignment. I was lucky that I was given a used stand, does make life easier.

arthur_scrimshaw

Veronese68 wrote:

Sorry to hear you're injured Malcolm, heal fast.
Solboy, as Ugo says have a go yourself. I got the Roger Musson ebook and did it that way. Just built a new set of wheels for the MTB with Novatec hubs and offset rims then put my previous build onto my CX bike. Not had any problems (yet). Take your time and follow the instructions and it's not that hard, just be methodical. In Lieu of a wheelstand you could use the bike frame and tape markers on to gauge alignment. I was lucky that I was given a used stand, does make life easier.

Do you need a gauge for spoke tension or is there a work around?

ugo.santalucia

You spend on the equipment and save on the wheels.

For instance: Hope with DT 460 and Sapim laser + d-Light spokes I spent 310 pounds... if you shop around you'll find they will charge you 400 for the same at the very least.

cycleclinic

The work around is tone but I don't think it can be done accurately by ear unless you are very tuned. I know I can't. There are apps to help here. The only tension gauges worth having are the sapim, do Swiss and possibly the wheel fanatic gurgle. There may actually be others but the sapim gauge is the nicest thing there is. I have both versions and the latest one can be held all day.

Of course you can save money by shopping around ugo but you first have to be able to build them yourself and work out the spoke lengths. None of this is difficult but not everyone feels comfotrable doing it all themselves either.

timothyw

I bought some wheel building gear fairly recently - there's obviously room for improvement but for my needs it seems entirely satisfactory -

Spoke tensiometer: https://www.bike-discount.de/en/buy/kat ... ter-574554
Truing stand: https://www.bike-discount.de/en/buy/min ... tand-52013
Dishing Tool: https://www.bike-discount.de/en/buy/min ... -310-55781
Spokey: https://www.bike-discount.de/en/buy/spo ... -red-25041

You can use Edd to calculate spoke lengths (it's a website, google it) although other spoke calculators are available and should be cross referenced to be sure.

This article is a pretty good pep talk if you are in two minds about building your own wheels - http://miketechinfo.com/new-tech-wheels-tires.htm