La Vuelta '15 #11 Andorra laVella/Cortals dEncamp *SPOILERS*

frenchfighter

There is seemingly footage of the Paulinho moto crash:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gmHRDouA2_A

Now this is very odd for a couple of reasons: he does not fall off on contact and rides on after and it is completely his fault as far as I can tell.

The only thing is maybe if he had already been hit and was chasing the moto to remonstrate with him.

Any Spanish speakers can translate what is being said?

Dorset_Boy

[url=http://www.bikeradar.com/forums/viewtopic.php?p=19695349#p19695349]frenchfighter[/url] wrote:

There is seemingly footage of the Paulinho moto crash:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gmHRDouA2_A

Now this is very odd for a couple of reasons: he does not fall off on contact and rides on after and it is completely his fault as far as I can tell.

The only thing is maybe if he had already been hit and was chasing the moto to remonstrate with him.

Any Spanish speakers can translate what is being said?

The moto clearly slowed down on the corner and gave Paulinho nowhere to go.
But then if you ever actually rode you bike........ :?

salsiccia1

[url=http://www.bikeradar.com/forums/viewtopic.php?p=19695349#p19695349]frenchfighter[/url] wrote:

There is seemingly footage of the Paulinho moto crash:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gmHRDouA2_A

Now this is very odd for a couple of reasons: he does not fall off on contact and rides on after and it is completely his fault as far as I can tell.

The only thing is maybe if he had already been hit and was chasing the moto to remonstrate with him.

Any Spanish speakers can translate what is being said?

Sorry, have to disagree. On a closed road race, the rider has the right to be anywhere he wants, it's the moto's job to stay out of the way. Surely there was every chance of Paulinho taking a wide line out of that corner, and the moto pilot has to know and anticipate that.

Anonymous

Read the inrng piece on it. I think it may have been that driver.

Yes the rider had the right to be where he wants and was way off line but could well have gone flying into th hedges had it not been for the moto like where G was hit in the Tour or that big crash in the Enco tour (I think).

The motos are there to obviously provide the shots which make the sport money but I don't think it's unreasonable for them to expect the riders not to screw up their lines. Furthermore that would mean that they would have to be nowhere near the racing.

(I think Gweeds posted the link above)

Richmond Racer 2

My take is that yes, the motos have do their utmost not to interfere with the race and the racers. But the fact is that they ARE in the race, the riders know that and know why (in the case of tv motos, its images of the riders' mugs being broadcast over the world after all). And they need to coexist. Paulinho came hooning into that corner so fast he ensured that he had to take so wide a line. A glance as he approached the corner should have told him there was a moto travelling over on the far left hand side of the road he was turning into, and adjusted his speed so that he didnt need the entire width of that road.

Unfair to put ALL the blame on the moto IMO.

Dorset_Boy

Looked to me that Paulinho was taking the perfect line - wide entry, close to the apex, wide exit, minimal scrubbing of his speed.
The moto should not have been on the racing line out of the corner.

However in any accident involving more than one party there is usually some blame for all parties involved.

The_Boy

[url=http://www.bikeradar.com/forums/viewtopic.php?p=19695376#p19695376]Richmond Racer 2[/url] wrote:

My take is that yes, the motos have do their utmost not to interfere with the race and the racers. But the fact is that they ARE in the race, the riders know that and know why (in the case of tv motos, its images of the riders' mugs being broadcast over the world after all). And they need to coexist. Paulinho came hooning into that corner so fast he ensured that he had to take so wide a line. A glance as he approached the corner should have told him there was a moto travelling over on the far left hand side of the road he was turning into, and adjusted his speed so that he didnt need the entire width of that road.

Unfair to put ALL the blame on the moto IMO.

Eaxctly my sentiment when I saw the vid. In contrast to the incident involving Fuglsang (?) at the Tour where he was hit from behind, Paulinho had every opportunity to avoid that crash.

Of course the cyclists should have priority at all times and this should be drummed into anyone driving a vehicle on the course of a bike race at any level - I doubt anyone would disagree with that. But accidents happen, mistakes are made and for the most part the motos and cars are all there for a reason.

gweeds

The Moto in that clip is ahead of the bike. IMO there's a degree of fault with Paulinho for not trimming his speed into the corner as he was always going to drift out taking that apex. Hard to see how a Moto rider is supposed to adjust his line there.

With skiing, the skier coming down a piste is responsible for not hitting skiers lower down (who are moving at all sorts of random angles and speeds), the idea being that a skier can't look up a slope to adjust for those behind. Similar principle here for me.

ddraver

This is a race for the cyclist and not for the moto though Gweeds. The moto should be doing the utmost to keep well out of the way of any line Paulinho might takes

gweeds

[url=http://www.bikeradar.com/forums/viewtopic.php?p=19695431#p19695431]ddraver[/url] wrote:

This is a race for the cyclist and not for the moto though Gweeds. The moto should be doing the utmost to keep well out of the way of any line Paulinho might takes

A fair point and not one I can disagree with, but for one caveat DD.

The riders aren't racing in a vacuum. If we assume that the moto rider is concentrating on his downhill line (and we don't know if he had any clear space ahead to move into) then there is an onus on the rider behind to ensure he has a line out of the corner. It seems that a slight dab on the brakes would have allowed Paulinho to tighten his line. It looks like his injury was caused by clipping a peg or hero blob on the moto (and the lack of impact seen on camera suggests it was a brush rather than slammed into it).

But I take your point

frenchfighter

I thought it was his left foot...not sure how you can break your right foot from crashing on the left hand side of the road.

I didn't even know how he managed to break his foot in the first place tbh. I just assumed he kicked (an almighty whack) on the wooden barrier. Maybe he went round it and kicked it with his right foot.

imatfaal

[url=http://www.bikeradar.com/forums/viewtopic.php?p=19700281#p19700281]frenchfighter[/url] wrote:

I thought it was his left foot...not sure how you can break your right foot from crashing on the left hand side of the road.

I didn't even know how he managed to break his foot in the first place tbh. I just assumed he kicked (an almighty whack) on the wooden barrier. Maybe he went round it and kicked it with his right foot.
...

I assume he went to the left of the wooden post and caught the inside of his right foot on the wooden post as he went past. it is a strange place to break in a bike accident - inside of the foot above the arch under the ankle.