Porte at BMC 2016
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Really looking forward to seeing Porte and Froome climb against each other. They obviously know the capabilities of the other better than anyone else in cycling. On any mountain stage he is as dangerous as rider as there is. Can he stay healthy for 3 weeks though? That's the only thing holding him back from being right there with Froome and Quintana IMO.0
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if you look at previous GT winners there is probably quite a few who have won that you would never have thought could but due to the hitters crashing, getting banned or skipping one GT for another you get a second rate GT winner. I think this is where any of these three could have a shout, such at the Veulta this year Dumoulin was in the mix but had he had one of the big 3 on form he wouldn't have had a look in.
Contador retiring next year opens another door too.0 -
Quick note for all attendees. Don't mention the oil price in front of Dish during this difficult time.
Nor me, if I was coming. Been a bit rubbish at work the last while. Just got a new job though innit, feck Aberdeen and feck oil.
Woss Dish do?0 -
Why the panic? Clean riders improve that much in their mid 20's all the time - Riis, Indurain, Chiappucci, Di Luca, Kohl, Vandevelde are just a few examples.[url=http://www.bikeradar.com/forums/viewtopic.php?p=19761751#p19761751]Richmond Racer 2[/url] wrote:[url=http://www.bikeradar.com/forums/viewtopic.php?p=19761733#p19761733]SpecialGuestStar[/url] wrote:could you make it 100 pounds - as 100 was the position Dennis tended to finish in last years bumpier stages
Remind me where Froome finished in his first Tour? oh yeah, 83rd.
*sounds the incoming doping chat alarm*
Supporter of Sky, transparency and clean cycling. Opponent of pseudoscience.
The greatest clean cycling performance ever http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-eiN2vfGKhk0 -
What do you mean? Porte has all the ability to win a GT, he just needs to fix two small problems - Weeks 2 & 3...[url=http://www.bikeradar.com/forums/viewtopic.php?p=19761680#p19761680]Richmond Racer 2[/url] wrote:Didn't frenchfighter get a load of abuse for suggesting that Porte wasn't a GT contender? Seems to be the prevailing opinion now.
Yes, FF is the soothsayer to end all soothsayers
Last year's Giro persuaded me that Porte aint got the necessary mental attitude
It was the moment when he and Bert had crashed, and whilst Porte stood there fumble fumble with his bike, Bert had yelled at a team mate to give him his bike and was halfway back to the peloton
Harsh but there you go. It just summed it up for me.Supporter of Sky, transparency and clean cycling. Opponent of pseudoscience.
The greatest clean cycling performance ever http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-eiN2vfGKhk0 -
I suspect neither will get the top prizes, but as mentioned a tad of luck and anything can happen. BMC obviously wanted to up their game but I am not sure who was around for them to recruit who would truly make them GT contenders (if you remove good/bad luck)
However I like Porte so I hope he does well be it 1 week or 3 week races
BMC should have kept their money in their pocket for 12 months and then gone for Nibali, but you suspect the Porte deal was inked before it became obviously Nibali would be on his way out of Astana.
Porte & TJVG fall into that awkward group of riders who aren't top drawer enough to make a big solo impact and clinch a GT a la pedale, but are too good to be ignored and allowed to mug everyone when the rest of the top guys are watching each other. They need to be more like Ryder H and less like Purito.0 -
Quick note for all attendees. Don't mention the oil price in front of Dish during this difficult time.
Nor me, if I was coming. Been a bit rubbish at work the last while. Just got a new job though innit, feck Aberdeen and feck oil.
Woss Dish do?
You have to come to drinks to find out...0 -
I suspect neither will get the top prizes, but as mentioned a tad of luck and anything can happen. BMC obviously wanted to up their game but I am not sure who was around for them to recruit who would truly make them GT contenders (if you remove good/bad luck)
However I like Porte so I hope he does well be it 1 week or 3 week races
BMC should have kept their money in their pocket for 12 months and then gone for Nibali, but you suspect the Porte deal was inked before it became obviously Nibali would be on his way out of Astana.
Porte & TJVG fall into that awkward group of riders who aren't top drawer enough to make a big solo impact and clinch a GT a la pedale, but are too good to be ignored and allowed to mug everyone when the rest of the top guys are watching each other. They need to be more like Ryder H and less like Purito.
Isn't Nibs heading to Trek - esp with the new Italian sponsor.
Ryder won the Giro on the TT, not Porte and TJ's weak point. If you're going to make the comparison I'd argue they need to be more like Purito - resilient and never giving up...0 -
I suspect neither will get the top prizes, but as mentioned a tad of luck and anything can happen. BMC obviously wanted to up their game but I am not sure who was around for them to recruit who would truly make them GT contenders (if you remove good/bad luck)
However I like Porte so I hope he does well be it 1 week or 3 week races
BMC should have kept their money in their pocket for 12 months and then gone for Nibali, but you suspect the Porte deal was inked before it became obviously Nibali would be on his way out of Astana.
Porte & TJVG fall into that awkward group of riders who aren't top drawer enough to make a big solo impact and clinch a GT a la pedale, but are too good to be ignored and allowed to mug everyone when the rest of the top guys are watching each other. They need to be more like Ryder H and less like Purito.
Isn't Nibs heading to Trek - esp with the new Italian sponsor.
Ryder won the Giro on the TT, not Porte and TJ's weak point. If you're going to make the comparison I'd argue they need to be more like Purito - resilient and never giving up...
Yes Nibali is off to Trek by the sounds of it, but at the time that BMC were signing up Porte earlier this year that probably wasn't the case - but hindsight etc....
The Ryder H comparison was more about where they stood in the 'pecking' order rather than relative strengths - no-one was giving Ryder too much of a shot in the Giro he won, and Purito himself I think has admitted he didn't turn the screw when he should have because they didn't think Ryder H was a genuine contendor, TT to come or not. That was a strange race all round to be honest when you look at who came 3rd as well.
Purito himself is one of those names who will always (or was always) seen as a 'contender' for any GT he entered, or at least the podium, even tho that '12 Giro and Vuelta races aside you could never see a way that he could beat the likes of Contador etc. I'd put Porte & TJVG in that bracket - podium potential certainly, but can't see how they can actually win unless none of the big 4 (as they're seen now) are present at full capacity.0 -
Quick note for all attendees. Don't mention the oil price in front of Dish during this difficult time.
Nor me, if I was coming. Been a bit rubbish at work the last while. Just got a new job though innit, feck Aberdeen and feck oil.
Woss Dish do?
You have to come to drinks to find out...
Long way from Aberdeen though!
I was at a different festive drinks last night. Otherwise I probably wouldn't have made that post
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GT Winners since 2010 (at the time, not in the CAS courtroom afterwards...)
2010:
G - Basso
T - Contador
V - Nibali
2011:
G - Contador
T - Evans
V - Cobo
2012:
G - Hesjedal
T - Wiggins
V - Contador
2013:
G - Nibali
T - Froome
V - Horner
2014:
G - Quintana
T - Nibali
V - Contador
2015:
G - Contador
T - Froome
V - Aru
So for the past 15 GTs only 3 have been won by guys who could be argued weren't one of the big favourites (c. Kelly, S) before the race.0 -
I hear you YR. Though the horse has kinda bolted for Porte and TJ on that front. It's hard to become invisible again. Rohan Dennis on the other hand...
Bob - shout if you find yourself in the big smoke...0 -
And speaking of who came third in the 2012 Giro. ICYMI this is a fine translation from disgruntled goat - viewtopic.php?f=40002&t=130251660
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Bob - shout if you find yourself in the big smoke...
I'll be in Manchester from March so that's what, 300+ miles closer 0 -
TJ is a good rider, but lacks that special something.
Porte is a good rider, but lacks that special something.
Dennis is a good rider...you get the picture.
Caruso too FWIW.0 -
GT
So for the past 15 GTs only 3 have been won by guys who could be argued weren't one of the big favourites (c. Kelly, S) before the race.
Was going to post something similar, and of those three I doubt many of us believe they all won clean.
If I had to bet I'd go for Porte to win the Giro simply because at his best he is probably better than the competition who will roll up to that one. TJ has a more impressive GT record but he's done it in a very low profile way and to win one he'll need to take the initiative more. Dennis is an interesting one but for every rider who does something to suggest they might be a future GT rider very few come through.[Castle Donington Ladies FC - going up in '22]0 -
I have genuinely no clue why Dennis is mentioned as a GT rider. He's been a pro at workd tour level for 3 or 4 years now and shown nil to that end"In many ways, my story was that of a raging, Christ-like figure who hauled himself off the cross, looked up at the Romans with blood in his eyes and said 'My turn, sock cookers'"
@gietvangent0 -
I suspect neither will get the top prizes, but as mentioned a tad of luck and anything can happen. BMC obviously wanted to up their game but I am not sure who was around for them to recruit who would truly make them GT contenders (if you remove good/bad luck)
However I like Porte so I hope he does well be it 1 week or 3 week races
BMC should have kept their money in their pocket for 12 months and then gone for Nibali, but you suspect the Porte deal was inked before it became obviously Nibali would be on his way out of Astana.
Porte & TJVG fall into that awkward group of riders who aren't top drawer enough to make a big solo impact and clinch a GT a la pedale, but are too good to be ignored and allowed to mug everyone when the rest of the top guys are watching each other. They need to be more like Ryder H and less like Purito.
Porte's moving on a 1 year contract. All contracts are up end-2016 at BMC, I think - question marks over what happens beyond that as even Andy Rihs may be sick off shoring up things on his own $. Rumours of a merger with IAM, does the rounds.0 -
[url=http://www.bikeradar.com/forums/viewtopic.php?p=19762597#p19762597]disgruntledgoat[/url] wrote:I have genuinely no clue why Dennis is mentioned as a GT rider. He's been a pro at workd tour level for 3 or 4 years now and shown nil to that end
The guy can climb, And he has a massive engine. And he can make it through a GT with enough in the tank to score 3rd in the final day's TT (2014 Vuelta)
I'm punting on how he turns out. Shift some kgs, Sky-stylie, move to a team where he gets leadership of bigger races that the US races. Lets see what happens over the next few years.0 -
[url=http://www.bikeradar.com/forums/viewtopic.php?p=19762607#p19762607]Richmond Racer 2[/url] wrote:[url=http://www.bikeradar.com/forums/viewtopic.php?p=19762597#p19762597]disgruntledgoat[/url] wrote:I have genuinely no clue why Dennis is mentioned as a GT rider. He's been a pro at workd tour level for 3 or 4 years now and shown nil to that end
The guy can climb, And he has a massive engine. And he can make it through a GT with enough in the tank to score 3rd in the final day's TT (2014 Vuelta)
I'm punting on how he turns out. Shift some kgs, Sky-stylie, move to a team where he gets leadership of bigger races that the US races. Lets see what happens over the next few years.
It does seem to be a new direction, finds someone who can TT well and make them drop a few kgs so they climb well rather than find a tiny climber and try to make them good at TTs0 -
I hear you YR. Though the horse has kinda bolted for Porte and TJ on that front. It's hard to become invisible again. Rohan Dennis on the other hand...
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Agreed - was sort of my point - Porte & TJVG too good to be ignored, not good enough to boss it.
Ref. Porte and the Giro next yr - if Cannondale back Uran I'd suggest he's got as much if not more chance, 2 x 2nd previously (assuming it's Uran for the Giro and Rolland for the Tour for them).
RR2 - the IAM / BMC thing makes a lot of sense - very Swiss & logical. Would miss the IAM kit & bikes though.0 -
Tee Jay :- Since his impressive ride of dropping Evans, I've always contradicted the media's waffle of him being the next GT superstar.
In my book TJ is on a par wth Andy Hampsten.Organiser, National Championship 50 mile Time Trial 19720 -
And Hampsten won the Giro.Tee Jay :- Since his impressive ride of dropping Evans, I've always contradicted the media's waffle of him being the next GT superstar.
In my book TJ is on a par wth Andy Hampsten.Twitter: @RichN950 -
never sure why others don't see TJVG
2nd in Dauphine - 3 rd in tour up to stage 17 last year and a 3 week tour proven rider - yet some personality clash that seem to stop others backing him - as also been said a solid apprenticeship with Evans and early years with Rabo development where he nearly won Avenir
only thing not going for him/them in this tour is a ttt0 -
I don't remember seeing TJVG ever take the initiative - I can see him attritioning (yeah that's right, I made a verb up) his way to a podium or 2 but can't see him ever striking out for victory. At least if Porte's around to have a go at a win he'll generally give it a shot.0
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I don't remember seeing TJVG ever take the initiative - I can see him attritioning (yeah that's right, I made a verb up) his way to a podium or 2 but can't see him ever striking out for victory. At least if Porte's around to have a go at a win he'll generally give it a shot.
Check back on St 4 of Catalunya this year. Also st 4 of Oman0 -
[url=http://www.bikeradar.com/forums/viewtopic.php?p=19762732#p19762732]Richmond Racer 2[/url] wrote:I don't remember seeing TJVG ever take the initiative - I can see him attritioning (yeah that's right, I made a verb up) his way to a podium or 2 but can't see him ever striking out for victory. At least if Porte's around to have a go at a win he'll generally give it a shot.
Check back on St 4 of Catalunya this year. Also st 4 of Oman
I don't see it. He's good but IMO not capable of taking a top prize. He hangs in well. Pinot, Bardet, Lopez Moreno, both Yates, Meintjes, Chaves and probably some of the neos like Latour will be better.0 -
(yeah that's right, I made a verb up)
Actually, what you were doing there was 'verbing'.Team My Man 2018: David gaudu, Pierre Latour, Romain Bardet, Thibaut pinot, Alexandre Geniez, Florian Senechal, Warren Barguil, Benoit Cosnefroy0
