World Championship - ***SPOILERS***

graeme_s-2

One of the write ups I read (possibly inrng) included the phrase "try playing poker after a seven hour ride in the rain" which I think is a fair comment. Yes they're all hardened professionals, but they had to make split second decisions in an extreme situation. It's hardly surprising that sometimes they make the wrong ones.

greasedscotsman

Cards would be a bit soggy after 7 hours in the rain...

NervexProf

Interesting article here - 60 years ago - 22lb steel bikes and Bedwell finished!

http://greenjersey.wordpress.com/2013/0 ... -years-on/

frenchfighter

NervexProf wrote:

Interesting article here - 60 years ago - 22lb steel bikes and Bedwell finished!

http://greenjersey.wordpress.com/2013/0 ... -years-on/

Ha good one. Old school heavyweights forever. Look at that winning margin also.

frenchfighter

Anyone know if Hushovd crashed or bailed as he was wet?

FJS

TheBigBean wrote:

FJS wrote:

I really do not buy he didn't have the legs, and even if he was tired, he could at least have made an attempt to react to Rui Costa. Minguez (and J-Rod) does not buy his story; I think he should have a pretty good insight in what goes on in his team, right?

I've only read that they think Valverde should have gone with Costa. We all think that. The only matter for debate is why he didn't. It might have been part of his wicked plan to get bronze for himself and a gold for Costa, or it might have been becuase he was tired. I favour the latter reasoning.

As I said upthread, it is almost exactly the same situation as LBL this year. Valverde didn't react to the move by Dan Martin - is that because he wanted Dan Martin to win, or because he didn't have the legs and thought someone else would chase?

That was a completely different situation. Martin attacked uphill and the idea that Valverde couldnt follow is reasomable. And even if he did have the legs, looking for others to chase was a possibility, because there were others (even though Valverde had probably the fastest sprint). This sunday the attack was on the flat, after a long period Valverde could sit in the wheels and had shown no problem at all staying with Nibali on Via Selviati. And, there was nobody else to look to chase - Nibali had been riding his socks of for miles chasing JRod, it really was Valverde's task, and his only, to react to anything Rui Costa was doing.

greasedscotsman

TheBigBean wrote:

...thought someone else would chase?

I favour this for both the Worlds and Liege.

Pross

Compare and contrast

dwanes wrote:

These Sky boys remind of those Over-paid footballers who are only up for a big game, and as soon as they have to play a lower league club in a cup game they think they are above it.
I think their luxury bus and lives in general are becoming too cosy and It is becoming too much about the money.

frenchfighter wrote:

IN CYCLING, THERE ARE DAYS SOMETIMES WHERE YOU HAVE TO TAKE RISKS. TODAY I TOOK ONE TOO MANY, BUT THAT'S THE SPORT, THAT'S CYCLING. LUCKILY, I'M FINE.

shazzz wrote:

Richmond Racer

Good grief, was it only 3 months ago everyone was praising G for his courage in riding the Tour with a fractured pelvis?

As Neal Rogers tweeted a few weeks ago, to no sport does 'what have you done for me lately ' apply more than cycling

TheBigBean

NervexProf wrote:

Interesting article here - 60 years ago - 22lb steel bikes and Bedwell finished!

http://greenjersey.wordpress.com/2013/0 ... -years-on/

So what explains the fact that they were almost the same speed?

Richmond Racer

TheBigBean wrote:

NervexProf wrote:

Interesting article here - 60 years ago - 22lb steel bikes and Bedwell finished!

http://greenjersey.wordpress.com/2013/0 ... -years-on/

So what explains the fact that they were almost the same speed?

Perhaps this year's race being run through rivers of water might have something to do with it

dish_dash

Been lurking away on this thread and taking a look at Pez prompted a few thoughts:
- Doesn't Sagan look fat when he isn't in Green?
- Where was Contador? Note that 'heavyweight' was a DNF alongside all those overpaid robots... and hasn't he had comparatively poor season?
- All this criticism of the British team. I note that GB came away with an individual medal (albeit silver).
- Finally, Purito to win Lombaria? He deserves it...

essexeagle

TheBigBean wrote:

NervexProf wrote:

Interesting article here - 60 years ago - 22lb steel bikes and Bedwell finished!

http://greenjersey.wordpress.com/2013/0 ... -years-on/

So what explains the fact that they were almost the same speed?

Yes and that included a fag break

frenchfighter

dish_dash wrote:

Been lurking away on this thread and taking a look at Pez prompted a few thoughts:
- Doesn't Sagan look fat when he isn't in Green?
- Where was Contador? Note that 'heavyweight' was a DNF alongside all those overpaid robots... and hasn't he had comparatively poor season?
- All this criticism of the British team. I note that GB came away with an individual medal (albeit silver) which is more than Italy or Belgium did (I'm exluding the TTT).
- Finally, Purito to win Lombaria? He deserves it...

Contador crashed early on and instead of pulling out he rode hard with Sagan to cover a gap of over a minute. He then kept along with the main group until the 2nd to last ascension. It kicked off and he dropped off the pace and presumably then pulled out as he would be of no help to Rodriguez and Valverde (he was there in a support role).

Rodriguez won Lombardia last year in awful conditions. I`m sure he will go again hard for it but I suspect that Gilbert will be really keen to get it. Note the top ten from last year. Contador is there as is Simon Clarke. Note that the only Sky riders finishing where it mattered were the Colombians who have had a hard life.
1 RODRIGUEZ OLIVER, Joaquin (KATUSHA) 6:36:27
2 SANCHEZ GONZALEZ, Samuel (EUSKALTEL - EUSKADI) + 0:09
3 URAN URAN, Rigoberto (SKY PROCYCLING)
4 SANTAMBROGIO, Mauro (BMC RACING)
5 HENAO MONTOYA, Sergio Luis (SKY PROCYCLING)
6 HESJEDAL, Ryder (GARMIN-SHARP)
7 MOLLEMA, Bauke (RABOBANK)
8 ZAUGG, Oliver (RADIOSHACK-NISSAN)
9 CONTADOR VELASCO, Alberto (SAXO BANK-TINKOFF BANK)
10 KESSIAKOFF, Fredrik Carl Wilhelm (ASTANA)
11 QUINTANA ROJAS, Nairo Alexander (MOVISTAR)
12 PELLIZOTTI, Franco (ANDRONI GIOCATTOLI)
13 CUNEGO, Damiano (LAMPRE - ISD) + 0:35
14 KOLOBNEV, Alexandr (KATUSHA) + 0:57
15 CLARKE, Simon (ORICA - GREENEDGE)
16 MARTIN, Daniel (GARMIN-SHARP) + 1:23
17 VAN AVERMAET, Greg (BMC RACING) + 1:25
18 PERAUD, Jean-Christophe (AG2R LA MONDIALE)
19 RABOTTINI, Matteo (FARNESE VINI - SELLE ITALIA)
20 DI LUCA, Danilo (ACQUA & SAPONE)

bigmat

frenchfighter wrote:

dish_dash wrote:

Been lurking away on this thread and taking a look at Pez prompted a few thoughts:
- Doesn't Sagan look fat when he isn't in Green?
- Where was Contador? Note that 'heavyweight' was a DNF alongside all those overpaid robots... and hasn't he had comparatively poor season?
- All this criticism of the British team. I note that GB came away with an individual medal (albeit silver) which is more than Italy or Belgium did (I'm exluding the TTT).
- Finally, Purito to win Lombaria? He deserves it...

Contador crashed early on and instead of pulling out he rode hard with Sagan to cover a gap of over a minute. He then kept along with the main group until the 2nd to last ascension. It kicked off and he dropped off the pace and presumably then pulled out as he would be of no help to Rodriguez and Valverde (he was there in a support role).

Rodriguez won Lombardia last year in awful conditions. I`m sure he will go again hard for it but I suspect that Gilbert will be really keen to get it. Note the top ten from last year. Contador is there as is Simon Clarke. Note that the only Sky riders finishing where it mattered were the Colombians who have had a hard life.
1 RODRIGUEZ OLIVER, Joaquin (KATUSHA) 6:36:27
2 SANCHEZ GONZALEZ, Samuel (EUSKALTEL - EUSKADI) + 0:09
3 URAN URAN, Rigoberto (SKY PROCYCLING)
4 SANTAMBROGIO, Mauro (BMC RACING)
5 HENAO MONTOYA, Sergio Luis (SKY PROCYCLING)
6 HESJEDAL, Ryder (GARMIN-SHARP)
7 MOLLEMA, Bauke (RABOBANK)
8 ZAUGG, Oliver (RADIOSHACK-NISSAN)
9 CONTADOR VELASCO, Alberto (SAXO BANK-TINKOFF BANK)
10 KESSIAKOFF, Fredrik Carl Wilhelm (ASTANA)
11 QUINTANA ROJAS, Nairo Alexander (MOVISTAR)
12 PELLIZOTTI, Franco (ANDRONI GIOCATTOLI)
13 CUNEGO, Damiano (LAMPRE - ISD) + 0:35
14 KOLOBNEV, Alexandr (KATUSHA) + 0:57
15 CLARKE, Simon (ORICA - GREENEDGE)
16 MARTIN, Daniel (GARMIN-SHARP) + 1:23
17 VAN AVERMAET, Greg (BMC RACING) + 1:25
18 PERAUD, Jean-Christophe (AG2R LA MONDIALE)
19 RABOTTINI, Matteo (FARNESE VINI - SELLE ITALIA)
20 DI LUCA, Danilo (ACQUA & SAPONE)

That's an impressive top 20, dopers excepted. Brits don't really do well in hilly classics do they? (unless you count Dan Martin). I'd hoped Little Pete or even G might have stepped it up by now - maybe Edmondson over the next year or two? But there'll be nothing this year, so can we just get that out of the way in advance please and no sniping / gloating / trolling after the event?

frenchfighter

dsoutar

frenchfighter wrote:

I would rather 1 Valverde then 25 factory boys riding tempo.

I provided the example, there are more if you want to find them yourself. Not to mention the huge number of top 5 placings. In his ten years as a pro, his CQ rankings are as follows: 4, 4, 1, 1, 3, 2, 14, 4, 6, 338. A better palmares than almost the entire pro peloton.

Errm - you missed something rather glaring off that "wonderful" palmares - a 2 year ban.

Just remember cheating riders cost the sport sponsors. That means deserving, hard working, clean cyclists lose their jobs and livelihoods but scum like him don't think about that.

In my book that nullifies everything you have written above and more, especially given his refusal to put his hand up about the whole issue

Pross

BigMat wrote:

Brits don't really do well in hilly classics do they? (unless you count Dan Martin). I'd hoped Little Pete or even G might have stepped it up by now - maybe Edmondson over the next year or two? But there'll be nothing this year, so can we just get that out of the way in advance please and no sniping / gloating / trolling after the event?

I fear that as most Brits coming through will end up at Sky that any potential hilly classics contenders amongst them will be pressed into service as domestiques for stage races instead as they lend themselves to that type of riding. The chance for them to go for one day races will be limited as they will often been out on training camps when their type of race is being run. We have seen it with Uran and Henao - they have done well when given the chance but their main role has been to support a GC contender. I'm a fan of what Sky has done for British cycling but unless they have a change of emphasis (and why would they given their success in the last 2 years) riders who can ride hard in the hills will continue to be support riders in stage races until they are considered to be good enough to have a crack at stage races for themselves. It's for that reason I'd like to see the young Brits getting spread around a bit.

adr82

frenchfighter wrote:

Contador crashed early on and instead of pulling out he rode hard with Sagan to cover a gap of over a minute. He then kept along with the main group until the 2nd to last ascension. It kicked off and he dropped off the pace and presumably then pulled out as he would be of no help to Rodriguez and Valverde (he was there in a support role).

Ah I see, it's OK for Contador to pull out when he knew he would be "of no help". Do you have some sort of multiple personality disorder by any chance? It's either that or you're a massive hypocrite.

salsiccia1

dsoutar wrote:

frenchfighter wrote:

I would rather 1 Valverde then 25 factory boys riding tempo.

I provided the example, there are more if you want to find them yourself. Not to mention the huge number of top 5 placings. In his ten years as a pro, his CQ rankings are as follows: 4, 4, 1, 1, 3, 2, 14, 4, 6, 338. A better palmares than almost the entire pro peloton.

Errm - you missed something rather glaring off that "wonderful" palmares - a 2 year ban.

Just remember cheating riders cost the sport sponsors. That means deserving, hard working, clean cyclists lose their jobs and livelihoods but scum like him don't think about that.

In my book that nullifies everything you have written above and more, especially given his refusal to put his hand up about the whole issue

Hard to argue with that.

RichN95.

Pross wrote:

I fear that as most Brits coming through will end up at Sky that any potential hilly classics contenders amongst them will be pressed into service as domestiques for stage races instead as they lend themselves to that type of riding. The chance for them to go for one day races will be limited as they will often been out on training camps when their type of race is being run.

I'm not sure that's really true. Of the Tour team, Froome, Porte, Lopez, Siutsou, Kiryienka and EBH all rode at least one of Amstel-Fleche-LBL. And Stannard, Thomas and EBH did San Remo-Ronde-Roubaix. Only Kennaugh missed out.

hammerite

frenchfighter wrote:

Rodriguez won Lombardia last year in awful conditions. I`m sure he will go again hard for it but I suspect that Gilbert will be really keen to get it. Note the top ten from last year. Contador is there as is Simon Clarke. Note that the only Sky riders finishing where it mattered were the Colombians who have had a hard life.
1 RODRIGUEZ OLIVER, Joaquin (KATUSHA) 6:36:27
2 SANCHEZ GONZALEZ, Samuel (EUSKALTEL - EUSKADI) + 0:09
3 URAN URAN, Rigoberto (SKY PROCYCLING)
4 SANTAMBROGIO, Mauro (BMC RACING)
5 HENAO MONTOYA, Sergio Luis (SKY PROCYCLING)
6 HESJEDAL, Ryder (GARMIN-SHARP)
7 MOLLEMA, Bauke (RABOBANK)
8 ZAUGG, Oliver (RADIOSHACK-NISSAN)
9 CONTADOR VELASCO, Alberto (SAXO BANK-TINKOFF BANK)
10 KESSIAKOFF, Fredrik Carl Wilhelm (ASTANA)
11 QUINTANA ROJAS, Nairo Alexander (MOVISTAR)
12 PELLIZOTTI, Franco (ANDRONI GIOCATTOLI)
13 CUNEGO, Damiano (LAMPRE - ISD) + 0:35
14 KOLOBNEV, Alexandr (KATUSHA) + 0:57
15 CLARKE, Simon (ORICA - GREENEDGE)
16 MARTIN, Daniel (GARMIN-SHARP) + 1:23
17 VAN AVERMAET, Greg (BMC RACING) + 1:25
18 PERAUD, Jean-Christophe (AG2R LA MONDIALE)
19 RABOTTINI, Matteo (FARNESE VINI - SELLE ITALIA)
20 DI LUCA, Danilo (ACQUA & SAPONE)

I know Sky baiting is your favourite sport... but looking through the top 20 most teams only end up with one rider in there, with the exception of Garmin and BMC - presumably because the rest of their squads were riding for the rider in the top 20. Do you really expect Sky to have more than 2 riders up there?

With regard to comparing Valverde and Froome's palmares (or CQ ranking) their not really comparable. Valverde is 5 years older that Froome so has a bit of a head start!

Pross

RichN95 wrote:

Pross wrote:

I fear that as most Brits coming through will end up at Sky that any potential hilly classics contenders amongst them will be pressed into service as domestiques for stage races instead as they lend themselves to that type of riding. The chance for them to go for one day races will be limited as they will often been out on training camps when their type of race is being run.

I'm not sure that's really true. Of the Tour team, Froome, Porte, Lopez, Siutsou, Kiryienka and EBH all rode at least one of Amstel-Fleche-LBL. And Stannard, Thomas and EBH did San Remo-Ronde-Roubaix. Only Kennaugh missed out.

Not saying they won't ride them and I'm sure they hope to get riders placing highly but the onus is on these riders supporting the GC contenders in stage races. Even the more minor stage races take priority over the Classics. It's not exactly a criticism, just the way Sky have set themselves up and they have been successful in that way.

ddraver

Agree with Pross a bit. Although it should be emphasised that Sky concentrating on Le Tour and their home tour seperates them from almost no cycling team whatsoever. Even the Belgian Teams have that scrawny Manx bloke and the Massive German to make sure they show in July

VCDL did an interview with Brian Smithy last year as the whole JTL deal was being finalised and although he was happy that one of his proteges had made the big time he was cautioning that he is NOT a GT climbing domestique but a Hilly classic type explosive rider (the impression he gave to me was somewhere between Dan Martin, Phil Gil and J-Rod) and there was already some nervousness that Sky would not let him do that properly...and so it turned out.

I get the impression that if Sky did nt HAVE to turn up for the Hilly classics, they wouldnt. Not sure why but the cobbled classics seem to sit a but higher up their priorities but still...To use Brailspeak I doubt they were anyone's "Stated Goals"*

(*Hey, I found myself explaining the inner chimp model to a very tearful housemate last night!)

mechanism

James Murdoch knew about the Tour de France and more recently became aware of Paris-Roubaix but is probably still a bit vague about the other races.

ddraver

Mechanism wrote:

James Murdoch knew about the Tour de France and more recently became aware of Paris-Roubaix but is probably still a bit vague about the other races.

Same with all the people he sells to then, except that they thing the Tour de France is Paris Roubaix and is still won by that American Cancer bloke...

frenchfighter

This: http://chrisfroomelookingatstems.tumblr.com/?og=1
Needs to be updated with this:

:roll:

greasedscotsman

He's not looking at his stem, he's looking at his power meter! :roll:

graeme_s-2

frenchfighter wrote:

Have they made up post race then, or is this before the race?

frenchfighter

Not too sure.