Campag/Shimano.

PLuKE

Afternoon.

I have been looking at gearing of late, currently running Tiagra and like to upgrade to Ultegra after having a brief play with it, so smooth and positive!

Well I was looking at some bikes in LBS and they had Campagnolo on, and lovers the way the hoods felt and layout, and not to forget the finish of the mechincal parts. But the prices are expensive!

I have Campag wheels and upgraded to Campag calipers.

Is Chorus equivalent to Ultegra, as I want an upgrade from Tiagra, so things are amoother and positive.

Thanks
Luke

drlodge

Chorus is the best value top end Campag groupset IMO, all the benefits of ultra shift but without the cost of Record/Super Record. Chorus is definately an upgrade from Tiagra, or any Shimano groupset for that matter ;-)

dennisn

drlodge wrote:

Chorus is definitely an upgrade from Tiagra, or any Shimano groupset for that matter ;-)

Wow. Kind of wondered when this argument would rear it's ugly head? OK guys, I'm waiting.

twgh

Had both - went Dura Ace and would never ever ever go back. Functionally they are both great but Shimano is 1/2 the price and imo Dura Ace is much better looking.

Ask yourself this....do you have a local bike shop that is able to properly service campag?

bondurant

To answer the OP:

Yes, so long as you find the hoods more comfortable on Chorus and you get on with the thumb shifter, most people would consider it 'better' than Tiagra. 'Better', though, might mean lighter, or more pleasing to the eye. On the basis that all they both functionally do is change gears and brake, you'd have to be convinced that this is enough to justify the outlay.

bondurant

If you're remotely practical, I wouldn't get too hung on up whether your LBS can service Campag either...if you can wield an Allen key you can fix most things yourself, while Chorus being Ultra Torque means very little tool related outlay.

PLuKE

I guess I have started something here!

I know there's nothing between the to in shifting. What I was trying to get at is this:

Chorus is expensive, twice the price of the Ultegra when I priced it up.
Athena and Centaur are the next step down, but would I feel a better shift over my Tiagra?

Many say you need to jump from Tiagra to Ultegra to feel a difference?

Luke

bondurant

If we're talking better shifting feel I'm amazed you could detect much of a difference between Tiagra and Ultegra. Maybe one of them was set up better.

twgh

PLuKE wrote:

I guess I have started something here!

I know there's nothing between the to in shifting. What I was trying to get at is this:

Chorus is expensive, twice the price of the Ultegra when I priced it up.
Athena and Centaur are the next step down, but would I feel a better shift over my Tiagra?

Many say you need to jump from Tiagra to Ultegra to feel a difference?

Luke

For the same price as Chorus you can get Dura Ace...? Ultegra 11 speed is brilliant and about £400 these days you really cannot argue that it is the ultimate value/performance groupset.

Do not mess around with Athena it is poo (especially the god awful bottom bracket/crank combo). Either go Chorus or don't bother.

PLuKE

Bondurant wrote:

If we're talking better shifting feel I'm amazed you could detect much of a difference between Tiagra and Ultegra. Maybe one of them was set up better.

I agree. When shifting there was less throw, and very little tension. My friend has Tiagra, and feels the same as mine.

Luke

bendertherobot

SRAM Force

PLuKE

twgh wrote:

PLuKE wrote:

I guess I have started something here!

I know there's nothing between the to in shifting. What I was trying to get at is this:

Chorus is expensive, twice the price of the Ultegra when I priced it up.
Athena and Centaur are the next step down, but would I feel a better shift over my Tiagra?

Many say you need to jump from Tiagra to Ultegra to feel a difference?

Luke

For the same price as Chorus you can get Dura Ace...? Ultegra 11 speed is brilliant and about £400 these days you really cannot argue that it is the ultimate value/performance groupset.

Do not mess around with Athena it is poo (especially the god awful bottom bracket/crank combo). Either go Chorus or don't bother.

Yes £600+ for Chorus. I guess your paying for a name? The rear derailleur is carbon cladded in areas.

Oh! Bugger Athena then! Centaur is ok?

Luke

bondurant

If you are going for Campag I'd say avoiding Power Torque BB is a must. Which means Chorus, as pointed out above.

PLuKE

Bondurant wrote:

If you are going for Campag I'd say avoiding Power Torque BB is a must. Which means Chorus, as pointed out above.

Power Torque BB? Is that there bottom bracket? What's the bad deal with it?

Thanks all for your input.

Luke

bondurant

Requiring an expensive tool to change the bearings is the main complaint. Ultra Torque is a simple and easy to service system. UT entry level is Chorus.

PLuKE

Argh ok, more expense!

My max budget really was £300 for a groupset which Wiggle can do with the Ultegra.

Maybe when the time nears, March, then I shall see prices and sales that are on and go from there.

Any info on Centaur?

Luke

twgh

PLuKE wrote:

Argh ok, more expense!

My max budget really was £300 for a groupset which Wiggle can do with the Ultegra.

Maybe when the time nears, March, then I shall see prices and sales that are on and go from there.

Any info on Centaur?

Luke

To be honest 105 will be great as well. The new Shimano 11 speed is a step above everything else.

bondurant

Bet you can't tell us exactly *how* it is a step above, other than subjectively.

I'm not having a dig at you personally. It's just how these things go.

rolf_f

With Campag, you buy Veloce or Chorus for technical reasons whilst Centaur, Athena and Record is purchased for bling reasons.

Have Shimano worked out how to do multiple downshifts yet?

twgh

Of course it is totally subjective - don't get me wrong if money were no object I would love several bikes one with Di2, Super Record, DA9000 etc. I just think that DA9000 is quite simply brilliant and unless you really want campy the value/performance winner in all categories is Shimano.

dennisn

PLuKE wrote:

Bondurant wrote:

If we're talking better shifting feel I'm amazed you could detect much of a difference between Tiagra and Ultegra. Maybe one of them was set up better.

I agree. When shifting there was less throw, and very little tension. My friend has Tiagra, and feels the same as mine.

Luke

I don't follow the worrying about how it's shifting feels. You press a lever with your finger, not much force is required, your finger moves the lever a half inch or so, the shift you wanted is done. How is this even an issue on any of the groupsets? i.e. How hard to learn, and get used to, is pressing a lever? :?

galatzo

It's all just personal preference 're shift action, lever shape, budget, existing kit/wheels. I had Chorus for years but fancied a change (& campag is that bit more expensive) and got a mega deal on Force 22 and love it due to the improved lever shape over the old Sram levers and also the cost to replace parts .
That said at the moment it's hard to see past Ultegra 11speed for value and the massive improvement in lever shape.
Try a few and see what's comfy ,all are instinctive to use and the only way one will make you a better rider than another is if it makes you want to ride more.

kingstonian

I tried Campag, just couldn't get to grips with the thumb shifter. Some love it, unfortunately I didn't. So I went with Ultegra Di2 and love it.

mfin

The OP has said his budget is really about £300. This wipes out any argument of Campag vs Shimano if he doesn't mind Shimano, as the closest sensible option for an upgrade from Tiagra is an Ultegra purchase.

OP, as others have said, if you are going to go Campag, stretching to Chorus is where the proper Campag stuff starts.. but is way over budget.

The only other option really is Sram Force, still over budget but bloody good and bloody light.

One day you can free yourself of Shimano, at least you'll have something to look forward to even if you can't do it now

PLuKE

Thanks for the input guys.

I think for now it's going to be Ultegra for the next upgrade for price/performance.

Maybe the next bike could have Campag and when my pockets are deeper too!

Luke

galatzo

Did I miss what bike it's going on ? It's an issue for some if an Italian wears anything other than Campag

PLuKE

Galatzo wrote:

Did I miss what bike it's going on ? It's an issue for some if an Italian wears anything other than Campag

No you didn't miss. It's going on a Merida, so no Italian fibres in her frame!

Luke

twgh

You are going to love Ultegra.

holiver

Rolf F wrote:

With Campag, you buy Veloce or Chorus for technical reasons whilst Centaur, Athena and Record is purchased for bling reasons.

This is a frustration of mine with Campag. In order to get the Ultrashift mechanism you have to pay a huge price over Veloce to Chorus.

I solved it by going with older Chorus 10 speed levers, but this means the older hood design.

I'd like to see a cheaper alternative from Campag with Ultrashift levers.

bigmat

holiver wrote:

Rolf F wrote:

With Campag, you buy Veloce or Chorus for technical reasons whilst Centaur, Athena and Record is purchased for bling reasons.

This is a frustration of mine with Campag. In order to get the Ultrashift mechanism you have to pay a huge price over Veloce to Chorus.

I solved it by going with older Chorus 10 speed levers, but this means the older hood design.

I'd like to see a cheaper alternative from Campag with Ultrashift levers.

When Campag first introduced the new lever shape, you could got Centaur ultrashift carbon (proper carbon, not wrapped). If you can get hold of a pair of those you can run 10-speed ultrashift with the new (and in my opinion far better) lever shape. Sadly mine are starting to look a bit battered and will probably need replacing soon, at which point I'll probably end up having to fork out for Chorus and go 11 speed.

At OP, if you wanted to go Campag I would just piece together a groupset - you can get older Veloce / Centaur ultratorque chainsets and ultrashift shifters (as discussed above). Those are the bits people tend to gripe about with the current 10-speed gruppos. 11 speed Ultegra probably makes more sense if you're already running Shimano anyway though.

DeVlaeminck

twgh wrote:

Had both - went Dura Ace and would never ever ever go back. Functionally they are both great but Shimano is 1/2 the price and imo Dura Ace is much better looking.

Ask yourself this....do you have a local bike shop that is able to properly service campag?

What ? Anyone that can't work on Campag isn't a bike mechanic I'd want anywhere near my bike anyway - it's hardly high end engineering to work on a bike.