TDF-Stage 16: Carcassonne–Bagnères-de-Luchon: *Spoiler*

Macaloon

Wallace and Gromit wrote:

Macaloon wrote:

But given we'd possibly elect President Farage in the current climate, I'm not convinced it's a smart idea in practice.

Or even worse, President Blair. The republicans should be very careful what they wish for! The Royal Family may be imperfect and heavily inbred, but the alternatives must surely be worse. The Irish system seems to work quite well, it must be said, though this seems to be an exception to the rule.

The other incentive for keeping existing constitutional monarchies compliant is that when they get out of line, they tend to lose their heads, not a mere election. This is the same argument that some use in favour of the current Chinese system. Their government has to be responsive to the needs of the masses, or they'll lose more than their penthouses come the inevitable revolution.

The_Boy

RichN95 wrote:

DeVlaeminck wrote:

I understood that the cost of the royal family did not include the vast sums spent protecting them and arranging their various publicity stu...I mean visits around the country. I would be willing to bet that the sums they supposedly bring into the country are inflated just as their cost is deliberately underestimated. All these things are stage managed so we don't question why a family are allowed money and influence by birthright.

They don't get that bold bit because they are royals, they get it because they are rich. Lots of people inherit money and influence by birthright. Even in republics.

They get it because they are rich *and* because they are royals. Hence the grauniad reporting that prince lugs has been consulted repeatedly on legislation, and why the government are planning on giving the royals new rights to secrecy even in cases of public interest.

Anyway, this thread has gone a bit weird.

dsoutar

Back on topic, can people tell me why the mechanics don't put larger sprockets on some of these rider's bikes. Watching Gaultier going over the last col was like watching a bloke wrestling two ferrets in a sack. I'm sure at one point he was actually going more from side to side than forwards

RideOnTime

Finally caught up with the hi-lights of the stage after having just seen a few intermittent bits. What a great stage . Beginning to think with Nibs big margin there was nothing to watch but these French Boyz. What a race this is to the podium and there's a lot to play for in the GC further down.

Awesome finish by the Aussie as well.

frenchfighter

george is only one but has been to more than half the countries I have ever wanted to go to.

simon_e

frenchfighter wrote:

coriordan wrote:

Your knocking of the Royal family is showing a lack of respect for the figurehead of the country where you have chosen to make your living.

I am English.

The puppets that get tons of land, money and palaces through no merit of their own and off the backs of hard working true contributors to this country are relics.

It is an insult on your intelligence, freedom and dignity to support them.

Man, I found some of your recent race-related posts unpleasantly hostile but you have redeemed yourself here. Totally agree with you on this subject.

Regarding Rogers, he may be a great rider blah blah but I can't see past his doping and the absence of a confession. In that particularly respect he's like Valv and many others so I couldn't celebrate this stage win.

I know many find Voeckler irritating but I like what he does; admittedly, his riding style as erratic and unattractive but this is not ballroom dancing. Interviews (like this one at CW) suggest that he does what he thinks is right and he races with passion; and he hasn't worked with the likes of Ferrari or Fuentes or get done for banned substances.

frenchfighter

Thanks for the interview link - great read.

Coachb

dsoutar wrote:

Back on topic, can people tell me why the mechanics don't put larger sprockets on some of these rider's bikes. Watching Gaultier going over the last col was like watching a bloke wrestling two ferrets in a sack. I'm sure at one point he was actually going more from side to side than forwards

Sometimes the riders and teams get the gearing wrong. That's why a recon can be important. But usually if your legs have gone it does not really matter as long as you can turn over the gear. I climb and have climbed most of the famous tour climbs on a 53X26. Its something I have always done and feel comfy climbing on the big ring. The one time my legs went I changed down on to my 39 and found it was easier to go back up on the 53,,,, when you spent your spent.

dish_dash

Mighty shame if this is true... though I gather that Albasini spoke to Reza this morning to resolve the issue.

http://road.cc/content/news/124595-euro ... ini-racism

frenchfighter

dish_dash wrote:

Mighty shame if this is true... though I gather that Albasini spoke to Reza this morning to resolve the issue.

http://road.cc/content/news/124595-euro ... ini-racism

Completely unacceptable. Didn't like Albasini any way but this is one big reason to put him on the red list. F*ucker.

Orica management need to make a statement and should pull him from the Tour or ASO should fine and remove him.

Reza is a great rider. Very versatile.

ben@31

nic_77 wrote:

You do know that the royal family costs each UK taxpayer less than £1.50 per year? The amount of money brought into the country by the royal family is significantly greater than that - like around £15 per taxpayer from tourism alone.

Of course that doesn't make their position correct - but from an economical perspective it's good business.

Nic, do you honestly think the royals would ever admit to being a waste of money?

The government pays the queen an annual grant currently totalling £37.9 million. The actual cost to the public purse is far higher when you include costs such as security and royal visits. The figures above also dont include the cost of special events such as the diamond jubilee festival or the £20 million royal wedding. But it is hard to find exact figures for how much they cost. A freedom of information request would be useful but royal finances have been made exempt from the Freedom of Information Act. Ask yourself why would they hide their true cost?

Also Nic, I am still to see 1p of the money the royals allegedly bring in. They do nothing for the part of the UK I live in.

At least politicians are democratically elected and serve a short term before they need to be re-elected. If monarchies are that good, how come no republic has ever gone back to being a monarchy?

In my job we have suffered no payrise for years but rising inflation, redundancies, cutbacks on spending, loss of resources, a compulsory change in our pension for the worse... Have the royals? Quote "We're all in this together" unquote.

salsiccia1

Lots of people wrote:

general ballbag

Oi, you lot! Don't you know there's a Tour on?

Coachb

ben@31 wrote:

nic_77 wrote:

You do know that the royal family costs each UK taxpayer less than £1.50 per year? The amount of money brought into the country by the royal family is significantly greater than that - like around £15 per taxpayer from tourism alone.

Of course that doesn't make their position correct - but from an economical perspective it's good business.

Nic, do you honestly think the royals would ever admit to being a waste of money?

The government pays the queen an annual grant currently totalling £37.9 million. The actual cost to the public purse is far higher when you include costs such as security and royal visits. The figures above also dont include the cost of special events such as the diamond jubilee festival or the £20 million royal wedding. But it is hard to find exact figures for how much they cost. A freedom of information request would be useful but royal finances have been made exempt from the Freedom of Information Act. Ask yourself why would they hide their true cost?

Also Nic, I am still to see 1p of the money the royals allegedly bring in. They do nothing for the part of the UK I live in.

At least politicians are democratically elected and serve a short term before they need to be re-elected. If monarchies are that good, how come no republic has ever gone back to being a monarchy?

In my job we have suffered no payrise for years but rising inflation, redundancies, cutbacks on spending, loss of resources, a compulsory change in our pension for the worse... Have the royals? Quote "We're all in this together" unquote.

Spot on...Sooner we stop having to pay millions for so called events like Wills wedding the better.
Back on topic Reza has been great all season and very aggressive and I really hope that he starts getting some big wins. The whole team should go. Just not acceptable in any way.

cesco

frenchfighter wrote:

dish_dash wrote:

Mighty shame if this is true... though I gather that Albasini spoke to Reza this morning to resolve the issue.

http://road.cc/content/news/124595-euro ... ini-racism

Completely unacceptable. Didn't like Albasini any way but this is one big reason to put him on the red list. F*ucker.

Orica management need to make a statement and should pull him from the Tour or ASO should fine and remove him.

Reza is a great rider. Very versatile.

Indeed, class rider. Does great work for his team in the sprints AND on the climbs!

Anonymous

It's part of the problem politicians are voted out after 3 years - all they want to do is further their career and survive the next election. They can't make the unpopular but right decisions.

At least The royals aren't afraid to stick their oar in a bit as they won't get hoofed out overnight. The gov wastes more than 38m on bloody procurement for The NHS.

Furthermore, you're not a small trader or restaurant in London, Windsor or balmoral. I reckon they'd see the benefit differently

adr82

ben@31 wrote:

nic_77 wrote:

You do know that the royal family costs each UK taxpayer less than £1.50 per year? The amount of money brought into the country by the royal family is significantly greater than that - like around £15 per taxpayer from tourism alone.

Of course that doesn't make their position correct - but from an economical perspective it's good business.

Nic, do you honestly think the royals would ever admit to being a waste of money?

The government pays the queen an annual grant currently totalling £37.9 million. The actual cost to the public purse is far higher when you include costs such as security and royal visits. The figures above also dont include the cost of special events such as the diamond jubilee festival or the £20 million royal wedding. But it is hard to find exact figures for how much they cost. A freedom of information request would be useful but royal finances have been made exempt from the Freedom of Information Act. Ask yourself why would they hide their true cost?

Oh please, that sort of cash is chump change for a country with an economy the size of the UK. When you start getting into the hundreds of millions and especially into the billions, that's where things really start to matter, and there are far more dubious projects of much greater expense that have no trouble getting funding. If you want to save real money, you need to look at the major areas of government expenditure when they're routinely spending tens or even hundreds of billions. Pensions, welfare, health, defence, education, etc.

In the end, it's the government you should be blaming for all of it, not the royal family themselves, because in the end it's the government who continue to tolerate them. If the government wanted, and if public opinion supported it, we could be rid of the royals almost overnight.

salsiccia1

If you lot don't cut it out, I'll get Chasey on you. Then you'll be sorry.

above_the_cows

dish_dash wrote:

Mighty shame if this is true... though I gather that Albasini spoke to Reza this morning to resolve the issue.

http://road.cc/content/news/124595-euro ... ini-racism

I really hope that is not true.

RichN95.

Talking of the Royal Family, the curse of Will and Kate has been in full effect. They shook hands with seven riders in Leeds - Froome, Cavendish, Contador, Schleck, Costa and Yates are all gone. Only Geraint Thomas remains.

(And judging by the rate that Welsh Commonwealth medal hopes are dropping like flies at the moment I don't hold out much hope of him seeing Paris)

ben@31

adr82 wrote:

Oh please, that sort of cash is chump change for a country with an economy the size of the UK. When you start getting into the hundreds of millions and especially into the billions, that's where things really start to matter, and there are far more dubious projects of much greater expense that have no trouble getting funding. If you want to save real money, you need to look at the major areas of government expenditure when they're routinely spending tens or even hundreds of billions. Pensions, welfare, health, defence, education, etc.

In the end, it's the government you should be blaming for all of it, not the royal family themselves, because in the end it's the government who continue to tolerate them. If the government wanted, and if public opinion supported it, we could be rid of the royals almost overnight.

Adr, did you miss my point that nobody really knows the true cost of the royals? Because they are not transparent and made it exempt from the freedom of information act. Why?

Also don't forget that all the millions we are paying the royals is only going to just a few individuals. Yes, defence and education spending may be more but remember how many 100,000's are employed in education or defence.

As for the cost of pensions, welfare and health.. we have paid for our own through national insurance and taxation.

frenchfighter

RichN95 wrote:

Talking of the Royal Family, the curse of Will and Kate has been in full effect. They shook hands with seven riders in Leeds - Froome, Cavendish, Contador, Schleck, Costa and Yates are all gone. Only Geraint Thomas remains.

(And judging by the rate that Welsh Commonwealth medal hopes are dropping like flies at the moment I don't hold out much hope of him seeing Paris)

above_the_cows

RichN95 wrote:

Talking of the Royal Family, the curse of Will and Kate has been in full effect. They shook hands with seven riders in Leeds - Froome, Cavendish, Contador, Schleck, Costa and Yates are all gone. Only Geraint Thomas remains.

(And judging by the rate that Welsh Commonwealth medal hopes are dropping like flies at the moment I don't hold out much hope of him seeing Paris)

Ahem, correlation, causation...

knedlicky

adr82 wrote:

Nibali held up by a car on the descent

The car was of a Brittany daily newspaper – Pinot doesn’t come from Brittany but he happened to be ahead of Nibali on the descent just then.
Despite what Phil and Paul say, Pinot’s descending hasn’t radically improved, so occasional help to avoid being dropped may still be needed.

iainf72

Above The Cows wrote:

dish_dash wrote:

Mighty shame if this is true... though I gather that Albasini spoke to Reza this morning to resolve the issue.

http://road.cc/content/news/124595-euro ... ini-racism

I really hope that is not true.

Albasini v Reza solved. Albasini said: take a turn or I call Nygaard (via Julien Pretot)

frenchfighter

Plausible.

Did it take a whole day for Orica's PR to think that one up.

adr82

ben@31 wrote:

adr82 wrote:

Oh please, that sort of cash is chump change for a country with an economy the size of the UK. When you start getting into the hundreds of millions and especially into the billions, that's where things really start to matter, and there are far more dubious projects of much greater expense that have no trouble getting funding. If you want to save real money, you need to look at the major areas of government expenditure when they're routinely spending tens or even hundreds of billions. Pensions, welfare, health, defence, education, etc.

In the end, it's the government you should be blaming for all of it, not the royal family themselves, because in the end it's the government who continue to tolerate them. If the government wanted, and if public opinion supported it, we could be rid of the royals almost overnight.

Adr, did you miss my point that nobody really knows the true cost of the royals? Because they are not transparent and made it exempt from the freedom of information act. Why?

Also don't forget that all the millions we are paying the royals is only going to just a few individuals. Yes, defence and education spending may be more but remember how many 100,000's are employed in education or defence.

No, I didn't miss it, I just think it's worth caring about. Like I said, on a national scale it's nothing. Unless you really think they're secretly obtaining tens of billions in extra funding from the taxpayer somehow?

Politicians waste much more of your money than the royal family do. For a start they each get paid £67K/year to do f*ck all. There's a thing in the computing world called "premature optimization". It basically means trying to make a program run faster without actually first checking which parts of it are running slowest. What you're suggesting is the financial equivalent: "Let's do away with the royals because they cost us so much! No need to study other much larger budgets that could be trimmed!". Take a step back and try thinking about how else we could easily save money. A simple example: HS2 is projected to be well over £50 billion IIRC, and that's hardly a vital project. Cut that and you'd probably save more than the royal family costs us in a couple of decades. I'm not a fan of the royals and I wouldn't be sad to see them go, but to try and lump them with some sort of responsibility for all your economic woes is absurd.

RichN95.

iainf72 wrote:

Above The Cows wrote:

dish_dash wrote:

Mighty shame if this is true... though I gather that Albasini spoke to Reza this morning to resolve the issue.

http://road.cc/content/news/124595-euro ... ini-racism

I really hope that is not true.

Albasini v Reza solved. Albasini said: take a turn or I call Nygaard (via Julien Pretot)

Bullsh1t.

Did Orica just get their staff list out and look for the name that sounded most like a racist insult?

tailwindhome

Salsiccia1 wrote:

Lots of people wrote:

general ballbag

I'm no fan of the monarchy, but I'd prefer her than him

RichN95.

TailWindHome wrote:

Salsiccia1 wrote:

Lots of people wrote:

general ballbag

I'm no fan of the monarchy, but I'd prefer her than him

She comes from the village next to mine*, so I quite like her.


*Where I grew up, not Cardiff

frenchfighter