Europcar and cortisone...

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Comments

  • DeadCalm
    DeadCalm Posts: 4,242
    Mad_Malx wrote:
    I still can't see anything that confirms he has taken cortisone - the reports say his cortisol levels are down.

    This may be because
    1. He has been taking cortisone (or other glucocorticoid) in an attempt to improve performance but has now stopped. It can take weeks to recover natural cortisol production, because the synthetic glucocorticoid switches off natural production
    2. He has been taking cortisone (or other glucocorticoid) repeatedly to treat injury, and now stopped ....
    3. He has been chronically overtraining/over competing
    4. and/or he has a medical condition

    If 1 he should be hung up by the danglies. If the intent is there then it is cheating, but I'm still of the opinion that the actual performance benefits are negligible while taking cortisone and DETRIMENTAL ONCE HE STOPS, so it would be a particularly stupid sort of cheating.

    If 2, 3 or 4 he needs rest & treatment. I would side mainly with 2 or 3.
    There is a study that followed cortisol levels in riders in the Tour, showing how, in a sample of riders, they fall by the end of week 3 to levels close to the lower threshhold (can't find this one just now), and this is attributed to fatigue and over-exercise. It isn't beyond possibility that levels in an individual rider could fall very low solely due to overtraining/competing.

    Digging deeper there IS a small amount of data that suggest potential performance benefits (summarised by Montlavan & Duclos, 2008, Br J Sports Medicine, but this is not generally available free) - rats run further on their wheels when given glucocorticoids - and some hypothetical benefits (EDIT - this will be while taking them, and NOT after stopping). I haven't had chance to look closely at these, but I very much doubt that doses used to treat injury would make any difference at all.

    I have a student dissertation I happened to looking at today to thank for this reference.
    Thanks Mad Max. How about a combination of factors?

    In other words, given that he's 7th in the list of days raced out of the entire pro peloton, that as one of very few star riders in the Europcar squad he is under pressure to deliver each time he does race, that he has almost certainly been training hard for his season's objective with the expectation on his shoulders of not only his team but his entire nation, that Bernaudeau is desperately seeking sponsorship to ensure the survival of his team and is thus likely to be pressuring riders to ride through niggles, do we think that it is possible or even probable that his cortisol levels were low as a combination of 2 and 3?

    Apologies for the length of that sentence. If it was not so late I'd edit into smaller chunks but I hope you get the gist.
  • Mad_Malx
    Mad_Malx Posts: 5,160
    ^^I think your scenario is quite likely.
  • above_the_cows
    above_the_cows Posts: 11,406
    Interesting info Mad_Malx. Every post should have at least one reference :wink:

    And glad to see your dissertations are of some use. I do not think mine could help here or anywhere on this forum, although I did once spot in an article on European border policies (not a dissertation) a reference to the Festina Affair in a discussion over country suspensions of the Schengen Agreement. :D
    Correlation is not causation.
  • chipoleany
    chipoleany Posts: 16
    Lets be honest. Europcar are filthy as f*** and they've been caught red handed here. The style of Rolland's and Voeckler's wins last year in le tour (which I did my balls on on Betfair) are not capable by clean human beings. Scenario 1 nailed on.
  • Mad_Malx
    Mad_Malx Posts: 5,160
    ^But any noticeable enhancement of performance was not a result of using corticosteroids.
  • powerbookboy
    powerbookboy Posts: 241
    Cortisone has a number of effects which can be beneficial for a Pro. Obviously the sanctioned use for the treatment of inflammation can get a rider back on his bike sooner (think Wiggins, Rolland, etc. or anyone with major objectives round the corner).

    However it also causes muscle to be broken down, which is why it's associated with chronic long term injury (think original Ronaldo and his ankle), as the repeated injection into tendons causes weakness and increased risk of rupture. Cycling is a "non-contact" sport and hence I guess the chances of "popping" a tendon or ligament are lower than football, rugby,etc, so maybe the Drs aren't completely evil.

    Famously it's also really useful for "burning" muscle. Perfect for when you've got to quickly drop a kilo or 2 of muscle mass to get your Watts looking more competitive for those Haute Category climbs (see Armstrong L amongst many others).

    And as mentioned earlier, it's entirely possible he's been monstering the training pre-Tour. Long term over-training will make Cortisol and other stress hormones go all over the shop in comparison to "normal" baselines.

    If Rolland's being injected for treatment, they're playing with fire as rest it more suitable. Sadly, Europcar and Rolland may feel backed into a corner (see Millar's book and pressure he felt under a Cofidis to perform), so I get that. I also get he might be getting some "preparation" for the Tour. Losing that last kg could mean Top 10 or Top 5.

    Tough luck on Rolland if he's just been pounding the miles. Tough deal if he's the doctor's pin-cushion. Tough-shit if he's prepping. We'll probably never know...
  • DeadCalm
    DeadCalm Posts: 4,242
    I assumed that this would already have been mentioned on here as it is yesterday's news but I couldn't find anything much except drivel relating to Sky so, just to point out that Europcar have been temporarily suspended by the MPCC.

    http://www.cyclingnews.com/news/mpcc-temporarily-suspends-team-europcar

    It should be stressed that they have been suspended due to the fact that they raced Rolland with low cortisol levels, not because they are suspected of doping.