Diet help need advice

Camcycle1974

I do find gels etc useful as a supplement to whole foods when out riding long distances. The Cambridge to Norwich and back ride I did was 8 1/2 hours in the saddle and it would have been hard to carry enough food without taking some gels. I wouldn't rely on them solely and don't bother on training rides.I don't race but for sportives etc when aiming for a good time they have their uses. For recovery, milk and a decent balanced meal afterwards is fine.

tilt

Camcycle1974 wrote:

madasahattersley wrote:

Why are people so obsessed with protein shakes? Serious question - does Froomey wake up in the morning and down a protein shake? I'll bet the answer would be 'never in a million years.' Maybe having some supplemental protein as part of a much more comprehensive post-training recovery regime, but it's not the be all and end all.

Totally agree, especially when a pint of milk acheives the same thing for 50p. Supplement companies are there to make money, pure and simple. Same with energy drinks, pretty simple to make your own with glucose/fructose for a fraction of the cost.

Whey is cheaper (40p for the same amount of protein as a pint of milk)
Whey protein has a much higher bioavailability than milk
Whey last ages before going off so it's convenient to have in the cupboard/work desk drawer
Whey has less carbs, if you're trying to limit them
Whey has less lactose, if that's an issue

It's a cheap, convenient, high protein, low carb food

dw300

tilt wrote:

Camcycle1974 wrote:

madasahattersley wrote:

Why are people so obsessed with protein shakes? Serious question - does Froomey wake up in the morning and down a protein shake? I'll bet the answer would be 'never in a million years.' Maybe having some supplemental protein as part of a much more comprehensive post-training recovery regime, but it's not the be all and end all.

Totally agree, especially when a pint of milk acheives the same thing for 50p. Supplement companies are there to make money, pure and simple. Same with energy drinks, pretty simple to make your own with glucose/fructose for a fraction of the cost.

Whey is cheaper (40p for the same amount of protein as a pint of milk)
Whey protein has a much higher bioavailability than milk
Whey last ages before going off so it's convenient to have in the cupboard/work desk drawer
Whey has less carbs, if you're trying to limit them
Whey has less lactose, if that's an issue

It's a cheap, convenient, high protein, low carb food

Don't bother explaining, they don't want to understand that it has it's place. They only want to feel superior over those that are using supplements wrongly.

If you're bulking, you can't afford NOT to use whey .. well, unless you're minted.

Camcycle1974 wrote:

dw300 wrote:

Camcycle1974 wrote:

madasahattersley wrote:

Why are people so obsessed with protein shakes? Serious question - does Froomey wake up in the morning and down a protein shake? I'll bet the answer would be 'never in a million years.' Maybe having some supplemental protein as part of a much more comprehensive post-training recovery regime, but it's not the be all and end all.

Totally agree, especially when a pint of milk acheives the same thing for 50p. Supplement companies are there to make money, pure and simple. Same with energy drinks, pretty simple to make your own with glucose/fructose for a fraction of the cost.

Protein shakes are aimed at athletes looking to gain mass whilst keeping calories to a minimum, not to cyclists.

There are some recovery drinks with protein, but those aren't what is colloquially referred to as a protein shake.[/quire]

Sorry but this doesn't make sense. To gain mass you need an excess of calories..it's how you manage the excess that determines how much fat you gain along with the muscle. I would wager that a bodybuilder trying to gain size would consume 3-4000 calls per day, similar to a cyclist with a heavy training schedule.

Strong quoting ..

How does it not make sense? You actually showed how it did make sense in your answer! Make your excess cals come from protein .. maximise muscle gain, minimise fat gain .. ? What's hard to understand?

dw300

madasahattersley wrote:

This is a cycling thread. Who on here is 'bulking'?

You were the one that brought protein shakes into the thread. I'm just saying unless you're bulking you're not the target audience for those products, after you rubbished the companies that produced them.

If you can show me an ad for whey protein powders aimed at cyclists as an example of the supplement industry marketing products where they're not needed i'll stand corrected.

I think you guys may be mistaking bad coaches, nutritionists, PTs or forum fanboys suggesting incorrect use, or saying they use them inappropriately, for the actual marketing strategy of the company. Just because some people have more money than brains does not make a product unsuitable for their intended purpose.

As with the majority of supplements, you're paying for convenience, which, if your time is valuable to you, generally makes them cheap. That can make them more suitable for purpose assuming they're nothing more than equally beneficial compared with home prepared options.

dw300

Yes totally. And I just feel I have to stand up for the companies, because it's really not them spreading the misinformation.

Getting protein from milk is acceptable for a cyclist, assuming you're not very lactose intolerant (which I think most humans are to some degree). But you can get 20g of protein for 100kcals from a shake, or 20g of protein and 280kcals from a pint of milk. You do that 100 times a year and that's 5lbs of extra fat you have to burn through. Which is fine if you're already at racing weight, but might be inappropriate for someone trying to drop some. You can't just be going around saying there's no place for them, everyones situation is different.

Do you remember the 'Lucozade' documentary? They slated that company, and all the documentary showed was ignorant people using the product wrongly, abusing it I suppose you could say. Parents giving their kids a 250kcal bottle of juice to fuel a half hour kickabout in the garden that might have burned a couple of hundred tops. But then ask the parents how many cals are in the drink or how many the kids are burning doing that exercise and they dont know .. it's your kids damn health ffs.

I think there was a girl died in the London marathon after drinking about 4 gallons of Jack3d before and during an event that her heart would have been bouncing off the limiter without the stimulants .. very sad, but not the company's fault.

Anyway, sorry for thread derail!

Camcycle1974

My point is that your average Joe training up to 5 hours a week has no need for supplements. Everything required can be assimilated from food. I took whey for several years but concluded that it offered me no benefit over regular food (it did give me terrible wind though!) I just found that a pint of milk post training worked best for me. There have been studies done concluding that milk is the perfect recovery drink due to it's mix of protein/carbs, vits and minerals. I suppose milk+whey could give the best of both. A pint of skimmed milk is 195 calories by the way and the carbs and extra nutrients combined within make it superior to whey protein in a cycling context.