Working towards 20mph
Comments
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I would think over 30mph, as the TT record for 100 miles is 3 hrs 18 mins, which is just over 30mph:MrB123 wrote:What would a pro expect to average, riding solo for 3 hours on a fairly flat route?
http://www.cyclingweekly.co.uk/news/lat ... ord-1806320 -
^ The above is based on a competitive situation. Shouldn't we be guesstimating what speed the pro would ride on a training ride solo?seanoconn - gruagach craic!0
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MrB123 wrote:What would a pro expect to average, riding solo for 3 hours on a fairly flat route?
It would depend how hard they were riding and the weather conditions and whether they were riding alone, or in a group.0 -
Imposter wrote:MrB123 wrote:What would a pro expect to average, riding solo for 3 hours on a fairly flat route?
It would depend how hard they were riding and the weather conditions and whether they were riding alone, or in a group.
How does one ride solo in a group?
But in all seriousness, most domestic TT records are not set by pros. Even guys like Hutch, Dangerfield, Cammish et al aren't even remotely in the same league. Pro riders can knock out 3 hours tempo pace at 25mph+, no problem at all.0 -
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Well, it would depend how hard the pro was going on a training ride. If it was a training ride of 60 miles the pro was doing, it probably wouldn't be a flat ride, like the one the OP is aiming at.MrB123 wrote:Pinno wrote:^ The above is based on a competitive situation. Shouldn't we be guesstimating what speed the pro would ride on a training ride solo?
Yeah, that's what I meant. A solo ride on a normal road bike, not a TT record attempt.0 -
I follow quite a few pros and neo-pros, and their training rides are often surprisingly slow, less than 30km/h, albeit punctuated by the odd 'blast'.
They have the luxury of putting in as many hours per week as they like, so many of those hours can be 'base' and quite easy.0 -
I'd be very surprised if a pro was regularly doing 3 hours at 25mph outside of racing.0
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Christmas Day 2011, Chris Froome went out on the roads around Mombasa, Kenya^ in 35+ deg heat. 6 hour ride, 120 miles.
Have a look at Cuddles' documentary. He talks about level 1,2 and 3 rides over that length of time. There are Pro's and then there are Pro's. Worth a watch:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MlXR3LXCB64
*Diabolical roads and dangerous.seanoconn - gruagach craic!0 -
Pinno wrote:^ The above is based on a competitive situation. Shouldn't we be guesstimating what speed the pro would ride on a training ride solo?
Just look at the pros on Strava. Alex Dowsett is a good one who does a lot of training rides in relatively flat Essex. e.g.
82miles, 20.1mph average at 126bpm av HR.
https://www.strava.com/activities/509051862
Analysing average MPH is mostly rubbish though unless you like riding up and down dual carriageways 0 -
Simon Masterson wrote:Imposter wrote:MrB123 wrote:What would a pro expect to average, riding solo for 3 hours on a fairly flat route?
It would depend how hard they were riding and the weather conditions and whether they were riding alone, or in a group.
How does one ride solo in a group?
But in all seriousness, most domestic TT records are not set by pros. Even guys like Hutch, Dangerfield, Cammish et al aren't even remotely in the same league. Pro riders can knock out 3 hours tempo pace at 25mph+, no problem at all.
To average 25 mph, you'll need to go maybe 27 on the flat sections. That is pretty hard going on a road bike on a training ride! 350-380 W maybe? Consider that Milan San Remo has had an average speed of about 27 MPH for the last few years.
These days, we do have the frame of reference between the UK domestic time trial scene and the top pro level thanks to the likes of Wiggins and Dowsett spanning both. We know that Wiggins and Dowsett generally have a margin over the top non-pro (but maybe full time) UK time triallists, but it's a bit off to say that they're not remotely in the same league.0 -
ForumNewbie wrote:
Well, it would depend how hard the pro was going on a training ride. If it was a training ride of 60 miles the pro was doing, it probably wouldn't be a flat ride, like the one the OP is aiming at.MrB123 wrote:Pinno wrote:^ The above is based on a competitive situation. Shouldn't we be guesstimating what speed the pro would ride on a training ride solo?
Yeah, that's what I meant. A solo ride on a normal road bike, not a TT record attempt.
I'd guess 3 hours aiming for a high average speed isn't a typpical training session for a pro.0 -
Pinno wrote:Christmas Day 2011, Chris Froome went out on the roads around Mombasa, Kenya^ in 35+ deg heat. 6 hour ride, 120 miles.
Have a look at Cuddles' documentary. He talks about level 1,2 and 3 rides over that length of time. There are Pro's and then there are Pro's. Worth a watch:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MlXR3LXCB64
*Diabolical roads and dangerous.
Makes sense. If Froome's FTP is about 400 W, then 6 hours at about 250 W will be about 20 MPH. Nice steady endurance ride! :shock:0 -
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Pinno wrote:
That should drop the nuggets0 -
No sense in flapping your legs around.0
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Surely we should all be working towards the Holy Grail of 1 rpm @ 20mph. It would make more sense.seanoconn - gruagach craic!0
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Posted a reply yesterday, but don't see it here. I'll try again, maybe it sat on the screen too long before clicking.
Either way, I didn't expect this to rile up such a storm. After this I will temporarily refrain from any further instigating the topic. I will just leave here for a while with a little update and info. I may revisit this again in a few months for an update.
Update:
I've done close to what I said I'd do earlier. On an out of town trip I rode to work in addition to any other work. I also added a little time on the trainer anytime I'm at a gym instead of gym only. During this time I've learned a few things. Yes, an avg mph does seem to be a vague goal. Not necessarily moronic, but unnecessarily vague. I guess my misunderstanding was in the fact runners time themselves for distances. I'll think about this and see if I can come up with something better since I don't have a computer to measure watts, only the trainer bike indoors has that and it's probably not very accurate.
It's been about a month. I've never run a 5k in under 30 minutes and did it in 27 minutes yesterday. The same time on the trainer is now being done at about 10 watts more for a long and steady ride and about 30 watts more for interval sprints.
I've also lost about 6 lbs despite eating and drinking about the same, or more.
Random other things:
-Did my own work and replaced a stretched chain and worn cassette
-Replaced the tubes/tires and did my first roadside flat fix for a stranded dude
Lastly, the bike is a 1993 Trek 1100, for whatever that's worth.0 -
burnthesheep wrote:Posted a reply yesterday, but don't see it here. I'll try again, maybe it sat on the screen too long before clicking.
Either way, I didn't expect this to rile up such a storm. After this I will temporarily refrain from any further instigating the topic. I will just leave here for a while with a little update and info. I may revisit this again in a few months for an update.
Update:
I've done close to what I said I'd do earlier. On an out of town trip I rode to work in addition to any other work. I also added a little time on the trainer anytime I'm at a gym instead of gym only. During this time I've learned a few things. Yes, an avg mph does seem to be a vague goal. Not necessarily moronic, but unnecessarily vague. I guess my misunderstanding was in the fact runners time themselves for distances. I'll think about this and see if I can come up with something better since I don't have a computer to measure watts, only the trainer bike indoors has that and it's probably not very accurate.
It's been about a month. I've never run a 5k in under 30 minutes and did it in 27 minutes yesterday. The same time on the trainer is now being done at about 10 watts more for a long and steady ride and about 30 watts more for interval sprints.
I've also lost about 6 lbs despite eating and drinking about the same, or more.
Random other things:
-Did my own work and replaced a stretched chain and worn cassette
-Replaced the tubes/tires and did my first roadside flat fix for a stranded dude
Lastly, the bike is a 1993 Trek 1100, for whatever that's worth.
An mph based goal certainly isn't moronic. It's more that speed is so variable on a bike. It's more useful for running pace as you point out. On the other hand, so many common personal cycling goals are speed based e.g. sub hour 25 miles, sub 21 minute 10 miles etc... I'd still maintain that hitting 20 average can be a good motivator.
Power is more meaninful in terms of measurable to train to, and check whether you're getting fitter. But, targets based on power are somewhat arbitrary too, right? That is unless you know you need to hit X watts power in training to stand a chance of dropping Contador on Alpe d'Huez.
Good luck in your training. Sounds like you're enjoying it, so keep going.0 -
I think one of the main things people were scoffing at was the 20mph for THREE hours thing. Now goals are vital in training but it's also vital that the goal is attainable, even if it is a lofty one. So on that note I would suggest that aiming for 20mph for one hour, is a much more attainable goal and plenty people do that sort of riding, but it's still a tough challenge to get there.0
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markhewitt1978 wrote:I think one of the main things people were scoffing at was the 20mph for THREE hours thing. Now goals are vital in training but it's also vital that the goal is attainable, even if it is a lofty one. So on that note I would suggest that aiming for 20mph for one hour, is a much more attainable goal and plenty people do that sort of riding, but it's still a tough challenge to get there.
I think I suggested aiming for a sub 30min 10 mile TT on the first or second page, and going from there.0 -
Sorry but I don't understand this at all. 20 mph in 3 hours on a flattish course is entirely attainable with a graduated/progressive approach to training. This isn't that hard a goal! 22+ mph on the other hand....markhewitt1978 wrote:I think one of the main things people were scoffing at was the 20mph for THREE hours thing. Now goals are vital in training but it's also vital that the goal is attainable, even if it is a lofty one. So on that note I would suggest that aiming for 20mph for one hour, is a much more attainable goal and plenty people do that sort of riding, but it's still a tough challenge to get there.FFS! Harden up and grow a pair
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Yeah but it's a 5k in sub 30....... not 10k.....0
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Svetty wrote:
Sorry but I don't understand this at all. If the OP can run a sub-30 minute 10k he is clearly pretty fit and hence 60 miles in 3 hours is entirely attainable with a graduated/progressive approach to training. This isn't that hard a goal! 22+ mph on the other hand....markhewitt1978 wrote:I think one of the main things people were scoffing at was the 20mph for THREE hours thing. Now goals are vital in training but it's also vital that the goal is attainable, even if it is a lofty one. So on that note I would suggest that aiming for 20mph for one hour, is a much more attainable goal and plenty people do that sort of riding, but it's still a tough challenge to get there.
"...attainable with a graduated/progressive approach to training. This isn't that hard a goal!"
It may be attainable, but it IS a hard goal by most peoples standards. The OP wanted to aim for this, and proposed a training plan which in the opinion of most on this forum seemed unlikely to meet the goal.
Also, I say with much fatigue, running isn't cycling.0 -
Fenix wrote:Yeah but it's a 5k in sub 30....... not 10k.....
Ooops, my bad - I've edited the post to correct. The point still stands though, 20mph for 3 hours - given a flattish course - is a perfectly attainable goal for most people if they are prepared to put the effort into training appropriatelyFFS! Harden up and grow a pair0
